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Thread: To my friend: stop going to casinos.

  1. #21
    Originally Posted by Vegas_lover View Post
    So losing 5000 dollars (out of pocket money) at the slots could mean you've ran 25000 or more dollars through the machine. Could it be that the bean counters, count the same way in craps?
    At video poker, you are lucky to get 1% of your coin-in back as comps. With $25,000 of coin in you are looking at $250 worth of comps.
    You'll never get that comp level in craps or at any table game.

    Redietz was claiming that somehow a $5,000 loss in craps would yield a fantasmic return in comps of $10K or more. Never.

  2. #22
    Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson View Post
    Comps are lower for craps... period. Vegas_lover don't get swept up in this BS. You don't get $10k in comps for $5k in play... win or lose. Must be another of red's mysterious articles.
    Craps is different. Since there is no computer recording every bet you make, the casino briefly watches your play and the length of time that you play. Each bet in craps, other than odds, pays less than the actual odds for making that number. Based upon which numbers you play, and the amount initially placed on that number, they can calculate your theoretical loss (i.e. the difference between the actual odds on a number and the amount they pay you for that number, multiplied by the amount that you bet on that number. They then factor in a theoretical number of rolls per hour. It is far from exact.

    A good floor man will recognize increases in your wagers during a good roll. But the lazy ones who don't care about your comps just put in the initial bet.

    Casinos differ on odds because there is no house edge and thus no theoretical loss. When discretionary comps were more common, my odds bets got me anything I wanted--no questions asked. But today, it's all computer and therefor most casinos disregard the odds bet (unless you qualify for discretionary comps).

    Example: The actual odds on a 9 are 3-2. In craps, it pays 7-5. If I bet $10 on the nine, it should pay me $15, but they only pay me 14. Calculate the number of hours and the hypothetical number of rolls per hour, and that is the theoretical loss. If I bet 4 numbers--do the same calculation for all 4 numbers.

    It is therefore impossible to get $10K in comps for $5k in play in craps.

  3. #23
    I am going to anticipate redietz's response and I think this is what he is going to say supports his original statement:

    Originally Posted by regnis View Post
    When discretionary comps were more common, my odds bets got me anything I wanted--no questions asked.
    Originally Posted by redietz View Post
    He grinds out twice the comp value as his losses each year.
    So my question is, regnis, even back in the day when "discretionary comps were more common" could any craps player get $10K in comps for $5K in craps play?
    I say "no."
    What do you say?

  4. #24
    I would say absolutely not, unless he was being "rated" by a friend who was risking his own job.

  5. #25
    Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson View Post
    Losing is not a requirement for 7 Stars or for Diamond.

    Rob has told us he is now 7 Stars. Rob, are you winning or losing?
    I am 7-Stars now, but it is only because of the heavy play on the $1 to $25 machines I gave them on several visits around the country. And yes, I've been very lucky at CET as you've seen in my photos, and am ahead 6-figures (between '13 & '14, so don't nitpick the exactness of the years this time please).

    For VL, you missed the boat about Dancer again. Why do you bother trying to appear up to snuff with what goes on over here, when you have all you can do with wondering about the failings of your pride-inducing soccer team? Dancer etc. make money from their misguided customers out of saying one thing and doing something else. I admit it's luck along with my highly efficient and intelligent play that makes me able to be a consistent vp winner, and I win a lot more than those imposters.

  6. #26
    Originally Posted by Rob.Singer View Post
    I admit it's luck along with my highly efficient and intelligent play that makes me able to be a consistent vp winner,
    Gee Rob, if it is luck + your play I guess that means "your play" doesn't have any special significance?

  7. #27
    I don't get it here. Is anyone really winning while playing VP? I also don't understand what the comps have to do with the game. I basically play the game to entertain myself along with the possibility of winning a few bucks. The comps are great including the free suites, stocking of the bar, lunch or dinner with my host and of course the free play along with the numerous 7 Star gifts I receive during the year. As far as I'm concerned this game is a game of pure luck. I don't understand the pay back percentages that everyone is discussing. I see this one way. I am playing against a machine. With a little luck I may get some quads, quads with the kicker, and the possible Royal Flush. I should mention that I have received several Royal Flush's while playing with the free play. As far as the comps go I only receive them because I play with real money and that generates my tier score level. The same applies to the Reward Credits. I really don't see any perfect method however a basic understanding of the game applies. You may ask me if I am winning or losing and the simple answer is I probably lose more than I win. Why do I play because I enjoy the game and the game is fun to me. If I lose I'm gone. If I win I'm gone. Does the Casino win? Yes the Casino wins everyday. The Casino is nothing more than a business. If they don't win then they shut the doors. I am happy for the Casino. I personally like to hang there. I'm not a big drinker however the drinks are free. I go to the Casino not because of the comps but the fun I have in playing the game. Do the comps entice me? Not really. I just like to play. Does the Casino thrive? Most certainly the Casino thrives. Is it because of me? My answer is it's because of all of us that go. I feel sorry for the people that have developed a question of thought. I feel sorry for the people who are down on there luck. There is always another tomorrow. It's time to catch a plane to Vegas. Thanks to my friends at CET. I'm definitely going to use this comp. Why not. I've earned it. I wish you all well and lots of good and better luck! Go get lots of Quads and finally Quad AAAA's out!

  8. #28
    Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson View Post
    Gee Rob, if it is luck + your play I guess that means "your play" doesn't have any special significance?
    You're always searching for a reason why you don't win, and when you offer up such weak and dumb rationale about anything video poker, it's like you're announcing it to everyone like you.

    What makes you never willing to read and comprehend the entire post? Luck is a good part of it, but without a structured strategy behind whenever luck decides to appear, whether the win is due to random luck or due to a special play that gave luck a better opportunity to appear, any player will end up like you do and give all or most of it--and more--right back to the casinos. It is, as they say, as simple as that.

  9. #29
    Originally Posted by Quad AAAA's View Post
    I don't get it here. Is anyone really winning while playing VP? I also don't understand what the comps have to do with the game. I basically play the game to entertain myself along with the possibility of winning a few bucks. The comps are great including the free suites, stocking of the bar, lunch or dinner with my host and of course the free play along with the numerous 7 Star gifts I receive during the year. As far as I'm concerned this game is a game of pure luck. I don't understand the pay back percentages that everyone is discussing. I see this one way. I am playing against a machine. With a little luck I may get some quads, quads with the kicker, and the possible Royal Flush. I should mention that I have received several Royal Flush's while playing with the free play. As far as the comps go I only receive them because I play with real money and that generates my tier score level. The same applies to the Reward Credits. I really don't see any perfect method however a basic understanding of the game applies. You may ask me if I am winning or losing and the simple answer is I probably lose more than I win. Why do I play because I enjoy the game and the game is fun to me. If I lose I'm gone. If I win I'm gone. Does the Casino win? Yes the Casino wins everyday. The Casino is nothing more than a business. If they don't win then they shut the doors. I am happy for the Casino. I personally like to hang there. I'm not a big drinker however the drinks are free. I go to the Casino not because of the comps but the fun I have in playing the game. Do the comps entice me? Not really. I just like to play. Does the Casino thrive? Most certainly the Casino thrives. Is it because of me? My answer is it's because of all of us that go. I feel sorry for the people that have developed a question of thought. I feel sorry for the people who are down on there luck. There is always another tomorrow. It's time to catch a plane to Vegas. Thanks to my friends at CET. I'm definitely going to use this comp. Why not. I've earned it. I wish you all well and lots of good and better luck! Go get lots of Quads and finally Quad AAAA's out!
    I guess you have the AP's of the world figured out. Most, if not all, are lifetime losers, and every single one of them are addicted in a big way to the poker machines. There are also more than a few who have either abandoned their sick wives, or enjoyed making them suffer just to feed their own pathological gambling problems. That's why I chose my own road to success. When I see how some of these selfish "AP's" ended up, although they're truly paying back the piper, it is a learning experience to behold.

  10. #30
    Rob what makes you think I don't win? I made 7stars this year with a profit thanks to a $2 royal. And I used Dancer's strategy and not yours.

    Rob you seem to think everybody but you loses at video poker -- well there are many, many winners and many, if not all of them, never heard about even one of your special plays or your other self-glorified strategies.

    May I suggest a little self-administered dose of humility? You might find that there are others out there who win even more than you do.

  11. #31
    Originally Posted by Quad AAAA's View Post
    I don't get it here. Is anyone really winning while playing VP? I also don't understand what the comps have to do with the game.
    Right off the bat, let me suggest that you have a problem. You obviously are not a serious player and it appears that much of what is discussed here is flying either over your head or between your ears. If you just want to throw money into machines and push buttons, then continue what you're doing.

    Originally Posted by Quad AAAA's View Post
    I basically play the game to entertain myself along with the possibility of winning a few bucks. The comps are great including the free suites, stocking of the bar, lunch or dinner with my host and of course the free play along with the numerous 7 Star gifts I receive during the year.
    Well, first you said you don't understand what comps are all about, and then you say you do. Make up your mind.

    Originally Posted by Quad AAAA's View Post
    As far as I'm concerned this game is a game of pure luck. I don't understand the pay back percentages that everyone is discussing.
    Why do you bother playing video poker? With this attitude, you should be just as happy playing traditional slot machines.

    It's true that video poker is primarily a game of luck, but because there is a "fixed deck of cards" you have the ability to figure out odds and chances and getting lucky with certain combinations and certain pays. If all of that escapes you -- don't play because you might be making the wrong holds which are costing you money. If you just want to take a chance to get lucky play craps, or just traditional slots, or keno. You play video poker only because you are willing to invest some thought. If you can't invest any thought in each play then you are wasting your time and your money.

    Originally Posted by Quad AAAA's View Post
    I see this one way. I am playing against a machine. With a little luck I may get some quads, quads with the kicker, and the possible Royal Flush. I should mention that I have received several Royal Flush's while playing with the free play. As far as the comps go I only receive them because I play with real money and that generates my tier score level. The same applies to the Reward Credits. I really don't see any perfect method however a basic understanding of the game applies. You may ask me if I am winning or losing and the simple answer is I probably lose more than I win. Why do I play because I enjoy the game and the game is fun to me. If I lose I'm gone. If I win I'm gone. Does the Casino win? Yes the Casino wins everyday. The Casino is nothing more than a business. If they don't win then they shut the doors. I am happy for the Casino. I personally like to hang there. I'm not a big drinker however the drinks are free. I go to the Casino not because of the comps but the fun I have in playing the game. Do the comps entice me? Not really. I just like to play. Does the Casino thrive? Most certainly the Casino thrives. Is it because of me? My answer is it's because of all of us that go. I feel sorry for the people that have developed a question of thought. I feel sorry for the people who are down on there luck. There is always another tomorrow. It's time to catch a plane to Vegas. Thanks to my friends at CET. I'm definitely going to use this comp. Why not. I've earned it. I wish you all well and lots of good and better luck! Go get lots of Quads and finally Quad AAAA's out!
    This last section of what you wrote is a fair appraisal. But it seems to me you could say the same thing if you were playing "mindless slots" or just randomly throwing two dice, or picking keno numbers.

    I think you are also a candidate for stopping the play of video poker until you learn more about the game and at least learn and practice basic strategy. Otherwise you might enjoy the game "Texas Tea" which is a popular slot game and requires no thinking.

  12. #32
    Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson View Post
    Rob what makes you think I don't win? I made 7stars this year with a profit thanks to a $2 royal. And I used Dancer's strategy and not yours.

    Rob you seem to think everybody but you loses at video poker -- well there are many, many winners and many, if not all of them, never heard about even one of your special plays or your other self-glorified strategies.

    May I suggest a little self-administered dose of humility? You might find that there are others out there who win even more than you do.
    It is you who has perpetrated the fact that you don't win. And winning one year is not what I or even you are discussing. Plus, I seriously doubt you know optimal play well enough, based on your many comments and questions here over the years, for it to be any more than a guide on how to play the game....let alone a reason for winning in a year. And it's not "Dancer's strategy". It's known math, which he and a host of others choose to wrap up and sell to players as a method of income.

    Any winning you experience is only due to a basic knowledge of the game along with better-than-average luck. This doesn't come along often, which is why you have few winning years. Other than the past 18 months or so, I've always had average luck, and it was my playing strategy that made the big difference. THAT'S the key, and if you've ever paid attention, you'd have seen where the strategy requires getting up and LEAVING THE ACTION BEHIND once a win goal is attained, and not using a jackpot winning hand as an excuse to whittle the winning down to a much smaller amount while pretending you still feel "good" about the final result of the session, just so you didn't have to stop getting your gambling fix.

    It really is that simple, and you still have time for my free training offer.
    Last edited by Rob.Singer; 06-19-2014 at 08:12 AM.

  13. #33
    Originally Posted by Rob.Singer View Post
    For VL, you missed the boat about Dancer again. Why do you bother trying to appear up to snuff with what goes on over here, when you have all you can do with wondering about the failings of your pride-inducing soccer team? Dancer etc. make money from their misguided customers out of saying one thing and doing something else. I admit it's luck along with my highly efficient and intelligent play that makes me able to be a consistent vp winner, and I win a lot more than those imposters.
    Unlike you Rob, I'm not a broken record. I know your position on, and frustration about true VP Legend Bob Dancer. It's so obvious it's pathetic. And about the bold sentence, try to write a coherent sentence next time ok? You're just sounding like the genormous idiot you probably are. Be careful about who you call imposter, Alan what where your comments again about statements like this?

    But go ahead and return to your daily ludacris rants. Oh wait, you don't have time for that until the end of the year. You know......travelling and all

    Ta ta

  14. #34
    Rob it's no ones business what I win or lose in casinos and the last thing any real person is going to do is publish their win/loss for the world to see.

    There are several forum members here who are real VP winners. They needn't impress anyone.

  15. #35
    Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson View Post
    Gee Rob, if it is luck + your play I guess that means "your play" doesn't have any special significance?
    Alan, the way I read Rob's statement is that he has luck ALONG with using his stratagies for being successful, of course the strategy part of the equation is significant.

  16. #36
    Dannyj I "read" Rob's comments as telling us only what he wants to tell us. His system does not have any monopoly or edge on luck. In fact he could be winning more with conventional play which is pretty much what he's been doing lately. A system which is a variable system is no system at all. He is playing video poker just as Dancer, Scott and Grochowski would. The day he told us he held kickers it was all over.

  17. #37
    Originally Posted by Rob.Singer View Post
    Other than the past 18 months or so, I've always had average luck
    Of course you have. What you've reported is probably exactly like everyone else experiences:

    November 2008:
    This year I hit 4 royals, played 25 hours total
    (less than 4,000 hands per royal)

    August 2010:
    I've played a whole 5 hours in 2010 and most of it via the free-play route, but thanks to a very unusual four Royal Flushes (one on quarters and THREE on $2 machines) I've profited over $20,000
    (less than 1,500 hands per royal)

    2011: 4 royals and one A-C-E-S reported in 2 month period, in what was claimed to be a limited amount of play. (Impossible to know exactly how many hands were played, but based on your statements from that time frame of playing no more than 90 minutes every 10 days it would amount to one royal in less than every 1,250 hands, not included the ACES hit).

    Its a good thing that you've never done any thing that might make people question your honesty or they might doubt your good fortune. What I can't quite figure out is why you were constantly crowing about how GT was always posting your big wins if you just had average luck.

    I also noticed that the royals slowed down and the quads with kickers had a huge gain this spring, with aces plus a kicker coming in at about 10 times the expected rate of 1 every 15,000 hands and 2/3/4 with a kicker coming in at twice the expected rate. You have been very lucky indeed.

    I had a question about how you define "sessions" and "win goals". In your post you stated:

    Originally Posted by Rob.Singer View Post
    the strategy requires getting up and LEAVING THE ACTION BEHIND once a win goal is attained
    You say that a lot. In an a post from July of '13 where you said you were training someone you wrote:

    Originally Posted by Rob.Singer View Post
    But the most important part of the training sessions was TO QUIT AS SOON AS THE WIN GOAL WAS ATTAINED, and that's exactly what was done both days.
    In the very next article, posted 5 hours after the first, you mentioned losing $1,600 the day before and then wrote:

    Originally Posted by Rob.Singer View Post
    The final 3 sessions, from today, show a $4000 royal for a session profit of $3600; a $1250 dealt quad for a session profit of $375; and $2000 quad Aces for a session profit of $1700. So how much did I make in less than THREE hours and four sessions of play? $4075, that's how much, and it was ALL on NEGATIVE EV GAMES!!
    That doesn't quite seem like "LEAVING THE ACTION BEHIND once a win goal is attained". You've posted goals here before, and none have been anywhere close to $4,000 or $5,000. I'm also not sure how "sessions" work if you include one from the day before.

    According to your own statements those three sessions netted $3,600, $375, and $1,700.

    And, as you said, they were all played on the same machine.

    I'm having trouble figuring out where the "leave" part comes into play. This doesn't seem to be all that much different from what you constantly rail against other players doing. You stayed on the same machine. You seem to count the losses from a day earlier in your session count. You had big wins yet kept playing. How does this differ from what Bob Dancer or Alan or anyone else does?


  18. #38
    Originally Posted by Vegas_lover View Post
    Unlike you Rob, I'm not a broken record.
    So you don't have to keep typing that out;


  19. #39
    I appreciate the attention along with how very much I have to be inside your head Spock (and if you had any of those "brains" you're trying to display, you'd have first realized how that's what I mainly attempt to do to you just to antagonize such a fool as much as possible!)....however, your nonsense has more spin included than the liberals when they lie, flip flop, then lie about the lie again. Pick any one of those made up assertions, and I'll make you look as dumb as you are in front of the other five posting members here, one at a time. Go ahead, pick your strongest lie first!

  20. #40
    Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson View Post
    Rob it's no ones business what I win or lose in casinos and the last thing any real person is going to do is publish their win/loss for the world to see.

    There are several forum members here who are real VP winners. They needn't impress anyone.
    Alan, again, it has been YOU who has constantly posted about your losing almost every year. I don't much care because I know the game, I know the strategy you SAY you use and that a few others here use, and I know the only way any of you guys win is when you have an exceedingly lucky year.

    Now tell me how you know which forum members win. That should be good.

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