Quote:
Originally Posted by
kewlJ
I have been so busy here :rolleyes:, that I haven't followed the drama at BJNormF in real time, but just caught up. Interesting!
Eliot claims he has been an advocate of allowing card counters to play for years with the casino industry. I never head anyone else say anything like that and it doesn't mesh with some of the things I have read from him. I do know that fairly recently, several years ago, when he wrote his book and basically posted the same things on his blog, he did have some wording about card counters are no real threat compared to the hole-card plays he was exposing. I wouldn't call that advocating for allowing card counters to play. I call it twisting words to make his case that there are bigger threats and that is why they should hire or consult with him.
Bill Zender, now he advocated for allowing card counters to play. Rightfully showed that 99.9% of card counters are no real threat and most have holes in their game or are not properly bankrolled or just to scared to throw out the big bet. He advocated that casinos should offer deep penetration, which would increase casino win from everybody and not worry about that 99.9% that aren't doing any real damage. That they should just focus on the high level players and team. THAT was advocating for allowing card counters! Not what Eliot said.
So moving on, the drama at the NormForum is most interesting. I am a big Don fan, despite having had my own mini-feud with him in the last 6 months. He is definitely growing grouchy as time goes on. :rolleyes: If anyone else had said what Don said, they would have been suspended. But members aren't on equal footing at BJTF...never have been.
So Don said what was on his mind. If Eliot is someone Norm welcomes to the forum, Don should let it go. But he won't. Both of them demanding Norm do something can only result in Norm backing Don. They are 45 year friends.
I sure would like to know where this 99% figure comes from? It completely sounds made up and it seems like it's stuck. I can guarantee you that it's a much higher percentage halfway competent card counters that are in fact a threat to the casinos. If you want to include every Joe Blow that tried card counting once, then there might actually be some truth to that.
And here's the funny thing... I hear lots of competent card counters repeating the same 99% figure. I think you guys are fooling yourselves because you want that to be true and you would love for the casinos to believe that. Sure, it would be absolutely be great for everyone into Advantage play if the casinos believe that, but it's not going to happen, because it's simply not true. A few competent card counters certainly wouldn't be that big of a threat to the casinos. But they can't just sit there and let card counters play unmolested or they would have a serious issue. If you have hundreds of card counters pecking away at you over and over and over, it's eventually going to hurt. There are enough company card counters out there that if left unmolested they would be a considerable problem.
Strangely enough, this discussion did came up the other day involving some competent card counters who are saying the same thing about the 99% figure. after some discussion think I swayed them into believing that number was way off and card counters could potentially do significant damage at the casinos didn't keep it in check. Obviously, other methods can hurt the casino much worse. But if you think about that, there's far less people out there participating in those types of methods compared to how many competent card counters there are. I'm just guessing here, but it's probably a 80 to 1 ratio.
Are the people using other methods making 80 times the amount then all the card counters put together?