Strong Arm Removal at MGM

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Originally Posted by redietz

Sure, if that's want you want to say, I served Mr. Walters coffee cake on Wednesdays. Or strudel. Sometimes we bet on it ("Guys and Dolls"). I had a wonderful reputation as a strudel server, so his lackeys contacted me. It was my grandmother's strudel recipe.

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Glad to see your coming clean.

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Originally Posted by blackhole

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Originally Posted by redietz

I'm truly sorry. If you're a rousing success in the NFL, maybe Billy Walters will recruit you. Then you'll have some non-fiction stories to share with the forum.

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What exactly was your position with the Billy Walters group? Did you get coffee and cake for him in between placing bets without knowing why the bet was being placed. Did you know when he was trying to change the odds when the real money was on a different hopeful winner?

I love the way two-bit alleged AP’s on assorted anonymous forums seem to always sooner or later when using an example, fall back on the exceptionally rare one-time wonders of other famous AP people. I can’t tell you how many times I heard the names like Billy Walters, Don Johnson, MIT team, Phil Ivey, Doyle Brunson, etc. being used in alleged AP conversation as if their play is equal to their achievements.

I wonder if the two-bit alleged AP’s on these different forums ever realized that these extremely rare individuals never openly talked anywhere about their strategies until it was exposed. Even then it’s usually in a court room.

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So this is where I disclose that I actually sired secretariat.

So, blackhole, regale us with your vast knowledge on gambling by telling us exactly what law was put in place to deal with Billy Walters. Maybe Alan or Rob or Bill Yung can help. That is, after they do exhaustive searches on the internet trying to figure out what law it is so they can come back here and act like they knew it the whole time.

Mickeycrimm I'm still looking for info about what triggered security guards to do something that security guards don't normally do without a manager or supervisor directing them to do it?

Please keep me out of the other petty debates.

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Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson

Mickeycrimm I'm still looking for info about what triggered security guards to do something that security guards don't normally do without a manager or supervisor directing them to do it?

Please keep me out of the other petty debates.

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Most likely surveillance.

Jbjb it's very UNLIKELY that security by themselves would approach any player. If security was concerned they'd contact some manager or supervisor first. Especially in the case of APs who might be on high denomination machines, security would not want to risk offending a high limit player without talking to management and having management there with them.

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Originally Posted by mickeycrimm

So, blackhole, regale us with your vast knowledge on gambling by telling us exactly what law was put in place to deal with Billy Walters. Maybe Alan or Rob or Bill Yung can help. That is, after they do exhaustive searches on the internet trying to figure out what law it is so they can come back here and act like they knew it the whole time.

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I'm thinking that Walters didn't know about it either. Same way they got Capone. You're not supposed to see it coming.

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Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson

Jbjb it's very UNLIKELY that security by themselves would approach any player. If security was concerned they'd contact some manager or supervisor first. Especially in the case of APs who might be on high denomination machines, security would not want to risk offending a high limit player without talking to management and having management there with them.

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Getting a dealt royal flush is also UNLIKELY but it DOES HAPPEN. It's very possible these players have been under watch by the EITS for a while.

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Originally Posted by mickeycrimm

So, blackhole, regale us with your vast knowledge on gambling by telling us exactly what law was put in place to deal with Billy Walters. Maybe Alan or Rob or Bill Yung can help. That is, after they do exhaustive searches on the internet trying to figure out what law it is so they can come back here and act like they knew it the whole time.

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I'm not sure why you're asking blackhole this question. The law was mentioned by redietz. Now I'm curious... what's the law?

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Originally Posted by jbjb

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Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson

Jbjb it's very UNLIKELY that security by themselves would approach any player. If security was concerned they'd contact some manager or supervisor first. Especially in the case of APs who might be on high denomination machines, security would not want to risk offending a high limit player without talking to management and having management there with them.

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Getting a dealt royal flush is also UNLIKELY but it DOES HAPPEN. It's very possible these players have been under watch by the EITS for a while.

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My point is some "suit" would be with security. Security would not show up alone.

And what exactly did these guys do?

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Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson

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Originally Posted by jbjb

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Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson

Jbjb it's very UNLIKELY that security by themselves would approach any player. If security was concerned they'd contact some manager or supervisor first. Especially in the case of APs who might be on high denomination machines, security would not want to risk offending a high limit player without talking to management and having management there with them.

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Getting a dealt royal flush is also UNLIKELY but it DOES HAPPEN. It's very possible these players have been under watch by the EITS for a while.

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My point is some "suit" would be with security. Security would not show up alone.

And what exactly did these guys do?

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"Some suit" is not always with security.

As for what they did, I have no idea.

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Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson

Jbjb it's very UNLIKELY that security by themselves would approach any player. If security was concerned they'd contact some manager or supervisor first. Especially in the case of APs who might be on high denomination machines, security would not want to risk offending a high limit player without talking to management and having management there with them.

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The first thing to know when security asks for ID is the jig is up. They are going to trespass you and they want your personal information for future reference. Don't give it to them. They are not the cops. And I don't know where you got the idea that security has to have a suit around. They don't. I've rarely seen a suit around when security jacks someone up.

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Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson

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Originally Posted by mickeycrimm

So, blackhole, regale us with your vast knowledge on gambling by telling us exactly what law was put in place to deal with Billy Walters. Maybe Alan or Rob or Bill Yung can help. That is, after they do exhaustive searches on the internet trying to figure out what law it is so they can come back here and act like they knew it the whole time.

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I'm not sure why you're asking blackhole this question. The law was mentioned by redietz. Now I'm curious... what's the law?

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So he can show his vast knowledge of everything gambling.

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Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson

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Originally Posted by jbjb

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Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson

Jbjb it's very UNLIKELY that security by themselves would approach any player. If security was concerned they'd contact some manager or supervisor first. Especially in the case of APs who might be on high denomination machines, security would not want to risk offending a high limit player without talking to management and having management there with them.

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Getting a dealt royal flush is also UNLIKELY but it DOES HAPPEN. It's very possible these players have been under watch by the EITS for a while.

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My point is some "suit" would be with security. Security would not show up alone. And what exactly did these guys do?

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Security shows up alone all the time. I don't know where you got that cockamamie idea. And the crime committed by the slot AP's is only playing certain machines and then only playing them when they find them in advantage mode. It's not as well known about slot AP's catching heat as blackjack players. This is not the first time MGM has went on the war path. Fifteen years ago the Chinese had monopolized the MGM vulturable games. One day security lined about 20 of them up and marched them out the door.

I guess I just don't play in the casinos you do Mickey. The only time I've seen security approach a player (who was not having a visual problem such as illness) was with a suit. I've seen suits ask players for IDs just as dealers do. In Nevada you must present an ID on demand or you can't play. That's the law.

WHAT EXACTLY TRIGGERED THE REQUEST FOR ID?

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Originally Posted by pepe

Probably a good idea to not even stick your players card in certain machines at MLife properties

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Why the hell would you vulture a play that might go as few as three spins with a card in?

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Originally Posted by MaxPen

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Originally Posted by mickeycrimm

Okay. I finally got some information. The guy was playing advantage slots in Luxor when security approached him and asked for ID. He refused. They trespassed him. He walked over to Excalibur and was checking the HD's when he was tackled from behind and without warning by security. He went crashing to the floor with them on top of him. It broke his nose and a possible broken wrist. He lost a lot of blood. They had to bring in hazmat to clean it up. Robert Nersessian took the case and said it will cash for 125K to 200K.

The person this happened to is not just well known as a slot AP. He is also known in poker, baccarat and other forms of gambling.

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That is turning out to be a pretty lucrative vulture play.

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Fuck yeah! Do you have about $100,000 you don't want, MaxPen? You can break my nose, but I want the money first. I've had a broken nose, I'd consider the pain far less than $100,000. I'm not making you a better offer, though.

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Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson

I guess I just don't play in the casinos you do Mickey. The only time I've seen security approach a player (who was not having a visual problem such as illness) was with a suit. I've seen suits ask players for IDs just as dealers do. In Nevada you must present an ID on demand or you can't play. That's the law.

WHAT EXACTLY TRIGGERED THE REQUEST FOR ID?

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What exactly happened was security intended to trespass a slot pro and the first step in the process is to ask for ID. Showing them your ID won't do you any good and could possibly do you a lot of harm because they could pass the information around. You are a dead duck. Forget about trying to talk your way out of it. Don't show them ID and head for the door.

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Originally Posted by Mission146

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Originally Posted by MaxPen

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Originally Posted by mickeycrimm

Okay. I finally got some information. The guy was playing advantage slots in Luxor when security approached him and asked for ID. He refused. They trespassed him. He walked over to Excalibur and was checking the HD's when he was tackled from behind and without warning by security. He went crashing to the floor with them on top of him. It broke his nose and a possible broken wrist. He lost a lot of blood. They had to bring in hazmat to clean it up. Robert Nersessian took the case and said it will cash for 125K to 200K.

The person this happened to is not just well known as a slot AP. He is also known in poker, baccarat and other forms of gambling.

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That is turning out to be a pretty lucrative vulture play.

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Fuck yeah! Do you have about $100,000 you don't want, MaxPen? You can break my nose, but I want the money first. I've had a broken nose, I'd consider the pain far less than $100,000. I'm not making you a better offer, though.

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The problem with such a "play" is getting paid off. A jury has a lot less sympathy for a bum/gambler/crook. Maybe more sympathy for an author of gambling corn.

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Originally Posted by mickeycrimm

It's not as well known about slot AP's catching heat as blackjack players.

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Well, this is another bit of reading between Crimm's lines.

Why more heat for blackjack players, who, according to Crimm, by way of KJ's $275 a day (to $100,000 a year), make less than his $500 a day? I mean, it's still the casino's money that he's running off with.

So, out of some more curiosity sparked by this seeming contradiction, I did a general search for making money from slots. The second bit I read was this.

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Having run many casinos, there are a few ways we see people make a living playing slots, although it is a generally a low income living.

You can become a jackpot Hunter and only play machines when the progressive jackpot is so high that the machine has swung to a mathematical Player advantage. This is not uncommon, and usually involves an entire team of people playing when the machine becomes advantageous to the player. It's a little tricky but not too difficult to understand exactly when this point has been reached.

The second way to make a living playing slots is to take advantage of casino promotions such as triple points, cashback, etc. these deals are not widespread, but if you're happy taking payment in the form of hotel rooms and free food then you can certainly make a living doing this. Also, a good portion of your income on this method will be your invitations to free slot tournaments. When doing this, you have to be sure to play a game with an extremely low house advantage like properly played video poker, or video blackjack.

The third way is to become A professional video poker player and looking for the games that have over 100% payback. Casinos offer these games as a promotion, knowing that most players will never be able to achieve the full 100+ percent payback. So if you study video poker and couple this with cashback and comps you too can earn a living playing slots.

https://www.quora.com/How-can-I-play...ine-for-living

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By Todd Haushalter, Vice President, Gaming Ops at MGM Resorts International. He should know. Right?

Well, he called it a "low income living".