An Open email to me about Rob Singer and the debate on this and the LVA Forums

[Rob.Singer]

Peter, I wonder what's going to happen when Frank Kneeland concludes that there's no merit to the Singer strategy in terms of ongoing positiive financial results. I'm guessing he'll be reclassified as just another "addicted" AP'ers who need to write books and consult with casinos to actually earn a living.

It's funny as hell to see what's happening on vpFree's board. Singer has been allowed to post there as long as he doesn't promote/comment on his system. If you never met this guy nor read his typical tirades, you'd actually think he's a nice guy based on what he writes there. He's calm, insightful and even witty. I can see through this as clear as day.....he's sucking up to Kneeland as being his last hope to convince that his system has merit.

Rob, having the most viewed post due to the reason that most people despise you isn't something that I'd be proud of. Peter does make a very sound point....where are your supporters and more importantly, those disciples who you have personally trained who are consistently making money with your system? You claim to have taught about 500 people. Presumably, if they follow your system, they should be able to replicate your results, right? So, there are 500 or so people walking around with the knowledge of how to make just less than $100K/yr. and to do this in about 43 sessions. Do I have all this correct? I hope so as I'm using your numbers that you've provided on this very board. I'd love to meet one or two of these people in the flesh.

Unlike you, I don't know of many AP'ers who claim to make $100K/yr. playing vp. They may be out there but not in the circles I run. If I could make $100K/yr. gambling, I'd like give up my primary gig. Then again, I'd probably play 86 sessions a year and earn $200K....I'm a bit more ambitious than most.

Not to harp on this but you claim to have a system that makes $100K/yr. and you're happy to share it for free and you've had 500 people already take you up on this offer. If this were possible, you'd have a vast majority of these 500 telling all of us non-believers how much they're making and with enough verification, others would be jumping on board this money making system and you'd be hearalded as the smartest gambler of all time.

Can you see why this doesn't pass the stink test with the overwhelming majority of people?

Alan, just had a thought that might cut thru the chase with the never ending debate. How about this....

I'm not sure if I have all the facts straight but this is what I recall. Rob says that he needs about $57-58K bankroll for his strategy. To get an unbiased review of his system, how about a little experiment? Designate someone to be the player. I might suggest Slappy but you might have someone else in mind. Rob escrows the required bankroll and you front the player an equivalent amount of actual bankroll. Under Rob's tutelage and perhaps even his direct supervision, the player plays the 40 or so sessions that Rob deems is necessary for his system to be financially successful. If the player wins, Rob gets the profit....the equivalent of him having a free employee out making money for him. If his system loses, your losses are reimbursed by the escrow amount. Where does this get good for you? Well, just think about it....you can cut an upfront promotion deal with Rob where you would actually produce his full system on video and sell it exclusively on your website. Rob makes money on these sales and you get a cut along with all the enhanced traffic to the website. You can even video some of the individual sessions and the player can even have a blog where he can post his daily experiences and results. Once again, unless I'm missing something, this has to be a win-win if Rob's system has merit. If it doesn't, perhaps we can finally put all the bickering to rest and Rob will have to concede that his system doesn't work.

Your thoughts?

Dan

Dan: I understand your need to input against me here. Why Not? You were just humiliated after making one of the dumbest, most incomplete, most unprepared, and most unknowledgeable challenges in the history of video poker.

If you actually read what Frank wrote before he got sick of watching arcimedes interfering & make a fool out of himself, you'd see that HE approached ME to review my play strategy. You might want to pay attention to what he reports. Then you might want to prepare yourself.

As far as the people I've trained, you will never see the majority come onto any forum and mention it because most aren't as skilled as I am and haven't the stomach for being blindly ridiculed. Look in the mirror my friend. Whenever any poster says anything positive about my approach or disagrees with AP, YOU immediately accuse them of being me! I assume you've inherited that paranoia from arci.

Do you recall reading where I train players how to play but as yet, I have not found one player capable of being able to handle what I do. You ought to be familiar with reason #1 because you just had a taste of it yourself: They don't have the bankroll to play it. Next, they don't have either the discipline, the math ability, or the determination. That's why Frank is a good choice to review what I do. He has the ability, the money and the discipline to understand it and play it if he chooses to.

I'm willing to bet you (uh-oh...I don't want to scare you away) that you don't know ANY so-called APer's who win anything other than the right to over-value their slot club benefits so they can claim to be winners. Ask your pal arci about that one.

Once again you're proposing something that you have trouble identifying. Have you heard that I'm retired and will only consider accepting playing challenges like the one you couldn't get right? Here's the flash again: I'm not like your hero Dancer---I didn't start playing professionally with $6000 and then enter into a curse of having to work for the rest of my life just to KEEP on gambling. I actually prepared for retirement FIRST, and now we're becoming full-time RV'ers in Jan. But if you ever get this challenge thing right and you can find the financial backers, let me know!

[Rob.Singer]

You are confused again, Robbie. In this case a session is the play at one level. You claimed you've won about 70% at the $10 and $25 levels. These are equivalent to any regular session played without a progression. Or, are you now claiming 85% wins at those levels? Even more hilarious.

You continue to show your disconnect with what I do. There is no session played at a single level. Will you ever get it right?

[Rob.Singer]

You see, Alan, another lie right here. I've never seen a single person claim they use Singer's system to WIN. There will always be a few that don't want the math to be a valid approach as that would mean they have lost when they could have won. They don't want to think.

The key point is none of them claim to use Singer's approach. So, we now see he has added another lie to his massive total.

Is this misrepresentation the result of all your MASSIVE problems??

[Vegas_lover]

I write Vic because there's a Vic who makes the same convoluted, uneducated argements you do solely for the sake of argeument and born out of envy. The poster's name means nothing.

You have very little grasp of applied math. I use a special play one out of 20 times, but there is not a huge winner one out of 20times. If you weren't so overly consumed with my success you'd be capable of following the bouncing ball.

If you have a beef with this Vic guy, sort that out with Vic but leave me out of that one. Alan, you're doing a great job giving this dumb *** a platform. Thank you for complimenting me about having little grasp of applied math. I have no grasp of your applied math because it's BS. I learned that at school, that's where my degree comes in handy.

Here you go again with the envy thing. It's probably the best thing and the only thing you can come up with. Please do tell me, what should I be jealous about? Your personality? The money you made? Your intelligence? I'll address them all:

Your personality? I pride myself in having a large group of friends. Friends I can rely on and they can rely on me. I've got 50 people working for me and all are happy with me being their manager. I know for a fact my personality is not a problem. You on the other hand enjoy being an arrogant a**hole and that's pretty sad. But it's your problem, I couldn't care less.

The money you made? Not really either. Within 5 years I will own the family business with a turnover of 2 million a month, so don't worry about my financial position. I'm perfectly happy with the position I'm in. But more important, I have a couple of healthy sweet kids, a good life, a nice house and a lovely wife. Money is second to that, any amount of money!!!!! You are more consumed by your "succes" than I am. I couldn't care less if you made 100 million. Good for you, enjoy it. All the money in the world doesn't change the fact that you have a crappy personality

Your intelligence? I'm not jealous of your lack of (social) intelligence.

At this point I just enjoy coming back here to piss you of some more oh little one

[Vegas_lover]

I've been to the Netherlands several dozen times and they're known for their impatience, easily having their feathers ruffled, and their arrogance. They also find it difficult to accept that which they are not qualified to understand. Ever heard of the word "Bingo!"?

Oh good job dumb ***, now the whole country is stupid. Why do you come here? Please do my country a favour, don't come back any more. We enjoy the fresh air........ It's people like you that give Americans in general a bad reputation in some parts of the world. And that's really sad for all those fine American people out there......That superior attitude you show is rather out of place. You want me to give you a history lesson???? You know who the native Americans where right? What are you? British, Spanish, Italian, Irish, French, German or......Dutch? You know who owned the city of New York once? Oh and here's the nicest one: you know which country was the first one to acknowledge the United States as a country? Right: The Netherlands. You know which country stood by yours as one of the first ones during the first and second Gulf war and in Afghanistan? Right, the Dutch. You know who got rid of all the water in New Orleans after the floodings? Right: Dutch enigeers

In other words, get of your high horse and get back to your trailer....because that's where you belong.....

[Rob.Singer]

If you have a beef with this Vic guy, sort that out with Vic but leave me out of that one. Alan, you're doing a great job giving this dumb *** a platform. Thank you for complimenting me about having little grasp of applied math. I have no grasp of your applied math because it's BS. I learned that at school, that's where my degree comes in handy.

Here you go again with the envy thing. It's probably the best thing and the only thing you can come up with. Please do tell me, what should I be jealous about? Your personality? The money you made? Your intelligence? I'll address them all:

Your personality? I pride myself in having a large group of friends. Friends I can rely on and they can rely on me. I've got 50 people working for me and all are happy with me being their manager. I know for a fact my personality is not a problem. You on the other hand enjoy being an arrogant a**hole and that's pretty sad. But it's your problem, I couldn't care less.

The money you made? Not really either. Within 5 years I will own the family business with a turnover of 2 million a month, so don't worry about my financial position. I'm perfectly happy with the position I'm in. But more important, I have a couple of healthy sweet kids, a good life, a nice house and a lovely wife. Money is second to that, any amount of money!!!!! You are more consumed by your "succes" than I am. I couldn't care less if you made 100 million. Good for you, enjoy it. All the money in the world doesn't change the fact that you have a crappy personality

Your intelligence? I'm not jealous of your lack of (social) intelligence.

At this point I just enjoy coming back here to piss you of some more oh little one

You're the jealous type--it's written all over your posts. Constantly whining and overstating how much I've won. Really....

When I worked last it was for Notrhrop-Grumman and I had 500 people working for me. And they weren't my friends. If you really had people working for you then you wouldn't have told that lie.

Why would anyone care about what an anonymous Internet poster says about himself? Just how slow are they in Europe these days?

[Rob.Singer]

Oh good job dumb a**, now the whole country is stupid. Why do you come here? Please do my country a favour, don't come back any more. We enjoy the fresh air........ It's people like you that give Americans in general a bad reputation in some parts of the world. And that's really sad for all those fine American people out there......That superior attitude you show is rather out of place. You want me to give you a history lesson???? You know who the native Americans where right? What are you? British, Spanish, Italian, Irish, French, German or......Dutch? You know who owned the city of New York once? Oh and here's the nicest one: you know which country was the first one to acknowledge the United States as a country? Right: The Netherlands. You know which country stood by yours as one of the first ones during the first and second Gulf war and in Afghanistan? Right, the Dutch. You know who got rid of all the water in New Orleans after the floodings? Right: Dutch enigeers

In other words, get of your high horse and get back to your trailer....because that's where you belong.....

Maybe someday you'll understand that when a poster finds the need (or just can't help himself) to use vulgarity then it's only because they know they're losing an argument and the blood begins to boil.

I tingle when that happens to my critics.

[Vegas_lover]

You're the jealous type--it's written all over your posts. Constantly whining and overstating how much I've won. Really....

When I worked last it was for Notrhrop-Grumman and I had 500 people working for me. And they weren't my friends. If you really had people working for you then you wouldn't have told that lie.

Why would anyone care about what an anonymous Internet poster says about himself? Just how slow are they in Europe these days?

You're making great progress! Now, the entire continent is slow instead of just the Dutch being stupid, too funny! I saw that Mr. Mendelson started to edit our posts because of vulgarity. He's showing his true nature now too. For him this is obviously about getting as much traffic on his website as possible. That's the only reason he let's a person like you continue to post. You're replies to what any of us post are of no substance. They don't clarify anything about your system and even he should be able to see by now you have no intention of making the bet between Dan and you happen. Still he gives you a platform. Why? He can still use you.......for now. And you like to be used for that because you just can't do without the attention. The more crap you get, the better you feel........go see a doctor, you need help.

Let me tell you this, I don't care if you believe the things I tell you or not. You have just shown that provocing you a little is enough to make people see your true nature again. You don't reply to questions in debt. You avoid them and start throwing insults. You have Alan Mendelson as your puppet for now but that will get old pretty soon too. And then you'll be back to where you were, a lonely frustrated internet troll with a so called system that's completely bogus. A guy from Holland challenges you and all of a sudden, my entire country is filled with stupid and arrogant people. That's what pisses me of. You don't like me? Who cares. Want to insult me? Go right ahead. Just leave the rest of the country out of it.

Please do repeat one more time I'm jealous of you. And to be original, make sure to tell people again that I'm a liar and don't understand anything about math. I'm glad you already figured out where I work and who I work with.....I was lying about that too right? Great fact finding job.....

[Vegas_lover]

Maybe someday you'll understand that when a poster finds the need (or just can't help himself) to use vulgarity then it's only because they know they're losing an argument and the blood begins to boil.

Again great analysis. If that were true, you have lost all arguments you've even been in on the internet. Because you use vulgarity everywhere and as a result get thrown off everywhere. I don't know where you get these brain farts but stating them as if they were facts only makes you look more stupid than you already look.

Please do repeat one more time I'm jealous of you. And to be original, make sure to tell people again that I'm a liar and don't understand anything about math. Oh and how jealous I am of you because of the money you made. I'm thinking about starting a Singer fanclub, I'll be the treasurer and the membership fee is $984,000......

[Alan Mendelson]

Vegas_Lover I don't believe in censorship which is why I will let your posts stand... including those posts that are critical of me. What is not allowed is vulgarity and obscenity and personal attacks. Well, your comments about me and Mr. Singer can be considered personal attacks, but so can many of Mr. Singer's posts... but taken in context they should be allowed, and because we don't censor they remain (for now).

What I want you to understand is that I started this Forum because of how the Forum at the TVSpy website was destroyed by "adults" who did not know what obscenity and personal attacks meant -- and these were TV professionals for heaven's sake. It got to the point that the attacks were so obscene, that all of the "good posters" left and only the "animals" were left. It got so bad, that ownership changed, new managers came in but that Forum never recovered to what it once was. Instead of being a forum to discuss trends and ideas in TV news and the media read every day by just about everyone "in the business" it is now frequented by maybe a dozen "usual suspects."

I place a very high value on everyone's ability to speak their ideas and their criticisms of those ideas. You are welcome to post here as much as Mr. Singer is welcome to post here, as is Arcimede$ and everyone else who blasted me on the LVA Forum. I will not censor ideas, even ideas I don't subscribe to and even comments critical of me. But I do not tolerate vulgarity and obscenity or unlawful posts or messages.

Frankly, this Forum would be a lot better off if you guys would stick to the facts -- or to what you say is a lack of facts posted by others -- and leave the testosterone to your writings on other Forums. Thanks.

[Vegas_lover]

Alan,

There's only one critical error you're making. You started to interview Mr. Singer, posted those videos on your website and invited people to respond to his system. After that, Mr. Singer started to post about his system on your forum and was challenged by several. His response has been to react with arrogance, insults an anger towards every single person. Throwing around insults asks for replies and replies he will get. Check your own forum again please.......all topics about Singer's system have been started by Singer himself or you. After that the only direction it goes every time is downhill.... Now, it's your choice to sit it out till the end, or end it here and now. You will probably choose for option 1 because you do not want to censor. Do realize it will give you more arguments on your forum for the next period of time. Mr. Singer has been thrown off everywhere because he will always continue to insult people. And those insults will always get replies........What you are basically saying to most posters is: "I know Singer is an arrogant troublemaker and there's nothing I can change about that. Please let him continue to provoke and insult you but respond in a clean an civil manner". What are the chances of that happening you think??????

I'll predict the outcome. This will stop as soon as Singer is no longer a member of your forum. The reason for my prediction is the fact that it has worked the same way on several other forums.....Now, I don't want you to throw Singer of, just be prepared to see a lot more BS on your forum than you've seen until now....

[Vegas_lover]

Oh and Rob, when you reply to my last post towards Alan, make sure to emphasise again that all my comments are made out of jealousy over your succes, my lack of understanding correct math, my general lack of intelligence and Europeans just being slow ok. We do want to stick to the facts and cut out the BS.......

[arcimede$]

Singer's comments about the math are always hilarious as the math makes it clear that no system can change the expected return. The math proves he is wrong. The math proves his special plays are losers. The math demonstrates that many of his claims (eg. 5th card flips-overs, hot/cold cycles) are so unrealistic that any normal person would assume they are lies.

Add that to his narcissistic attacks on anyone who comes out and speaks the truth and you know everything you'll ever need to know about him.

[Rob.Singer]

Vegas_Lover I don't believe in censorship which is why I will let your posts stand... including those posts that are critical of me. What is not allowed is vulgarity and obscenity and personal attacks. Well, your comments about me and Mr. Singer can be considered personal attacks, but so can many of Mr. Singer's posts... but taken in context they should be allowed, and because we don't censor they remain (for now).

What I want you to understand is that I started this Forum because of how the Forum at the TVSpy website was destroyed by "adults" who did not know what obscenity and personal attacks meant -- and these were TV professionals for heaven's sake. It got to the point that the attacks were so obscene, that all of the "good posters" left and only the "animals" were left. It got so bad, that ownership changed, new managers came in but that Forum never recovered to what it once was. Instead of being a forum to discuss trends and ideas in TV news and the media read every day by just about everyone "in the business" it is now frequented by maybe a dozen "usual suspects."

I place a very high value on everyone's ability to speak their ideas and their criticisms of those ideas. You are welcome to post here as much as Mr. Singer is welcome to post here, as is Arcimede$ and everyone else who blasted me on the LVA Forum. I will not censor ideas, even ideas I don't subscribe to and even comments critical of me. But I do not tolerate vulgarity and obscenity or unlawful posts or messages.

Frankly, this Forum would be a lot better off if you guys would stick to the facts -- or to what you say is a lack of facts posted by others -- and leave the testosterone to your writings on other Forums. Thanks.

Aside from all that, I think it's funny how he says he's not going to come back and reply to anything, then like arci, he can't do what he said he was going to do because he just can't help himself!

[Rob.Singer]

Singer's comments about the math are always hilarious as the math makes it clear that no system can change the expected return. The math proves he is wrong. The math proves his special plays are losers. The math demonstrates that many of his claims (eg. 5th card flips-overs, hot/cold cycles) are so unrealistic that any normal person would assume they are lies.

Add that to his narcissistic attacks on anyone who comes out and speaks the truth and you know everything you'll ever need to know about him.

Spoken by someone permanently banned from vpFREE for continuous narcissistic attacks on Bob Dancer, someone whom Frank Kneeland had to dump a thread over because of those same attacks and overall poor behavior, and someone who I see was recently outed on videopoker.com as being the disruptor on LVA!

Yes....ABSOLUTELY HILARIOUS!!

[Vegas_lover]

Aside from all that, I think it's funny how he says he's not going to come back and reply to anything, then like arci, he can't do what he said he was going to do because he just can't help himself!

Keep throwing insults and keep getting replies........But than agian, that's what's it's all about for you. This whole thing isn't about your system because there isn't enough to continue to talk about. You avoid gong into details......your explanation for that because the rest of the world is too stupid to understand it..........my take is your system isn't a winning system, it's a hoax. Now, anything else to complain about my country and the people living here.........I see how relevant that is for the discussion about your system....

Oh, you still forgot to repeat how jealous I am of your succes, your back account, your superior intelligence and the price of your car...........keep up buddy!

[Rob.Singer]

Keep throwing insults and keep getting replies........But than agian, that's what's it's all about for you. This whole thing isn't about your system because there isn't enough to continue to talk about. You avoid gong into details......your explanation for that because the rest of the world is too stupid to understand it..........my take is your system isn't a winning system, it's a hoax. Now, anything else to complain about my country and the people living here.........I see how relevant that is for the discussion about your system....

Oh, you still forgot to repeat how jealous I am of your succes, your back account, your superior intelligence and the price of your car...........keep up buddy!

A display of a loss of self-control if there ever was one!

[Vegas_lover]

Of course, more of the high horse attitude.

Now let's get back to the issues at hand. You make your special plays all the time. I've got a few questions for you:
How many hands per hour do you play?
How many times per hour (on average) do you make a special play?
How do you keep track of the amount of special plays you've made?
How do you know what specific hand qualifies as a hand for special play for you?
How strict is that 5% maximum for you?
What's you're average result on playing perfect math play. In other words, what percentage of winning sessions do you have because of correct math play?

Let's start with this and see where we go from there..come on, let's end the mistery....

[arcimede$]

Spoken by someone permanently banned from vpFREE for continuous narcissistic attacks on Bob Dancer, someone whom Frank Kneeland had to dump a thread over because of those same attacks and overall poor behavior, and someone who I see was recently outed on videopoker.com as being the disruptor on LVA!

Yes....ABSOLUTELY HILARIOUS!!

Lie #1: I left vpfree on my own. My so-called attack was pointing out that Dancer's articles/posts were often a little egotistical. Yup, just awful and repeated many other times by other members. I don't participate in any forum that censors the truth. I told that to the vpfree administrator and told him if he wanted me back he'd have to apologize. I haven't been back. The interesting thing is the same administrator who claims in his own words that freevpfree is open to free speech did ban me from there. He obviously did not want the facts available to the other forum members. A true coward if there ever was one.

Lie #2: Frank simply decided he didn't want to post on a thread where Singer, in one of his many aliases, started attacking me and anyone else who presented facts. Alan was there, and he knows that I never attacked Frank personally.

Lie #3: Rob, in what is most likely another alias, claimed I was a disruptor when I continue to point out the facts. Anyone who read that LVA thread can easily determine I never disrupted anything. So, anyone making that claim is most likely to be Singer himself. (As if it wasn't already obvious). It was humorous how I controlled him over there. He had to shut up or give himself away completely.

Alan, as you can easily see, Singer will lie at almost anything. However, the KEY thing to note is he has ZERO comebacks to the mathematical statements I made. This is the way Singer always operates. He attacks people because he has NO, ZERO, NADA, ZILCH arguments to support his claims. You will NEVER see him try to present any hard facts that supports his claims.

[Rob.Singer]

Of course, more of the high horse attitude.

Now let's get back to the issues at hand. You make your special plays all the time. I've got a few questions for you:
How many hands per hour do you play?
How many times per hour (on average) do you make a special play?
How do you keep track of the amount of special plays you've made?
How do you know what specific hand qualifies as a hand for special play for you?
How strict is that 5% maximum for you?
What's you're average result on playing perfect math play. In other words, what percentage of winning sessions do you have because of correct math play?

Let's start with this and see where we go from there..come on, let's end the mistery....

Clearly, you have never paid attention.

1. HPH is unimportant and irrelevant when playing for goals. I can play 1400 hph for an hour without errors and I used to do it as a fool AP. After an hour EVERYONE's (including Dancer & arci and any other AP who claims but cannot prove they win all the time) accuracy stumbles exponentially the longer they play. SPS has no requirement for speed and is therefore a far more enjoyable strategy.

2. Special plays come up on average about 1 out of every 20 hands. Do the math. Playing 300 hph equates to 15 special plays per hour; 500 hph is 25, etc.

3. I don't keep track of the special plays I make, other than to know what they are and when to use them.

4. 5% is not a maximum and is just an estimated average.

5. Every session incorporates optimal holds and special plays throughout. It's the structured use of them in concert that creates the wins, not the use of one vs. the use of the other.