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Thread: Locals Casinos Free Play Strategy -- do you have one?

  1. #41
    Originally Posted by redietz View Post
    If anyone's interested in my opinion, I'm relatively certain Rob could manage what he claimed, especially in the historical time frame in which he made most of his money.
    A couple of comments:

    1. I'd certainly like to know the details of what he did to not pay any taxes of what he said were "profits" of nearly one million dollars? I would like to know what was included as "professional expenses" to offset those profits. Maybe I am missing something when I file my taxes?

    2. What's the point having profits of one million dollars playing video poker if your expenses are so high that you don't have any taxable income left? As a basic example of what I am talking about: If it costs you ten dollars to travel to a casino to win $10, what's the point of going?

  2. #42
    If I were advising Singer or any other gambler, I would advise them not to discuss this on any public forum. If we are to believe that he made the million (which I do) then the logical assumption is that he paid taxes. He says he didn't which makes you question the win or the honesty of the returns. I am not making any accusations here, I'm just pointing out the obvious and, as I said, I would advise people not to make such tax issues public.

  3. #43
    Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson View Post
    A couple of comments:

    If it costs you ten dollars to travel to a casino to win $10, what's the point of going?
    Where else can you get smoke blown in your face, beer spilled on your lap, and be mistreated by a corporate giant that no longer believes in customer service?

  4. #44
    What regnis said. Look, Apple managed to pay no taxes last year. The top 100 US corporations paid a much lower tax rate than the average citizen. I don't think any of them decided it was prudent to explain how they did it. They'd have to be dumb as rocks. Same with Rob -- assuming he did it, he'd have to be dumb as a rock to share the details.

    Of course, these corporations undoubtedly finessed the topic at shareholders' meetings so everyone was aware. Maybe Rob is floating the idea in case he garners a few investors.

  5. #45
    Gamblers are at a big disadvantage to begin with. Losses can only be used to offset wins, and unlike stock market losses they cannot be carried over.

    While regnis cautions everyone not to discuss their taxes on the web (which of course is great advice that applies to all personal info including where you live, names of children and spouses, employers, sexual fantasies, etc.) Rob Singer who has presented himself as an authority on video poker and casino strategies now has to say something more.

    He is now on record as saying both that he won nearly a million dollars playing video poker and that he escaped paying any taxes at all on nearly a million dollars of gaming income. An explanation is in order, and a failure to explain is a self inflicted attack on his own credibility.

    I cannot imagine how a million dollars of casino wins (profits) can be 100% tax free. He has also hinted that he used an RV and a Corvette to shield that income and on the face of it those deductions would not be valid and that also needs an explanation from him.

  6. #46
    One small correction Alan. Rob probably files as a professional gambler and therefor is not subject to the limitation on deductions for losses. Still--a million!!!

  7. #47
    Originally Posted by regnis View Post
    One small correction Alan. Rob probably files as a professional gambler and therefor is not subject to the limitation on deductions for losses. Still--a million!!!
    All gamblers can offset their wins with losses in the current year. Are you saying that as a professional he can carry over his losses from one year to offset wins in the next? If that is the case he should say that's what he did. And if did do that, it also undermines what he has told us about the strength of his system and his play because it means he also had big losing years.

    However, he said he lost about $250,000 as an "advantage player" and that he won $960,000 (profit) using his system. That still leaves a lot of taxable income that he paid zero taxes on and that needs to be explained.

    Look, he brought this up. I didn't. If it's a can of worms, Rob opened the can all by himself.

  8. #48
    Another question to ponder: I thought one of Rob's blood relatives works for the IRS? (His nephew is an auditor or somesuch?)

    I may be wrong about this, but I seriously think I remember reading this somewhere....maybe on VPFree? Not sure.

  9. #49
    Originally Posted by Count Room View Post
    Another question to ponder: I thought one of Rob's blood relatives works for the IRS? (His nephew is an auditor or somesuch?)

    I may be wrong about this, but I seriously think I remember reading this somewhere....maybe on VPFree? Not sure.
    Yes, he has made this claim but like all of his claims should be taken with extreme skepticism.

  10. #50
    Why would it make a difference if a close blood relative works for the IRS? Are you suggesting that the close relative pulled strings for Rob? Rob says he was audited and I doubt a close blood relative would have any influence on an audit or IRS procedures -- as I trust the system. I just think the only question here is what does Rob Singer know about the tax law that the rest of us don't know? It just seems far fetched to me that he could offset so much in profits to escape paying tax on an average of about $100,000 per year over ten years from video poker.

    I can easily accept that he had some business expenses each year. Were they 20% of the profits or even 50% of the profits? But how do you write off 100% of the profits?

  11. #51
    Alan, you are absolutely right. I looked into being a professional gambler it wasn't that attractive as far as I could tell. You have to show that all your deductions really are part of your profession. In addition, you have to show you are really trying to win money. Singer claimed he only gambled a few hours every year. That would never survive an audit as it would be clear it was not a full time profession.

  12. #52
    Arc-while "full time" is one relevant factor, it is not determinative of professional status. But keep in mind that he was a professional writer for the newspaper and, in those types of situations, you can lump the gambling wins and losses in with the wages that he earned for writing and the expenses pertaining to his writing. It is similar to what we do in horse racing where if you write on the sport, or even own racehorses, you lump the gambling in with it. It is one of our best gimmicks and has proven successful for many years.

    That being said, it still doesn't explain how you offset a million dollars.

  13. #53
    You know, if Rob Singer were a corporation, nobody would be surprised in the least that he didn't pay taxes on this. There's a good chance he was, what with the ease of Nevada personal incorporation.

  14. #54
    Originally Posted by regnis View Post
    Arc-while "full time" is one relevant factor, it is not determinative of professional status. But keep in mind that he was a professional writer for the newspaper and, in those types of situations, you can lump the gambling wins and losses in with the wages that he earned for writing and the expenses pertaining to his writing. It is similar to what we do in horse racing where if you write on the sport, or even own racehorses, you lump the gambling in with it. It is one of our best gimmicks and has proven successful for many years.

    That being said, it still doesn't explain how you offset a million dollars.
    He wasn't paid for his GT articles. Next.

  15. #55
    Originally Posted by redietz View Post
    You know, if Rob Singer were a corporation, nobody would be surprised in the least that he didn't pay taxes on this. There's a good chance he was, what with the ease of Nevada personal incorporation.
    Singer was a resident of AZ, not NV.

  16. #56
    Originally Posted by regnis View Post
    it still doesn't explain how you offset a million dollars.
    Right.

    Originally Posted by arcimede$ View Post
    Singer was a resident of AZ, not NV.
    Right.

  17. #57
    State of residence or state of incorporation would not matter. Simple to incorporate anywhere and federal tax laws are same regardless. State taxation of course would vary.

    There are issues regarding using a corporation for a professional gambler however. I don't remember all of the specifics but I do remember that there are issues.

  18. #58
    Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson View Post
    All gamblers can offset their wins with losses in the current year. Are you saying that as a professional he can carry over his losses from one year to offset wins in the next? If that is the case he should say that's what he did. And if did do that, it also undermines what he has told us about the strength of his system and his play because it means he also had big losing years.

    However, he said he lost about $250,000 as an "advantage player" and that he won $960,000 (profit) using his system. That still leaves a lot of taxable income that he paid zero taxes on and that needs to be explained.

    Look, he brought this up. I didn't. If it's a can of worms, Rob opened the can all by himself.
    Alan--no carryover for losses from gambling. However, in the case of a professional, they can deduct losses up to their winnings, but then create a loss by deducting their gambling and related expenses, and that loss can offset other income from any source in that year. A non-pro is just limited to a net zero and can't create a loss.

    Again, memory a little fuzzy, but this may not have existed in the years in question for Singer as I think it came in around 2010 or 2011.

  19. #59
    Alan, I've got a little time so I'll give you more info on how I didn't need to pay taxes on any of my wiining as a professional gambler for the 11 years I did it. Of course, it's a different scenario since retiring from filing schedule C in each of those years, but I still pay zero taxes on my modest net winnings.

    You're familiar with filing as a business. I was in business for myself as an author/writer, gambling advisor, and as a professional vp player. And as a filier of this status, I deducted a portion of my house in Phx., my home in Hawaii, and my apt. in Phx. Why & how? Because I lived, ate, slept and breathed vp during those years, and aside from my renting a car every day of the year each year that I deducted, along with all the gas and some insurance, whenever I was at a home I'd deduct travel there, food, dinners out even if I brought up gambling for an instant or for hours, etc. etc. etc. Take my wife to dinner and discuss my upcoming schedule for my travel to Nevada for the next week? Deductible. Buy groceries that helped keep me going all those endless hours at the computer writing? Deductible. I had some people I trained over to my house in Phx., and I liked to entertain them at the pool & spa while we talked "business". Bottom line, much of the expenses in my life were deductable legally, and my audits supported that. Outsiders may see this as a stretch, but they are all loophole-safe. My son-in-law also works for the IRS as a manager/Agent, and I made sure I followed the guidelines as required, as far along the edge as some of my deductions may have been.
    Last edited by Rob.Singer; 08-02-2013 at 06:06 PM.

  20. #60
    Da plane ...

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