A costly error in VP

[Canucknut]

I was playing $1 DDB today using my modified "Singer Strategy" when I committed a very costly error--one that I will never make again!

Having a session bankroll of $1800 I managed to parlay that into $4080 when I decided to cash out. Since the money kiosks don't dispense more than $2000 I had to redeem the ticket at the cashier, which was on the other side of the casino.

After she scanned the ticket she asked me if I would like the $2000 in hundreds or twenties. "Two thousand?" I said. Yes, "two thousand," she repeated back as she showed me the ticket I just gave her. Oh my god I thought; the machine didn't dispense the full amount and I didn't think to check the value of the ticket. I just took it for granted that it would have dispensed the full amount when I cashed out.

So I raced back there and, of course, the rest of my $2080 was gone. I was instantly sickened and just left. I couldn't believe I did something so stupid after all these years of playing VP. I should've known better.

I guess the lesson here is don't get distracted by everything that's going on
around you, and to always verify the ticket amount cashed out and make sure the credits read $0. Easily the most costly error I've ever made in a single session of VP. One that I won't soon forget.

[Alan Mendelson]

Canucknut thank you for joining us and for posting but I'm sorry that this was your first post. That is an absolute shame. I am curious where this happened? At most of the California casinos the machines start spitting out tickets when the credit balance is $1,000 or more. At Rincon in San Diego the tickets start coming at $1200. I've even heard of California casinos that spit out tickets when the credit meter reads as low as $600 on certain low-denomination games.

At Caesars in Vegas I've seen the credit meters build up to several thousand dollars and no tickets are spit out. However, when you hit the cash out button one ticket is dispensed for the full amount. I once got a ticket at Caesars for $5,000.

[Canucknut]

Hi Alan,

Thanks for welcoming me. I discovered you through Singer's (retired) website and the subsequent videos you did with him. I have been "lurking" around your forum for a bit and decided to join. I think you do a fine job running this forum and really admire (and appreciate) your penchant for freedom of speech and toleration for differences of opinion. It seems to fit well with my own libertarian philosophy.

As my handle might imply, I am from Canada and live in the province of Ontario.

This incident happened at Caesars in Windsor. It was on a Bally Game Maker machine. Now it does say (like others I've played around the province) that it pays up to $2000 and that any amount beyond that will require a hand pay. And that has happened to me before where I had something like $2700 (at another casino in toronto) and when I tried to cash the ticket out, it generated a hand pay and I had to wait for the attendent.

But this time when I hit the button to cash out the machine didn't lock up so i took it for granted that it was printing the full amount. At the same time I got focused on something else across the casino floor and just had my hand over the ticket dispenser and never thought to actually look at the ticket amount as I grabed it and headed for the cashier. So stupid of me, I know.

I'm done beating myself up over it, though. Now I just try to look at it as a donation to someone who needed the money more than me.

Canucknut thank you for joining us and for posting but I'm sorry that this was your first post. That is an absolute shame. I am curious where this happened? At most of the California casinos the machines start spitting out tickets when the credit balance is $1,000 or more. At Rincon in San Diego the tickets start coming at $1200. I've even heard of California casinos that spit out tickets when the credit meter reads as low as $600 on certain low-denomination games.

At Caesars in Vegas I've seen the credit meters build up to several thousand dollars and no tickets are spit out. However, when you hit the cash out button one ticket is dispensed for the full amount. I once got a ticket at Caesars for $5,000.

[Alan Mendelson]

I've been thinking about this and here's a case where you definitely want to check with security to be sure that casino personnel didn't cash out the machine, and if they can use their eye in the sky tapes to determine who did. I was at Rincon when a slot floorperson found credits on a $5 video poker machine and cashed them out -- but not before asking me if I had been playing the machine (I was on a nearby machine). I am sure that they would have given the TITO to a player who came in and reported that they were on the machine -- and that of course can be verified with through surveillance or players card data.

[slingshot]

I've been thinking about this and here's a case where you definitely want to check with security to be sure that casino personnel didn't cash out the machine, and if they can use their eye in the sky tapes to determine who did. I was at Rincon when a slot floorperson found credits on a $5 video poker machine and cashed them out -- but not before asking me if I had been playing the machine (I was on a nearby machine). I am sure that they would have given the TITO to a player who came in and reported that they were on the machine -- and that of course can be verified with through surveillance or players card data.

Wow! Sad story. I believe they would have been in trouble at my casino. I've had personnel stop me and show me money on the floor or credits on the machine-telling me they can't touch it. I have had the pleasure of turning in several purses to management.

[Rob.Singer]

If there were credits on an unattended machine it is far more likely someone saw them and just cashed it out. Most people in casinos are only aware of one thing--money, and when it appears out of nowhere they take it and aren't concerned at all about whether it's OK. We talk about the laws and proper reactions here, but when the "gift" happens upon you especially in a casino, it's a completely different story.

I've seen machines spit out tickets after reaching anywhere from $400 to my personal highest, which I think was around $6400. It must be something they can set from the menu, although I didn't see that feature when I had a machine.

[Alan Mendelson]

Gee Rob, you surprised me:

1. You said nothing about win goals.
2. You said nothing about "finders keepers, losers weepers" when it applied to one of your followers.

[Rob.Singer]

Didn't he cashout ahead? That's what counts. I don't teach players they have to do exactly as I do; they learn to change the way they've been playing to a more enjoyable method, and to quit when they get ahead some amount that's comfortable to them, or if they're losing much of their bankroll and suddenly find themselves slightly ahead or ahead by any amount, they should be thankful and quit.

The "loser's weepers" doctrine was more eloquently said in my first para.

[Canucknut]

That is true, Rob. I did cash out ahead. Except I went home with only $200 more than what I came with instead of the $2280 I should have went home with.

Didn't he cashout ahead? That's what counts. I don't teach players they have to do exactly as I do; they learn to change the way they've been playing to a more enjoyable method, and to quit when they get ahead some amount that's comfortable to them, or if they're losing much of their bankroll and suddenly find themselves slightly ahead or ahead by any amount, they should be thankful and quit.

The "loser's weepers" doctrine was more eloquently said in my first para.

[Rob.Singer]

While it puts a pit in the stomach, at least you went home with more than you came with. So as a consolation, you can say what the AP's would say: "at least I got the points!"

[Canucknut]

Actually, I can't say that because I no longer use a slot club card. It reinforces in me the fact that I am only there for the money.

While it puts a pit in the stomach, at least you went home with more than you came with. So as a consolation, you can say what the AP's would say: "at least I got the points!"

[Rob.Singer]

Actually, I can't say that because I no longer use a slot club card. It reinforces in me the fact that I am only there for the money.

Thank you for saying that because it is one important way to do exactly the opposite of what the casinos want and expect you to do. I was surprised Alan didn't jump on you for that, but as everyone who has ever played will attest to if they're being truthful, playing only for the money when, where, and how you like is far superior to being roped in by the casinos for their comps, promotions, and "freebies". Simple common sense readily tells the strong player that those "illusions" only and always lead to losing.

[Alan Mendelson]

playing only for the money when, where, and how you like is far superior to being roped in by the casinos for their comps, promotions, and "freebies". Simple common sense readily tells the strong player that those "illusions" only and always lead to losing.

Rob, I only hope you can convince a lot more people not to play with their club cards, so that more of the casino comps are left for us "small folks" who do value the comps, promotions and freebies. The fewer you take... the more the rest of us will have to share.

Canucknut: I still want to know if you tried to alert casino personnel when you realized you left $2080 in credits on the machine? And if so, what did they say or do? Did they try to help or just shrug?

[regnis]

At the race track, if you bet with your player's card, your number is printed on the ticket or voucher and so if someone finds it and turns it in, management will look up the number and come find you. Also, if someone else finds it and uses it, if that person puts his player card in, they can trace it to that player and will bring security in to attempt to make him give it back. Usually, when caught, they will say oh I didn't realize it--the other guy must have left it in the machine. So only if he finds it and cashes it can it not be traced.

I wonder why the casino can't do something similar for cases like Canuck.

[Alan Mendelson]

Canucknut, I just need to know if you made any effort to contact security or the floor people... just in case they cashed out your credits and are holding them to be claimed??

[Canucknut]

Hi Alan,

No, I made no such attempt. It happened so fast and I was so shocked (and embarrased) that it didn't really occur to me to notify casino personnel. Of course, in retrospect I should have immediately done just that.

Canucknut, I just need to know if you made any effort to contact security or the floor people... just in case they cashed out your credits and are holding them to be claimed??

[Canucknut]

Hi All,

Regarding my decision not to use a slot club card: 1) I don't want the casino keeping specific tabs on what games I play and how I play. 2) Comps for video poker players at this casino absolutely suck. 3) My style of (fast) play doesn't lend itself well to the use of a club card for me. I'll easily cycle through 20+ machines 2, 3, or 4 times in a session.

However, there was a time when I did use the club card religiously and I found that it did tend to promote addiction in me. But I would never claim that the use of a club card promotes addiction for everyone. There may be some who are disciplined enough not to get roped in by it; I don't personally know anyone like that but I'm willing to admit the possibility of it.

[Alan Mendelson]

Hi Alan,

No, I made no such attempt. It happened so fast and I was so shocked (and embarrased) that it didn't really occur to me to notify casino personnel. Of course, in retrospect I should have immediately done just that.

Just in case, I would try now. At worst... maybe security can pull up the video of when you played and they can see who cashed out your money. At best, someone might recognize that person and if approached they might "do the right thing" and give you the cash.

You might also see it was cashed out by a casino employee.

You have NOTHING to lose and $2,080 to gain.

[vpguy]

Welcome to the board Canucknut. Sorry about what happened to you what a kick in the head that is! You are now due a huge Royal to get that money back.
Hey I have a question. Would you mind going over your strategy for me as it sounds interesting. I'm always looking for new approaches in my play and yours sounds like something I may want to try. Good luck in the future and again Welcome.

[Canucknut]

Hi vpguy,

Thanks. Ya, I don't mind telling you my strategy. It was, of course, born out of a lot of the stuff I garnered from Rob Singer's website--combined with a slot strategy I read from John Robison on the Casino City Times website. I'll try and post it for you sometime this weekend. It's worked well for me but naturally I can't guarantee that it will work well for you.

Welcome to the board Canucknut. Sorry about what happened to you what a kick in the head that is! You are now due a huge Royal to get that money back.
Hey I have a question. Would you mind going over your strategy for me as it sounds interesting. I'm always looking for new approaches in my play and yours sounds like something I may want to try. Good luck in the future and again Welcome.