Bob Dietz' Coming Appeararance On PokerFraudAlert Radio

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Originally Posted by redietz

"Who monitors the monitor?" is a decades-old question.

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To me the decades old question should be 'if a player can pick winners, why isn't he picking winner and betting instead of marketing his picks or service'?:confused:

And this applies to other forms of gambling. Those that can win at blackjack do it. We don't make a living writing books about it. Those that can win at machines, do it.

Anyone writing books or selling information (picks) rather than betting and winning themselves, 1) probably isn't a winning player and 2) is no longer operating in the arena of gambling. They are marketing.

ya know Red, weeks ago, I asked a question that you did not answer. What kind of money you have made from sports betting, of which I included contest winnings, but excluded marketing or selling of a service or picks. You didn't answer. I think we now know why.


Guy says to his friend, hey I am a professional gambler. Friend says that is great. How much did you make last year gambling? Guy replies I lost money, but I wrote a book or sold my picks that made more money than I lost. :rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by kewlJ

Guy says to his friend, hey I am a professional gambler. Friend says that is great. How much did you make last year gambling? Guy replies I lost money, but I wrote a book or sold my picks that made more money than I lost. :rolleyes:

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Jesus KJ, did you graduate from the Tasha school of posting with this?;)

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Originally Posted by kewlJ

ya know Red, weeks ago, I asked a question that you did not answer. What kind of money you have made from sports betting, of which I included contest winnings, but excluded marketing or selling of a service or picks. You didn't answer. I think we now know why.


Guy says to his friend, hey I am a professional gambler. Friend says that is great. How much did you make last year gambling? Guy replies I lost money, but I wrote a book or sold my picks that made more money than I lost. :rolleyes:

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Why in God's name would I answer questions from an anonymous internet brat who the forum owner has labeled as a liar? LOL. What is the point?

You don't seem to get the gist, KewlJ(s). Engaging with you is a detriment to my own credibility. Anyone who engages you is damaging his or her own credibility. Why would anyone take seriously whatever you have to say? I can see it now, "Oh, oh, I convinced the KewlJ(s) I know what I'm doing. What an honor!"

Get real. The forum owner labeled you a serial liar. There's no coming back from that. Your posting here is a massive waste of time, for you and everyone else. It would be different if it was just Singer or MDawg blasting you. But when myself and Axelwolf have issues with you, when the forum owner whose whole schtick is honesty/legitimacy in gambling labels you a liar, there is zero point in engaging you. It's a complete waste of time. As they say in show business, "Go break an arm!" LOL.

Easter just passed. Everybody's burned out on people coming back from the dead, you know, like you. I'm not going to write one more word regarding you. There's no point in trying to bash someone with zero credibility.

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Originally Posted by kewlJ

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Originally Posted by redietz

"Who monitors the monitor?" is a decades-old question.

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To me the decades old question should be 'if a player can pick winners, why isn't he picking winner and betting instead of marketing his picks or service'?:confused:

And this applies to other forms of gambling. Those that can win at blackjack do it. We don't make a living writing books about it. Those that can win at machines, do it.

Anyone writing books or selling information (picks) rather than betting and winning themselves, 1) probably isn't a winning player and 2) is no longer operating in the arena of gambling. They are marketing.

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I kind of disagree with this. Why does anyone successful write a book? Movie stars, sports stars, politicians all are making huge money and still want to make more. Who doesn’t? The “Masterclass” scam is a perfect example of this.

I’m not arguing it’s an industry filled with scammers but writing a book or selling pics doesn’t make you a scammer in itself. Look at how many poker pros wrote books during the boom, it’s extra income.

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Originally Posted by The Boz

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Originally Posted by kewlJ

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Originally Posted by redietz

"Who monitors the monitor?" is a decades-old question.

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To me the decades old question should be 'if a player can pick winners, why isn't he picking winner and betting instead of marketing his picks or service'?:confused:

And this applies to other forms of gambling. Those that can win at blackjack do it. We don't make a living writing books about it. Those that can win at machines, do it.

Anyone writing books or selling information (picks) rather than betting and winning themselves, 1) probably isn't a winning player and 2) is no longer operating in the arena of gambling. They are marketing.

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I kind of disagree with this. Why does anyone successful write a book? Movie stars, sports stars, politicians all are making huge money and still want to make more. Who doesn’t? The “Masterclass” scam is a perfect example of this.

I’m not arguing it’s an industry filled with scammers but writing a book or selling pics doesn’t make you a scammer in itself. Look at how many poker pros wrote books during the boom, it’s extra income.

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This KewlJ(s) poster is either an idiot or being disingenuous. By his metric, there should be no investment counselors or financial advisors because, geez, why don't they all keep their advice to themselves and all make a fortune? There should, by the KewlJ(s) logic, be no investment counselors or financial advisors.

The KewlJ(s) just want people to pay attention to them by blathering on and on and on. Since the KewlJ(s) are such stand-up guys, their next project will be to get on a couple dozen investment forums and explain why the financial managers are all ripping people off. No sense limiting such brilliance to one forum.

One would think that when a forum owner calls somebody a liar, that liar would take the hint and vacate the forum.

Ok, first of all Dan Druff stated that I haven't been honest about some things. Mickeycrimm told us that no real advantage player is honest about everything. We can't be. That is why most don't post too much on forums and share what they do. Those of us that do, have to hide and yes even lie about some things. BUT it isn't our actual gambling experiences that we sometimes are not honest about. It is the non-gambling details, and that is done intentionally to throw people off that may be out to identify and harm us and our careers.

Dan Druff is a professional poker player. That is a little different from a professional AP or blackjack player. I am not aware of casinos out to identify poker players (they already know) because poker players are not taking from the casinos. they are taking from other players. So I don't know how much Dan Druff understands the dynamic of just what a blackjack player or other AP playing for a living goes through in that regard.

And yes, I know Dan Druff is an AP on some level. I don't know if he considers himself making a living from that. Earlier this year, I think in January, Druff told the story of being backed off (No more blackjack) at a casino he hadn't played in I think he said 10 years. While, he didn't give all the details of that, that is exactly the kind of thing real professional APs encounter and why we are less than honest about some details on forums. Druff thinks I take it to the extreme, more than I need to I guess. Anyway Druff did NOT say I have lied about what I do, although he did question it...which is fine. I don't want people to know everything. I share what I want to share.


Anyway, this isn't about me. It is about you and your claims, redietz. But I do want to distinguish what a professional gambler, or professional player, now-a-days called AP really is. Being an professional gambler, AP involves risk. We put our money where our mouth is on a daily basis. And if we don't win, in a relatively short period of time we don't eat. We don't pay rent. If we can't win long-term, in a relatively short period of time, we better have a spouse that can support us (ala Rob Singer) or a rich daddy like Mdawg.

What you are talking about doesn't involve that. There is no risk. You are a marketer. You don't know what it feels like to lose for days on end, weeks on end, months on end. No matter how well and properly bankrolled you are, it takes a special mental constitution to handle that and come out the other side.

This is what a real professional gambler, professional player, now called advantage player is. NOT what you do or did for 40 years. But congrats to you on a successful marketing career.

And by the way, you will notice the posers, frauds, people like dawg and Singer, never talk about losing. Everything is winning, winning, winning with these people. That is one of the ways you can almost immediately spot them. They are telling and selling a fantasy (even if they aren't actually selling anything).

Some of you guys give ZenKing a hard time, because he comes here and vents. That is one of the reasons I KNOW he is real and what he claims is basically real.

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Originally Posted by Dan Druff

The bottom line is that you tell a lot of lies on forums. If there's info you wish to suppress in order to keep your identity a secret, simply don't post it. Fabricating stories/details makes no sense, unless you just enjoy lying on the internet, which I think you do.

It's not like you're changing names or other details which are irrelevant. For example, if you had an issue at a casino on September 3, 2024, and you claimed it was on September 1, 2024, that would be a harmless lie. However, if you added details to the incident which didn't really occur, then you're just destroying the story and turning it into a tall tale. It's amazing that you can't see the difference.

On these forums, usually there's fire where there's smoke. You have lied so many times about so many things (and not just on here) that you need to just own up to it and admit that you've had a lot of problems telling the truth on AP forums.

The biggest problem is that you get especially arrogant and condescending toward anyone who doubts your stories. You don't just lie. You get angry and nasty with anyone who questions you. That's why a lot of people have an issue with you. If it were just a matter of lying itself, it would be less of a big deal.

I'll also say that it seems very important to you that people believe you.

You seem to descend into a much darker place when you battle with people on these forums.

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Originally Posted by axelwolf

There have been some things that you said that make me take great pause and I just find them hard to believe. If I am to be honest, I think you highly fudge on some of your stories, and I don't know why. It's beyond leaving things out or adding things to protect yourself.

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Originally Posted by smurgerburger

At some point you will realize you're dealing with a compulsive liar.

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Again, this thread is NOT about me MDAWG. This is a thread about Red and his claims. You have ample threads to troll and attack me, who you are obsessed with, without hijacking this thread.

You just can't stand that there is a thread about a topic (sports betting) that you know nothing about and can't even pretend to like you do blackjack and baccarat.

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Originally Posted by redietz

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Originally Posted by AxelWolf

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Originally Posted by redietz

Jesus, Axelwolf, this is why I'll limit myself to once a week. But because I'm into sports betting education, here we go:

This is Street and Smith, about the most famous, kind-of-old-school college football pre-season magazine. It published forever. If I remember correctly, I think I read Street and Smith because it tried to give kicker/punter summaries for most of the college football teams in a clear fashion when many other magazines kind of blew off returning kickers unless they were all-conference or had some kind of notoriety. Pre-internet, I religiously read Street and Smith and GamePlan and another one whose name eludes me. I still read them post-internet but cross-referenced them with other sources.

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Let's go one step at a time.

While you might think me to be asking if that was the correct magazine, or associated with it was dumb/odd/strange/crazy... It's really not. I think it would be hard to find many people who have ever heard of those magazines, but that can be a different debate(even a side bet). Let us take that out of the equation for now.

I googled "Tipsters or Gypsters published by Mike McCusker", and this is what came up in the top 5 or so....

WINNING STYLE | —~

Internet Archive
https://archive.org › download › street-smith-pro-f...
PDF
Our winning record monitored and verified by Mike McCusker of Las Vegas. To order. McCusker's Tipsters or Gypsters, send $17 to P.O. Box 19477, Las Vegas, ...

That link took me to the link I posted up here, and that's why I asked the question in the first place. I think most reasonable people without inside direct knowledge of those publications would be wondering the same thing.

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So one of the advertisers in Street and Smith mentioned "Tipsters or Gypsters?" as a way to verify their record. That makes sense.

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Well, I don't know when they started verifying/monitoring, but that magazine I link to is touting this complete BULLSHIT.

Since 1974 when Harold Peterson, Staff Writer for Sports Illustrated, monitored
Danny's sensational 89% versus the spread
(184 winners of 205 games, plus 28 of 28 upset
specials

Who is monitoring the people monitoring the monitors and so on?

It's all a big monitoring circle jerk.

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Originally Posted by redietz

Why in God's name would I answer questions from an anonymous internet brat who the forum owner has labeled as a liar? LOL. What is the point? You don't seem to get the gist, KewlJ(s). Engaging with you is a detriment to my own credibility. Anyone who engages you is damaging his or her own credibility.

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If that is really how you feel then why do you continue to "engage" with KJ?

Just ignore him...but only IF maintaining "credibility" is your true.goal.

Seems to me you enjoy the jousting and will happily engage with any "contender:"...not that there's anything really wrong with that.

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Originally Posted by The Boz

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Originally Posted by kewlJ

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Originally Posted by redietz

"Who monitors the monitor?" is a decades-old question.

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To me the decades old question should be 'if a player can pick winners, why isn't he picking winner and betting instead of marketing his picks or service'?:confused:

And this applies to other forms of gambling. Those that can win at blackjack do it. We don't make a living writing books about it. Those that can win at machines, do it.

Anyone writing books or selling information (picks) rather than betting and winning themselves, 1) probably isn't a winning player and 2) is no longer operating in the arena of gambling. They are marketing.

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I kind of disagree with this. Why does anyone successful write a book? Movie stars, sports stars, politicians all are making huge money and still want to make more. Who doesn’t? The “Masterclass” scam is a perfect example of this.

or selling pics doesn’t make you a scammer in itself.

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It makes them a pussy who doesn't belive their picks are good enough to beat the books, or they are not savvey enough to make any significant money betting sports themselves.

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Originally Posted by kewlJ

Again, this thread is NOT about me MDAWG. This is a thread about Red and his claims. You have ample threads to troll and attack me, who you are obsessed with, without hijacking this thread.

You just can't stand that there is a thread about a topic (sports betting) that you know nothing about and can't even pretend to like you do blackjack and baccarat.

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It actually IS about you kew. And mdawg just did another masterful job sorting out all your "I'm a professional gambler" bullshit.

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Originally Posted by AxelWolf

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Originally Posted by The Boz

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Originally Posted by kewlJ

To me the decades old question should be 'if a player can pick winners, why isn't he picking winner and betting instead of marketing his picks or service'?:confused:

And this applies to other forms of gambling. Those that can win at blackjack do it. We don't make a living writing books about it. Those that can win at machines, do it.

Anyone writing books or selling information (picks) rather than betting and winning themselves, 1) probably isn't a winning player and 2) is no longer operating in the arena of gambling. They are marketing.

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I kind of disagree with this. Why does anyone successful write a book? Movie stars, sports stars, politicians all are making huge money and still want to make more. Who doesn’t? The “Masterclass” scam is a perfect example of this.

or selling pics doesn’t make you a scammer in itself.

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It makes them a pussy who doesn't belive their picks are good enough to beat the books, or they are not savvey enough to make any significant money betting sports themselves.

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In many, but not all cases, I agree. But I still have no problem with those supplementing their income, or lack of it, from selling picks. I still blame the customers that fall for nonsensical 60%+ winners claims, dreaming of incoming riches. It’s like the Christopher Mitchell nonsense, is he to blame or is it the idiots who believe his nonsense, or both?

One of the best handicappers based on results on X is JJ Gruden. But he’s making additional money from his Podcast. As are others with YouTube videos and such. The hustles evolved but they are always about the money above and beyond the bets themselves.

Why a sports handicapper would market his picks instead of just betting them himself is a valid question.

There is an old axiom in gambling that if one is good enough to make a living as a professional gambler then that person would do very well in the business world. Richard Munchkin recently made a statement about this situation. He said:

"If I can make money gambling why would I want to go into the business world?"

A sports handicapper marketing services has moved into the business world. Why?

I'm with Munchkin on this one. If I could pick 57% winners I'm going to kelly bet until filthy rich. To hell with creating extra work by starting a business. I'm going to spend my valuable time searching for the best bets and getting the action down.

And now for something lighter I found Rob’s theme song from the 60’s.:D

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=fUUzb6...cJCYQJAYcqIYzv

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Originally Posted by mickeycrimm

Why a sports handicapper would market his picks instead of just betting them himself is a valid question.

There is an old axiom in gambling that if one is good enough to make a living as a professional gambler then that person would do very well in the business world. Richard Munchkin recently made a statement about this situation. He said:

"If I can make money gambling why would I want to go into the business world?"

A sports handicapper marketing services has moved into the business world. Why?

I'm with Munchkin on this one. If I could pick 57% winners I'm going to kelly bet until filthy rich. To hell with creating extra work by starting a business. I'm going to spend my valuable time searching for the best bets and getting the action down.

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Yeah. Genie appears and say "I grant you the power to win 57% of your sports bets". The guy responds, "Oh good, I can sell my picks". :confused:

What are we missing mickey? :D

I see nothing "wrong" with touting.

Having others pay you for your suggestions generates money and will not likely have any effect on the line, so who cares, really?

Unlike "Beat the Dealer" it doesn't lead to effective casino counter measures, does it?

I choose not to bet sports but if I did, and if I felt I had some sort of skill or edge, I'd not be afraid to "sell" my wisdom to the sheeple.

We're capitalists, after all...aren't we?

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Originally Posted by mickeycrimm

Why a sports handicapper would market his picks instead of just betting them himself is a valid question.

There is an old axiom in gambling that if one is good enough to make a living as a professional gambler then that person would do very well in the business world. Richard Munchkin recently made a statement about this situation. He said:

"If I can make money gambling why would I want to go into the business world?"

A sports handicapper marketing services has moved into the business world. Why?

I'm with Munchkin on this one. If I could pick 57% winners I'm going to kelly bet until filthy rich. To hell with creating extra work by starting a business. I'm going to spend my valuable time searching for the best bets and getting the action down.

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LOL. You're off on two things, which aren't exactly minor issues.

Point Number One: The people who pick 57% winners in a sport pick 57% winners in one, count 'em, one sport, with a limited number of plays per year, usually under 100 for football; maybe 250-300 or thereabouts for basketball. People are not, I repeat NOT, Leonardo Da AP's. When Mr. Walters recruited handicappers, he recruited them as specialists, not Leonardos. The roundtables he assembled for different sports were largely different groups of people. So it's pretty tough to get "filthy rich" handicapping at a 57% rate per year with 100 plays. You're talking 10-15 games over .500 per annum. I broke this down in other posts; you'd need a starting bankroll somewhere between 250K and 500K to make this work. Tough to do that without....other income.

Point Number Two for all you "APs" out there: When a handicapper works on a pay-after-you-win basis, what he has done is flip the percentages, a la AP'ing by definition. While the classic number is 52.3% versus "normal" juice, if a handicapper has clients who pay him after he wins (whether that winning is per game or per season), he has augmented his profits with the same percentage. If he wins 53% of the time, depending on how many clients he has and what they are paying him, he has generated income as if he'd hit 55% or 58% or 60% or more. He's basically turned that 10-10 payoff when he wins into an 11-10 or a 13-10 or a 2-1. It's classic "AP" methodology, only some people for some reason can't appreciate the obviousness of that. It's the equivalent of using a slot club to boost a marginally profitable (or even negative) game.

Now I find it very, very difficult to believe that mickey crimm, who is the creme de la creme of AP'ing, doesn't immediately grasp all this. So reading mickey's stuff, I'm forced to believe either (A) mickey is dumb as a rock or (B) he has some agenda. I'll go with (B).

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Originally Posted by MisterV

I see nothing "wrong" with touting.

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There is nothing "wrong" with it. It is not illegal or anything.

It is just that selling picks does not make you a professional sports bettor. Just like writing a book about blackjack doesn't make you a professional blackjack player. Nor does writing a book about video poker (Rob) make you a professional VP player.

Redietz has lead us to believe he was more of a sports bettor than a guy making his money as a tout, selling picks.