Rob Singer's Commentary

I invited Rob Singer to send to me his articles/commentary for publication on my website. The first article is now online here: http://alanbestbuys.com/id362.html

I am posting the articles without any editing (except for formatting, with no changes to the content) and I am inviting everyone to read his commentaries and then comment about them here on the Forum.

By the way, I am also offering space on my website to other gambling professionals and experts who also want their commentaries posted. Please contact me if you have articles that you would like published.

I remember Rob having hundreds of weekly articles on his VP Truth website over a period of several years (2000-2006 or so). It's a shame those articles weren't stored somewhere and re-submitted online. That's a lot of work destroyed otherwise.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Count Room

I remember Rob having hundreds of weekly articles on his VP Truth website over a period of several years (2000-2006 or so). It's a shame those articles weren't stored somewhere and re-submitted online. That's a lot of work destroyed otherwise.

---

It was 2000 thru 2009. Ten full years, and almost 8 of the years' articles were also published weekly in Gaming Today. They are not gone, however. Before my web guy shut it down, he saved everything on vptruth.com on a flash drive and sent it to me. I have it in storage with my car and other old stuff. But it's always good to present new articles based on more recent info, analyses, and thinking as well as on new experiences.

Rob sent me a PM explaining exactly how one's discipline can erode or be destroyed in a casino, and what can be done about it. I particularly liked the last few sentences he wrote. It was something I had never thought of before and it's something I will have to remember going forward:

Feel free to copy and post any of this at any time.

I learned everything I know about the dark side of what casinos do to people when I was an AP from 1990-1996. But if I didn't have that experience, I'd never have been able to see the unprecedented success I've seen since. So it's likely that almost everyone else is either where I used to be--or they are like so many others who cruise along using vp as some sort of "entertainment" tool and expect to lose in the process. Kind of like our host--who accepts the losing and enjoys the perks, all while constantly being in the casino's radar as they actually "control" what he does. At least he knows what's going on. Most don't.

First, you must have the DETERMINATION to follow thru on what it is you planned on doing--which of course is winning your minimum win goal (or losing up to your loss limit) then leaving immediately. Without determination, you will easily stumble right into the casino's hands. But it goes beyond all that. You've seen me rail against other posters who do everything the casinos want and expect losers to be doing, and there's a reason for it. When you finally tell yourself that things will change, you have to think in terms of which powers casinos hold over their players, and what it is that helps destroy their discipline either after winning or during losing. You do this, as I've said time and again, by doing EVERYTHING exactly the opposite as the casinos want & expect you to do. No casino credit, no casino ATM usage EVER, no drinking while playing, and NO TIPPING AFTER HANDPAYS. There's your start. Then when you win, NEVER stay and play, and NEVER go to a higher denomination on your next visit because of it until you actually have the full bankroll to do so. These are all things the casinos want and know most players will do. Learn to get satisfaction out of NOT doing them....out of being able at will to do what you want, not what THEY want you to do. Doing this will make you a happier and more fulfilled gambler.

The absolute toughest part of all that is getting up and leaving when losing your limit, esp. when you have a pocket still full of cash. Next toughest is getting up and leaving after attaining your win goal. Just think: you get a handpay, you're in a state of euphoria, and now you're first faced with beating that intimidation to tip. Then they finally leave, and you know you should leave but your craving for more action tries its hardest to keep you there. Here's the key: STOP & THINK while you're still sitting there wondering if you should really cash out your remaining credits or not, and the casino ambience, music, girls etc. are pulling at you to stay & play. Look at your money, then think about how nice it will be counting it out when you get home or back to your room. Also wonder what it would look like if all or most of it were GONE. I guarantee you, if you LOOK at the cash and go thru these steps, it will be much easier to just get up and leave. And once you actually do this, it gets easier and easier as you move forward.

EDIT: Would this mean Alan is handicapped since he uses markers and wouldn't be able to visualize the current cash winnings (or visualizing it all GONE) at home or in a hotel room?

Let me respond to this comment: Would this mean Alan is handicapped since he uses markers and wouldn't be able to visualize the current cash winnings (or visualizing it all GONE) at home or in a hotel room?

When you play with markers you are also paid in CASH except when you decide to use the cash payouts to pay off or pay down your markers. If I take out a $1,000 marker and win $2,000 I have two choices: (1) pay off the marker and keep the cash, or (2) keep all the cash and then pay off the interest-free marker thirty days later.

Only once did I see a player who was asked to pay off his markers when they were going to give him a handpay. It was in the high limit room at Caesars and the player just hit a royal on a $10 machine for $40,000. A "suit" came over to him while they were getting the W2G and asked him "would you like to pay off your $10,000 in markers?"

I have never been asked to pay off markers, but I always do when I hit a big winner.

I hope that Rob writes a lengthy article about his beliefs on "tipping" and using "markers." I tip and I use markers. And I really would like to see ALL of his reasoning in one place, and in detail.

At some point and time, I would like to see a article on 'RTT strategy can have many variations'. It has been lost from the site and I would think would make good topic. Thanks.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson

When you play with markers you are also paid in CASH except when you decide to use the cash payouts to pay off or pay down your markers. If I take out a $1,000 marker and win $2,000 I have two choices: (1) pay off the marker and keep the cash, or (2) keep all the cash and then pay off the interest-free marker thirty days later.

---

Alan: Yeah, I'm totally unfamiliar with the concept of using markers for VP & slots. I've seen markers used a fair number of times at table games in the past, though.

When you take out a marker for the machines, do they just give you a TITO voucher for the marker amount just like they would give chips for a marker at the tables?

I was thinking you may have been unable to visualize the cash if your answer to that question is "yes" because there have been times when I hit a bunch of non-W2G quads for a nice win only to see it evaporate before leaving the casino.

If they do give you a TITO for your marker, I suppose it would be easy enough to cash it at the cage or cash dispensing machines any time you wanted to, anyway.

You can ask for a marker for machines in either "cash" or TITO. When paid for a jackpot you can be paid either as cash or TITO -- it's your choice -- as well as having your marker paid off or paid down.

This is why I really want Rob to DETAIL all of the reasons he is so opposed to using markers. There is NO reason not to use markers. If for no other reason -- with a marker you get a 30-day INTEREST FREE LOAN. And of course there is absolutely no risk of carrying around large amounts of cash.

In fact, the only reason you might want to downplay markers is because you can't qualify for a credit line.

I'll do my next article on tipping and marker use. I have adequate experience in both. When I was an AP I both tipped and used markers. It turned out being part of my learning process.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson

You can ask for a marker for machines in either "cash" or TITO. When paid for a jackpot you can be paid either as cash or TITO -- it's your choice -- as well as having your marker paid off or paid down.

This is why I really want Rob to DETAIL all of the reasons he is so opposed to using markers. There is NO reason not to use markers. If for no other reason -- with a marker you get a 30-day INTEREST FREE LOAN. And of course there is absolutely no risk of carrying around large amounts of cash.

In fact, the only reason you might want to downplay markers is because you can't qualify for a credit line.

---

Well that's interesting, Alan, thank you. I didn't realize markers are that flexible. I should mention most of my local casinos don't use them, but I will look into this further next time I go to Vegas or AC.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Rob.Singer

It was 2000 thru 2009. Ten full years, and almost 8 of the years' articles were also published weekly in Gaming Today. They are not gone, however. Before my web guy shut it down, he saved everything on vptruth.com on a flash drive and sent it to me. I have it in storage with my car and other old stuff. But it's always good to present new articles based on more recent info, analyses, and thinking as well as on new experiences.

---

By the way, Rob, regular flash drives/memory sticks can only be relied upon for 5-8 years of data storage assuming they are handled with reasonable care. It's a good idea to create new backups of them every 3-4 years just in case...

I've thought some about how I'll do my next article which will focus on tipping, so I'll explain my marker use view here.

It's not that I'm against the versatility of having & using markers. If you have used one and you get a hand pay, why NOT have them pay it down or off immediately instead of taking a check or cash? But that's where the sense of even having markers begins and ends. An "interest free loan"? Really? Dancer used that one too, and it's not even original. When I had one of those dumb "hosts" at the MGM during my AP days, she used that line as a way of talking me into signing up for a $10k credit line. The critical point here is, no one should EVER be taking out loans of any kind to gamble with, whether you can afford them or not. Casinos don't care where you get your money to gamble with, and they don't care one bit about if losing the money causes you any kind of problems. They simply want you to play, which means you are once again doing things the exact way they want and expect players to do things.

The part about not having to carry cash around is extremely weak. EVERYBODY has cash on them in casinos and everyone already knows it. And there you are--gambling, which means you're more than ready to part with all of it. And people are deathly afraid that someone will risk incarceration taking chances that someone else might have a ton of it with them by trying to rob them in one of the safest environments known? I have never worn a sign saying I carry lots of cash. Do you? It's a CASINO people! You get cash, you go to the place, and you gamble. Why all the worry and self-intimidation? Are we that insecure?

Which gets us to the bottom line in all this--IT IS ONLY LOSERS AND PEOPLE WHO EXPECT TO LOSE that sign up for casino credit. Forget about being shortsighted about carrying around cash; forget about feeling like a casino big-shot; forget about using handpays as marker pay-offs for that "interest free loan" money you lost in the first place. THE FIRST LESSON IN LEARNING TO BECOME A CONSISTENT WINNER IN GAMBLING IS BY DOING EVERYTHING YOU CAN THAT'S DIRECTLY THE OPPOSITE OF WHAT CASINOS WANT & EXPECT YOU TO DO! And no, I cannot say this loud enough. They WANT you to have easy access to your money at their casino. They WANT you to be able to tap into a credit line should you lose what you brought with you. They WANT you to look at their markers as some sick type of "interest-free loan". Everything about it, they do for THEM....NOT YOU!

Folks, if you use markers then you're letting the casinos play you like fiddles. And you need to wise up. The more things you are led into doing because the Casino made you think they're bestowing one of their special "benefits" upon you, the more probable it is you will lose your money because that's what's behind EVERY action a casino takes with and "for" it's customers. We need to look at casinos as one simple thing: a place to go in and come out with more money than we went in with. That's it. Begin to look at it in ANY other way....such as where your "friend", the "host" works, a "loan" office, or a location where you can get lots of "free stuff", and all you're doing is playing right into a casino's hands. They'll have you right where they want you. My gambling life has turned COMPLETELY around since I woke up to all this. Yours will too, if you choose to understand what I'm saying to you. You cannot successfully argue against simple common sense.

And Alan, I know you're approach to gaming is different from mine. You currently see it as "Oh, I''ve got nothing to do, so I think I'll take a drive to Caesars to have a couple of fun days in a free room, eat some free meals, get some interest-free money to go play some games with, and TRA-la-LA-la-LA....I don't really expect to win anything, but I'll get some wonderful entertainment in!" Life is good!

But that's not me or what I teach. I go for enjoyment AND I expect to win. If either of those ended then I would not go any more. And I train people to do the same. There's no need to train people who could just as well on their own go for a fabulous non-gaming location vacation that they PAID for.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Count Room

By the way, Rob, regular flash drives/memory sticks can only be relied upon for 5-8 years of data storage assuming they are handled with reasonable care. It's a good idea to create new backups of them every 3-4 years just in case...

---

I wasn't aware. It's in a metal box that never gets moved. The facility is climate controlled if that means anything.

Rob's second article about "tipping" is now posted.

Regarding Rob's comments about the use of markers:

Rob, you have reached the point of saying ludicrous things. While the marker represents an "interest free loan" it does not mean that you are "borrowing money" to gamble. It only means that the casino is letting you use their money to gamble WITH NO INTEREST BEING CHARGED while your money sits in your bank account or money market fund and continues to earn interest. Yes Rob, you can let your money earn interest while you use the casino's money to gamble with. And if you think you have an edge over the casino the use of the casino marker money will only add to your advantage and to your profit.

And I would never suggest to anyone that they carry large amounts of cash -- ever. There is no reason to. Just stop it -- carrying large amounts of cash is an invitation to lose it or even to get killed for it. I don't know anyone except for criminals (especially drug dealers) who want to carry around large amounts of cash in this day and age. Granted back in the 1950s and 60s before credit cards and travel cards such as Diners Club and Amex were popular people did carry large amounts of cash. But back then a "large amount of cash" was maybe $200 and a high income professional earned about $25,000 a year.

Alan, the "loan" issue escapes you. First you call it an interest free loan, then you don't, then you do again. And I understand your confusion. You look at it from only your point of view. It actually IS a loan, because no one but the customer knows whether they have the cash in the bank or on hand to pay it back should it be lost. That's why no one should ever use casino credit. You may always have the money waiting to pay down your markers, but you can be sure there are many who don't and have to shuffle the bills for a few months because of it. And again, it's something the casino wants you to do because they couldn't care less if the customer experiences financial problems because of it or not. They simply want you to play, and as a credit customer, you're one of the reasons Caesars is still in business. You are firmly in the pocket and under the full control of CET, and you don't usually win but you get all those fabulous freebies and special recognitions along with a big whoop card. That doesn't bother you?

You'll get killed for carrying cash? Huh? Has there EVER been an instance of that anywhere where there's casinos, and if so, can you be sure the death would not have occurred if the victim were carrying fifty bucks and a pack of very colorful cards along with marker strength? Talk about foolish statements....

Rob... people get followed home from casinos and get killed pretty often. It only has to happen to you once.

Rob, can you get a credit line today?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson

Rob... people get followed home from casinos and get killed pretty often. It only has to happen to you once.

Rob, can you get a credit line today?

---

I haven't heard about any deaths because of carrying cash. I'm sure there have been some, just like anything else.

Can I get a credit line? I'm not really sure. Don't you need to have a job to qualify? And if you want to think this is why I'm against those things, you're missing another point. I teach people how to be responsible gamblers. People with casino credit lines almost always also have a bevy of other loans and an impressive collection of colorful credit cards with constant high balances. That's how it is in S. California, is it not....People have to drive cars they can't afford, spend money they don't have, and try to one-up each other's neighbor? It's all about having "credit" to them and it makes them feel special. And why would ANYONE ever want to give their financials over to a casino? Doesn't that sound foolish to you? C'Mon, THINK. You actually believe being that much on a casino's radar is something good? Oh wait....I'm looking at it from someone who expects to win's perspective. Now I see the disconnect.

Rob take a look at these articles about follow-home robberies from casinos:

http://www.fox23.com/news/local/stor...swgg--NMw.cspx
http://www.contracostatimes.com/brea...-arrested-five
http://www.stltoday.com/news/local/c...9bb30f31a.html
http://www.dispatch.com/content/stor...-at-fault.html
http://losangeles.cbslocal.com/2013/...e-from-casino/
http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/27...mmerce-497902/
http://www.sfgate.com/bayarea/articl...on-3077315.php

Rob you also wrote: People with casino credit lines almost always also have a bevy of other loans and an impressive collection of colorful credit cards with constant high balances. That's how it is in S. California, is it not... This is absolutely ridiculous and how can you reach such a conclusion?

Rob-I have been followed and attacked at Ballys in a hallway going to my room. I was lucky--another door opened and I ran into that person's room as the door opened. I try not to carry cash in Vegas. I settle markers at the table if I win and only take the profit. I used to use the safe deposit boxes until they were eliminated. If I have a big win, I have a bank account in Las Vegas and go there to deposit. I don't want it on me.

Here is a very recent one here in Illinois/Indiana.

http://wgntv.com/2014/04/16/palos-he...nds-at-casino/

They followed him a good 25 miles.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson

Rob take a look at these articles about follow-home robberies from casinos:

http://www.fox23.com/news/local/stor...swgg--NMw.cspx
http://www.contracostatimes.com/brea...-arrested-five
http://www.stltoday.com/news/local/c...9bb30f31a.html
http://www.dispatch.com/content/stor...-at-fault.html
http://losangeles.cbslocal.com/2013/...e-from-casino/
http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/27...mmerce-497902/
http://www.sfgate.com/bayarea/articl...on-3077315.php

Rob you also wrote: People with casino credit lines almost always also have a bevy of other loans and an impressive collection of colorful credit cards with constant high balances. That's how it is in S. California, is it not... This is absolutely ridiculous and how can you reach such a conclusion?

---

Conclusions like those come from know-it-all blowhards who with narrow minded views. Those observations, which he offers up as "the truth", are nothing more than snapshots that rarely represent the big picture. For someone as "well traveled and well educated" as he says he is, he really hasn't been paying attention. Sadly, he now shows himself to be someone who wallows in a comical self-aggrandizement world of his own.

Personally, I can't even believe that it is possible that Rob isn't aware of the follow-home robberies. The articles I cited above are only a tiny fraction of those that appear with a basic Google search. I only used "follow home" as a keyword in the search. I didn't include robberies inside casino garages, or on casino property, or on casino elevators and in hotel rooms and in casino lounges.

Just during my last trip to Caesars there was a robbery in the lounge with the "barge" and four security guards had to chase a thief who stole a handbag from a patron. They ran right through the casino.

Do I have to even mention the motorcycle bandit with the gun at Bellagio? Here Rob... more good reasons for you to carry lots of cash:

http://www.lasvegassun.com/news/2012...casino-heists/

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson

Personally, I can't even believe that it is possible that Rob isn't aware of the follow-home robberies. The articles I cited above are only a tiny fraction of those that appear with a basic Google search. I only used "follow home" as a keyword in the search. I didn't include robberies inside casino garages, or on casino property, or on casino elevators and in hotel rooms and in casino lounges.

Just during my last trip to Caesars there was a robbery in the lounge with the "barge" and four security guards had to chase a thief who stole a handbag from a patron. They ran right through the casino.

Do I have to even mention the motorcycle bandit with the gun at Bellagio? Here Rob... more good reasons for you to carry lots of cash:

http://www.lasvegassun.com/news/2012...casino-heists/

---

Alan, unlike you, my life isn't everything casinos all of the time. For the amount of casinos in this country, attempted thefts are miniscule. If they were commonplace, someone like myself who always has carried plenty of cash in and around them along with being recognizable as well as could have easily been watched in all the high limit rooms I've played in, would have been a victim many times over if it were as sensationalized as you portray it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson

Rob take a look at these articles about follow-home robberies from casinos:

http://www.fox23.com/news/local/stor...swgg--NMw.cspx
http://www.contracostatimes.com/brea...-arrested-five
http://www.stltoday.com/news/local/c...9bb30f31a.html
http://www.dispatch.com/content/stor...-at-fault.html
http://losangeles.cbslocal.com/2013/...e-from-casino/
http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/27...mmerce-497902/
http://www.sfgate.com/bayarea/articl...on-3077315.php

Rob you also wrote: People with casino credit lines almost always also have a bevy of other loans and an impressive collection of colorful credit cards with constant high balances. That's how it is in S. California, is it not... This is absolutely ridiculous and how can you reach such a conclusion?

---

You obviously take pride in having credit, and S. Cal. is the king of pride in that dept. It's only logical that people who have lots of credit use lots of credit, and they actually believe having credit means they're well-off. I'm not buying your weak argument that you get casino credit to save yourself from "robberies from the bad guys" when all you do is hunker down inside Caesars or Rincon until you accept the usual beatings. If you use casino credit then you do it either to impress yourself or to be sure there's cash readily available in order to get your gambling fix at any time you get the urge for action, even if you don't have any at the moment. You'll never accept or see that this is exactly how the casinos want it to be. And finally, you'll never understand or want to understand that people who follow casino leads are far more likely to lose.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by regnis

Rob-I have been followed and attacked at Ballys in a hallway going to my room. I was lucky--another door opened and I ran into that person's room as the door opened. I try not to carry cash in Vegas. I settle markers at the table if I win and only take the profit. I used to use the safe deposit boxes until they were eliminated. If I have a big win, I have a bank account in Las Vegas and go there to deposit. I don't want it on me.

Here is a very recent one here in Illinois/Indiana.

http://wgntv.com/2014/04/16/palos-he...nds-at-casino/

They followed him a good 25 miles.

---

Regnis, I agree these things happen. But I will NEVER do anything any casino wants me to do ....not if I expect to win. Casino credit isn't some "benefit" (ie, the foolish "interest-free loan" excuse) that casinos just "give away" out of the kindness of their hearts. It's one of their most effective money-making tools, just as credit cards are for banks.

Anywhere there's cash, there are thieves. That's expected. And NO ONE knows who has what. That's paranoia driven stuff. The issue then comes down to whether you want to keep taking chances and if you're prepared for it. I chose preparation. I ALWAYS valet park unless the casino is very easy-in/easy-out, I never dress very good when I go, I rarely wear my expensive watch, and I carried a gun in my bag right next to my cash up until 2009. Never was followed, harrassed, or had any trouble anywhere, and still haven't.

I really don't get why some continue to be so foolish to keep feeding this troll. There is no reasoning with this character. The only thing you'll get while discussing anything Singer says or claims is insults, sarcasm and belittlement. Obviously some people around here enjoy to be spit in the face every day. You're at the right address with Singer for that. So please continue to cherish this treasure :)

Vegas_lover I agree with you. He is being absolutely ridiculous. In a previous post he pretty much told us that he doesn't have a credit line and questioned if he could get one given that he is not employed. He doesn't know what he's talking about when it comes to this subject. Namely, a credit line is determined only by your checking account balance plus a check of your "credit history" with casinos. They don't even check your regular credit files or "credit score." Either Rob never applied for a credit line or can't have one because of the lack of a sufficient checking account balance or his previous bankruptcy which may or may not impacted casinos in the past.

Regarding the miniscule number of casino robberies what Rob fails to understand is that it only has to happen to you once and it is no longer a miniscule problem.

If this character is really carrying around large amounts of cash it tells me that he either can't qualify for a credit line or he is being a show off.

Hey... if the casinos have blocked you from having a credit line well then it would make sense that you criticize anyone who has a credit line.

And yet you continue to provide him with a platform and a dedicated part of your website to spread his growing pile of crap. I will never get that and I won't even try to understand it anymore. You are not providing any service if you think that. You are only giving a sick individual his "daily fix". There is absolutely nothing educational in Singer's words. The only thing we know now (as we did about two years ago) is that this man is a raging lunatic. I'm not trying to attack you Alan I just really don't understand why you invest so much time in this bs.

There is some value in the things that Rob says. And then, he is misguided in other things. I think it is important to get all the information "out there" for everyone to discuss.

Actually, there might be those who agree with Rob about credit lines and Rob should have the opportunity to present his views -- just as you have the opportunity to disagree.

It would be wrong not to discuss his views freely and openly otherwise he just as easily could publish his one-sided views himself without an opportunity for discussion.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson

There is some value in the things that Rob says. And then, he is misguided in other things. I think it is important to get all the information "out there" for everyone to discuss.

Actually, there might be those who agree with Rob about credit lines and Rob should have the opportunity to present his views -- just as you have the opportunity to disagree.

It would be wrong not to discuss his views freely and openly otherwise he just as easily could publish his one-sided views himself without an opportunity for discussion.

---

That still doesn't explain why you invest so much time in this. You are the one forum member that's into this back and forth discussion the most. It's Singer against the rest with you being "head of the opposition". If you'd spend as much time into develloping this Vegas forum into something useful as you spend discussing all this Singer crap you could actually have something good in your hands. Something that would make you some money as well (at least more than covering part of your expenses). So I really don't understand part of your reasoning. I always thought the idea behind creating a forum is to have some interesting (educational) conversations and a growing group of active contributors. You're not achieving that because you gain some members but you lose just as many because of all Singer's crap. He derails every topic and makes it about him and his nonsense. But, anyhow, feel free to continue. I'll check in from time to time to see if anything's changed but I'm not counting on it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Rob.Singer

Regnis, I agree these things happen. But I will NEVER do anything any casino wants me to do ....not if I expect to win. Casino credit isn't some "benefit" (ie, the foolish "interest-free loan" excuse) that casinos just "give away" out of the kindness of their hearts. It's one of their most effective money-making tools, just as credit cards are for banks.

Anywhere there's cash, there are thieves. That's expected. And NO ONE knows who has what. That's paranoia driven stuff. The issue then comes down to whether you want to keep taking chances and if you're prepared for it. I chose preparation. I ALWAYS valet park unless the casino is very easy-in/easy-out, I never dress very good when I go, I rarely wear my expensive watch, and I carried a gun in my bag right next to my cash up until 2009. Never was followed, harrassed, or had any trouble anywhere, and still haven't.

---

ok--I fly to Vegas--so can't carry a gun. I wear shorts and a t shirt--winter or summer--no flash. I also never show any emotion or excitement--you never know I have won. Unless you are at the craps table and see me cash out, or at the cage and see me cash out. I am aware of my surroundings and try not to get in an elevator alone. But it happened once at about 3 A.M.. I was ready to fight but instead got lucky that a door opened.

At the race track, I get a manager to take me privately into his office to get paid so as to avoid any onlookers. I don't even want the tellers to know. I have won large amounts and no one will ever know. But again, it only takes one time.

It does happen!!!

I lose money on the forum and always have. It's an "open forum" and Vegas_lover you are free to post what you consider valuable.
For me, this forum was just a simple, low-cost addition to my regular website which I need for my TV shows.
The TV shows pay the bills, and not this forum. Even Dan doesn't profit from this forum. If anything, its a free service to those who want to use it.

Regarding Rob's articles on my website (and the videos) that is also free and open and if Bob Dancer wants his stuff published here I would publish it also. And if redietz wants to publish his gaming info here the offer is also open to him. It costs me nothing to add pages. I already have more than 400 pages on the main site -- and that doesn't include the Forum.

I mostly agree with his article about casino tipping (though I'm not as hard-line as he is).

I disagree with his "special plays" foolishness.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Dan Druff

I mostly agree with his article about casino tipping (though I'm not as hard-line as he is).

---

For the purpose of discussion, what do you "mostly" agree with?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson

I lose money on the forum and always have. It's an "open forum" and Vegas_lover you are free to post what you consider valuable.
For me, this forum was just a simple, low-cost addition to my regular website which I need for my TV shows.
The TV shows pay the bills, and not this forum. Even Dan doesn't profit from this forum. If anything, its a free service to those who want to use it.

Regarding Rob's articles on my website (and the videos) that is also free and open and if Bob Dancer wants his stuff published here I would publish it also. And if redietz wants to publish his gaming info here the offer is also open to him. It costs me nothing to add pages. I already have more than 400 pages on the main site -- and that doesn't include the Forum.

---

Alan: My thanks to you and Dan Druff for running the Best Buys forum and website. It has added plenty of reading enjoyment during my free time over the past couple years.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson

Vegas_lover I agree with you. He is being absolutely ridiculous. In a previous post he pretty much told us that he doesn't have a credit line and questioned if he could get one given that he is not employed. He doesn't know what he's talking about when it comes to this subject. Namely, a credit line is determined only by your checking account balance plus a check of your "credit history" with casinos. They don't even check your regular credit files or "credit score." Either Rob never applied for a credit line or can't have one because of the lack of a sufficient checking account balance or his previous bankruptcy which may or may not impacted casinos in the past.

Regarding the miniscule number of casino robberies what Rob fails to understand is that it only has to happen to you once and it is no longer a miniscule problem.

If this character is really carrying around large amounts of cash it tells me that he either can't qualify for a credit line or he is being a show off.

Hey... if the casinos have blocked you from having a credit line well then it would make sense that you criticize anyone who has a credit line.

---

That's just dumb Alan. You're only acting this way because of how the ugly truth about Souther Californians and their beloved use of credit to impress each other, angers you.

The same goes for casino credit lines. I'm no expert on HOW they approve lines, but I AM an expert in WHY they do. One thing I know you're wrong about is the job verification, which can be done many ways. No place of business would ever give someone an unsecured loan without confirming there's an income. That's common sense. And if you've every actually played in a high limit slots room and won big instead of sitting at gotcha machines on the main floor that just happen to go as high as $5, you'd know the first thing the suit says is "would you like to open a personal credit line with the casino?" Again, only a fool who plays right into a casino's hands by having cash readily available when that far-too-often gambling-fix bug bites, uses casino credit and/or casino cash advance machines. Gee, too bad you can't tip those machines. Wouldn't that be the end-all in casino ownership of you??

So please do tell: when I carry a lot of cash, you now claim (of course, because I hit a very sensitive nerve about the one-upmanship that goes on where you live, and how so many people drive cars they can't afford just for perception purposes) that I do it as a "show off"? Then explain it so even the red, white, & blue-bleeding foreigner can understand: Do I carry a sign? Do I staple hundies to my hat? Or maybe I throw 'em around every now & then! C'Mon man :)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson

For the purpose of discussion, what do you "mostly" agree with?

---

I'd be most interested in what it is about the special plays he finds foolish. I'll discuss the issue w/o insults in hopes that my answers might help others better understand them and how their use may be beneficial when used in conjunction with other strong approaches to the game.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Rob.Singer

That's just dumb Alan. You're only acting this way because of how the ugly truth about Souther Californians and their beloved use of credit to impress each other, angers you.

The same goes for casino credit lines. I'm no expert on HOW they approve lines, but I AM an expert in WHY they do. One thing I know you're wrong about is the job verification, which can be done many ways. No place of business would ever give someone an unsecured loan without confirming there's an income.

---

You're digging a deeper hole for yourself, Rob. Now you are lumping everyone in Southern Cal as being lovers of credit. Why don't you take the next step and say the problem with Southern Californians is that they are all from Europe or the Middle East?

Secondly, I haven't been "employed" in the last 8 years -- I am self employed and own my business. There is no one to verify my income nor do I have "regular income." Over the past 8 years Ive renewed my credit line several times at Caesars and the only thing I gave them was my checking account account number.

Alan, I just looked at a Nevada casino's app for casino credit. It REQUIRES the applicant list their income source. Get it yet? So you're just blowing some more of that California Flake smoke into the conversation....the same type of smoke when you attempt to claim Southern Californians are not credit-happy one-upmanship fanatics. And the more money you have, the more credit you need and find a way to get.

If I said that about people in Southern Texas, now you might be able to reasonably argue that. But in the dog-eat-dog/image-crazy/over-priced/over-taxed/illegal alien & minority-infested place you have to deal with? No chance in hell you can deny it with a straight face. Misplaced pride, yes. But reality is a very tough nut to crack.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Rob.Singer

Alan, I just looked at a Nevada casino's app for casino credit. It REQUIRES the applicant list their income source. Get it yet? So you're just blowing some more of that California Flake smoke into the conversation....the same type of smoke when you attempt to claim Southern Californians are not credit-happy one-upmanship fanatics. And the more money you have, the more credit you need and find a way to get.

If I said that about people in Southern Texas, now you might be able to reasonably argue that. But in the dog-eat-dog/image-crazy/over-priced/over-taxed/illegal alien & minority-infested place you have to deal with? No chance in hell you can deny it with a straight face. Misplaced pride, yes. But reality is a very tough nut to crack.

---

Maybe Vegas_lover was right... having a conversation with you is a waste of time.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Dan Druff

I mostly agree with his article about casino tipping (though I'm not as hard-line as he is).

---

For the purpose of discussion, what do you "mostly" agree with?

---

I agree with his general philosophy regarding casino tipping.

Casinos should start paying employees better base salaries, and the whole practice of tipping them should stop.

The handpay tips are especially ridiculous, because handpay isn't a service. It's something that's done according to gaming law. Rob is correct that you don't tip bank tellers for doing essentially the same job. It has also gotten obnoxious how entitled a lot of these handpayers have gotten, to where a token $5-$10 tip isn't enough, and they make an angry face at you for giving them "too little". Funny how these people think they are entitled to big tips, yet the guys in the same hotel cleaning the public toilets don't get any tips at all.

I've never had any casino employee EVER wait around for a tip. Sometimes, I have to "chase after" a floor person at Caesars or Rincon to tip them. They routinely hand me the paperwork and the money and turn and start walking. So in short, I've never had an experience of workers "wanting" or "expecting" tips.

Even when I've played cash games at poker dealers do not have their "hands out." I often forget to tip at cash games because I usually play tournaments where there is no tipping on individual hands -- and no poker dealer has ever given me a bad look or an angry face. And when I "catch myself" for not tipping, I always get a warm thank you and smile.

Now about the subject of tipping: I don't mind tipping at all. Yes, I agree that the casinos should pay these people more, and even if they were better paid I probably would still tip as appropriate... just as I tip house keepers, and cab drivers, and valets, and waitresses, etc.

However, with that said, twice I was at craps tables where the dealers were "tip hustling" but that was the exception. It happened twice in more than 20 years of going to casinos.

Speaking of credit--what do you think is up with this local casino that shall remain nameless. I have had a small line of credit there for 20 years. It used to be my main place for craps, but for the last few years I go there every month or so for VP. All these 20 years I have had a small $5,000 line of credit, and have never even been late once on payment. And nothing has changed in my financial situation if they happened to have run an updated credit report.

So I go to the cage to get a marker for $2,500, and the cage supervisor who I have known for years and always have a friendly conversation with comes over with a sour look and tells me my line has been reduced to $1,000. I ask why and she says that periodically they review your play and my play doesn't justify the $5,00 line of credit. So I sit down and play a little VP and the guy next to me says they did the same thing to him.

What's up with this? They just lost me as a player after all these years for no reason or at least no reason that I can understand. I'll only go back there to use up my comps--they have a decent steak house.

What are they doing??

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson

I've never had any casino employee EVER wait around for a tip. Sometimes, I have to "chase after" a floor person at Caesars or Rincon to tip them. They routinely hand me the paperwork and the money and turn and start walking. So in short, I've never had an experience of workers "wanting" or "expecting" tips.

Even when I've played cash games at poker dealers do not have their "hands out." I often forget to tip at cash games because I usually play tournaments where there is no tipping on individual hands -- and no poker dealer has ever given me a bad look or an angry face. And when I "catch myself" for not tipping, I always get a warm thank you and smile.

Now about the subject of tipping: I don't mind tipping at all. Yes, I agree that the casinos should pay these people more, and even if they were better paid I probably would still tip as appropriate... just as I tip house keepers, and cab drivers, and valets, and waitresses, etc.

However, with that said, twice I was at craps tables where the dealers were "tip hustling" but that was the exception. It happened twice in more than 20 years of going to casinos.

---

I thought you recently told a story of an obnoxious woman handpaying you at an airport VP machine.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson

Maybe Vegas_lover was right... having a conversation with you is a waste of time.

---

For certain personalities, it must be. Teachable moments are not their bag.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Dan Druff

I agree with his general philosophy regarding casino tipping.

Casinos should start paying employees better base salaries, and the whole practice of tipping them should stop.

The handpay tips are especially ridiculous, because handpay isn't a service. It's something that's done according to gaming law. Rob is correct that you don't tip bank tellers for doing essentially the same job. It has also gotten obnoxious how entitled a lot of these handpayers have gotten, to where a token $5-$10 tip isn't enough, and they make an angry face at you for giving them "too little". Funny how these people think they are entitled to big tips, yet the guys in the same hotel cleaning the public toilets don't get any tips at all.

---

There's a thread on vpfree discussing cruise ship tipping. Everyone who doesn't mind NCL inserting a "tip fee" into the cost that has to be paid, keeps saying it's because they're "concerned" over how low a wage the service people get aboard ships. That's code for "I hate that I'm forced to pay this fee and I'd rather dish out cash on an as-earned basis. But if I want this partially comped cruise, I'd better stick to the popular narrative about wages".

We as customers, regardless of the venue, should never have any concern for what anyone else is being paid, and as such, it's not any of our business to be made to feel that it's up to us to make up for poor wages if they aren't being paid what we consider "fairly". I've been on 3 cruises in my life, and each time I felt the announced tipping policy, which always specified the minimum acceptable, was stupid and for intimidation purposes so that the weak would just fork it over. We were always told to leave the cash in an envelope and hand it to the steward on the way off the ship. My policy prevailed however, in that I never left any envelope full of money and instead chose to tip anyone whom I felt earned it in real time.

......................

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson

I've never had any casino employee EVER wait around for a tip. Sometimes, I have to "chase after" a floor person at Caesars or Rincon to tip them. They routinely hand me the paperwork and the money and turn and start walking. So in short, I've never had an experience of workers "wanting" or "expecting" tips.

Even when I've played cash games at poker dealers do not have their "hands out." I often forget to tip at cash games because I usually play tournaments where there is no tipping on individual hands -- and no poker dealer has ever given me a bad look or an angry face. And when I "catch myself" for not tipping, I always get a warm thank you and smile.

Now about the subject of tipping: I don't mind tipping at all. Yes, I agree that the casinos should pay these people more, and even if they were better paid I probably would still tip as appropriate... just as I tip house keepers, and cab drivers, and valets, and waitresses, etc.

However, with that said, twice I was at craps tables where the dealers were "tip hustling" but that was the exception. It happened twice in more than 20 years of going to casinos.

---

Alan, that's just silly. EVERY floor person wants and expects a tip after a hand pay. Some are able to walk away without showing emotion better than others. One thing they can't possibly be trained for is to react negatively to what they might think is a stiff from a playing customer. And if you're "chasing after" any floor person, there's only one reason for that: they're inside your head, and you don't want any bad feelings on the next go-around. That's all it is.....either that, or you're still enshrined in that God-awful philosophy of "we take care of our own" that I'm sure has now given you terrible Obama buyer's remorse.

Tell me, before you leave after NOT receiving any W2G's, do you chase after these people even if you just sunk $2500 into their machines? If not, why wouldn't you feel like "making up for their low wages" in this case?

Rob: (I am simply emphasizing "DETERMINATION", not screaming here)

So you would say that leaving with an attained win or lose goal and not tipping on handpays are both part of a DETERMINATION package?

In other words, if your DETERMINATION not to tip wavers, then your DETERMINATION to win will also eventually waver like falling dominoes?

You have to be perfectly DETERMINED on all facets of play to keep it going, does my interpretation make sense?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Dan Druff

I thought you recently told a story of an obnoxious woman handpaying you at an airport VP machine.

---

Dan here is that thread about the royal and the handpay: http://vegascasinotalk.com/forum/showth...=vegas+airport

Where did I say anything about an obnoxious floor person giving me a handpay?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Rob.Singer

For certain personalities, it must be. Teachable moments are not their bag.

---

It has nothing to do with teachable moments. There's nothing for you to teach me. I'm not a gambling addict. I haven't gambled since september 2013. And besides that, 99% of what you say comes out of your ass so why waste time listening to any of it?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Vegas_lover

It has nothing to do with teachable moments. There's nothing for you to teach me. I'm not a gambling addict. I haven't gambled since september 2013. And besides that, 99% of what you say comes out of your ass so why waste time listening to any of it?

---

Same here, V.L. Although I have gambled in 2014, I have a set budget for gambling and I stay within my limits. There is nothing that he can spew here than is meaningful enough for me to take to a casino. After perusing serious topical websites, I then come to this forum to read his blather. It provides me with my internet moron entertainment fix.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Vegas Vic

Same here, V.L. Although I have gambled in 2014, I have a set budget for gambling and I stay within my limits. There is nothing that he can spew here than is meaningful enough for me to take to a casino. After perusing serious topical websites, I then come to this forum to read his blather. It provides me with my internet moron entertainment fix.

---

Well, this is THE place for moron entertainment. We already have over 2800 gems with complete nonsense from our resident lunatic. Oh wait, we're just jaelous of his incredible success Vic. :)

Mister Singer doesn't even see how big an idiot he his. All this gambling stuff doesn't interest him anymore since he's not a professional gambler anymore. But at the same time he has over 2800 posts on this forum. Mister number two poster!

Mister Singer doesn't have the time nore the interest in listening or responding to all the critics. He's way too busy travelling and living the good life. OVER 2800 posts on this forum prove he has very little time.

Mister Singer isn't a professional gambler anymore. He made $100,000 a year over a period of 10 years as a professional. Now he's just a recreational gambling addict and he even makes more money at the casino's than when he was a professional. He accomplishes that by not playing his strategy consistently. If that doesn't prove his strategy is worthless than I don't know what does.

About a week/two weeks ago Mister Singer told us he wasn't going to post anything until the end of this year. He was going to be too busy travelling. Since that statement, he's been posting almost every day. Conclusion: Yep, an abundance of moron entertainment indeed.

Let's see how Rob is going to respond. Here are some keywords for his next response:
Eurotrash, gays, entitlement, handouts, Obama, dominating women, gambling addiction, jealousy, being stuck where we are, drug addicts, hookers, wooden shoes, windmills, tulips. :)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Count Room

Rob: (I am simply emphasizing "DETERMINATION", not screaming here)

So you would say that leaving with an attained win or lose goal and not tipping on handpays are both part of a DETERMINATION package?

In other words, if your DETERMINATION not to tip wavers, then your DETERMINATION to win will also eventually waver like falling dominoes?

You have to be perfectly DETERMINED on all facets of play to keep it going, does my interpretation make sense?

---

It's not a determination not to ever tip--that part's common sense, just as not cashing checks at casinos, never using casino ATM's, and not having a casino credit line are all common sense. These things are all part of what casinos want & expect players to do, and most oblige. Is it then a coincidence that most players LOSE too? Of course not. As an example, someone like Alan does just about everything any casino could ever hope one of their disposable-income-happy customers could do....and he's as happy as a lark while he keeps transferring his money from his accounts to theirs. All those "freebies", the gas cards & discounts, special treatment, wonderful year-end gifts, that "big shot" feeling as he struts up to the cashier to "draw" on that credit line, and that "invincible feeling" he gets as he looks at all those magnificent online offers and opens the mailed-in invites with sweaty palms....this stuff is all part of the "losing ain't THAT bad" process which the casinos control their best players with. "Put a positive spin on it, & maybe it'll rub off on others" is what the casinos are always hoping for, and you see that being done here in spades.

Determination comes into play when and if you develope a plan, and then always do it the way you told yourself you would do it. Casinos do everything in their power so you WON'T follow your plan because they want you to follow theirs. You know what I mean. Determination also comes in the form of saying you're gonna irritate the V boys, then actually DOING it, as you see here, in great BIG SPADES!:)