Russians like to drink vodka and smoke cigarettes. I stick with vodka but I'm not Russian. I'm Ukrainian from the east coast of the U.S.of A.
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Russians like to drink vodka and smoke cigarettes. I stick with vodka but I'm not Russian. I'm Ukrainian from the east coast of the U.S.of A.
Reagan helped cause the USSR to implode by ramping up the Arms Race; the soviets couldn't keep up.
Not it's Putin's turn to try to fuck us the way we did them by escalating the Arms Race (hypersonic missile, underwater weapons etc.).
They say turnabout is fair play.
American Life Expectancy has also fallen the last couple of years.Quote:
Originally Posted by MisterV
Russia may try to escalate the arms race but that’s not going to help their economy much. Their economy isn’t even in the top 10 in the world. It’s like 13th behind South Korea. Another reason why I didn’t buy into the “Putin wanted Trump to win” schtick, yeah he wanted us to have a stronger military and a growing world leading economy.
America is circling the toilet due to rampant declining social morals.Quote:
Originally Posted by MisterV
like with reagans star wars.....putins new weapons are a fairy tale as wellQuote:
Originally Posted by MisterV
you cant bullshit a bullshitter
its been done.....and done very well by reagan....so he is trying to pull the same rabbit out of the hat. That rabbit has long died.
The real question is "what kind of super weapons do we REALLY have?"
There's stuff out there, kept under wraps, that we've no inkling of.
Beyond basic beam weapons, rail guns, and sonic weapons.
Putin has to do with weapons what the nurse with a hand opuppet at the doctors office does to the young child as the doctor injects the vaccine.
Its a distraction for the Russian masses. They dont have the creature comforts that most americans have. The internet shows them slices of the outside world....andthey know what they have and what they dont have i comparison. Why isnt my leader providing a better world in russia they may ask. But wait....we are a power in the world....my country can beat up your country.
Whereas the folks in the USA dont give a shit. We drink our starbucks, drive our cars with relatively cheap gas, we go to movies and sporting events watching the best actors and athletes in the world, we have out adult toys to play with after work, and our military prowess is the last things on our mind.
While the russians stand on line for the newest shipment of vegetables at the local market....they can smile that their leader ensures them that he can kick our collective asses.
YAWN
As I sit in front of my laptop while I listen to sports talk radio while my wife is in the other room watching everybody loves raymond on a large flatscreen tv. In a well heated spacious home.
the biggest threat to me is terrorism......not russia.
Romes is the one that is hard to figure out. By all accounts he is very successful at multiple ventures and seemed to have earned everything through the basics, hard work, common sense and making the right decisions in life instead of the easy ones. To me these are core conservative principles that almost anyone can follow and have a good life in America. But it seems he has the liberal disease of thinking most people are too lazy and stupid to make it on their own without government help, or those who have succeeded cheated to get there. Typical liberal nonsense.Quote:
Originally Posted by mickeycrimm
There is more opportunity and money to be made than perhaps ever before in history yet many just want to sit back, and bitch and moan about how crooked the system is. Get off your ass, get a 2nd job, pay your debts and find your opportunity. It’s sad how the liberals have created a generation of “victims”.
You're still here, aren't you?Quote:
Originally Posted by LarryS
Liberal politicians NEED a permanent underclass, one with a victims mentality....even better.Quote:
Originally Posted by The BozRomes is the one that is hard to figure out. By all accounts he is very successful at multiple ventures and seemed to have earned everything through the basics, hard work, common sense and making the right decisions in life instead of the easy ones. To me these are core conservative principles that almost anyone can follow and have a good life in America. But it seems he has the liberal disease of thinking most people are too lazy and stupid to make it on their own without government help, or those who have succeeded cheated to get there. Typical liberal nonsense.Quote:
Originally Posted by mickeycrimm
There is more opportunity and money to be made than perhaps ever before in history yet many just want to sit back, and bitch and moan about how crooked the system is. Get off your ass, get a 2nd job, pay your debts and find your opportunity. It’s sad how the liberals have created a generation of “victims”.
what does what I say have to do with attendance.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill YungYou're still here, aren't you?Quote:
Originally Posted by LarryS
your logic is a failure.
Some, but not all liberals may harbor that belief.Quote:
Originally Posted by dannyj
Seems to me that the difference between liberals and conservatives is compassion and empathy toward others vs. concern primarily for oneself.
For example, you're driving down the road and see that a car ran off the road into a tree, and a person is standing in the roadway trying to flag you down as you approach.
A liberal wonders "How can I help?"whereas a conservative wonders "Is this guy gonna try to rob me?"
2 things can be equally true.
he could legitimately have a car crash and he can be a murdering rapist
the condition of the car doesnt change who he is.
in which case I drive by, dont stop, and call the local police to report it.
according to you, more liberals are assaulted, and robbed because they put themselves in these positions more than conservatives. Could be.
kind of like the innocent or stupid child that walks up to a wild animal in the woods to feed it....it could be a deer or a bear....the aftermath varies
i think you have bought into the myth that conservatives show less compassion and empathy toward others. Some, but not all conservatives may harbor that belief.
People watch "news" that they like to hear. Rachel Maddow....enough said.
It is a generalization, certainly, but it helps to illustrate the great divide.
Larry, even the best bullshitters bullshit themselves. And, diamonds cut diamonds. The best we can do is find ourselves, and let the rest of the world fight it out.Quote:
Originally Posted by LarrySwhat does what I say have to do with attendance.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill YungYou're still here, aren't you?Quote:
Originally Posted by LarryS
your logic is a failure.
and the fact that "i am here" is illustrative of nothing regarding the statement "you cant bullshit a bullshitter".
if i were a "bullshitter" or werent a "bullshitter".....I would still be here. One or the other has nothing to do with attendance or lack of attendance.
Didn't kewlj and Mendelson bullshit each other (and all of us) until they both left in a huff?
kj didnt leave and Alan didnt leave because he was a bullshitter...he left because he has thin skin and he is weak.
How do you know? Have you ever met or spoken with him? Maybe he doesn’t care what his on-line persona is or simply tired of talking to strangers all day long..or maybe he left along with the many others because...well you’re a smart boy, you can figure it outQuote:
Originally Posted by LarryS
ok i will rephrase regarding alan
his online "persona" has thin skin, and his online "persona is weak.
it would be rare that a person would be thin skinned online, and weak online and be a pillar of strength in real life. But I give you that. In real life he could be a real tiger.
In all fairness to alan, he wound up enduring a pile of shit that would have taxed the powers of Hercules.
Not that he didn't deserve it, but I cannot fault him for packing up his tent and moving off.
Only a true masochist would have stuck around.
there is nothing that an anonymous person can say on these anonymous boards that should be able to vex someone. For all I know MrV is an inmate in an insane asylum that was released under Regan, and for all you know I can be serving time at Rahway prison. Now if someone you respect and has credentials undresses you in public..that is something different.
Bur "Mr V was mean to me" is juvenile and weak. Mr V could be homeless and posting out of a library. He has zero cred....just as I as well.
If you claim to see a ten billion to 1 event occur, and you claim you had many chances to financially take advantage of it but refused....a sane person would see where the doubt comes from. He however never acknowledge that it was unbelievable behavior not to bet on this unbelievable event. He simple stated as fact that he doesnt bet on the horn. He never even claimed that he kicked himself for not placing a small bet. Then he is incredulous when people question the bizarre behavior coupled with the billions to one event.
But he was questioned by anonymous people with no credentials. We all might as well have been a clan of child molesting heroin addicts to him.
Running away from anonymous people who probably have their own imperfections is weak. Very weak.
If being questioned , mocked, disbelieved, laughed at, by anonymous people on a message board ,makes you ill at ease enough to make you run away....then you never belonged on message boards to begin with.
Heck on GF I had someone daily mocking me, disbelieving me, laughing at me, multiple times a day. Way less reserved and with more venom than anything here directed at ALAN. And I managed to deal with it. I could deal with it by ignoring him or go head to head.....and I did both....and I didnt need a psychiatrist in the end. Real life goes on. In the context of real life this board or any board is not worth gaining angst from. Its a diversion and even with the people who bash you...fun can be had.
So I stand by my characterization of his actions.....very weak.
He ran from wov as well and that board is overly moderated and he still got upset.
BS, I see it as both would see if the person is ok. Most people on both sides have common decency. But the liberal would then advise the person that they are a victim and show them the ways they were victimized by the other driver, the car manufacturer, the road crew who paved it and the gas station who last sold them fuel. The conservative would ask if they had insurance and if they didn’t help how them the opportunities out there to rebound.Quote:
Originally Posted by MisterVSome, but not all liberals may harbor that belief.Quote:
Originally Posted by dannyj
Seems to me that the difference between liberals and conservatives is compassion and empathy toward others vs. concern primarily for oneself.
For example, you're driving down the road and see that a car ran off the road into a tree, and a person is standing in the roadway trying to flag you down as you approach.
A liberal wonders "How can I help?"whereas a conservative wonders "Is this guy gonna try to rob me?"
LarryS., you point out that these are anonymous boards.
That is true, mostly.
Alan of course is the exception: nothing anonymous about him.
again, when anonymous people give your the business, really so what. He is willingly known. He wants us to know who he is , or else he could have arranged a moniker.
Again I had someone callling me a liar daily on GF,...whether I was known or was anonymous it would effect me the same. The person calling the names did not impress me so I didnt generate angst over it.
So if I give him a hard time or you do, or someone else here or at wov.......we all carry no weight. Just as the moron at GF who hated jews . We only have ower over you if you give us that power. Otherwise we are just dogs howling at the moon. I carry no weight. I am an expert on my own opinion..thats all I claim. And Alan can tell me that my opinion is flawed or he can run away.
Alan needs to learn to laugh at himself. He needs to see how what he claims does have "fibbing" written all over it. And maybe the people he hangs with in real life pretend to believe him and shrug it off. Thats fine. But the message boards are a different animal.
KJ perpetrated a lie about his death, he came clean, and gave reasons for it, and he may even regret it, and I dont use that to question believably of current comments by him.
However Alan never came clean, he still holds to the tale, and for that its fair game to question authenticity of other things he says. And thats the position HE put himself in.
Yet its no reason to keep running away. Especially from anonymous people who have no credibility in gambling established. I know I DONT. Most people on this board have no credibility established.....totally anonymous with unproven backgrounds. Maybe KJ and Mickey have some cred ...but thats about it for me. I dont know about the credentials of others.
So who cares is a self proclaimed umproven lawyer,and a self proclaimed unproven pharmacist, and other self proclaimed folks give him a hard time. Whatever we say carries little weight. Its not like the great John Patrick criticized him. Just a bunch of nobodies. He didnt feel the sting of being criticized on this board by gambling scholars
He left because he could mount no effective defense, and he knew it.
Alan very much wanted to be thought of in a positive light, and the "eighteen yo's in a row" saga caused that light to dim.
I suspect that his health problems may also be complicating things a bit, causing him to lose the desire to engage in a good fight.
Fact is, the "eighteen yo's" is only one of a variety of questionable things he's said over the years, and previously when challenged about his wild claims and beliefs he just charged forward like the Energizer bunny.
Looks like that ship has sailed.
Quote:
Originally Posted by LarryS
A couple of notes on these comments.
My primary rationale for being on this forum was the Mendelson/Singer (Argentino) dynamic and how it resonated with all of the classic paranormal claimants attaching themselves to media people who didn't quite know enough (and preferred to not learn).
I have no real reason to post much any longer, as the forum is pretty much Wizard West (or something), and I never was a member, and had no interest in being a member, of the Wizard forums. I think I may have signed up once to read what Singer had posted under a pseudonym, but that was it, and I'm not sure of that.
I have just about zero interest in having "conversations" with anonymous taglines on some message board, which segues into I think that
LarryS misses the forest for the trees with his "why is Alan bothered by anonymous posters?" comments.
Alan wasn't anonymous. Singer wasn't anonymous. Dan wasn't anonymous. Those were the three dominant posters here -- all real people with real names (everybody knew/knows Dan and Rob's actual identities). I may have been fourth -- again, a real person with a real name. All real people -- taking real life ownership of what was being said and anecdotes and opinions. And what was said here very clearly following them into real life.
Unlike just about every other braindead, stupid blathering anonymity-fest forum, the people doing the most posting here, me included, were connected to the real world. So the forum is completely, utterly different when it transforms from one where the four people posting the most are not anonymous to one where basically everybody is anonymous. It's completely, utterly different. Whatever my differences with Mr. Mendelson, it makes perfect sense for him to step away.
Taking flak from anonymous posters is unbalanced warfare. It's a waste of time. As far as the 18 yo's goes, the most reasonable Ockham's explanation is that somehow rigged dice were inserted into the game, probably accidentally by the house. I don't see what the debate is about. Alan was so adamant about it, while I have a hard time with 18, maybe it was 11 or 12 or something outlandish. Or maybe the rigged dice were that good and it was 18. If it happened, then clearly there were rigged dice. No big mystery. Various houses have used rigged dice in the past. Rigged dice exist. They explain the event.
The forum has gone from one where the primary posting people were real and took ownership of what was said in the real world, and they could be found in the real world. Now it's not that. Perfectly reasonable for many of the previous posters to call it a day.
Thats funny. Ha ha funny.
If a person with no credential, who could be sitting in the basement of hos moms gives alan a hard time....that would cause him angst?
A person with knowledge can run rings around a dope that just posts with no credentials....including me.
Look at the Patrick board. Its a ghost town becahsue he presides over a house of cards, and he deleted or banned people who questioned his methods. If he was competent and knowledgeable...he could undress the non believers with facts and figures. But h couldnt so instead of running away, he did the second best cowardly thing.....force the questioners to go away.
Alan is no different. Maybe there is an exotic explanation for 18 yos, but he never backed down from that nimber, And he never explained why he didnt bet even once...other than"i dont bet horn bets".
so he got heat for the 18 yo story and for the unhuman reaction of just standing by and observing at table populated by a handful of people
however like Patrick he takes the weakling way out.
knowledge wins out...and knowledgeable people wipe the floor with detractors because they know more and can make the less knowledgeable look foolish
Quote:
Originally Posted by LarryS
It's unbalanced warfare. Every interaction or debate or argument Alan has with you, or anybody anonymous, carries risk in reality on his end and not on yours or theirs. Same with me or Dan or Singer, for that matter. So why bother?
Same for patrick.....he is the so called person with credentials. He opens up a site and wont have a free exchange of all ideas. Just his ideas. He is not capable of defending his claim that his new BS in BJ brings the house edge down to zero. I questioned that and my post was deleted. Because he was only equipped to make a declaration. and expected all to accept it as fact.
Now his board gets maybe at best one post a day outside of patrick.
So alan has and had a choice. He can use his name or he can use an anonymous moniker. He chose to go public. Whether it was initially ego, or felt his name had credentials tied to it...it was his choice. The upside of being known is that you can win an argument or enjoy a debate with info that others cannot dispute....like I think he has interviewed various people.And thats the plus side...you get personal credit for making a good point. But the other side is that you get personal discredit for making a ridiculous point. When you do what he does and uses his name...he takes the positive side of that but runs from the downside.Life doesnt work that way. We all take the good with the bad,
I'll save mickeycrimm the trouble of pointing out that LarryS used a false equitable dichotomy argument here. It's not "the good with the bad" for many people regarding anonymity versus non-anonymity. That's nonsense.Quote:
Originally Posted by LarryS
For example, there is virtually zero upside in the real world to my non-anonymous participation here. Zero. There is nothing to be gained. I'm non-anonymous primarily because I think it's juvenile to be anonymous.
the upside could be ego. Getting accolades as Alan M vs getting accolades as crapsguy24.
The upside is getting ones name out there for future money making opportunities. But that would work if you are in a community where you are the golden boy, giving advice, making comments and viewed as the "pro".
Thats what people want. They want to be recognized, well regarded by getting the public slap on the back by the masses. And when that slap on the back doesnt occur, or stops occurring ...then its time to run away.
there is great upside. Heck shackelford uses wov as a away to elevate himself in the eyes of the gambling world....and hopefully his name recognitin gets him some paydays...consult work etc. Shackelford has the power to ban or delete things that might challenge his elevation. However here Alan didnt have that power. But he could have been seeking the same that shackelford sought......keeping his name out there. There is an upside to that.
Maybe for you there is no upside that is valuable to you. But to others needing to keep their name relevant , using their real name is a decision they choose. But once you make that decision....and bathe in the glow of name recognition and building your brand when the masses bow to you.....then you have to accept there might be times that the masses will turn on you....often for something that you said.
so yes...take the good with the bad.
Alan was dangerous to novice gamblers. He is/was a B celebrity. The words of celebrities carry weight. He was wrong, but never in doubt, on many concepts in gambling but his words carry weight with the unknowing. "Who should I believe, Alan Mendelson, whose reputation is beyond reproach, or some anonymous high school dropout ex homeless drifter?" He once said "If you worked for me and you said the answer is 1 in 6 I would fire you."
I'm a nobody whether I'm anonymous or not. What difference does it make? Redietz could be scmeditz for all I care. It's the same content same credibility.
Or lack of credibility. I almost forgot scmeditz never did post any of that credibility building info that was supposedly sent to Alan.
most people here are pseudonymous not anonymous. the equivalent of "tripfags" or "namefags" on a real anon forum
Quote:
Originally Posted by quahaug
Yeah, except for the fact that an anonymous schmo doesn't get affected in the real world. It has real effect on the person posting.
The fact some of you are making this argument says it all. I mean, c'mon, get real. If I say one thing wrong out of a hundred, that's out there in the real world to be cherry plucked as evidence I have no idea what I'm talking about. There is no upside.
There are reasons all of you folks are anonymous. So don't give me the "what difference does it make?" gobbledygook. You're scaredy-cats that your posts will affect you in the real world.
Ego as a factor on this board? You gotta be kidding me. I think LarryS is confusing himself with everybody else...not that there's anything wrong with that...LOL.
Quote:
Originally Posted by quahaug
I do not recall ever, at any point or in any post, saying I would post anything. Quahaug must have me confused with somebody else. But, gee, quahaug, no problemo. Just furnish an address, and I'll send it along.
I would use my third place finish in the invitation-only Wise Guys last season (www.vegaswiseguys.com) as a point of braggadocio, but the fact is I led the thing for two months, and I am bitterly disgusted with the finish. I needed an Alabama cover in the title game to become the only living two-time Wise Guys champion. I will probably not get that chance again.
redietz
I miss the banter that used to take place on here several years ago. Sure Rob was a dick (and I’d never justify how he treated arci) but it was lighter, less serious. Heck, you and him used to have a friendly back and forth before it turned sour. And then of course there was Alan. Dare I say better times.
PS
I’m only slightly anonymous. Danny is my real first name and J is the real 1st initial of my last.
As mickeycrimm pointed out, Alan was dangerous to novice gamblers. But if you knew any math at all, he wasn't much of an issue. Singer actually had good points regarding many things (e.g. Dancer, slot clubs, addiction), but he was psychotically invested in his Rube Goldberg nonsense and absolutely vicious to anyone who exposed him.Quote:
Originally Posted by dannyj
What real effects are you talking about? How are my posts going to effect me in the "real world" whatever my identity is? I must be missing something.Quote:
Originally Posted by redietzQuote:
Originally Posted by quahaug
Yeah, except for the fact that an anonymous schmo doesn't get affected in the real world. It has real effect on the person posting.
The fact some of you are making this argument says it all. I mean, c'mon, get real. If I say one thing wrong out of a hundred, that's out there in the real world to be cherry plucked as evidence I have no idea what I'm talking about. There is no upside.
There are reasons all of you folks are anonymous. So don't give me the "what difference does it make?" gobbledygook. You're scaredy-cats that your posts will affect you in the real world.
Ego as a factor on this board? You gotta be kidding me. I think LarryS is confusing himself with everybody else...not that there's anything wrong with that...LOL.
I've explained the nuts and bolts of a lot of plays, put up math and everything, on WoV and vpFREE. Alot of novices and journeymen on those sites. But there were also world class pros and some of the best gambling math guys in the world chomping at the bit to call me an idiot if I got anything wrong. I knew it so I did my best not to make any mistakes. Only made a few over the years.
Exactly. For those of us who actually gamble, if you're posting under your real name, and you get 100 things right and mangle the math on one, what do you think will be remembered and transposed/reported to the real world? The 100 you got right? Not likely.Quote:
Originally Posted by mickeycrimm
Why is that important? Do you care what other people think about you all that much, or are you saying that this cred you think you need to protect is about wining or losing financially?Quote:
Originally Posted by redietzExactly. For those of us who actually gamble, if you're posting under your real name, and you get 100 things right and mangle the math on one, what do you think will be remembered and transposed/reported to the real world? The 100 you got right? Not likely.Quote:
Originally Posted by mickeycrimm
redietz is not your real name unless you are a lantern maker. Are you?Quote:
Originally Posted by redietzExactly. For those of us who actually gamble, if you're posting under your real name, and you get 100 things right and mangle the math on one, what do you think will be remembered and transposed/reported to the real world? The 100 you got right? Not likely.Quote:
Originally Posted by mickeycrimm
I now call bullshit on redietz. You have been exposed as an anonymous poster. Shame on you.
I’m going to be the voice of dissension here. No need to put out your real name out there and many reasons not to. I have met multiple incredibly decent people on forums who have helped me be a better gambler and honestly have made me a good amount of money. Far more important than putting your name out there is trust. Almost anyone gambling for a living has been f’d in the past and is rightfully cautious. The ideal situation is a win/ win for everyone involved and it takes good people to make that happen. And you have to be naturally suspicious of everyone. Stating your real name doesn’t add instant credibility in my book. I have also had scammers try to play angles with me, again both with real and assumed names on forums.
I have never met Mr V, and have no clue what his real name is, and really don’t care. But I would bet good money he is a lawyer in the Pacific Northwest. Unless he is playing the longest con ever, I trust he is who says he is. And he has no agenda. You can’t say that about everyone who puts their “real name” out there.
Those are fine lanterns, by the way. My grandfather had a couple, and that company has been in business forever. One grandfather worked in the mines; the other was a wildcatter at night, so they knew their lanterns.Quote:
Originally Posted by quahaug
Singer had trouble with the lack of periods. It's R.E.Dietz.
So you do sell lanterns. O.K.Quote:
Originally Posted by redietzThose are fine lanterns, by the way. My grandfather had a couple, and that company has been in business forever. One grandfather worked in the mines; the other was a wildcatter at night, so they knew their lanterns.Quote:
Originally Posted by quahaug
Singer had trouble with the lack of periods. It's R.E.Dietz.
For those craving an alan M. fix, normally I'd say check out his facebook page, but he last posted on it almost a month ago saying he was "uninstalling" it due to "viruses."
Of course, his facebook page is still up.
It can't be a win/win for the Casino that the incredibly decent people are winning all that cash from?? Someone has to lose!?Quote:
Originally Posted by The Boz
(Two good old boys in a fire-apple red convertible. Stoned. Ripped. Twisted. Good people.)
I'd like to know where to find these good people in Vegas? Perhaps one day I will meet up with one of them or someone like Pastor Barry Minkow. I guess when you talk about good people you are talking about the WoV West Community lol... WoV West... that was funny. I guess that falls under RS and his pals like Roger Kint and others.
You should of worked on this sentence a little more. I have met multiple incredibly decent people on forums...Quote:
Originally Posted by The Boz
lol... forget it... too easy to attack and make fun of. Sounds like some pitch at some Sales Convention I have to get to in the morning. Buster here is going to get an award. Fastest and the Best. Yup, sold 15k worth of druggist supplies last month alone!
How can anyone read that with a straight face? I have met multiple incredibly decent people...
It can not be done. I can not even type it out without having problems with uncontrollable laughter.
I worked for Barry Minkow at ZZZZ Best in 1987 in Las Vegas. I jumped out in the middle of the pyramid. I told other employee's something wasn't right and they best bail too. The ones still with him when it crashed were owed at least a couple of months backwages that they never got. But the asshole didn't get to burn me.Quote:
Originally Posted by monetIt can't be a win/win for the Casino that the incredibly decent people are winning all that cash from?? Someone has to lose!?Quote:
Originally Posted by The Boz
(Two good old boys in a fire-apple red convertible. Stoned. Ripped. Twisted. Good people.)
I'd like to know where to find these good people in Vegas? Perhaps one day I will meet up with one of them or someone like Pastor Barry Minkow. I guess when you talk about good people you are talking about the WoV West Community lol... WoV West... that was funny. I guess that falls under RS and his pals like Roger Kint and others.
You should of worked on this sentence a little more. I have met multiple incredibly decent people on forums...Quote:
Originally Posted by The Boz
lol... forget it... too easy to attack and make fun of. Sounds like some pitch at some Sales Convention I have to get to in the morning. Buster here is going to get an award. Fastest and the Best. Yup, sold 15k worth of druggist supplies last month alone!
How can anyone read that with a straight face? I have met multiple incredibly decent people...
It can not be done. I can not even type it out without having problems with uncontrollable laughter.
I remember Barry from the early days of FNN and the crash of 87. They promoted him as a genius and the future of stocks along with Boston Chicken (market). Of course they also used future VP candidate Wayne Root on weekends as an anchor as RE Dietz well knows.
Decades changes, but you always have to be looking for the obvious scams.
I just caught a post by Mission in the Pennsylvania thread where he said that class III machines outnumber class II machines in Oklahoma. The ratio looks to be about 25% class II to 75% class III to me. The class II machines have the bingo cards on them and are made by Video Gaming Technologies. They make class II machines exclusively but are owned by Aristocrat.
The class III machines, made by the major manufacturers, get way more action than the class II's. I suspect the tribes would get rid of them altogether if it weren't for the fact the money they make is not taxed by the state. The class III machines are taxed at 4 to 6%.
Also, Mission mentioned class II video poker. So far I haven't seen a class II video poker machine in Oklahoma and I've been in practically all the casinos there.
Minkow was from Reseda. The paybacks from ZZZZ Best had a very prominently displayed address of a bank in BEVERLEY HILLS, CALIFORNIA. Do you think that made the checks any easier to cash in Las Vegas? Not. That "bank in Beverley Hills" was one of the clues to me that he was a front.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Boz
Mick when you ever publish that book, you know you have a best seller. Worst case go to Curtis and his Huntington Press, low risk high reward. It’s an easy AP play.Quote:
Originally Posted by mickeycrimmI worked for Barry Minkow at ZZZZ Best in 1987 in Las Vegas. I jumped out in the middle of the pyramid. I told other employee's something wasn't right and they best bail too. The ones still with him when it crashed were owed at least a couple of months backwages that they never got. But the asshole didn't get to burn me.Quote:
Originally Posted by monet
It can't be a win/win for the Casino that the incredibly decent people are winning all that cash from?? Someone has to lose!?
(Two good old boys in a fire-apple red convertible. Stoned. Ripped. Twisted. Good people.)
I'd like to know where to find these good people in Vegas? Perhaps one day I will meet up with one of them or someone like Pastor Barry Minkow. I guess when you talk about good people you are talking about the WoV West Community lol... WoV West... that was funny. I guess that falls under RS and his pals like Roger Kint and others.
You should of worked on this sentence a little more. I have met multiple incredibly decent people on forums...Quote:
Originally Posted by The Boz
lol... forget it... too easy to attack and make fun of. Sounds like some pitch at some Sales Convention I have to get to in the morning. Buster here is going to get an award. Fastest and the Best. Yup, sold 15k worth of druggist supplies last month alone!
How can anyone read that with a straight face? I have met multiple incredibly decent people...
It can not be done. I can not even type it out without having problems with uncontrollable laughter.
And if you really don’t want to use him I have a guy in Jersey who will do it cheap with no residuals. A gamble but probably a good one for you.
I always wondered if he tried to be legit at the start or fell victim, and I use that word loosely, to the situation. It came too fast to him as a kid and thought it would be easy. But no doubt he knew what was going on at the end and lived it.Quote:
Originally Posted by mickeycrimmMinkow was from Reseda. The paybacks from ZZZZ Best had a very prominently displayed address of a bank in BEVERLEY HILLS, CALIFORNIA. Do you think that made the checks any easier to cash in Las Vegas? Not. That "bank in Beverley Hills" was one of the clues to me that he was a front.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Boz
Quote:
Originally Posted by The BozMick when you ever publish that book, you know you have a best seller. Worst case go to Curtis and his Huntington Press, low risk high reward. It’s an easy AP play.Quote:
Originally Posted by mickeycrimmI worked for Barry Minkow at ZZZZ Best in 1987 in Las Vegas. I jumped out in the middle of the pyramid. I told other employee's something wasn't right and they best bail too. The ones still with him when it crashed were owed at least a couple of months backwages that they never got. But the asshole didn't get to burn me.Quote:
Originally Posted by monet
And if you really don’t want to use him I have a guy in Jersey who will do it cheap with no residuals. A gamble but probably a good one for you.
I second that -- mickeycrimm's stuff is definitely book-worthy. Lots of decisions to make on what you'd want to focus on and accomplish with it, and what the breadth should or shouldn't be, but what's great is that he has all kinds of wide-ranging options, not too few.
anyone here familiar with Jeffrey Toll/Jeffrey Warren Toll? He is known as Wizardofnothing, JeffWarren75, StrictlyAP on WoV and is a well known casino scammer and con artist. https://jeffreywarrentoll.com
Perhaps KJ, DarkOZ, MC and MYSELF can all colaberate on a master AP novel and even get some guest AP'' along for the ride.
Probably sarcasm.
Wow! This is ground breaking news to me. Jeffrey Warren Toll is the guy Bob Dancer wrote a column about a few years back. Apparently, this guy Toll ripped Bob off on a play back east somewhere.Quote:
Originally Posted by swimswimmer
I googled Bob Dancer Jeffrey Warren Toll to see if I could find Bob's articles about Toll. This is what I found. I wonder if Dancer is behind this website. Bob's articles on Toll are published here.
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=...U2FXLeNdlVgREZ
Edit: I just seen where swimswimmer already put this link up. Swimswimmer, how do you or anyone know that JWT is/was strictlyap and wizardofnothing?
RE: The Range Slots thread on WoV.
On my first trip to Oklahoma last spring I met a long time member of WoV. He's been operating there for years and knows a lot more about the machines there than I do. So a couple of months ago I walk up on him about to put a play down on a $500 must hit. The number was on $492.51. I couldn't believe he caught a number that high. I told him it was a super strong play. He told me it wasn't a super strong play because it was going to run him to $499.99. We were in an Indian casino, mind you. He said those particular machines always ran to $499.99.
I wished him good luck and went on my way. Several hours later he texted me this picture:
Well that’s ducking interesting man
So where is Jeffrey Toll these days and what is he up to?
Colorful character.
A piece of shit, perhaps, but colorful nonetheless.
Oh my!! WoV thread StrictlyAP/WoN is blowing up good this morning. So darn funny to see these honest Gamblers and APs hustling one another. First it's funny that WoN can get people to just hand him cash. Second it's hilarious to see the honest AP so called Rec Gamblers being just as dishonest paying people for players cards and PIN numbers. I really love seeing sharks and snakes biting one another and watching the ones who get suckered claim they are the honest ones getting cheated. Just beautiful and nothing really on TV at the moment although that Con Man movie Focus with Will Smith was on. Not great but it's similar to the AP world how thieves work together and team up.
In another thread Spring Fling should be at the end of this May. This is a good time to meet all the WoVers and get pictures and information to post up on the AP/Rec Gambler Thread that someone should start!
This is one advantage of playing solo and not having to chop up the proceeds and you don't have to worry about some other smooth talking AP trying to make the moves on your girlfriend. RS was saying in another thread and on this site that ten APs have more power or potential to make 10x more per hour but even if that's true it isn't worth the headache of trusting 9 other souls unless your forced to play on a team it's better to do it on your own. Play smaller and build up and try to get to the position of F U. This way when things go south and I promise you things will go south given enough time and pressure, you can take your ball and go home and tell everyone F U buddy!
I read the entire article of how Dancer says he was ripped off. AND I agree with monet in that Dancer allowed himself to be ripped off. Who the heck hands over a ticket and says :send me the money". How lazy do you have to be to not go and cash it out yourself. And then accepting a payment plan of 175 dollars at a time before he wised up?
Why would someone who was well off need to pay you off little by little on a cashed ticket.
So he had sucker written all over him. It doesnt excuse the behavior of Toll....but Dancer could have mitigated his damages easily.
Its amazing what we are finding out. It seems Mission was knowingly or unknowingly used as a credibility token, when meeting with a member who's daughter later got scammed for 4k. I cant make that call...its one or the other.
After all someone who appears to be hanging out with mission has to be cool....right?
And then Mission says he knew that JWarren was WON. And he allowed him to have an advert in is signature .as did all the other mods allow.
maybe mission was duped into meeting with at east one other WOv member along with toll as part of a scheme for future scams as an added credibility security blanket for the mark to see. Maybe he knew. I have no idea, and if he knew or was part of it....he certainly isnt going to admit it here.
So innocent till proven guilty.
However it does seem that WON got some nice treatment at WOV....favorable to say the least.
the question that arises is that he was at a nugget eating contest from wov, and he tried to hook up with a member who attended to do something and even offered to get him a free room at the ARIA....and more than one person attending warned him not to get involved that he was bad news. So did he identify himself as WON???? And when seeing him and matching the face to the name did they PM a mod that his signature was looking for trouble for members. Or did he say he was another members name who didnt attend? It seems enough people(maybe 3) at the small gathering knew he was bad news.
Like I said in the other thread on WoV, I was there in the context of it being only the first or second time I worked with the guy. I'm pretty sure it was the first time, but I don't promise that. It was nearly two years ago.Quote:
Originally Posted by LarryS
As far as I was concerned, we were just having lunch with someone. My belief is that the two of them were supposed to meet up whether I went or not. I was just asked whether or not I wanted to stick around for a lunch as I left AC immediately after. I'd have lunch with literally anyone who wants to have lunch, so why would I not have went to lunch?
I knew StrictlyAP was WoN, but I didn't know that until well after the WoN account had been created. You can see for yourself StrictlyAP's last post was 1/2015:Quote:
And then Mission says he knew that JWarren was WON. And he allowed him to have an advert in is signature .as did all the other mods allow.
https://wizardofvegas.com/forum/info...27/#post428272
And, the WoN account was not created until 7/2015:
https://wizardofvegas.com/member/wizardofnothing/
I did not ever meet StrictlyAP/WoN in person until 2016, and I wouldn't have checked WoN for an IP Match unless a post WoN made were to violate the Rules. By the time I would have known that SAP=WoN, I probably was either told or assumed that it had been allowed, but I don't specifically remember. Again, over two years ago at this point.
I am 100% sure that the only WoV Member who did not already know StrictlyAP personally that I was ever with at the same time as StrictlyAP is Darkoz. I have only met one other associate of StrictlyAP, in person, in my entire life. If that person is a forum member, and I don't think he is, then he knew StrictlyAP prior to meeting me because he works for him and had done for quite some time.Quote:
maybe mission was duped into meeting with at east one other WOv member along with toll as part of a scheme for future scams as an added credibility security blanket for the mark to see. Maybe he knew. I have no idea, and if he knew or was part of it....he certainly isnt going to admit it here.
I am almost 100% sure that I have never been in the company of anyone else at all at the same time that I have been in the company of StrictlyAP. Like I said before, I've only seen him in person a handful of times to begin with.
I was not there and know nothing about that. Only saying so because you mentioned it in the same post.Quote:
the question that arises is that he was at a nugget eating contest from wov, and he tried to hook up with a member who attended to do something and even offered to get him a free room at the ARIA....and more than one person attending warned him not to get involved that he was bad news. So did he identify himself as WON???? And when seeing him and matching the face to the name did they PM a mod that his signature was looking for trouble for members. Or did he say he was another members name who didnt attend? It seems enough people(maybe 3) at the small gathering knew he was bad news.
Why would you assume a sock would be permitted, or that another mod had allowed a sock?Quote:
Originally Posted by Mission146
Seems clear to me that given the draconian enforcement of rules there that such a thing would be prohibited.
It's getting ugly over there with people accusing Mission of benefiting but with no knowledge of being used. That guy accusing Mission says he knows for a fact 100% but doesn't back it up with facts. He basically is saying Mission is smart enough to receive money but too dumb to know what is going on... just mean! I for one like Mission or at least his online persona. It's getting down right libelous I suppose. Perhaps Bill Yung is right and one day even the mighty Wizard of Oz will fall and be caught up in some mischief. Certainly possible and I believe he helps thrawt APs no matter what anyone says.
it is getting heated there.
I remember a day when simply suggesting that the members should be treated as valued customers rather than leeches that take take and take would get someone nuked.
But look how mission is left to twist in the wind. No other mods defend him. Sure they comment on the abilities of the mods when hewas accused of selling personal info or giving personal info to WON.
But other than clarifying the software available to them.....its all on mission to resolve the issue that has the crowd with torches out in the public square.
I think his luke warm recognition of WON being a conman is hurting. You know the ..i dont have hard proof of the things being said.....shows a sense of devotion to him. A sense of loyalty.
there is no comment like "i cant believe I associated with that conman,,,if even one of those stories is true it makes me sick ". If he hammers WON, then maybe WON goes on another board and spills some beans abour his days with mission. So maybe for self preservation reasons he needs to temper his comments.
I am sensitive to people and their ability to make a living and support a family. But is he naive? I mean he said he was thinking of resigning as a mod, but is asking the wiz if it would adversely effect his writing articles for pay on wov. WTF???????? If he loses his credibility to be a mod.....then what cred would his articles have??
I think most people are skeptical of his reaction , his deleting the original post rather than editing it, his lack of stated remorse for hanging with won, his inability to pass judgement based on some real credible stories. Thats what is causing issues with people. He is just way to laid back as far as finding out that an associate of his has mug shots, and has public records of charges against him, and stories upon stories of con jobs.
the initial reaction is one of protection of his associate rather than outrage. Thats what makes people think there is a story yet told regarding mission.
thats my analysis.....
jan 2015 strictly AP is nuke "For allegedly welching on a bet. ". It seems "alleged" actions can cause a nuking. No solid proof.
will mission be nuked for allegedly associating with a conman multiple times.
when asked if he engaged in shady activity, mission pretty much said that alot of APs engage in that.
I think thats what gets most people is that like me, I always felt mission was a stand up guy. I dont agree with him on alot of issues, but he never shirked from answering critics.
But here he is holding back and seems to be protecting and having some loyalty to WON. And that disappoints me..and it seems to be doing the same to wov members.Its not a shock about WON.....but it is a shock about how mission has handled this.
What I don't understand is Mike has signed on the site today and he must know what is going on? I'm just waiting for him to actually make a statement. I have seen him many times claim he doesn't know what is going on. He claimed he didn't know I was pingpangpong and it was clear every othe mod and member knew. I suspect the Wiz knows more than he admits.
you are right. In the past if a mod was being critisized...mike would swoop in and suspend someone for some sort of perceived insult...and then all the munchkins would fall in line. End of discussion
Outsidethebox has posted total unsubstantiated nonsense that could in the past have caused a suspension....but everyone is standing back. The wiz and the mods are restrained...letting it play out.
How can a site that wants to be the consumers guide to getting a decent chance at casinos based on good math and knowledge....and provides articles on the best way to approach different games, and the wiz has his seal of approval on casino websites.......and now exposed in letting a conman advertise in the signature field as the message board was used as feeding ground for a conman while the regular rules didnt apply to WON as far as advertising.
So we now look askance at the advice on the board, on the articles, and on the wiz's seal of approval....and wonder if its all a con. And right now the wiz has to stand back and let it sort out. He is a coward..so I dont expect him to make any decision of substance.
So far there isnt a real contingent in favor of mission. You know, there are usually a few bleeding hearts. So all the nuked people like me and monet, and kj just sit with a tub of popcorn and watch it unfold.
It will eventually come to a conclusion naturally on its own.
However i live in America (as a lot of us here do) and it is still innocent until proven guilty. Right now it's all hearsay and conjecture. At this point bring solid proof or leave him alone. After all you are only entitled to one bite from the apple....HomelessinNYC..the first bleeding heart.
This is not a court of law. Members of wov are consumers of an entertainment facility. I dont need to see hard evidence and semen samples from the 50 women who accuse cosby of rape for me to decide I will not see him in concert if he tours. Innocent until proven guilty does not exist in the consumer world. If a man accused of raping a single woman has a hardware store....as a consumer I will choose not to frequent that store. If my babysitter is accused of robbing a home and is awaiting trial.....its ok..he is my ex babysitter.
As a consumer I dont need the evidence that a jury needs. I dont need to wait for due process for me to decide where to spend my time or dollars. Due process will decide if there is jail or no jail.
So with all the info out there....people on wov are deciding whether or not to devote their time and expertise on that site. And they have every right without having to be presented with courthouse evidence.
No one is saying mission should be in jail. THAT would require due process. The complaint is the optics of how WON was treated before he left the board, and now the protective stance mission takes of him.it makes customers want to leave....it makes them uneasy. It makes them question the ethics of a site that prides itself on ethics.
So innocent till proven guilty belongs in a courtof law. We make consumer decisions all the time without needing a judge and jury decision to guide us.
Michael Jackson was never convicted of child molestation. However he has more than one settlement. As a parent I would never let my child spend any time alone with him.(even now in his excavated coffin)..but he was innocent until proven guilty.
Speaking of babysitters, I read about one up in Oregon getting 21 years in jail for giving kids melatonin. Tough sentence when murders get 5 to 10.
I have been pretty busy the past couple weeks, putting in mega hours. I seem to go in cycles. So I haven't been keeping up with everything here, there (WoV) or basically any forums all that closely. I knew SAP was WoN, but didn't knew they were this Jeff Warren person, nor did I know all of what this Jeff Warren person is or may have been involved in (all the scamming).Quote:
Originally Posted by LarryS
Again, I say if we are going by this 'supposed' website that started these threads, there is nothing official about that link. It does not appear to be any kind of legit organization, nor is there a byline...all an anonymous webpage making numerous charges, unsubstantiated by any proof that I have seen.
Don't get me wrong, I am not defending this Jeff Warren / Strickly AP / WoN person. I actually have had my own negative interaction with him (as WoN), that I am going to keep to myself.
I like Mission. I think he is generally a good guy. I think he tries to be a fair moderator, at least up until this incident. From what I have read, it doesn't smell good for him. I get the feeling he made a bad choice, hasn't come completely clean and as is often the case, the "coverup" is often the worse part. :( But again, I don't know all the facts. That's just how it looks from the outside.
Anyway, you are sort of right LarryS, I have enjoyed the last now 45 minutes, reading the drama. No popcorn though, but I am working my way through a container of Dryers cookies and cream Ice Cream, while reading the drama. :rolleyes: Pick your poison.
Wizard is obviously traveling. That's always obvious when he doesn't log on several days in a row. He did log on today, because he was made aware of this drama, but hasn't made time to look into it or weigh in. If I were a betting man, I would bet Mike will be supportive of Mission. Mike is kind of a loyalty guy. We'll see what happens. :cool: