Bob Dietz' Coming Appeararance On PokerFraudAlert Radio

MrV, before deciding if you would consider me a "professional sports bettor," which is largely a matter of counts and amounts and opinions, check out the posted tickets in the Retro Road Trip thread and decide if those amounts constitute "professionalism." Some posters are very, shall we say, selective in what data they include in their posts (when they're not being caught in innumerable lies).

For example, both the KewlJ(s) and myself have accounts at Oddsmaker.ag. I have a dozen or so offshore accounts, and Oddsmaker would be considered a "boutique" sportsbook (not a big one). Now my wagering there totals somewhere between half a million and a million. Is that indicative of "professionalism?" I have no idea; you'll have to ask the Kewj(s). Maybe they've bet more there; I have no idea.

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Originally Posted by redietz

Point Number Two for all you "APs" out there: When a handicapper works on a pay-after-you-win basis, what he has done is flip the percentages, a la AP'ing by definition. While the classic number is 52.3% versus "normal" juice, if a handicapper has clients who pay him after he wins (whether that winning is per game or per season), he has augmented his profits with the same percentage. If he wins 53% of the time, depending on how many clients he has and what they are paying him, he has generated income as if he'd hit 55% or 58% or 60% or more. He's basically turned that 10-10 payoff when he wins into an 11-10 or a 13-10 or a 2-1. It's classic "AP" methodology, only some people for some reason can't appreciate the obviousness of that. It's the equivalent of using a slot club to boost a marginally profitable (or even negative) game.

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Nice try. :rolleyes:

If you are selling picks rather than betting, you are not a sports bettor. You are a tout. Spin and twist all you want. You can't change that fact.

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Originally Posted by redietz

MrV, before deciding if you would consider me a "professional sports bettor," which is largely a matter of counts and amounts and opinions, check out the posted tickets in the Retro Road Trip thread and decide if those amounts constitute "professionalism." Some posters are very, shall we say, selective in what data they include in their posts (when they're not being caught in innumerable lies).

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I don't know exactly what you do so how could I attempt to pigeonhole you?

My comment was a generalization and not directed specifically at you.

While I currently play slots I am interested in all aspects of gambling.

Bon chance.

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Originally Posted by kewlJ

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Originally Posted by redietz

Point Number Two for all you "APs" out there: When a handicapper works on a pay-after-you-win basis, what he has done is flip the percentages, a la AP'ing by definition. While the classic number is 52.3% versus "normal" juice, if a handicapper has clients who pay him after he wins (whether that winning is per game or per season), he has augmented his profits with the same percentage. If he wins 53% of the time, depending on how many clients he has and what they are paying him, he has generated income as if he'd hit 55% or 58% or 60% or more. He's basically turned that 10-10 payoff when he wins into an 11-10 or a 13-10 or a 2-1. It's classic "AP" methodology, only some people for some reason can't appreciate the obviousness of that. It's the equivalent of using a slot club to boost a marginally profitable (or even negative) game.

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Nice try. :rolleyes:

If you are selling picks rather than betting, you are not a sports bettor. You are a tout. Spin and twist all you want. You can't change that fact.

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Again, I'm just going to keep hammering you with the obvious analogy. Financial advisors invest their own money. Yet they're still investment advisors. Obviously, I invest my own money and always have. So your entire argument is spurious nonsense.

Just another lie from the guy who told more whoppers than anyone on these forums.

So, do broken legs heal faster after you come back from the dead or before? And does Nersesian know how to set a broken bone or not?

Inquiring minds want to know.

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Originally Posted by redietz

So, do broken legs heal faster after you come back from the dead or before? And does Nersesian know how to set a broken bone or not?

Inquiring minds want to know.

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I have never had a broken leg so I wouldn't know. Nor do I know the extent of Mr. Nersesian's medical training if he has any.

But here's an idea. If you can't figure out these answers with you 130+ IQ and perfect SAT scores from 50 years ago, maybe you could have lunch with some academic Professor from John Hopkins and ask him or her.

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Originally Posted by redietz

So your entire argument is spurious nonsense.

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Somehow he failed to consider the obvious in his evaluation.

Spurious is being too kind...he's an imbecile.

I may not know everything Redietz, nor claim to. But here is what I do know. I may troll a bit and fight and argue with the trolls and haters, but I also have shared a lot of information on this forum about what I do and have done in Vegas over the last 16 years playing blackjack as a fulltime advantage player. And despite what your fellow troll and fool Rob Singer says, some of it is information you won't find anywhere else. Someone reading what I have written and shared about how I have played blackjack, would have a pretty good blue print of how to play for a living in Las Vegas and be welcome to play for a long time (longevity). Because THAT really is what it comes down to with blackjack and card counting....being able to keep playing.

Now, you.....I don't know what someone might have learned from you. How to be a tout? How to run a marketing business? I don't know. You tell me what someone might have learned from you? Seriously.

Anyway enough of this. Are we EVER going to get to this interview that you have been dragging your feet on? I think we can all see why you might have been doing so.

So, I have heard back from KimLee. He confirmed that Bob Dietz was listed in the 1980 Tipsters & Gypsters published by Mike McCusker, not that anyone doubted that. He also shared some other thoughts and information about not only Redietz, but some other well know people listed in those publications, which I am not going to repeat. That is his place to do so not mine. Maybe he will, maybe not. That is his call. I made him aware of this discussion, since Redietz brought his name up twice.

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Originally Posted by redietz

MrV, before deciding if you would consider me a "professional sports bettor," which is largely a matter of counts and amounts and opinions, check out the posted tickets in the Retro Road Trip thread and decide if those amounts constitute "professionalism." Some posters are very, shall we say, selective in what data they include in their posts (when they're not being caught in innumerable lies).

For example, both the KewlJ(s) and myself have accounts at Oddsmaker.ag. I have a dozen or so offshore accounts, and Oddsmaker would be considered a "boutique" sportsbook (not a big one). Now my wagering there totals somewhere between half a million and a million. Is that indicative of "professionalism?" I have no idea; you'll have to ask the Kewj(s). Maybe they've bet more there; I have no idea.

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A valid question is whose money are you betting?

There is a thread here from 2018 called Tipsters or Gypsters. Redietz posted some pics but two of them were upside down so I fixed them below. So according to Kimlee, reditz was in the rag in 1980. These two pics were for 1989 and 1990. It shows redietz did well those years. My question would be did he cherry pick those two years? He didn't publish any more results than those two years and he goes back to 1980 with this rag. What about the results for the other years?

https://vegascasinotalk.com/forum/sh...rs-or-Gypsters

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Originally Posted by mickeycrimm

There is a thread here from 2018 called Tipsters or Gypsters. Redietz posted some pics but two of them were upside down so I fixed them below. So according to Kimlee, reditz was in the rag in 1980. These two pics were for 1989 and 1990. It shows redietz did well those years. My question would be did he cherry pick those two years? He didn't publish any more results than those two years and he goes back to 1980 with this rag. What about the results for the other years?

https://vegascasinotalk.com/forum/sh...rs-or-Gypsters

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Note none of the “known” public handicappers of the era are shown on the list. This was the era where they were at their peak with 900 numbers, infomercials and ads everywhere in sports publications. Along with score phones which was huge in the day as an advertising platform.

This list is mostly smaller services like RED and others who I’m not sure how they advertised or promoted their services, or if they even did. With my skepticism of the industry I could assume this was the way they did. It wouldn’t be hard for one operator to own multiple companies on the list and then push the “winning” one.

But RED swears this was a legitimate service and overall he hasn’t ever lied to me about his history, I give him the benefit of the doubt. And we still have no proof, other than a vague claim from Rob, that he’s ever tried to solicit anyone here. I certainly heard of McCusker back then but again, he wasn’t the only one doing this and I just lumped him in with the other scammers/ angle shooters.

RED’s a stubborn SOB and no clue why he deals with the aggravation of arguing his status and history here. And yes Mick, I too would love to see the results over a 10-20 year period from this monitor. Are they lost to history?

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Originally Posted by mickeycrimm

There is a thread here from 2018 called Tipsters or Gypsters. Redietz posted some pics but two of them were upside down so I fixed them below. So according to Kimlee, reditz was in the rag in 1980. These two pics were for 1989 and 1990. It shows redietz did well those years. My question would be did he cherry pick those two years? He didn't publish any more results than those two years and he goes back to 1980 with this rag. What about the results for the other years?

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I should correct. When I said Kimlee confirmed redietz was in T & G in 1980, I should have said the 1980's, not specifically 1980.

But yes, this whole ordeal is about the cherry picking of a good year or two so that the "players" can use that as a tool to solicit clients/customers.

You might have though, as I originally did, that this kind of monitoring list was about bragging rights among real legit sports bettors. But that is not it at all. It is about doing well a couple years so you can cherry pick that information to use in soliciting new customers. And I am sorry, but that just isn't advantage play or winning sports betting.

An advantage player or in the case of sports, a real winning player is someone who plays whatever casino game, or in the case of sports, bets the games, and wins more than he loses. If you aren't actually winning by betting and playing you are not a winning player. :D It is NOT that difficult.

I mean come on, in addition to the writing books analogy, I will throw a couple more out there. These people, like the two different young ladies that play blackjack on YouTube are NOT professional blackjack players. There money comes from views on youtube. They are YouTubers.

And this one wont endear me to our fearless forum owner, who already doesn't care for me, but I have a problem with poker players buying pieces of one another. (besides that it opens the door wide for collusion), let me ask this. Is a player who plays lets say 20 tournaments a year, cashed in zero of them, but has pieces of players that cashed in several a winning player? :confused:

A winning player i someone that plays the game (or bets sports) and wins an amount more than he loses....PERIOD!!! This idea of supplementing an AP income with selling picks or writing books, is for the birds.


Hey what about this. Guy plays blackjack and bets sports for a living. At blackjack he loses 10k, at sports betting he losses 8k. But he "supplements his professional blackjack and sports betting by working as a night watchman for 50k a year. Is he really playing blackjack and betting sports for a living? :D

If you say you are doing something for a living....make your money from that!!!!!!

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Originally Posted by kewlJ

If you say you are doing something for a living....make your money from that!!!!!!

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Are touts akin to pastors, using their supposed "inside information" to "save" the uninformed...for a tithing...?

Oh geez. This brings me back to a fellow on Norms blackjack forum that I had a problem with. I am not going to say his name/handle. Some of you will recognise as to whom I am speaking of. He is probably gone now as last I heard he was in poor health.

So this guy presented himself as...and this is a direct quote, "a 20 year professional blackjack player".

Turns out he was a professor at a small college, retired early in his 50's and began his 20 year professional blackjack career. Also turns out he was a life-long degenerate gambler. Horses (big time horse player), roulette, craps I think.

So during this 20 year professional blackjack career, believe at the end he declared he had won like 300k. Over 20 years. And that included 1 year playing on a team where his income was 100k. So for the remaining 19 years he made 10k a year (shades of the late Moses).

And here is the best part. Being retired, he had a pension, and during part of that time collected social security, AND his wife worked full-time well into her retirement years to support him. Was he really a 20 year professional blackjack player, as he claimed when he was soliciting players to "Mentor"? :D

There is some other shady stuff about that fellow, but I am not going to go into since I am not naming him. the guys associated with blackjack have surely already heard it.

I will say it one more time, if you are claiming you do something for a living in gambling.....do that for a living!!

nothing wrong with APing while having a pension or on social security. I have argued in the past, that is a perfect time to AP. But you have to be somewhat honest about it, like mickeycrimm has been.

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Originally Posted by Dan Druff

Is this like the 10th time you've announced you're leaving? Why are you still here?

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Yeah and you were told to stop hijacking threads with this continuing shit. When is THAT going to happen?

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Originally Posted by The Boz

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Originally Posted by mickeycrimm

There is a thread here from 2018 called Tipsters or Gypsters. Redietz posted some pics but two of them were upside down so I fixed them below. So according to Kimlee, reditz was in the rag in 1980. These two pics were for 1989 and 1990. It shows redietz did well those years. My question would be did he cherry pick those two years? He didn't publish any more results than those two years and he goes back to 1980 with this rag. What about the results for the other years?

https://vegascasinotalk.com/forum/sh...rs-or-Gypsters

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Note none of the “known” public handicappers of the era are shown on the list. This was the era where they were at their peak with 900 numbers, infomercials and ads everywhere in sports publications. Along with score phones which was huge in the day as an advertising platform.

This list is mostly smaller services like RED and others who I’m not sure how they advertised or promoted their services, or if they even did. With my skepticism of the industry I could assume this was the way they did. It wouldn’t be hard for one operator to own multiple companies on the list and then push the “winning” one.

But RED swears this was a legitimate service and overall he hasn’t ever lied to me about his history, I give him the benefit of the doubt. And we still have no proof, other than a vague claim from Rob, that he’s ever tried to solicit anyone here. I certainly heard of McCusker back then but again, he wasn’t the only one doing this and I just lumped him in with the other scammers/ angle shooters.

RED’s a stubborn SOB and no clue why he deals with the aggravation of arguing his status and history here. And yes Mick, I too would love to see the results over a 10-20 year period from this monitor. Are they lost to history?

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Boz, I seen redietz advertising some time ago. I don't remember where it is so maybe he can post a link if it's still up and running. IIRC, he was advertising for investors with a promised return, something like 10% to 15%, for a 4 month period. That would be a pretty good return. It looks to me like they probably had to send him the money upfront and he would pay them at the end of the season. And that's why I've asked redietz, when he talks about all the action he has run, whose money was he betting.

Investors! That is even more fucked up than selling picks

If you are a successful sports bettor for what is it now Red....50 years, why do you need investors?

Just like an onion...

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Originally Posted by kewlJ

why do you need investors?

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It's likely because the investors pay him commission from their profits, which are achieved by following his advice.

He already explained how the math works in his favor.

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Originally Posted by mickeycrimm

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Originally Posted by The Boz

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Originally Posted by mickeycrimm

There is a thread here from 2018 called Tipsters or Gypsters. Redietz posted some pics but two of them were upside down so I fixed them below. So according to Kimlee, reditz was in the rag in 1980. These two pics were for 1989 and 1990. It shows redietz did well those years. My question would be did he cherry pick those two years? He didn't publish any more results than those two years and he goes back to 1980 with this rag. What about the results for the other years?

https://vegascasinotalk.com/forum/sh...rs-or-Gypsters

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Note none of the “known” public handicappers of the era are shown on the list. This was the era where they were at their peak with 900 numbers, infomercials and ads everywhere in sports publications. Along with score phones which was huge in the day as an advertising platform.

This list is mostly smaller services like RED and others who I’m not sure how they advertised or promoted their services, or if they even did. With my skepticism of the industry I could assume this was the way they did. It wouldn’t be hard for one operator to own multiple companies on the list and then push the “winning” one.

But RED swears this was a legitimate service and overall he hasn’t ever lied to me about his history, I give him the benefit of the doubt. And we still have no proof, other than a vague claim from Rob, that he’s ever tried to solicit anyone here. I certainly heard of McCusker back then but again, he wasn’t the only one doing this and I just lumped him in with the other scammers/ angle shooters.

RED’s a stubborn SOB and no clue why he deals with the aggravation of arguing his status and history here. And yes Mick, I too would love to see the results over a 10-20 year period from this monitor. Are they lost to history?

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Boz, I seen redietz advertising some time ago. I don't remember where it is so maybe he can post a link if it's still up and running. IIRC, he was advertising for investors with a promised return, something like 10% to 15%, for a 4 month period. That would be a pretty good return. It looks to me like they probably had to send him the money upfront and he would pay them at the end of the season. And that's why I've asked redietz, when he talks about all the action he has run, whose money was he betting.

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When looking I ran into this...


Checking In
« on: April 11, 2011, 02:12:34 PM »
Hey, everybody.

As a brief intro, I have been a reasonably well known sports gambler for the last 30 years, so if anyone has a question regarding such, fire away. I founded an enterprise called Integrity Sports back in 1979. Not really a "tout service" in the classic sense; I have worked primarily on percent-of-profit basis with people. I have, obviously, a good historical overview of the whole sports gambling world.

And I never, ever solicited anything on the LVA boards, so I doubt most folks know much of this. Don't worry about me trying to sell anybody anything (unless you're an Angelina Jolie clone, in which case I'll make an exception).

My sports writing, which was once a feature at Playbook, was cut when Jim Feist entered into the Playbook partnership. Now my stuff gets posted on freesportsinfo.com on occasion.

My claim to providing useful info to Las Vegas visitors is that I spent 90-100 days in hotel living in Las Vegas each year for more than 20 years, so I've seen everything from the old Gold Spike rooms to the ancient round-bed suites at Caesars. I'm reasonably well informed except when it comes to clubbing.

Anyway, hey there, and glad to meet you.

Bob Dietz (aka Bob Dietz)