kewlJ

I just wanted to add this.

I have read probably 70% of Dancer's columns and whatever he's written over the last 30 years. During that time he has been primarily a machine player, but he has also dabbled in sports betting, poker, blackjack, and everything else casinos have to offer in search of an edge. I do not recall any examples from his writing where he played unrated at one thing in a particular casino, then switched over and played rated at another later the same shift. Well, frankly, I don't recall him reporting this kind of thing on the same day ever, regardless of shift.

I have also been an LVA reader since its inception. I don't remember "Anthony Curtis/Kurt" ever mentioning switching from unrated to rated in the same casino on the same day with the expectation that his unrated identity would somehow be separate from his rated identity.

But what do I know? I've only been reading this stuff since 1983 or thereabouts (the beginning of the LVA).

Now I guess it's possible back in the dim past of slot clubs, such a thing was done regularly, but I have never encountered anyone with the expectation that their play would remain unlinked for any length of time.

Notice how kew got caught lying again by coach....and then further exposed his pathetic self by not "spending his time betting on sports while having little to no time available to read or post here for a few days"!

The true sign of a bonafide phony is in how he just CANNOT ever do anything he says he's gonna do, simply because he's being exposed by others thru his own fault.
In this glorious case, coach forces the pathological liar to re-create his bs blackjack playing in order that he not appear the lying fool he's been caught being so many times over on this very forum.

Of course, when he keeps getting caught with his pants down (YUK....) and whenever he can't help but end up suffering all night long over the things that are said here that rip the fairy up, it is pure music to not only my ears, but to nearly everyone else's.

And it's a beautiful thing :)

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Originally Posted by redietz

And through all of the KewlJ(s) replying, which was entirely about one line of mine ("I'll ask Munchkin"), the KewlJ(s) don't explain why such careful card counters are so nonchalant about being anonymous in the AM, eating lunch, and then being not-anonymous in the PM. I guess surveillance takes afternoons off, who knows?

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You are so full of shit dude. You play games with words, just like most trolls. Very coach Belly-ish of you.

The reason I was able to play unrated at blackjack and rated on video poker to get the good mailers (mailer play) was because someone else was playing all the machine play. Now go ahead and pretend you never heard me say that before. :rolleyes:

My partner handled 90% of out machine play. So if there was something about the machine play that aroused suspicion, they could back track and follow him throughout the casino and it would NOT lead to any unrated play at a blackjack table. And that was by design.

I really can't help it if you just are clueless about advantage play.

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Originally Posted by Rob.Singer

Notice how kew got caught lying again by coach....and then further exposed his pathetic self by not "spending his time betting on sports while having little to no time available to read or post here for a few days"!

The true sign of a bonafide phony is in how he just CANNOT ever do anything he says he's gonna do, simply because he's being exposed by others thru his own fault.
In this glorious case, coach forces the pathological liar to re-create his bs blackjack playing in order that he not appear the lying fool he's been caught being so many times over on this very forum.

Of course, when he keeps getting caught with his pants down (YUK....) and whenever he can't help but end up suffering all night long over the things that are said here that rip the fairy up, it is pure music to not only my ears, but to nearly everyone else's.

And it's a beautiful thing :)

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I run several sets of simulation for each game and make my plays earlier in the morning Rob. By 9:30 or 10 each day, I am finished and just watch games the rest of the day.

Rob you and coach belly know nothing about what I am doing right now. Nice try.

You being so completely ignorant of sports betting or any casino play done at an advantage is a beautiful thing. Somebody has to fill the casinos with money so they can despense it to the players actually winning. I am glad it is you.

Pretty obviously if you’re doing unrated one rated the other they’d be on seperate trips into the casino, possibly different shift/look if being more careful.

Dancer is as close as it gets to being a one trick pony, with apologies to red of course. Knew next to nothing about slots for a decade while it might have been the better play until his vp play dried up. Then moved to it only once there’s already approximately a dozen meth addicts and Zenkings per casino already doing it.

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Originally Posted by mcap

Pretty obviously if you’re doing unrated one rated the other they’d be on seperate trips into the casino, possibly different shift/look if being more careful.

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If it was one singular person doing different plays, one rated (for the offers) and one unrated, then yes, you would probably not do both on the same trip. But if it is two different people, like my partner and myself, one playing blackjack unrated, the other machines rated, it really doesn't matter. It is kind of stunning that I have to even explain this to these nit wits.

Now I will admit that on occasion when I was doing both plays, after my partners death, or even occasionally when he was alive, I would get lazy and complacent and play both plays on the same day. But only separated by a break (like lunch). Probably wasn't a great idea, but never lead to anything as far as I can tell. I was only no mailed at one location and it wasn't a location that I even played blackjack at. And almost all my backoffs were specifically, "no more blackjack", so there was no crossover consequences that I can see. But still probably wasn't a great idea.

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Originally Posted by kewlJ

The reason I was able to play unrated at blackjack and rated on video poker to get the good mailers (mailer play) was because someone else was playing all the machine play.

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Originally Posted by kewlJ

I did need to be careful at casinos where I played blackjack unrated (card counting) and also played rated on machines.

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Originally Posted by kewlJ

It is kind of stunning that I have to even explain this to these nit wits.

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Perhaps if you worked harder to create a coherent narrative that didn't contradict itself or defy common sense...

Ok I’m back on Red’s side now. No one accepted into Villanova is spelling dispense despense. Very few people get that wrong since both people that can spell and potheads get it right.

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Originally Posted by mcap

Ok I’m back on Red’s side now. No one accepted into Villanova is spelling dispense despense. Very few people get that wrong since both people that can spell and potheads get it right.

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Harrumph.

As a card-carrying pothead I gotta ask why you feel constrained to despense such nonsense?

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Originally Posted by MDawg

She's a homeless high school dropout prostitute.

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Originally Posted by pinchingyourballs

Perhaps if you worked harder to create a coherent narrative that didn't contradict itself or defy common sense...

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Originally Posted by Dan Druff

Unfortunately, you change/insert major details, and then end up claiming things which sound unlikely/impossible, which then leads to people putting in the work to disprove it, which then leads to you first acting outraged for being questioned, and then ultimately admitting you fibbed.

It's been the same song for years. Nobody else seems to have this issue on these gambling/AP forums. Ever wonder why?

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The "old man", from a deteriorated mental state, just, told me to remember, "If you get caught, you're not you." Ha.

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Originally Posted by OppsIdidItAgain

The "old man", from a deteriorated mental state, just, told me to remember, "If you get ☧aught, you're not you." Ha.

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---> You are not to use lightly the name of Adonai your God.

https://anagram-solver.net/The%20old....?partial=true

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Originally Posted by kewlJ

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Originally Posted by Rob.Singer

Notice how kew got caught lying again by coach....and then further exposed his pathetic self by not "spending his time betting on sports while having little to no time available to read or post here for a few days"!

The true sign of a bonafide phony is in how he just CANNOT ever do anything he says he's gonna do, simply because he's being exposed by others thru his own fault.
In this glorious case, coach forces the pathological liar to re-create his bs blackjack playing in order that he not appear the lying fool he's been caught being so many times over on this very forum.

Of course, when he keeps getting caught with his pants down (YUK....) and whenever he can't help but end up suffering all night long over the things that are said here that rip the fairy up, it is pure music to not only my ears, but to nearly everyone else's.

And it's a beautiful thing :)

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I run several sets of simulation for each game and make my plays earlier in the morning Rob. By 9:30 or 10 each day, I am finished and just watch games the rest of the day.

Rob you and coach belly know nothing about what I am doing right now. Nice try.

You being so completely ignorant of sports betting or any casino play done at an advantage is a beautiful thing. Somebody has to fill the casinos with money so they can despense it to the players actually winning. I am glad it is you.

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More excuses kew....as usual. You tried so hard to make believe you "didn't have time to post" except when these guys hit your nerves with more posts that you "just didnt have time to read", you instantly and as usual frantically read every word. And when you couldn't cope with how they exposed your phoniness, the nervous kew broke down yet again!

And THAT'S what I mean when I say "It's A beautiful thing"!

If you don't a jackpot I don't think it would typically matter.

Sure it isn't wise if you want to be anonymous at tables but play with your card in machines but in general I am highly skeptical that many surveillance operations pay attention to machines. Why would they? Why would they be instructed to do so?

This is how it was explained to me and it makes nothing but sense. Now they could be looking for certain types of behaviors like pulling cards for reasons or perhaps a dangerous casino. Or maybe a super sketchy patron?

Although after pacing up and down the reel based machine area at certain casino - twice I had security stand there 20 feet away and just watch me but act like he wasn't.. but he clearly was as there was no reason he'd stand there like that. [and he moved on when I got up] So in this case the casino was watching the machines ... so perhaps. But pretty sure that is the exception and might be because the reel machines have fewer people and were right by the high-limit? But most casinos aren't going to be as sharp as that one.

Although I also have certain characteristics that make me stand out .. and in general people are going to be less trusting of me than your random white guy without the neck tats.

Surveillance would have no reason to watch kj play video poker. If they were concerned he was an advantage bj player then that alone would have done him in. No identification of him is required for that. You don’t need someone’s name to determine they are a counter.

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Originally Posted by redietz

I just wanted to add this.

I have read probably 70% of Dancer's columns and whatever he's written over the last 30 years. During that time he has been primarily a machine player, but he has also dabbled in sports betting, poker, blackjack, and everything else casinos have to offer in search of an edge. I do not recall any examples from his writing where he played unrated at one thing in a particular casino, then switched over and played rated at another later the same shift. Well, frankly, I don't recall him reporting this kind of thing on the same day ever, regardless of shift.

I have also been an LVA reader since its inception. I don't remember "Anthony Curtis/Kurt" ever mentioning switching from unrated to rated in the same casino on the same day with the expectation that his unrated identity would somehow be separate from his rated identity.

But what do I know? I've only been reading this stuff since 1983 or thereabouts (the beginning of the LVA).

Now I guess it's possible back in the dim past of slot clubs, such a thing was done regularly, but I have never encountered anyone with the expectation that their play would remain unlinked for any length of time.

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Dancer gave up bj for video poker so never played unrated bj while playing rated video poker. He’s a piss poor example for you to use because he played rated advantage vp his entire career. He had to use the card to get the cash back/free play or anything else that made the play positive. Through the slot card the casinos had the track record of all his coin in and coin out plus all the benefits he received. The slot card makes it very easy for them to see what u are doing compared to bj. In the case of bj you don’t have to play rated to get the advantage.

The kewlJ(s) have always said that they are relying on hit-and-run to not be identified. They have repeatedly said this. If there is any suspicion at all that he is an advantage player in blackjack, his protection is that he hightails it away from the table and out the casino door before being identified.

If he counts at a table, and does NOT leave the casino, and then proceeds to play rated at video poker, he allows anybody surveilling him to identify him, which I thought was what he was supposedly avoiding. Plus he's doing it all during one shift, making it more blatant. The whole behavioral mish-mash makes no sense.

I'm curious if anyone on this forum has actually done any surveillance work. I did some non-casino security surveillance work back in my youth, and the guy who co-wrote the screenplays with me (James Dennison) has also done surveillance security. And many moons ago, my brother-in-law wrote a book on surveillance, which is on Amazon. Serious Surveillance for the Private Investigator by Bob Bruno. I just do not see how a card counter relying on bailing out before being identified sits around on the same shift in the same casino and plays rated on machines after a blackjack hit-and-run. It makes no sense to me. It sounds flat-out stupid.

I guess I just assumed people knew what doing surveillance was like. It's not really people reading porn and falling asleep like you see on TV. People actually have conversations about all kinds of trivia on the screens, and if anything, somebody suspected of something (like counting) in the short-term is going to be a subject of conversation and attention for the rest of the shift, especially if he stays on property. The people doing the surveilling aren't just blindly catching glimpses of screens while listening to the Yankees game.

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Originally Posted by mickeycrimm

Surveillance would have no reason to watch kj play video poker. If they were concerned he was an advantage bj player then that alone would have done him in. No identification of him is required for that. You don’t need someone’s name to determine they are a counter.

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Of course mickeycrimm is correct. Surveillance doesn't need a players name or identity to peg them as a card counter. Evaluations, either by computer or the old fashion way of human can determine that and if that happens, countermeasures taken. BUT a player playing rated, makes it easier. For a player playing rated, and even suspected of playing with an advantage, a simple check of all his past results will confirm the suspicion. THAT is why most card counter type advantage players play unrated and will forgo any comps and bonus points they might earn. It is also the big flaw in Dawgs stories and claims.

Now you can get into rat-holing to try to alter records and hide wins. A lot of players do so. I do so a bit. But it is hard to pull off on any large scale. If you are playing higher stakes, the chips counts wont add up. That and the possibility of someone seeing you rat hole and it all goes south real fast. If a player is identified as a rat-hole, that is as much as identifying them as a counter. Any "missing chips" will then be credited to that player. Might end up your records showing bigger wins than you actually had, which is the opposite of what you are trying to do.

In the end, the best strategy is short sessions. Just don't show too much....spread, winnings, play variations at any one session. And if playing unrated along with short sessions, it makes it hard to string multiple sessions together to confirm the information they are looking for. Not impossible...but harder. That is all you can hope to do.

One other advantage to shorter sessions, which I have mentioned many times. Whether a player is playing rated or not, there are certain threshold wins for a session that pit has to answer for. If you limit your session length, you are less likely to have those really big winning sessions that someone has to answer for. Instead you will have many smaller session wins (and losses) and nobody has to answer for anything. Kind of a "don't rock the boat" strategy.

And in the end most, not all, but most pit folks don't really want to have to do too much. Don't give them a reason to. :)