Las Vegas in December???

[BYLee291]

I'm interested in making a trip out to Las Vegas the first or second week of December this year. I'm told by some of the dealers, though, that the casinos are usually pretty empty that time of year, even in the evenings. Can someone who has been there in December or lives there all year tell me how busy the strip casinos are? I'm a craps player and usually stay at one of the Caesar's hotels. I'm coming from New York and don't like playing at empty tables, so I want to know if the trip is worth making. Thanks for the assistance.

[Alan Mendelson]

Hi. Thanks for joining. Even in an off season like December you will find crowded tables the same way you will find empty tables in the busy season.

[redietz]

I'm a sports gambler, and several of my clients, friends, and associates go to LV in December each year during the "dead week." That's the week between rodeo and Christmas. In my experience, and I'm not a craps player, Caesars has people that dead week, but many of the other strip casinos seem pretty empty. Some shows take blackout weeks. The first weeks in December, up to the end of rodeo, are fine. During rodeo, the place is usually rowdy and very busy -- and craps is very popular with the rodeo crowd.

I just checked dates and NRF is at the Thomas and Mack and starts December 5th and runs through the 13th. If you are going to LV anytime in that stretch, it'll be busy and the crap tables should be fine or better than fine.

One note: temps can be chilly when the wind whips in off the desert at night, so bring a warm jacket.

Second note: if you plan your trip to overlap with the end of rodeo and the beginning of the dead week, you can often get great room bargains that dead week and pick up a suite for less than the price of a normal room.

P.S. I just realized the reason Caesars probably has people during dead week is all the CET folks who can't normally get a CP room can get one that week, so CET funnels people to Caesars. That makes sense -- keep the flagship busy even if the other properties look a bit like tombs.

[Alan Mendelson]

One more note: craps tables are opened with demand. Caesars has eight tables. During a slow time only one might be open and as a result it will be crowded. When one table fills up they'll open another. You will not have a problem finding busy tables.

Why don't you want to play at "empty" tables? "Shooters" prefer empty so they get the dice.

[BYLee291]

Why don't you want to play at "empty" tables? "Shooters" prefer empty so they get the dice.

Thanks very much for the information. I'm a recreational gambler and not a DI specialist or anything so complicated. I enjoy the social aspects and camaraderie of craps and prefer the slightly slower pace of the game when other people are at the table betting and getting paid. Besides, the few times I've thrown by myself at a table have never turned out well.

[BYLee291]

Thanks to everyone for replying so quickly. I usually go to Las Vegas once a year for a pool tournament that used to be in May at the Riviera and is now in July at The Rio. I've been staying at the Imperial Palace/Quad/Linq going back to when it was the last of the independents, because I preferred smaller hotels. Plus, I've always liked a lot of the dealers at the IP, who have always greeted me by name as soon as I walk in, even though I've only gone there once a year. I stayed at Caesar's once for business, and just found it took such a long time to walk out of. I've always wanted to take a second trip there per year, but early December is the only time that seems to work for me. So now, I'm thinking about taking a December trip to see the new Linq, since it might be too expensive for me to stay there next summer.

[Alan Mendelson]

If you want low prices Christmas week is certainly the time to be there. But as redietz mentioned many shows are on hiatus and the city actually takes on a grumpy feeling. I've heard many complaints that dealers resent players who show up around Christmas. Christmas is not a "merry time" in Vegas. Those working in the casinos would rather be home.

[regnis]

To reiterate a little on what Red said, I always enjoyed Vegas during the rodeo, especially the craps tables. They are loud and fun without being obnoxious. I have fond memories because one year I was leaving for the airport and took the dice one last time. I rolled for an hour and twenty minutes and the "cowboys" from the rodeo went nuts. I missed my plane--the cowboys put me up in a suite for the night because they made huge money on my roll. They then had a big party in my suite as well.

[BYLee291]

Thanks. I was thinking about the first week of December, which I see would be during NRF, so hopefully those single digit dates won't be seen as too close to Christmas by the dealers. I'm not that concerned about shows or other things that might be on break. I just don't want to make a long trip and walking around or sitting in my room most of the time.

[Alan Mendelson]

If you are there during Rodeo you will not find cheap rooms. It's one of the biggest events in Vegas during the year. At Caesars you will find higher table limits at craps. Last December during Rodeo the craps tables were $25 and the tables were so busy, hat brim was touching hat brim. Any other time you will find $10 tables.

[redietz]

Damn, regnis, that is a really good story.

BYLee, just bring some earplugs -- because nothing drives me up a wall batty as much as every casino elevator playing country-and-western Christmas muzak for the cowboys. I swear, I just want to put bullets in every speaker. You'll get a real sense of how LV dresses up like a hooker-in-costume when a big niche audience comes to town. Suddenly you'll think you're in Dallas.

[BYLee291]

Alan Mendelson, Thanks, I get a pretty good rate from Total Rewards for my play. I get comped at other CET hotels for December, but they're not giving me anything at the Linq because it's a new hotel starting on October 30. The December rate, though, it better than other months, so I'll make a decision where to stay if I decide to go.

Redietz, I've already had many "interesting" discussions that have always been civil with mid-westerners and southerners when they find out I'm a Yankee from New York City that is often wearing with something with New York Giants on it. I've found there's a brother/sisterhood amongst all craps players when they're around the table. The music won't bother me, I grew up with three brothers in bunk beds in one bedroom. Fortunately, the Giants are not playing the Dallas Cowboys that weekend.

[Dan Druff]

Alan Mendelson, Thanks, I get a pretty good rate from Total Rewards for my play. I get comped at other CET hotels for December, but they're not giving me anything at the Linq because it's a new hotel starting on October 30. The December rate, though, it better than other months, so I'll make a decision where to stay if I decide to go.

Redietz, I've already had many "interesting" discussions that have always been civil with mid-westerners and southerners when they find out I'm a Yankee from New York City that is often wearing with something with New York Giants on it. I've found there's a brother/sisterhood amongst all craps players when they're around the table. The music won't bother me, I grew up with three brothers in bunk beds in one bedroom. Fortunately, the Giants are not playing the Dallas Cowboys that weekend.

They're not giving you anything at the Linq?!

You realize that the Linq is the old Imperial Palace, right? It's not a new hotel, and while it's renovated, I doubt it will compare in quality to a place like Caesar's, or even Paris.

You stated that it's a long walk to The Linq from Caesar's, but I disagree. It's right across the street. I did it in December.

If you really want to stay there, and are getting comped at Caesar's but not the Linq, I would suggest calling your host and seeing if they can get you comped at the Linq instead. I bet they would do it if you put in a fair amount of play every trip.

[Alan Mendelson]

Wow I am also kind of surprised you're not getting comped at the Linq. Is it possible that the remodel is something TREMENDOUS that will turn the place into a big ticket, boutique hotel? Or perhaps, is it sold out to some group and no comped rooms are available?

If you get TR comps, I wouldn't pay for any room when I could get a comped room.

And as Dan mentioned the Linq is just across the street from Caesars and the pedestrian bridge makes it a safe, easy walk.

[BYLee291]

It is my understanding, after talking to some of the managers in July, that, after the renovation, the rooms at the new Linq will be priced higher than those at Harrah's, Bally's, and Flamingo (I know, hard to believe for anyone who has spent any significant time in the old IP), since it will be the new hotel on the block. CET supposedly has some very ambitious plans for new rooms at the Linq (you can see some of the new room features at the Linq web site). If the new hotel proves popular, then Flamingo, Harrah's, and Bally's will be renovated over the next few years. Having stayed at Harrah's and the Quad, I can state that the Quad was the hotel is dire need of a renovation.

Right now, because of my TR level, I might qualify for five comped nights at the old IP/Quad, four nights at Harrah's, Flamingo, Bally's, and Rio, and maybe two or three at Caesar's or Paris. I imagine I'm a mid-level comped player, since I only get to Las Vegas once a year, and I don't go to Atlantic City at all. Because the new Linq isn't officially open yet, I think TR is not officially offering comps for the hotel yet, and they may be waiting to see what the demand is. The TR website can be a little weird. It shows me one room rate on one page, then a much more expensive rate when I look at the details for the rate. Higher level TR players probably wouldn't have a problem getting a comped room. I won't book until after the opening, so we'll see what happens.

I don't have a problem with walking, I'm from New York City and I've never had a driver's license, so walking (and subways) are fine with me. At larger hotels like Caesar's, it can be a long walk from the tower elevator, through the casino, to the Strip, so I started staying at the IP because I liked the staff and service, and I could get a room in the front tower so I could get outside quicker. The first time I called reservations after Harrah's bought the IP, they tried to redirect me to Paris or Caesar's. When I insisted on staying at the IP, the guy asked me, "why do you want to stay there?" I said, "It's my vacation, why am I arguing with you about where I want to stay?" I mentioned this to an IP floor manager when I got there, and she told me Harrah's was trying to redirect all their big players to different hotels. I know she complained about it to upper management. I ended up writing to the Caesar's president complaining about this, and I don't know if it made a difference or not, but next year, when I said I want to stay at the IP, she just replied "what dates?" I guess I just have a sentimental attachment to the IP/Quad/Linq, everyone there has always treated me well, probably better than I would get treated at some of the larger hotels.

[Alan Mendelson]

Ahhh... walking in New York City. How I fondly recall walking from 57th St and 10th Avenue to Penn Station at 34th. Sometimes I took the scenic route going thru Times Square.

One cold night about 11pm in Times Square there is an old lady with a white cane standing at the corner screaming "help me, help me." Obviously blind I walked up to her and said "I can help you cross the street."

"I don't want to cross the street," she yelled. "I want money."

So I said, "I'm sorry, I can't help you." And as I turned away I felt the sting of her white cane slam my shoulder and back. And if not for my thick winter coat I probably would have been decked by the blow.

Ahhh... walking in New York City.

[BYLee291]

Ahhh... walking in New York City.

If you haven't been back in a while, you wouldn't recognize Times Square now. Your little old lady has been replaced by people wearing superhero costumes trying to get their pictures taken with tourists then hitting them up for mandatory "donations." There have been reports of some of them getting violent when the donation wasn't large enough. Now they're talking about licensing these people. Most of Times Square is now a pedestrian mall, much to the chagrin of drivers trying to make deliveries to the area. Broadway and Seventh Ave. have been cut to two lanes as they try and reconfigure everything. So, I walk.

[RoeIncarnate]

Just saw a show at linq/quad/ip labour day weekend. The casino was renovated but the box office and theater where still in IP state. Kinda funny to me. Stayed at IP years ago. Wife didn't like it and we've gotten better deals at MGM casinos since (also moved up to nicer hotels).

[redietz]

I used to watch the NFL games at the IP on Sunday -- they would open the Legends showroom and put the screens in there and serve food and such. It was a hidden gem on Sundays -- pretty good lines to get in. Jay Kornegay, who has run the LVH, now Westgate, Superbook for years, got his start as a non-jacketed manager at the IP. I always liked the place. Not the rooms, mind you, but the place.

And when I needed to sprint around to check varying lines at properties (and when CET didn't own all of the properties, so lines did vary), I could leave the IP and check a bunch of places quickly. So I get the convenience.

Quick NY note:

I haven't been there in 15 years, but last time I stayed at a Days Inn near 54th or thereabouts. I walked into the "lobby," which was six feet wide, for the first time, and a dude with a car stereo with wires dangling out of it, was trying to trade his ill gotten gain for pharamaceuticals at the hotel desk. Ah yes, New York.

[Rob.Singer]

John Rocker has always been spot on right when he gave his opinion of NYC. ABSOLUTELY! spot-on. The last decent venue disappeared there when the Fillmore East closed its doors.