If you're going to count the positives of casinos you should add the negatives as well: ruining degenerate gamblers, increasing theft and homicide rates, etc.
Crime bosses create jobs too after all.
But I digress.
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If you're going to count the positives of casinos you should add the negatives as well: ruining degenerate gamblers, increasing theft and homicide rates, etc.
Crime bosses create jobs too after all.
But I digress.
You're going to have to explain this to me slowly. If you lose $29,000 in one week, but you earn $85,000 a year, you average how much profit per week overall?Quote:
Originally Posted by kewlJ
Alan you need to read up on and learn what the term "average" means?Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson
I say "average" and you immediately quote the extremes. Just like I said. I say "green", you hear "orange". :rolleyes:
But wait... it gets even more complicated. Let's include that six-month losing streak. What does that do to the average for positive weeks?
Now, quoting your own post: "The average win per casino is under $2500...."
Ya know, kewlj, I suspect I'm not the only one not understanding your numbers.
Average: a number expressing the central or typical value in a set of data, in particular the mode, median, or (most commonly) the mean, which is calculated by dividing the sum of the values in the set by their number.Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson
You’re making a good point Alan. I never thought about it the way you’ve gone through the numbers. One thing I’ve noticed with a lot of these young APs is their numbers don’t add up.Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan MendelsonYou're going to have to explain this to me slowly. If you lose $29,000 in one week, but you earn $85,000 a year, you average how much profit per week overall?Quote:
Originally Posted by kewlJAlan you need to read up on and learn what the term "average" means?Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson
I say "average" and you immediately quote the extremes. Just like I said. I say "green", you hear "orange". :rolleyes:
But wait... it gets even more complicated. Let's include that six-month losing streak. What does that do to the average for positive weeks?
Now, quoting your own post: "The average win per casino is under $2500...."
Ya know, kewlj, I suspect I'm not the only one not understanding your numbers.
There is a young AP called Joe who was on GWAE last year and he claimed to make $500,000 in his first year. I think he started with $10,000. Talk about a story that didn’t add up. Nothing he said made any sense. He also said he had an extended 200 hour downswing his first year. I’ve listened to the podcast several times, and every time I listen to it, it makes less sense.
He also bragged that he tipped almost zero during this run. Who brags about making $500,000 and tipping next to nothing? If this is true, I sure wouldn’t brag about it. These are the type of young APs I’ve seen come through my area lately.
Kewlj I have 33 hours of Economics from the Maxwell School of Public Policy at Syracuse University. To put it bluntly: I'm a trained economist. I realize you only have a GED or some kind of high school diploma... so please don't even try to lecture me on averages or means or anything else.
Simply explain yourself because your numbers just don't stand up by themselves.
I'm not accusing you of anything. I'm only asking you to explain. You must have had some wild swings given that you played "hit and run" sessions and averaged under $2500 per casino.
This needs an explanation. Don't accuse me of anything. They're your numbers.
Alan, you are clueless when it comes to numbers.Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson
No mickeycrimm I'm not clueless. I didn't win the Janus Award for Economics Reporting for being clueless. And I didn't blow the whistle on how the Bureau of Labor Statistics screwed around with the Unemployment rate and the wholesale price index... forcing the BLS to revise both. That was me who investigated and reported on CBS News.
Of course mickeycrimm you just want to show what a good AP club member you are. So I expect nothing less from you. But here's a tip: let kewlj speak for himself. He has to explain his numbers.
I'm thinking like bh...that this kind of action would draw attention.Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson
I guess it depends on how the losses were spread out.
How many stores were hit in that day, or that week?
Alan, mickey's getting nervous again because he's not handling kew's digging his own grave very well.
You will never get an understandable explanation about how the losing streak and big losing days affect the "avg. daily win". To do so will make his house of cards come crumbling all down.
What I am going to get is that I'm an anti AP shyster. Watch.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob.Singer
What he doesn't know is that I was discussing M1 and M2 with Paul Volcker over lunch before he was born, and it was me who interviewed the president of Bankers Trust when they confessed to supplying the Federal Reserve with incorrect money supply figures.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson
Alan, you seem like a really smart guy, can you figure this baffling puzzle out. You have these 5 gaming websites which include this one. three of those sites have about a hundred ACTIVE members one about 25 and one site only has one active member which site has the most volume of posts made per day, week and per month? You already know the answer and so does everyone else but only you could possibly explain the reason. While you are at it can you explain why that site's threads are also the most read by volume?
Bosox, I’m having a hard time following you. Could you please write in plain English, rather than in code or as a riddle? What was this post about? It looks like it could be interesting if I could figure out what you’re saying.Quote:
Originally Posted by BoSoxQuote:
Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson
Alan, you seem like a really smart guy, can you figure this baffling puzzle out. You have these 5 gaming websites which include this one. three of those sites have about a hundred ACTIVE members one about 25 and one site only has one active member which site has the most volume of posts made per day, week and per month? You already know the answer and so does everyone else but only you could possibly explain the reason. While you are at it can you explain why that site's threads are also the most read by volume?
I understand you’re the defacto forum defective, but at some point you need to learn to communicate with the average Joe...or Bob.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson
I don't know what you want from me Alan? You want me to post pages of results? pages of numbers? I can do that. It would involve some work, but I can do that. BUT, is all that is going to lead to is your or someone else asking for proof of those numbers. How do I prove anything. Am I suppose to take pictures of casino chips before I cash them? Take pictures of the dealer scooping up my chips after a loss? Maybe I should just hire someone to follow me around video recording every hand I play? Or are we back to bank accounts and sale/purchase of property?
I mean really tell me what you want from me Alan? I can spend a couple hours posting some numbers, but I am sure that won't satisfy you.
Kewlj I've always believed that you could make $85,000 or so a year card counting. The problems arise when you provide too many details. In fact it's all the details that draw out the skepticism. It's all the details that sabotage you.Quote:
Originally Posted by kewlJ
Look at what you've told us and understand how there can be skepticism:
1. You lose $29,000 in a week while you play short hit and run sessions that you describe as a grind. A $29,000 one week grind?
2. You quickly recover the $29,000 and you apparently did it again grinding short hit and run sessions.
3. Your average hit per casino visit is $30 or $50... yet you lost $29,000 in a week and then quickly won it back. That doesn't raise skepticism?
4. You admit to a six month losing streak but recover. Okay, that's doable. But again the recovery comes in grinding short hit and run sessions from 33 casinos at $30 to $50 a pop.
5. You speak of Averages but your average yearly take is under $2500 per casino each year and we have to wonder that you've had huge swings to maintain the averages...
6. And the bottom line is when you have to recover from a weekly loss of $29,000 and when you have to recover from a month or six months of losing, "inquiring minds" must wonder that there's more than $30-$50 casino hits and along with years of doing this you must be known.
7. Heck, they knew my face at Red Rock and Suncoast on my third visits to each casino... but you grind away for 15 years profiting on average $85,000 a year and overcoming $29,000 one week losses and you fly under the radar?
Ya know kewlj, if you just said you make $85,000 a year counting cards there wouldn't be any skepticism. But it's your added detail that sends up the red flares.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan MendelsonKewlj I've always believed that you could make $85,000 or so a year card counting. The problems arise when you provide too many details. In fact it's all the details that draw out the skepticism. It's all the details that sabotage you.Quote:
Originally Posted by kewlJ
Look at what you've told us and understand how there can be skepticism:
1. You lose $29,000 in a week while you play short hit and run sessions that you describe as a grind. A $29,000 one week grind?
2. You quickly recover the $29,000 and you apparently did it again grinding short hit and run sessions.
3. Your average hit per casino visit is $30 or $50... yet you lost $29,000 in a week and then quickly won it back. That doesn't raise skepticism?
4. You admit to a six month losing streak but recover. Okay, that's doable. But again the recovery comes in grinding short hit and run sessions from 33 casinos at $30 to $50 a pop.
5. You speak of Averages but your average yearly take is under $2500 per casino each year and we have to wonder that you've had huge swings to maintain the averages...
6. And the bottom line is when you have to recover from a weekly loss of $29,000 and when you have to recover from a month or six months of losing, "inquiring minds" must wonder that there's more than $30-$50 casino hits and along with years of doing this you must be known.
7. Heck, they knew my face at Red Rock and Suncoast on my third visits to each casino... but you grind away for 15 years profiting on average $85,000 a year and overcoming $29,000 one week losses and you fly under the radar?
Ya know kewlj, if you just said you make $85,000 a year counting cards there wouldn't be any skepticism. But it's your added detail that sends up the red flares.
Nope, nope, nope. #3, #4, #6 are not correct. I didn't say my average win or loss was $50ish. I said, you add up all the winning sessions and subtract all the losing sessions and it comes out to a small amount.
I will provide the win and loss amounts per session for the casino in question as I think it is roughly 50 visits and show you what I mean. I am not going to post the actual page of my results because there are dates and misc information that I record for each session that I don't want to make public. I am just going to post the 50 or so session results totals to clarify what I am talking about.
If you are just fucking with me Alan, and making me go through this, this will be the very last time, I give you even the time of day.
Winning days: 650, 837.50, 1575, 600, 425, 1875, 2425, 225, 537.50, 1200, 3375, 112.50, 475, 700, 825, 662.50, 275, 700, 1112.50, 12.50, 825, 350, 1075, 262.50, 3350, 512.50, 450, 275, 400
Losing days: -2125, -425, -775, 0, -225, -312.50, -625, -1725, -2425, -162.50, -850, -1462.50, 0, -2250, -1050, -337.50, 0, -3275, -200, -475, -112.50, -150
I hope I didn't make a mistake transferring numbers or god forbid, Mr "gottch ya" would jump on it.
The 29 winning days total, 26,100. Subtract the 22 losing (and zero) days total of 18,962.50 and I showed a total profit of 7137.50 at this casino in 2018.
7137.50 total profit divided by 51 visits or sessions equals an AVERAGE of 139.95 per visit. What did I estimate $140 per visit?
Got it Alan? see how this works?
Now those numbers are for my best casino (in terms of win). If you add all the casinos, including several that I had losing results for the year, that average per visit or session comes down below $50/per visit/session, which is what I said in the later post.
Why do I already have a feeling I am about to see a very stupid and frustrating response. :confused: :(
Why don’t you just send a package with all your play records to Alan’s office?
Because I am not out to prove anything, although I am sure that will be the next request/demand.Quote:
Originally Posted by mcap
But let me ask you, mcap, since you weighed in. You are a guy (or gal) that seems fairly level headed. And you have been critical of me at times, so it's not like your a KJ supporter.
Are you in any way confused or unclear as to what I am saying? Or it is just the guy that is supposed to be a journalist that has trouble understanding English (and basic math)?
Is that what you are???Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson
Is that code for being homosexual?Quote:
Originally Posted by kewlJ
When a casino opens in an area where they are the first then look for bankruptcies in the town to go up about 1500% the first year. And about a third of the women that the town sends to prison will be there for gambling related offenses like embezzlement and theft. Stories in the local newspaper along the lines of "Prominent doctor's wife gambles away their fortune" will start appearing.Quote:
Originally Posted by jbjbBullshit they are!Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob21
https://www.lasvegasadvisor.com/gamb...or-black-hole/
I agree. I get it...I get the downside of what happens with casinos. Everybody knows this. You'd have to be living under a rock to not know this. We shouldn’t be debating this, unless you're from Pluto and don’t know what a casino is.Quote:
Originally Posted by mickeycrimmWhen a casino opens in an area where they are the first then look for bankruptcies in the town to go up about 1500% the first year. And about a third of the women that the town sends to prison will be there for gambling related offenses like embezzlement and theft. Stories in the local newspaper along the lines of "Prominent doctor's wife gambles away their fortune" will start appearing.Quote:
Originally Posted by jbjbBullshit they are!Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob21
https://www.lasvegasadvisor.com/gamb...or-black-hole/
What you’re both missing is this isn’t the fault of the casino. The casinos are doing what they have been commissioned to do by the State. You should direct your angry at our government for allowing casinos to exists...not the casinos.
Casinos exist as an extension of our government to collect revenue for our government. They are run by private businesses, as an extension of our government. Think of it as a voluntary tax program or a tax program for the stupid, who are usually the poor and vulnerable. This is why conservatives don’t believe in casinos....they hurt the most most vulnerable in our society.
The point being your anger should be directed at our government, not casinos. It makes no sense to be angry at an industry that is doing exactly what it’s business model calls, which is to provide negative EV games for the purpose of entertainment. This isn’t my take on it...this is our governments take on it. It’s the same way they promote lotteries.
This is what I don’t understand about APs. They are all the same, pointing out to me how awful casino’s are. On BJTF someone posted about 10 articles showing me how awful and descructive casino’s are. Ok, I get it. Then if that’s the case, why aren’t APs banning together and trying to get them shut down. How does APing hurt casinos? How does APing help the people APs are so concerned about. Hint. It doesn’t.
Being an AP means your complacent in what casinos do. It gets back to inconsistency. APs are some of the most hypocritical people I know. They always criticize an industry, but do nothing about it. Making money in a casino is adding NO value to society, and it’s NOT helping anybody except the AP. Since gambling is a zero sum game, the only value being created in a casino is entertainment, which is what a casinos does. APs are creating NO value by being in casinos and making money. In fact, they are extracting value when they’re in a casino, since they are taking funds from our government. I get they are doing this legally.
Again, casinos are fulfilling their mission that our government has asked of them. They primary purpose is to provide revenue to the State. And they have done this in spades, by contributing billions in revenue to our state and local governments. If you don’t like this, then you should take it up with our government and try to get casinos shut down.
I know my take on this is not a popular one with APs, but it’s the correct one.
I wasn't criticizing anything. I was just telling you what to expect when a casino opens in an area that has never had one.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob21I agree. I get it...I get the downside of what happens with casinos. Everybody knows this. You'd have to be living under a rock to not know this. We shouldn’t be debating this, unless you're from Pluto and don’t know what a casino is.Quote:
Originally Posted by mickeycrimmWhen a casino opens in an area where they are the first then look for bankruptcies in the town to go up about 1500% the first year. And about a third of the women that the town sends to prison will be there for gambling related offenses like embezzlement and theft. Stories in the local newspaper along the lines of "Prominent doctor's wife gambles away their fortune" will start appearing.Quote:
Originally Posted by jbjb
What you’re both missing is this isn’t the fault of the casino. The casinos are doing what they have been commissioned to do by the State. You should direct your angry at our government for allowing casinos to exists...not the casinos.
Casinos exist as an extension of our government to collect revenue for our government. They are run by private businesses, as an extension of our government. Think of it as a voluntary tax program or a tax program for the stupid, who are usually the poor and vulnerable. This is why conservatives don’t believe in casinos....they hurt the most most vulnerable in our society.
The point being your anger should be directed at our government, not casinos. It makes no sense to be angry at an industry that is doing exactly what it’s business model calls, which is to provide negative EV games for the purpose of entertainment. This isn’t my take on it...this is our governments take on it. It’s the same way they promote lotteries.
This is what I don’t understand about APs. They are all the same, pointing out to me how awful casino’s are. On BJTF someone posted about 10 articles showing me how awful and descructive casino’s are. Ok, I get it. Then if that’s the case, why aren’t APs banning together and trying to get them shut down. How does APing hurt casinos? How does APing help the people APs are so concerned about. Hint. It doesn’t.
Being an AP means your complacent in what casinos do. It gets back to inconsistency. APs are some of the most hypocritical people I know. They always criticize an industry, but do nothing about it. Making money in a casino is adding NO value to society, and it’s NOT helping anybody except the AP. Since gambling is a zero sum game, the only value being created in a casino is entertainment, which is what a casinos does. APs are creating NO value by being in casinos and making money. In fact, they are extracting value when they’re in a casino, since they are taking funds from our government. I get they are doing this legally.
Again, casinos are fulfilling their mission that our government has asked of them. They primary purpose is to provide revenue to the State. And they have done this in spades, by contributing billions in revenue to our state and local governments. If you don’t like this, then you should take it up with our government and try to get casinos shut down.
I know my take on this is not a popular one with APs, but it’s the correct one.
I get it. I think everybody gets that. I come from a conservative background. My parents never stepped foot in a casino and were 100% against all types of gambling, which isn’t surprising since my dad was a Baptist minister. My views are different. I like to gamble.Quote:
Originally Posted by mickeycrimmI wasn't criticizing anything. I was just telling you what to expect when a casino opens in an area that has never had one.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob21I agree. I get it...I get the downside of what happens with casinos. Everybody knows this. You'd have to be living under a rock to not know this. We shouldn’t be debating this, unless you're from Pluto and don’t know what a casino is.Quote:
Originally Posted by mickeycrimm
What you’re both missing is this isn’t the fault of the casino. The casinos are doing what they have been commissioned to do by the State. You should direct your angry at our government for allowing casinos to exists...not the casinos.
Casinos exist as an extension of our government to collect revenue for our government. They are run by private businesses, as an extension of our government. Think of it as a voluntary tax program or a tax program for the stupid, who are usually the poor and vulnerable. This is why conservatives don’t believe in casinos....they hurt the most most vulnerable in our society.
The point being your anger should be directed at our government, not casinos. It makes no sense to be angry at an industry that is doing exactly what it’s business model calls, which is to provide negative EV games for the purpose of entertainment. This isn’t my take on it...this is our governments take on it. It’s the same way they promote lotteries.
This is what I don’t understand about APs. They are all the same, pointing out to me how awful casino’s are. On BJTF someone posted about 10 articles showing me how awful and descructive casino’s are. Ok, I get it. Then if that’s the case, why aren’t APs banning together and trying to get them shut down. How does APing hurt casinos? How does APing help the people APs are so concerned about. Hint. It doesn’t.
Being an AP means your complacent in what casinos do. It gets back to inconsistency. APs are some of the most hypocritical people I know. They always criticize an industry, but do nothing about it. Making money in a casino is adding NO value to society, and it’s NOT helping anybody except the AP. Since gambling is a zero sum game, the only value being created in a casino is entertainment, which is what a casinos does. APs are creating NO value by being in casinos and making money. In fact, they are extracting value when they’re in a casino, since they are taking funds from our government. I get they are doing this legally.
Again, casinos are fulfilling their mission that our government has asked of them. They primary purpose is to provide revenue to the State. And they have done this in spades, by contributing billions in revenue to our state and local governments. If you don’t like this, then you should take it up with our government and try to get casinos shut down.
I know my take on this is not a popular one with APs, but it’s the correct one.
My point is I wish APs would quite pointing out the evils of casinos. I think everybody understands the downsides of what happens when a casino opens in an area.
A casino only opens in a new state or local area because the government allows it. And the government allows it to generate more revenue. It’s that simple. I wish all the people who are upset with casinos would direct their angry at our government and not casinos. Why blame an industry for doing what it’s supposed to do?
You clearly don't know what the word "average" means nor the fact that when doing math, you take positive numbers and subtract away negative numbers. That total, also called a "sum", is then divided by some other number, in KJ's case, 50 (or 52) for the number of weeks. The result of that division process is called a "quotient" which is also the average.Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan MendelsonKewlj I've always believed that you could make $85,000 or so a year card counting. The problems arise when you provide too many details. In fact it's all the details that draw out the skepticism. It's all the details that sabotage you.Quote:
Originally Posted by kewlJ
Look at what you've told us and understand how there can be skepticism:
1. You lose $29,000 in a week while you play short hit and run sessions that you describe as a grind. A $29,000 one week grind?
2. You quickly recover the $29,000 and you apparently did it again grinding short hit and run sessions.
3. Your average hit per casino visit is $30 or $50... yet you lost $29,000 in a week and then quickly won it back. That doesn't raise skepticism?
4. You admit to a six month losing streak but recover. Okay, that's doable. But again the recovery comes in grinding short hit and run sessions from 33 casinos at $30 to $50 a pop.
5. You speak of Averages but your average yearly take is under $2500 per casino each year and we have to wonder that you've had huge swings to maintain the averages...
6. And the bottom line is when you have to recover from a weekly loss of $29,000 and when you have to recover from a month or six months of losing, "inquiring minds" must wonder that there's more than $30-$50 casino hits and along with years of doing this you must be known.
7. Heck, they knew my face at Red Rock and Suncoast on my third visits to each casino... but you grind away for 15 years profiting on average $85,000 a year and overcoming $29,000 one week losses and you fly under the radar?
Ya know kewlj, if you just said you make $85,000 a year counting cards there wouldn't be any skepticism. But it's your added detail that sends up the red flares.
Here's an example: Someone goes up to you and says, "Shalom, my name is Anal m'Endelson. I played at Caesars Palace twice a week for the last 3 years. I hit two royal flushes on $25 denom VP for $100k each. Even though I had big wins, I've already lost $350k there overall. My average loss is a little over $1k per trip or $2k per week, even though I've lost significantly more than that on a single trip."
Putting aside your wise ass anti semitic remark, what you presented as an explanation is far different from playing 33 casinos with short hit snd run sessions with bets that fly under the radar of $500 each, that also recover from six months losing streaks and $29,000 one week losses.Quote:
Originally Posted by RS__You clearly don't know what the word "average" means nor the fact that when doing math, you take positive numbers and subtract away negative numbers. That total, also called a "sum", is then divided by some other number, in KJ's case, 50 (or 52) for the number of weeks. The result of that division process is called a "quotient" which is also the average.Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan MendelsonKewlj I've always believed that you could make $85,000 or so a year card counting. The problems arise when you provide too many details. In fact it's all the details that draw out the skepticism. It's all the details that sabotage you.Quote:
Originally Posted by kewlJ
Look at what you've told us and understand how there can be skepticism:
1. You lose $29,000 in a week while you play short hit and run sessions that you describe as a grind. A $29,000 one week grind?
2. You quickly recover the $29,000 and you apparently did it again grinding short hit and run sessions.
3. Your average hit per casino visit is $30 or $50... yet you lost $29,000 in a week and then quickly won it back. That doesn't raise skepticism?
4. You admit to a six month losing streak but recover. Okay, that's doable. But again the recovery comes in grinding short hit and run sessions from 33 casinos at $30 to $50 a pop.
5. You speak of Averages but your average yearly take is under $2500 per casino each year and we have to wonder that you've had huge swings to maintain the averages...
6. And the bottom line is when you have to recover from a weekly loss of $29,000 and when you have to recover from a month or six months of losing, "inquiring minds" must wonder that there's more than $30-$50 casino hits and along with years of doing this you must be known.
7. Heck, they knew my face at Red Rock and Suncoast on my third visits to each casino... but you grind away for 15 years profiting on average $85,000 a year and overcoming $29,000 one week losses and you fly under the radar?
Ya know kewlj, if you just said you make $85,000 a year counting cards there wouldn't be any skepticism. But it's your added detail that sends up the red flares.
Here's an example: Someone goes up to you and says, "Shalom, my name is Anal m'Endelson. I played at Caesars Palace twice a week for the last 3 years. I hit two royal flushes on $25 denom VP for $100k each. Even though I had big wins, I've already lost $350k there overall. My average loss is a little over $1k per trip or $2k per week, even though I've lost significantly more than that on a single trip."
Kewlj brought the skepticism upon himself.
By the way, RS, not only are you an anti semitic pig but the numbers you use in your example are wrong. But it was a nice try sticking up for your AP buddy.
No, the bottom line is the same. Kewlj may have indeed won $85,000 a year betting up to $400 a hand at bkackjack... but the overly dramatic story of hit and runs at 33 different casinos and recovering from big loss swings while flying under the radar for 15 years is just too much for reasonable minds to absorb.
Yes, I see how this works. 51 visits and you still claim to fly under the radar?Quote:
Originally Posted by kewlJ
As I told you... after just three visits to Suncoast and Red Rock they knew who I was and even the cocktail waitresses knew I had cranberry juice without ice.
But you, playing green and black up to $400 a hand are unknown, while I'm playing $5 and $10 craps gets tagged?
I won a match-bet (or freebet i don't remember) for like $400 back in the day, on craps. Asked for black, dealer said it's customary to tip after a big win (dafaq?). I inquired more about what he meant....so of course, I asked him to break down a few blacks for me so I had a few greens and many whites & reds. I just took them all to the cage.Quote:
Originally Posted by kewlJ
Of course there are many dealers who are just straight up awful (ie: for tip hustling or not being appreciative of tips that are small in proportion to session win or average bet). If you're going to make an argument against tipping for that, then go ahead. I have no problem there. Just don't try to make up some other excuse like, "They're just doing their job that they are getting paid to do" or some other nonsense, because IIRC, you say that you tip other people who are also getting paid to do their job (cocktail waitresses, restaurant servers, bartenders at the Phoenix :) etc.).
What part was anti-Semitic? And what numbers are wrong? I've been up for a while now, but my calculator is still showing 350000/(52*3*2) = 1121...Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan MendelsonPutting aside your wise ass anti semitic remark, what you presented as an explanation is far different from playing 33 casinos with short hit snd run sessions with bets that fly under the radar of $500 each, that also recover from six months losing streaks and $29,000 one week losses.Quote:
Originally Posted by RS__You clearly don't know what the word "average" means nor the fact that when doing math, you take positive numbers and subtract away negative numbers. That total, also called a "sum", is then divided by some other number, in KJ's case, 50 (or 52) for the number of weeks. The result of that division process is called a "quotient" which is also the average.Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson
Here's an example: Someone goes up to you and says, "Shalom, my name is Anal m'Endelson. I played at Caesars Palace twice a week for the last 3 years. I hit two royal flushes on $25 denom VP for $100k each. Even though I had big wins, I've already lost $350k there overall. My average loss is a little over $1k per trip or $2k per week, even though I've lost significantly more than that on a single trip."
Kewlj brought the skepticism upon himself.
By the way, RS, not only are you an anti semitic pig but the numbers you use in your example are wrong. But it was a nice try sticking up for your AP buddy.
No, the bottom line is the same. Kewlj may have indeed won $85,000 a year betting up to $400 a hand at bkackjack... but the overly dramatic story of hit and runs at 33 different casinos and recovering from big loss swings while flying under the radar for 15 years is just too much for reasonable minds to absorb.
Alan, nothing about your mind is "reasonable", it's just crazy to think the way you think. You're constantly wrong on gambling and AP stuff and, as succinctly as I can describe it: You just don't get it and you never will.
Please do not call me a pig. In my culture, we cherish them because they are very tasty. Please don't be disrespectful. Thank you in advance.
First off. Kudos to KJ for going to the trouble of listing his numbers. As a working citizen in the corporate world, there are hundreds of "atta boys" which mean nothing. But 3 "aw, fucks" and you're out the door.
KJs Winning days: 650, 837.50, 1575, 600, 425, 1875, 2425, 225, 537.50, 1200, 3375, 112.50, 475, 700, 825, 662.50, 275, 700, 1112.50, 12.50, 825, 350, 1075, 262.50, 3350, 512.50, 450, 275, 400
Since Bob 21 seems to know the inside view of casinos, he may have a more concrete view from their perspective.
From a numbers perspective and blackjack playing standpoint, I'm told that losing days don't matter. From a casino point of view, that is what is suppose to happen. Hence, the atta boys. However, there are 9 winning days exceeding $1,000 over the course of one year. There are definitely 3 aw fucks and quite possibly 5. A tight casino there are likely 9 days.
So we still have $93k to go with no mention of the $29k losing week and $8,800 losing day. But let's take the minimum assumption of just 3 aw fucks a year. That is 30 over the course of 10 years in just 1 casino. With such detailed records, it would be interesting to know what constitutes his start and stoppage of play and length of session.
Also, the two largest winning days out of 51 visits is the majority of his profit for the entire year. I doubt he zoomed in and out on those two days without being noticed and someone getting their ass chewed.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob21I agree. I get it...I get the downside of what happens with casinos. Everybody knows this. You'd have to be living under a rock to not know this. We shouldn’t be debating this, unless you're from Pluto and don’t know what a casino is.Quote:
Originally Posted by mickeycrimmWhen a casino opens in an area where they are the first then look for bankruptcies in the town to go up about 1500% the first year. And about a third of the women that the town sends to prison will be there for gambling related offenses like embezzlement and theft. Stories in the local newspaper along the lines of "Prominent doctor's wife gambles away their fortune" will start appearing.Quote:
Originally Posted by jbjb
I thought you were consistent Bob, it turns out you are not. Look what you just said in the above quote but earlier in post #79 you wrote:
"That’s why I have a policy to NEVER take too much from a casino in any one month and always tip. I know the casinos are the ones adding the value to our society through jobs, entertainment for the people who play responsible (which is the majority), and revenue for the state and local governments."
If the MAJORITY of players are RESPONSIBLE in their gaming budgets how the fuck are all these small towns and cities economies devistated and ruined Bob? You can't have it both ways.
Digest this RS. I've highlighted your anti semitic remark and just one example of your incorrect numbers.
"Shalom, my name is Anal m'Endelson. I played at Caesars Palace twice a week for the last 3 years. I hit two royal flushes on $25 denom VP for $100k each. Even though I had big wins, I've already lost $350k there overall. My average loss is a little over $1k per trip or $2k per week, even though I've lost significantly more than that on a single trip."
But why get tied up with this. Let's focus on what's important which is kewlj's claim. Sure he might have won $85,000 a year... and why not? But it's his entire package of claims that isn't reasonable including and perhaps the most doubtful of all that he FLIES UNDER THE RADAR.
Sorry, RS, but it's just too much to handle, don't you think? After all, you were a dealer, right? Would you start to recognize the same patron after three visits, or four? How about a green and black chip bettor after 51 visits in a year? How about a green and black chip bettor after 51 visits over 15 years?
Are you really calling me unreasonable?
By the way, the glazed ham at the Suncoast breakfast buffet (carved to order) was surprisingly tasty.
Yet he flies under the radar?Quote:
Originally Posted by UCFX
He should have quit after simply saying he wins $85,000 a year.
Perhaps he’s careful about switching shifts and personnel he’s playing in front of within those shifts rather than going at 7am on a weekday with a name tag saying, “Hi, I’m Alan.”
Or maybe there’s plenty that are familiar with him but don’t really give a shit, so he tries to play more in front of those types.
Keep making excuses. You can come up with hundreds of them if you want to.Quote:
Originally Posted by mcap
Bob, to put it another way, Moses the person you idolize " only using a false perception" and makes all those numerous stupid post, do you think he may be just wired a little too tight? With, would you say, a little bit of pent up anger and hostility from personal matters that has been lingering far too long? Subsequently he is trying to take it out on blackjack players who are not responsible for all his poor choices in life.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob21Bosox, I’m having a hard time following you. Could you please write in plain English, rather than in code or as a riddle? What was this post about? It looks like it could be interesting if I could figure out what you’re saying.Quote:
Originally Posted by BoSoxQuote:
Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson
Alan, you seem like a really smart guy, can you figure this baffling puzzle out. You have these 5 gaming websites which include this one. three of those sites have about a hundred ACTIVE members one about 25 and one site only has one active member which site has the most volume of posts made per day, week and per month? You already know the answer and so does everyone else but only you could possibly explain the reason. While you are at it can you explain why that site's threads are also the most read by volume?
I understand you’re the defacto forum defective, but at some point you need to learn to communicate with the average Joe...or Bob.
[QUOTE=Alan Mendelson;85593]Quote:
Originally Posted by RS__No, the bottom line is the same. Kewlj may have indeed won $85,000 a year betting up to $400 a hand at bkackjack... but the overly dramatic story of hit and runs at 33 different casinos and recovering from big loss swings while flying under the radar for 15 years is just too much for reasonable minds to absorb.Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson
If that story is so far fetched to you Alan, How do you explain Moses flying under the radar? While playing single deck Blackjack in Reno for over a decade with a rotation of only 5 casinos, is that story not bizarre to you Allan?
Bosox, how is what I’m saying inconsistent? I’m not following you. Please explain.Quote:
Originally Posted by BoSoxQuote:
Originally Posted by Bob21I agree. I get it...I get the downside of what happens with casinos. Everybody knows this. You'd have to be living under a rock to not know this. We shouldn’t be debating this, unless you're from Pluto and don’t know what a casino is.Quote:
Originally Posted by mickeycrimm
I thought you were consistent Bob, it turns out you are not. Look what you just said in the above quote but earlier in post #79 you wrote:
"That’s why I have a policy to NEVER take too much from a casino in any one month and always tip. I know the casinos are the ones adding the value to our society through jobs, entertainment for the people who play responsible (which is the majority), and revenue for the state and local governments."
If the MAJORITY of players are RESPONSIBLE in their gaming budgets how the fuck are all these small towns and cities economies devistated and ruined Bob? You can't have it both ways.
If everybody played the casino games in a negative EV (the way the games were intended to be played), then state and local governments would have more revenue. That’s a fact. Why? Because casinos would pay more tax on their profits.
The reality is APs have found a way to play these games in a positive EV way and extract revenue from casinos (and thus revenue from state and local governments).
In addition, the reality is there are not that many APs so casinos can absorb that lost and it doesn’t devastate their cites and town’s economies. But these cites and towns would be better off if APs didn’t exists.
This is why I’ve called APs parasites and I include myself in that description when I’m APing. We are PARASITES, living off the host (casinos), which is feeding money to our government. The casino host (or government) can support a couple parasites, but they can’t support a lot of parasites.
It’s similar to people on welfare. Our economy is still fairly robust even thought we’re supporting quite a few people on welfare. People on welfare contribute nothing to the economy, similar to APs. This is not a statement against welfare. But when the number on welfare becomes too big, economies collapse. Look at what is happening in Europe, specifically Greece. Greece’s economy collapsed because the whole country became parasites, and had to be bailed out by the EU.
This is one reason I’m against business models like BJA that recruit and train more parasites (think APs). Just as our country doesn’t need more people on welfare, our country definitely doesn’t need more APs.
[QUOTE=BoSox;85605]Yes. It is bizarre.Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan MendelsonQuote:
Originally Posted by RS__
If that story is so far fetched to you Alan, How do you explain Moses flying under the radar? While playing single deck Blackjack in Reno for over a decade with a rotation of only 5 casinos, is that story not bizarre to you Allan?
Quite frankly if you see someone three times there's a high chance you'll recognize them again. This is one of the principles of advertising. There is a certain tipping point when something registers. In TV, a visual medium, it's three times. In radio, it's 8 times.
I put the question to RS. I'd like to see his answer. I'm sure he'll tell us he recognizes a player after three visits.
Dude, you couldn't figure out the two dice problem after all the clinics you got from people that know how to do the math. If there was a college class on it you would have gotten an F. Those videos of you playing video poker and making all those stupid sub-optimal holds shows clearly that you don't have a clue about numbers. Your lack of ability to learn correct strategy speaks volumes about what you know about probability and statistics. Zilch! Zero! Nada! Nothing!Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson
"Bosox, how is what I’m saying inconsistent? I’m not following you. Please explain."
Bob, you absolutely agreed with mickeycrimm's assessment about the real downside of casinos. Numerous huge increases in bankruptcies, embezzlement, and thefts. When earlier you wrote that you think that the majority of gamblers are responsible players in budgeting their playing dollars. That is a contridiction Bob. If that was true that the majority of gamblers were in fact responsible players you would not see all the resulting hardships that destroy small cities and towns.
Mickeycrimm you just want to focus on me, don't you? You don't want to examine kewlj's claims, right? This is obvious.
I'm glad you brought up my video poker play videos because one of the things I was criticized for was holding three royal cards instead of four to the flush. So I looked it up on Wizard of Odds. Guess what I found:
"3 to a royal flush or 4 to a flush: Keep 3 to a royal flush"
I'm just curious. If a casino opens and immediately gets 5,000 new patrons but the bankruptcy rate triples from 1 case to 3 cases, does your argument above still hold? Do two extra cases of BK mean that 5,000 new casino patrons are irresponsible?Quote:
Originally Posted by BoSox
Good to know someone has figured out, without snatching a Nobel prize and McArthur award, what truly is or isn't "parasitic" in this world. Always great when one genius has taken the steps to light society's way.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob21Bosox, how is what I’m saying inconsistent? I’m not following you. Please explain.Quote:
Originally Posted by BoSoxQuote:
Originally Posted by Bob21
I thought you were consistent Bob, it turns out you are not. Look what you just said in the above quote but earlier in post #79 you wrote:
"That’s why I have a policy to NEVER take too much from a casino in any one month and always tip. I know the casinos are the ones adding the value to our society through jobs, entertainment for the people who play responsible (which is the majority), and revenue for the state and local governments."
If the MAJORITY of players are RESPONSIBLE in their gaming budgets how the fuck are all these small towns and cities economies devistated and ruined Bob? You can't have it both ways.
If everybody played the casino games in a negative EV (the way the games were intended to be played), then state and local governments would have more revenue. That’s a fact. Why? Because casinos would pay more tax on their profits.
The reality is APs have found a way to play these games in a positive EV way and extract revenue from casinos (and thus revenue from state and local governments).
In addition, the reality is there are not that many APs so casinos can absorb that lost and it doesn’t devastate their cites and town’s economies. But these cites and towns would be better off if APs didn’t exists.
This is why I’ve called APs parasites and I include myself in that description when I’m APing. We are PARASITES, living off the host (casinos), which is feeding money to our government. The casino host (or government) can support a couple parasites, but they can’t support a lot of parasites.
It’s similar to people on welfare. Our economy is still fairly robust even thought we’re supporting quite a few people on welfare. People on welfare contribute nothing to the economy, similar to APs. This is not a statement against welfare. But when the number on welfare becomes too big, economies collapse. Look at what is happening in Europe, specifically Greece. Greece’s economy collapsed because the whole country became parasites, and had to be bailed out by the EU.
This is one reason I’m against business models like BJA that recruit and train more parasites (think APs). Just as our country doesn’t need more people on welfare, our country definitely doesn’t need more APs.
Meanwhile, those of us in the dark are trying to figure out how the fast food industry isn't parasitic as a whole, and the tobacco industry isn't parasitic as a whole, and the casino business isn't parasitic as a whole, considering they're all about investing time, energy, and resources that accomplish nothing. May as well pay people to jog on treadmills with crushed glass in their shoes. Keeps them employed and all. Keeps the shoe companies going, because glass is tough on shoes. Keeps the podiatrists employed. And the band aid companies. Plus it's recreational, if you convince people it is.
Thank God for the Bob21s of the world to light our path and name names so we can identify the parasites. LOL. Bob21 doesn't have a doctorate, or a clue, to his name. That's why he's Bob21 and not a real name. The hubris of anonymity rears its brilliant head once again.
As Bugs Bunny would say, "What a maroon."
What I wrote here comes from observation in the early nineties when gambling was spreading through South Dakota,, Colorado and New Mexico. I was bouncing around the mountain states playing the stud hi-lo games. It was my first professional gambling experience.Quote:
Originally Posted by mickeycrimm
When the poker rooms first opened there was a big rush of gambling money in the town. Lots of games going. Six months later it's dwindled down to one or two games a day. The bad players got their money gobbled up by the house rake and the few good players in the house and could no longer afford to play. A lot of the rooms wound up folding. This was just a microcosm of what was going on in the gambling towns.
Take Cripple Creek, Colorado. There was a big rush of capital into the town when gambling first opened up. Everybody opened casinos. The town was going gangbusters. All the joints making money. But a couple years later when all the money from Colorado Springs was gobbled up the weaker joints started folding. Some were bought out by the stronger places just to put them out of business.
The best year Deadwood ever had was it's very first year.
When I first got to Cripple Creek the Phoenix House Poker Room was going gangbusters. Lots of dead money in the room. Six months later it was down to one table of rocks. They closed the room. At that time they had just opened the poker room at Sandia in Albuquerque. So I head down there. The room was going gangbusters. Five stud hi-lo games every day. A year later it was down to one table of rocks.
Sandia was it's own joke. The Indians didn't know anything about game protection. Security was some good ol' boys from down on the reservation. The Caribbean Stud jackpot was hijacked. The poker room manager, Larry Ringinbird, was making book with the poker players (He's dead now so I can use his name). Pit bosses and dealers were pocketing black chips. The craps tables didn't make any money until they fired the Las Vegas crews they hired to run the games. They hired a Las Vegas professional to come in and clean things up. He absconded with 250K. LOL! Experienced gamblers broke those Indians in the hard way.
No, it is NOT. Believing these two statements is not contradictory. I’ve said I agree with Mickey on this point. You’re still missing it. The fact is the majority of gamblers are responsible, but the small amount that aren’t can still increase bankruptcies by 1,500%, and create other problems for a local community. I get it! Everybody pretty much gets this point! You'd have to living under a rock not to understand this.Quote:
Originally Posted by BoSox
Here’s a hypothetical example to show you how that works. Previous to a casino opening, a town has one bankruptcy. After it opens, there are 15 bankruptcy. That’s a 1,500% increase (I think). In this hypothetical example, 5,000 people are gambling responsibly and 15 are not. So in this hypothetical case bankruptcies increased significantly, but yet the majority gambled reasonably and did not go bankrupt.
Why is this so hard for you to understand? Are you slow? Should I start calling you Bobo, the clown again? Lol.
I checked some numbers.
The US population is about 327-million.
Each year in the US there are about 1.1-million new bankruptcy cases.
The American Gaming Association says that depending on age, 20% to 29% of legal age Americans go to a casino at least once a year.
20% of 327-million is about 65-million. If all 1.1-million BK cases were tied to casino gaming it would still be only about 1.5% of casino gamblers.
Alan, thanks for pulling up these numbers. I doubt if Bobo, the clown will get it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob21No, it is NOT. Believing these two statements is not contradictory. I’ve said I agree with Mickey on this point. You’re still missing it. The fact is the majority of gamblers are responsible, but the small amount that aren’t can still increase bankruptcies by 1,500%, and create other problems for a local community. I get it! Everybody pretty much gets this point! You'd have to living under a rock not to understand this.Quote:
Originally Posted by BoSox
Here’s a hypothetical example to show you how that works. Previous to a casino opening, a town has one bankruptcy. After it opens, there are 15 bankruptcy. That’s a 1,500% increase (I think). In this hypothetical example, 5,000 people are gambling responsibly and 15 are not. So in this hypothetical case bankruptcies increased significantly, but yet the majority gambled reasonably and did not go bankrupt.
Why is this so hard for you to understand? Are you slow? Should I start calling you Bobo, the clown again? Lol.
One real problem with these attempts at analyses and generalizations is the issue of definitions. Bob21 uses the phrases "gambling responsibly" and "gambling reasonably" as if they (1) are interchangeable, (2) actually mean something (i.e. have real definitions) and (3) and aren't mired in a casino-centric perspective of the world.
Depending on your place and time, "gambling responsibly" can mean wildly different things. The phrase "gambling responsibly" is casino industry jargon that was ridiculously popularized by the casino industry. To big chunks of the world, "gambling responsibly" is not a real thing. For chunks of American history, "gambling responsibly" was not a real thing. And those places and times wherein "gambling responsibly" was/is an oxymoron are not demonstrably incorrect in their stance.
Bob21 would have people believe that "gambling responsibly," by his overall definition of "parasites" and such, should entail nice slow losses to casinos so as to prop up an ostensibly non-parasitic (by Bob21's figuring) industry. I'd like to point out that Bob21 may as well call himself "CET" when he pushes these ideas.
Sorry Bob21, but the AP club members will tell you I'm dishonest, and a shyster, and I know nothing about math, and I can't even pour water out of a boot.
Listen shit for brains, you are the one who thinks that casinos are great for society in what they contribute. While completely ignoring all the exploitation of very real people, and you think that the AP's are the parasites. Yah you have it right BLOB.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob21No, it is NOT. Believing these two statements is not contradictory. I’ve said I agree with Mickey on this point. You’re still missing it. The fact is the majority of gamblers are responsible, but the small amount that aren’t can still increase bankruptcies by 1,500%, and create other problems for a local community. I get it! Everybody pretty much gets this point! You'd have to living under a rock not to understand this.Quote:
Originally Posted by BoSox
Here’s a hypothetical example to show you how that works. Previous to a casino opening, a town has one bankruptcy. After it opens, there are 15 bankruptcy. That’s a 1,500% increase (I think). In this hypothetical example, 5,000 people are gambling responsibly and 15 are not. So in this hypothetical case bankruptcies increased significantly, but yet the majority gambled reasonably and did not go bankrupt.
Why is this so hard for you to understand? Are you slow? Should I start calling you Bobo, the clown again? Lol.
Not with 10/7 Double Bonus. It's just the opposite.Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson
Casinos strip mine the economy. I strip mine the casinos.
You’re still missing my point Bobo. I do NOT thing casinos are good for our society. I think they are awful for our society. Have you read any of my posts? Please go back and read them. If I was in charge, I’d shut down every one of them, including the ones in Vegas. Obviously, that’s not going to happen.Quote:
Originally Posted by BoSoxListen shit for brains, you are the one who thinks that casinos are great for society in what they contribute. While completely ignoring all the exploitation of very real people, and you think that the AP's are the parasites. Yah you have it right BLOB.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob21No, it is NOT. Believing these two statements is not contradictory. I’ve said I agree with Mickey on this point. You’re still missing it. The fact is the majority of gamblers are responsible, but the small amount that aren’t can still increase bankruptcies by 1,500%, and create other problems for a local community. I get it! Everybody pretty much gets this point! You'd have to living under a rock not to understand this.Quote:
Originally Posted by BoSox
Here’s a hypothetical example to show you how that works. Previous to a casino opening, a town has one bankruptcy. After it opens, there are 15 bankruptcy. That’s a 1,500% increase (I think). In this hypothetical example, 5,000 people are gambling responsibly and 15 are not. So in this hypothetical case bankruptcies increased significantly, but yet the majority gambled reasonably and did not go bankrupt.
Why is this so hard for you to understand? Are you slow? Should I start calling you Bobo, the clown again? Lol.
My point is people’s argument against casinos is missplaced. They should be upset with our government for allowing them. The casinos are doing what our government is asking them to do.
I don't play 10/7 double bonus. I play bonus. But there you go again.... always making excuses and pointing out exceptions. Absolutely typical.Quote:
Originally Posted by mickeycrimmNot with 10/7 Double Bonus. It's just the opposite.Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson
Do you remember that Gary Loveman, CET CEO, commercial. "It's about heart. If you are having a problem setting or keeping a limit we hope you will call this number."
While he was running that commercial this is what he was doing to at least one gambler:
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=...V1EB1FPez6Xbon
That's because there is not one concrete strategy for all video poker games. And if you had any math sense you would have been playing 10/7 Double Bonus instead of 8/5 Bonus.Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan MendelsonI don't play 10/7 double bonus. I play bonus. But there you go again.... always making excuses and pointing out exceptions. Absolutely typical.Quote:
Originally Posted by mickeycrimmNot with 10/7 Double Bonus. It's just the opposite.Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson
You're really getting desperate Mickey. Next you'll tell us that Gary Loveman was personally involved in the Watanabe case.Quote:
Originally Posted by mickeycrimmThat's because there is not one concrete strategy for all video poker games. And if you had any math sense you would have been playing 10/7 Double Bonus instead of 8/5 Bonus.Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan MendelsonI don't play 10/7 double bonus. I play bonus. But there you go again.... always making excuses and pointing out exceptions. Absolutely typical.Quote:
Originally Posted by mickeycrimm
Oops. You already did. LOL
Do you think Loveman didn't know about Watanabe, a guy that was affecting his bottom line to that degree? It went on for a year. If you do you are naive.Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan MendelsonYou're really getting desperate Mickey. Next you'll tell us that Gary Loveman was personally involved in the Watanabe case.Quote:
Originally Posted by mickeycrimmThat's because there is not one concrete strategy for all video poker games. And if you had any math sense you would have been playing 10/7 Double Bonus instead of 8/5 Bonus.Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson
Oops. You already did. LOL
Said much better than anyone else ever could. I would probably add limp dick bad husband and father, but that’s just me.Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson
They gave him a special tier and card based on his play/ losses that only he had. Don’t try and tell me any CEO doesn’t personally know of their largest customer. Typical Alan garbage.Quote:
Originally Posted by mickeycrimmDo you think Loveman didn't know about Watanabe, a guy that was affecting his bottom line to that degree? It went on for a year. If you do you are naive.Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan MendelsonYou're really getting desperate Mickey. Next you'll tell us that Gary Loveman was personally involved in the Watanabe case.Quote:
Originally Posted by mickeycrimm
Oops. You already did. LOL
Alan Mendelson, you are a dishonest man, right through to your core.Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson
You challenge that my numbers don't add up. So I take the trouble to post my numbers. The exact amounts of wins and losses from 51 visits to the casino mentioned, proving that they do add up. And what do I get from you? Not an apology "gee, I was wrong". Not even, an "I misunderstood what you were saying". That would be the response of a decent person. But no not you, Alan.
Instead, you double down making further untrue accusation and challenges. like this line to RS: "After all, you were a dealer, right? Would you start to recognize the same patron after three visits, or four? How about a green and black chip bettor after 51 visits in a year?" This dishonestly paints a picture that I played with the same dealer 51 times.
Do you remember when I said I was only posting my numbers rather than showing copies of my records because I didn't want to make all the information that I record public? One such piece of information that I record for every session is name and description of dealer(s) played against, and the same information for pit personnel. The reason I do that is so I don't play the same dealer and pit over and over. And I especially note not to do so after any kind of session that may draw attention.
It so happens that in those 51 sessions the most I ever played against the same dealer was 5 times. 5 times in a year! So let's get this straight. A dealer at a $25 and up table, seeing a guy betting various amounts of green and black, 5 times throughout the year is going to declare this player public enemy #1? A dealer at a $25 and up table is going to see this dozens of times a day. This is what happens at a $25 table (sometimes I play $50 min). So again the dealer sees a guy 5 times a year that bets these same amounts as most people at $25 and up tables and he is alarmed? And less I remind you that I intentionally keep my sessions short.
You continue to grow more bizarre and dishonest Alan! I don't know why I am even a little surprised.
Two more things I am going to address and then I am done with you, you shyster.
"FLIES UNDER THE RADAR". Your words....not mine! My game is not about "flying under the radar". I am not trying to trick anyone. My game is playing levels that are not unusual and are well tolerated. Levels that are within the casinos comfort level. A player betting green and black at a $25 minimum and up table is just that...completely normal and well tolerated.
You Alan Mendelson,are noticed because you want to be noticed. You want the attention. You want casino personnel to remember you, to remember what you drink, to know your name. I guess that makes you feel good about giving away your money. Everything I do...everything is about avoiding or minimizing attention, right down to how I enter and exit a game and the casino itself. This is just yet another case of you spouting off about things you have no clue about.
The bottom line is you say things like "I am not buying it". These things don't make sense to you because you don't want them to make sense. You go into everything about me, every discussion of me and what I do with an I don't believe or want to believe attitude. I really don't care what you believe or don't believe Alan. I am not on trial here. It's a freaking gambling site and I share some of what I do. I am sick of your dishonesty and trolling....and that is exactly what it is, Mr. Shyster son of a shyster mob lawyer.
Sorry kewlj. But your story just doesn't add up. There's no way in the world that you're not noticed. Insult me all you want because insults are all you have.
You should have quit with "I make $85,000 a year." That is very believeable.
Good! I am glad my story doesn't add up to you. That proves I am doing something right. I should be so lucky as to have everyone be as dumb as you. :rolleyes:Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson
The joke is on me I guess for trying to convince the village idiot of anything.
But I would be willing to bet that my story adds up to most people on this forum. I mean sure there will be you and singer, and blackhole, and bob21 and whatever sockpuppet Moses is using, maybe coach belly....the usual anti-AP crowd who refuse to see anything add up, but for most normal, objective members of the site, who don't have an agenda, who aren't anti-AP because they hate players that use their brain to win instead of just donating their money to casinos, everything adds up just fine. :cool:
This is a pure example of what a dishonest sleeze bag you are Alan Mendelson. You know damn right well I don't have a GED, I have a high school diploma, because I have shared that experience. I finished my final 3 months of high school living in a homeless shelter after my stepfather kicked me out on my 18th birthday. I got up at the crack of dawn, took 2 public transportation buses to school, played on the school baseball team after school, worked at the mall in the evening and then two buses back to the homeless shelter.Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson
I am damn proud of that high school diploma. I earned it! I may not have 33 hours of Syracuse economics behind me, as my plans for college, and I did have plans for college, went out the window, the morning I turned 18 (still in high school) and found myself homeless.
So fuck you Alan! You continue to show what a sleezy low life, dishonest person you are every single day.
I have to ask, Alan, who is it really that you hate so much, me or yourself?
Stop for a moment kewlj and explain how someone like you who is a known winner and frequents 30 casinos on a regular basis and plays green and black chips isn't known to casino management?
How is that possible after 15 years?
Something is wrong. I wonder what it could be?
Wonder why it is that Alan’s posting activity suddenly goes thru the roof right at the end of the month....things that make you go hmmmmm:confused:Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson
I have explained it over and over and over.Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson
I guess the real question is why have I explained it over and over and over. That is on me. :(
Alan, you are a guy insisting that the earth is flat, when it has been explained over and over, shown pictures, everything and you respond "yeah but we are all going to fall of the side of the earth".
I am not explaining anything further to you because you aren't capable of learning anything. Your mission is to troll. I mean you are a guy who takes pride in the fact that you are a donor to the casino industry. I should just say thank you for that and move on. Because people that choose to play with an advantage need all the Alan Mendelson's that we can get to make it possible for us to win. So thank you.
And now I am off to work, although I don't feel much like working on such a beautiful day. I guess that is one of the traps of any kind of self employment. :(
Wow kj, you really have a highschool diploma? Good job! I’m proud of you!Quote:
Originally Posted by kewlJThis is a pure example of what a dishonest sleeze bag you are Alan Mendelson. You know damn right well I don't have a GED, I have a high school diploma, because I have shared that experience. I finished my final 3 months of high school living in a homeless shelter after my stepfather kicked me out on my 18th birthday. I got up at the crack of dawn, took 2 public transportation buses to school, played on the school baseball team after school, worked at the mall in the evening and then two buses back to the homeless shelter.Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson
I am damn proud of that high school diploma. I earned it! I may not have 33 hours of Syracuse economics behind me, as my plans for college, and I did have plans for college, went out the window, the morning I turned 18 (still in high school) and found myself homeless.
So fuck you Alan! You continue to show what a sleezy low life, dishonest person you are every single day.
I have to ask, Alan, who is it really that you hate so much, me or yourself?
Let’s say your story is correct about being a 15 year professional card counter. Is this all you want out of life? Doesn’t it get boring after a while?
Like a smack addict on the way to the dealer, he knows his fix is coming soon.Quote:
Originally Posted by KeystoneWonder why it is that Alan’s posting activity suddenly goes thru the roof right at the end of the month....things that make you go hmmmmm:confused:Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson
While he is a fun punching bag, if it was anyone else I would feel back busting on him like we do. But the broke stupid bastard keeps coming back for more so he must enjoy it.
As if he doesn’t get enough abuse from trying to take a normal shit each day and looking at his bank account, he still needs this site for more.
Kewlj at some point you have to go to the cage. While you might slip into games with chips in your pocket you can't keep everything in chips... or do you? This is just one of the blanks in your story.
Unfortunately you do have a history of telling stories and then making corrections to them.
For example you have admitted to being backed off when you initially said you hadn't. You even conceded that counting two tables could be accomplished under favorable conditions when your initial statement had no qualifications.
Now I haven't challenged you winning $85,000 a year. Frankly that's a realistic amount. For example there's a player I know at Red Rock who plays craos, pai gow, blackjack and baccarat who makes ON AVERAGE $100 a day and leaves. That's about $2500 a month and the dealers and managers don't bother him. In fact they like what he does and they admire him for it. They openly talk about him.
The reality is that regular players can't hide, except you? I'm sure mickeycrimm becomes known... he even gets comped rooms and meals and he tips too in order to keep the good karma.
It's your outlandish claims that draw the attention kewlj. If you were more "human" and less "Super AP" no one would object.
Not a blank Alan. I have talked about this. Undoubtedly, I have talked too much about this. :( My late partner was responsible for managing my chip inventory. That means making sure, There is not an excessive amount of chips for any casino. Just a few hundred to enter the game. This means his job was cash outs at the cage, which he did in small amounts at a time. This means I got to avoid the cage, which happens to be the spot that the casino has the best chance to get a good photo shot. He perfected this responsibility of managing my chip inventory. So it is a little harder for me, but I still manage to cash chips without doing so immediately after playing. Not going to get any more specific than that.Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson
Could you quote where I said I didn't get backed off and then changed because that never happened. I have been getting backed off since the day I arrived in Vegas. Actually my first Vegas backoffs were before I moved here. I have shared some of the stories of some of them on different forums for 10 years now. Some include repeated early backoffs at the small sweaty place downtown. Once 3 days in a row. Once the pit dude "mo" (Maurice) followed me into the men's room to back me off. At south point, the security escorted me off the property. I was backed off the table, told "no more blackjack", but not told I had to leave, but I did leave and as I was standing out front waiting for my ride, a bicycle security told me to leave the property and flowed me on his bike, down to the street, like he was someone important.Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson
Before I even moved to Vegas, on an early visit, I was backed off and being taken to the back room, by several "suits" and two security dudes. As we turned down a hall, I told one of the suits I wanted to call my attorney Robert Nersesian. Bob had just won a big settlement against a sister property of this chain. I didn't actually know bob at the time, but threw his name out. Upon doing so, one of the suits stopped, turned, glared at me and said "get the hell out of here". Bob saved me from my only backroom experience, and didn't even know it. ;) He does now as we have discussed it. He has joked about billing me. I buy him lunch now and again.
Valley Forge, Pa. I was backed off, but not told I had to leave. As I was wondering around the casino, I couldn't help but notice my own private security "kid" (he looked about 19) following 3 steps behind me, ever step of the way. I went into the men's room and when I came out he was leaning against the wall playing on his phone (not paying attention). I said to him "come on let's go" and he snapped to attention and resumed following me, until I left the building. :rolleyes: While that is a comical story, that backoff was actually my single worst. Valley Forge being a big contributor to OSN, made an entry with a rather clear picture of me. When I got back to Vegas, within days I was backed off at several of my regular casinos from that entry.
Backoffs are only temporary though until things cool down. And there is something to be learned from each backoffs. That is why I have shared some of my experiences. So maybe I haven't told all these experiences here in my two years, as until recently there was little blackjack discussion. But many can attest that I have shared these experiences on various forums. So I have no idea what you are talking about when you say "I initially said I hadn't been backed off". As a matter of fact the reason I moved to Vegas was because I lost Atlantic City. Not technically a backoff, because AC can't backoff or ban players, but countermeasures that amount to the same thing. So just another case of you not knowing what the fuck you are talking about, and making shit up, Alan.
And the tracking two tables...a lie. I always said when conditions permit.
Complete folklore. The fact that you believe this tells all anyone needs to know about you.Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson
I am late now, I gotta jet. Have a nice day. I know it will be a long day for you being end of the month and broke. Only a few more days until your check comes and you can resume donating to your favorite charity. :cool:
Complete folklore that someone besides you can win on average $100 day? LOL. That's just typical of the AP Club... you have to be a member. Well maybe he's an AP too?
By the way, my direct deposits come on the 1st, 5th, 12th and 15th. The AP Clubbers should correct their attacks.
Totally explains your increased forum activity towards the end of the month.Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson
RE: Recognizing the same player -- sure I'd probably recognize the guy if he came in three days in a row and played on my table each time.
But if a guy came in on a Friday at 9pm, he very well may go unnoticed. Next week he plays on Tuesday at 3pm, I'm not gonna see him because that's a different shift. Next week he plays Thursday evening, and if he's lucky, that's my day off....or else if I am there, then he needs to sit at my table in order for me to possibly notice him. Even if I do recognize him, that doesn't mean much if I don't even suspect him of card-counting. And if I do suspect him of counting, I actually need to give a shit and do something about it. If he is suspected of counting, they're generally going to want to have surveillance run the tapes, and given how he plays short sessions, they very well may have the attitude of, "Who gives a shit? He plays for 30-60 minutes at a time, he's polite, and doesn't camp out all day long. I'm only going to worry about it if it's obvious he's counting, and I don't even know if he is. Too much work."
Many floor people don't really give a shit about their job. They'd rather turn a blind eye if they can than have to deal with a situation.
Excellent post RS. Great insight from a former dealer.Quote:
Originally Posted by RS__
As a card counter, the dealers are not my biggest concern. Sure I have had a few that have 'ratted' on me, especially early on. But for the most part, my impression of most dealers is they are just "average joe's" wanting to get through their shift and get home, or the bar, or where ever they are going after work. You learn to read the few that might be a problem.
That phrase that RS used about turning a blind eye, I call that "the path of least resistance". And not only is it common among dealers, but it is pretty common among pit personnel. Backing off a player is not something most pit critters want to do and go looking for. It can make them look bad at the table in front of other patron. And at most places it is just extra work as they may have to report the action.
What they don't want is someone camping out for hours or walking away with a huge win that they have to answer for. Short sessions solves the first problem and minimizes the second. Sure there still will be some big wins, but much less frequently that if someone camped out for 4 hours.
And this is actually a scenario where familiarity works in the players favor. I mean Alan is right in that while I take steps to minimize playing too frequently with same dealers and pit, I am sure some recognize me. I sometimes see that look or recognition, even with pit folks. But they know that in 20 minutes, a half hour, 45 minutes at most (shoe game), I am gone out of their hair, with them having had to do nothing. Again...that is known as the path of least resistance and it is a human trait. Given a choice, most people choose that path whether they know it or not.
This is also where reading people, comes into play. You learn to do this. Mostly what you are looking for is that person where your play has for whatever reason, gone outside their comfort level. You learn to see the signs. Because a backoff NEVER occurs out of the blue. There are always signs. Sometimes as a player we miss those signs, but there are always warning signs.
Hey kj, how much time do you spend traveling between casinos and how much do you spend playing? It sounds like you spend most your time traveling between casinos. From experience, I know you can go an hour or more in a shoe game before you get a postive count. Do you leave after a postive count and you show your spread the first time? If you do, it sounds like your play is very inefficient from a time standpoint.Quote:
Originally Posted by kewlJExcellent post RS. Great insight from a former dealer.Quote:
Originally Posted by RS__
As a card counter, the dealers are not my biggest concern. Sure I have had a few that have 'ratted' on me, especially early on. But for the most part, my impression of most dealers is they are just "average joe's" wanting to get through their shift and get home, or the bar, or where ever they are going after work. You learn to read the few that might be a problem.
That phrase that RS used about turning a blind eye, I call that "the path of least resistance". And not only is it common among dealers, but it is pretty common among pit personnel. Backing off a player is not something most pit critters want to do and go looking for. It can make them look bad at the table in front of other patron. And at most places it is just extra work as they may have to report the action.
What they don't want is someone camping out for hours or walking away with a huge win that they have to answer for. Short sessions solves the first problem and minimizes the second. Sure there still will be some big wins, but much less frequently that if someone camped out for 4 hours.
And this is actually a scenario where familiarity works in the players favor. I mean Alan is right in that while I take steps to minimize playing too frequently with same dealers and pit, I am sure some recognize me. I sometimes see that look or recognition, even with pit folks. But they know that in 20 minutes, a half hour, 45 minutes at most (shoe game), I am gone out of their hair, with them having had to do nothing. Again...that is known as the path of least resistance and it is a human trait. Given a choice, most people choose that path whether they know it or not.
This is also where reading people, comes into play. You learn to do this. Mostly what you are looking for is that person where your play has for whatever reason, gone outside their comfort level. You learn to see the signs. Because a backoff NEVER occurs out of the blue. There are always signs. Sometimes as a player we miss those signs, but there are always warning signs.
It’s hard for me to see how you make any money playing short sessions. I get how this gives you cover. But I’d think this would mean you'd spend most of your time in your car driving between casinos.
Also, you said something about “average joe’s”. What about the “average bob’s”? Does the same thinking apply?
Bob21, I developed my style of short sessions, specifically FOR Las Vegas, when I moved here. It is different than what I played in AC. One of the smartest guys I encountered on these forum, known under the handle 'bigplayer' had a saying that "the strength of Las Vegas blackjack is quantity not quality". There is no other place, where you have so many "playable" games in such close proximity. That is why short sessions works so well here. I couldn't play my style in Pennsylvania, or the Midwest or anywhere else, the way I play it here.
And on top of just playing short sessions with aggressive exit triggers which extremely minimizes negative rounds, I had a driver for about 7 years. Health issue with his back prevented my partner from playing a lot of blackjack so he served as my driver until he passed away. I don't think players really realize just how much benefit there is to the short session, hit-and-run game to have someone dropping you off at the door and picking you up. You save considerable time. I didn't even realize how great I had it until I no longer had that.
No, just a positive count is not an exit trigger. Max bet count is. Once I show max bet I will exit at the next shuffle, of a shoe game. DD, I have some other tricks that allows me to show max bet twice. So if the count goes positive and I raise my bet to say $150/$200, no that is not an exit trigger. I can play another shoe until I show max bet or hit another exit trigger.
As for playing an hour or so without seeing a positive count. Rarely with my style. For one I track multiple tables when I can (wait til you see the shit storm this comment triggers). Tracking a second table means it is twice as likely to see a positive count in the same time frame. I also have aggressive negative count triggers. So even if I am unable to track a second table, I do not sit there and play through 15 minutes of negative counts to get to the next shoe. I aggressively exit negative counts and will jump immediately to a new table. These techniques means I am seeing far more rounds in a typical 45 minute period, which means there are several times the likelihood that I am going to see and play the max bet opportunities that I am seeking.
While most counters understand the advantage of a hit and run style, few can maximize it the way I do. For one thing there is really only once location to do that. And don't take this comment as me saying how great I am. I think the title of greatest card counter has already been claimed by Zenking. :rolleyes: All I do is maximize my play for the situation I have available and everything I have learned I have learned from other players on these forums. That is why I hate that this forum isn't about sharing experiences so as to help and benefit other players but rather attempts to discredit and tear other members down.
And you should stop being such a piece of shit degenerate gambler.Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson
Everyone knows you stiffed your son and laugh about it. Only thing worse than you is the gold diggers who stick that ugly unnatural cock of yours in their mouth while thinking you actually have the money you profess to have while seducing them.
Many have lost their money believing in you but more keep coming back for more while you smile with that creepy hair. Yea I don’t get it, but respect finding a way to fuck them over time and time again.
There is a special place in hell for you Alan, right beside David Seigel. One can only argue if you or Singer gets there first.
I’m betting on you Alan if it helps. But then again, I’m a taxpayer keeping your sorry ass alive while you suck out on the system your lazy ass fucks over year after year.