Observations of a couple at $100 video poker machines

[Alan Mendelson]

I don't see many people at $100 video poker machines but when I do I like to glance at how they are playing without being too obvious about it. Among the things I look for: the game they are playing, how quickly they play, do they have tickets for "coin in" or a brick of $100 bills, and are they smiling or not.

Well, over the weekend I had a special treat. I got to see a husband and wife, side by side, both playing $100 machines.

Except they weren't playing much. Most of the time they spent on their cell phones, or talking to casino staff -- even having long conversations with the guy who vacuums, and the gal who cleans the ashtrays and playing stations. They also had other "friends" drop in and engaged them in long conversations as well.

And when they did get around to playing "a hand" it wasn't with lightning speed either. No... they took their time and even discussed with each other the hand and the potential "play" of the hand. Here's an example:

Husband "Look honey, I have an ace. I'd like to get quad aces."

Wife "I have a pair of jacks. Am I missing something?"

Of course they got extra special service from the cocktail waitress and had nice conversations with her as well before they placed the actual order and after the drinks were delivered. (Wonder why you can't find a cocktail waitress?)

Obviously when you are playing five coins at $100/coin it doesn't take a big hand to generate a W2G win -- just three of a kind paying $1,500 stops the action. (I know what you're saying... it doesn't seem like there is much action!) And when they did have a "jackpot" they asked for $500 cash plus a ticket for the balance -- and I saw them do this as well for straights and flushes.

Watching them for almost an hour made me wonder if the key to "casino success" is to sit at one big denomination machine and make fewer bets than what you would play normally at a denomination you could actually afford to play? It might actually cost you less and you have an extension of your living room to chat with people and have someone else fetch you the drinks.

[Dan Druff]

I don't see many people at $100 video poker machines but when I do I like to glance at how they are playing without being too obvious about it. Among the things I look for: the game they are playing, how quickly they play, do they have tickets for "coin in" or a brick of $100 bills, and are they smiling or not.

Well, over the weekend I had a special treat. I got to see a husband and wife, side by side, both playing $100 machines.

Except they weren't playing much. Most of the time they spent on their cell phones, or talking to casino staff -- even having long conversations with the guy who vacuums, and the gal who cleans the ashtrays and playing stations. They also had other "friends" drop in and engaged them in long conversations as well.

And when they did get around to playing "a hand" it wasn't with lightning speed either. No... they took their time and even discussed with each other the hand and the potential "play" of the hand. Here's an example:

Husband "Look honey, I have an ace. I'd like to get quad aces."

Wife "I have a pair of jacks. Am I missing something?"

Of course they got extra special service from the cocktail waitress and had nice conversations with her as well before they placed the actual order and after the drinks were delivered. (Wonder why you can't find a cocktail waitress?)

Obviously when you are playing five coins at $100/coin it doesn't take a big hand to generate a W2G win -- just three of a kind paying $1,500 stops the action. (I know what you're saying... it doesn't seem like there is much action!) And when they did have a "jackpot" they asked for $500 cash plus a ticket for the balance -- and I saw them do this as well for straights and flushes.

Watching them for almost an hour made me wonder if the key to "casino success" is to sit at one big denomination machine and make fewer bets than what you would play normally at a denomination you could actually afford to play? It might actually cost you less and you have an extension of your living room to chat with people and have someone else fetch you the drinks.

I can't see how this would earn you much in additional comps, as slot/VP play is judged by coin-in, and not hours spent playing. While they do separate your play into "trips", I don't think they look at hours played on a specific trip. Hours played is used to judge pit games like blackjack/craps, since those have a fairly constant speed and there is no way to otherwise track them.

The only advantage I see to slowplaying a VP machine is really low denominations like 25c at a bar, where you get free drinks.

[Alan Mendelson]

Maybe they weren't real high rollers and just wanted to play the part?

It reminded me of a friend who years ago went into Caesars and opened a credit line and took out $10,000 in chips. He walked around the casino all weekend with the $10K in chips in his pocket and never made a bet. At the end of the weekend he wanted to be comped because he took out a marker for $10K but he was told "sorry... you didn't bet anything."

[Dan Druff]

Maybe they weren't real high rollers and just wanted to play the part?

It reminded me of a friend who years ago went into Caesars and opened a credit line and took out $10,000 in chips. He walked around the casino all weekend with the $10K in chips in his pocket and never made a bet. At the end of the weekend he wanted to be comped because he took out a marker for $10K but he was told "sorry... you didn't bet anything."

Yes, I bet this was a misguided attempt to establish themselves as high rollers deserving of big comps.

[Alan Mendelson]

Yes, I bet this was a misguided attempt to establish themselves as high rollers deserving of big comps.

This might be true. I remember overhearing their conversation with a custodian who came around with a vacuum... the husband said something like "it's been a year since we saw you last." I wouldn't define a "high roller" as someone who hasn't visited a casino in a year.

When I have seen "real players" at $100 machines they usually have a slot attendant standing behind them with a reset key and a yellow legal pad to record jackpots. That didn't happen which makes me think the casino knew these people weren't "for real."

[Rob.Singer]

Leave it to a locked-in TR pawn to worry about how much in comps these people were blowing by not playing fast.

[Alan Mendelson]

Leave it to a locked-in TR pawn to worry about how much in comps these people were blowing by not playing fast.

This is getting very old, Rob. No one mentioned a thing about "how much in comps these people were blowing by not playing fast." What Dan alluded to, and what I also view as possible, is that these folks may have been trying to "work the system" to appear as high rollers while not actually being high rollers. Dan's comment were appropriate, while your comments were more of the "same old same old."

I am looking forward to your upcoming articles in Gaming Today plus your explanation for how you hit so many big jackpots with so little play.

[Vegas_lover]

It took Rob only 4 responses until his first attempt to derail this thread and make it about him again. Can you say mental issues.......

[Rob.Singer]

Alan, you always like to make up scenarios about what other gamblers are doing and why. From what you're saying you witnessed, these people couldn't have cared less about generating the comps and freebies that you 7-Stars players are such slaves to. They were just enjoying their time at machines they could afford to play, maybe hoping to win something.

[Alan Mendelson]

I'm not sure what their motivation was, Rob. Like my friend who walked around the casino with $10K in chips, perhaps they wanted to give the appearance of high rollers so they would be comped? I don't know.

The fact is that a lot of people value comps -- even though you don't. A lot of people value being a 7 Stars player -- even though you don't.

[rymetymeuk]

I'm going to the Wynn for 2 nights in October for my 34th bday, and got a comp offer of $300 freeplay. I'm going to just see what happens with a couple of hands on the $100 JoB VP, and hopefully hit a 3 of a kind (well anything really!).

I think it's a more enjoyable way to have the thrill of hi limit action than one spin at a $1k slot machine pull.

i'll let you guys know how I do

[Alan Mendelson]

Not me. I'd rather use $300 of free play on a game/denomination where I'd have a chance to get some playtime and also wins... perhaps at a $1 game.

[rymetymeuk]

I see your point, I think it's just to get the thrill out of my system of potentially getting a huge hit. I know the odds are against me but hey, this is my last Vegas trip for quite some time so I don't want to be sat at home feeding the baby thinking "what if" :P

[Vpnewbie]

Hey Alan, I was at Rincon Friday and Saturday. If you ever see me at the 3116 machine playing. I'll gladly give up my seat to watch you play. And don't worry. I'm not a big talker.

[Alan Mendelson]

Hey Alan, I was at Rincon Friday and Saturday. If you ever see me at the 3116 machine playing. I'll gladly give up my seat to watch you play. And don't worry. I'm not a big talker.

There are two other machines with 8/5 Aces and Faces in the video poker section where I can play it at $1 and $2 and there are also 8/5 Bonus games. No need for you to give up your seat. There is no "magic" attached to 3116. I like it because of the location, primarily -- not on an aisle.

In the high limit room there is also a slant-top with Aces and Faces at $1 and $2.

[Rob.Singer]

I see your point, I think it's just to get the thrill out of my system of potentially getting a huge hit. I know the odds are against me but hey, this is my last Vegas trip for quite some time so I don't want to be sat at home feeding the baby thinking "what if" :P

As a former occasional $100 machine vp player (who sweat streams at times while playing them) the thrill stops when you get tired of signing every time you hit trips or better. And that's just signing the page your personal attendant gives you. If you decline an attendant who sits behind you, you have to go thru the jackpot thing every time. It's VERY boring.

[rymetymeuk]

If I get a handpay out of my two spins I'll be very pleased, and will swiftly move to the $1 denomination machines! I can see how that would get very tedious though!

[Alan Mendelson]

If I get a handpay out of my two spins I'll be very pleased,

I think the chance of a winning hand is 1 out of 3, and that "win" might only be a return of your original bet amount (jacks or better).

[arcimede$]

I think the chance of a winning hand is 1 out of 3, and that "win" might only be a return of your original bet amount (jacks or better).

Most games that return 2-1 on two pair have a chance of at least getting your money back at around 45%. Actually winning something is more like 25%.

[Rob.Singer]

Most games that return 2-1 on two pair have a chance of at least getting your money back at around 45%. Actually winning something is more like 25%.

I agree with the first part of that. But the 25% figure is only what AP's experience...if they're lucky. And why bother? I wouldn't ever play if that were the case for everyone.