Originally Posted by
kewlJ
Playing for comps is simply not a winning strategy in 2019 for advantage players Tasha. There was a time is could have been if done right. I'll get to the most unique example I know of in a minute.
For AP's time is money, and that goes for any kind of game you play. I am going to stick to blackjack for a minute because it is what I know and do. First of all the casino industry has a rating system as far as comps. Not all players are rated the same. I forget the exact terminology that was used when this was relayed to me by a pit friend, but for blackjack there were like 4 different level (maybe different at different locations). So when a player was rated he was rated as "bad player", "losing player", "basic strategy player" or "advantage player".
so 4 different players hand in there cards and play rated and play for an hour playing roughly the same stakes, they are going to earn different rates of comps and offers. For the advantage player comps and offers, will be minimum, may dry up completely. This is often one of the first counter-measures implemented against table game AP's.
For the other 3 ratings, all are playing a losing game, the basic strategy player only slightly losing and the other two, increasingly so. So someone rated as a "bad player" (or whatever corresponding term each casino may use), this would be a player standing on all his 13's, 14's 15's, even against 9's and 10's. Or maybe he hits his similar 13, 14, 14, 16 vs a dealer break card, or splitting his 7's vs the dealer 10 card. That type of thing. This player is going to get far more comps for the same level and time play as a basic strategy player, that is playing just a slightly losing game.
The rating game is for the casinos to identify the worst players and entice them back by giving them a small percentage of their expected loss back, knowing they will lose many times that.
For a while, a long while this seemed to be confined to table game players. The machine experts can correct that statement if they feel it is wrong, but it is my understanding that for a long time, machine players could play their winning game and pile on the comps on top with no consequences. That all seemed to change just a couple years ago, when casinos began extending their war on AP's to machine players. The first I really saw this in Vegas was Boyd, but it is everywhere now. The free ride for machine players is or has come to an end. And in a way they have in worse because they can't rat-hole chips to disguise win as table players can. Although there are a few tricks.
Now let's go back to blackjack. Before I moved to Vegas, there was a common trick employed by visiting blackjack AP's. You would have one location that you toned down your play, smaller, less aggressive spread ect and played rated, to earn hotel and food comps, for either the trip you were on or hotel comps for the next trip. The rest of the trip you would play aggressively, unrated, full spread, no holds barred. I too did this for a a few trips and than analyzed it. So lets say my regular EV is $100/hr (which it may have been back then). I would tone down my spread, maybe playing a game worth $50/hour for 3-4 hours earning a free hotel room. Now mind you weekday hotel rooms on the strip, not at the top places like Wynn (at the time), but Caesars properties like Harrah, planet Hollywood, ect started at $29 weekdays. Maybe $39 at MGM properties. Toning down the spread cost $200, for a free hotel room valued at less than 20% of that. Needless to say, I stopped toning down my spread and playing rated and earned my full EV and started paying for my own rooms. :rolleyes:
After I moved to Vegas and got into a limited amount of machine play, I had the best of both worlds, just like the machine players did for so long. I played blackjack unrated (except for one unique place), and played a small amount of machine play that would keep the mailers and offers flowing. But I never mixed the two, not even on the same visit. As a matter of fact it was even better than that because there was a different person playing my machine play. Today, I have all but given up machine play aspect of my AP. I play just a very small amount, just enough to eat for free daily and I since I am playing both parts I never play machines and rated at a property in my blackjack rotation that I play unrated.
I know....my usual long post with some personal experiences. The bottom line Tasha is do you really thing the casinos are giving comps and stuff just to be nice. It is about identifying losing players and giving then a tiny amount of losses to entice them back, while at the same time identifying winning players so they can stop giving them anything (first counter-measure) and eventually take further action to remove them.
