That could be, especially if they are peeking at dealer's cards in blackjack.Originally Posted by jbjb
That could be, especially if they are peeking at dealer's cards in blackjack.Originally Posted by jbjb
Hey, how else am I supposed to play my hand? Count cards, guess, etc.?Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson
I do agree though, any of them that uses their card should definitely get what they can out of it.
jbjb is peeking at the dealers cards in blackjack an accepted part of the game? I don't play blackjack so I don't know.
All I care about is legality.
Is it legal?Originally Posted by jbjb
What we do, yes! 100%Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson
Let's not derail your thread though.
Last edited by jbjb; 08-11-2015 at 05:47 PM.
I don't mind derailing the thread. If you peed at the dealer's cards that are in his hand before they are dealt, are you doing something legal?
If unintentional, then yes it's 100% legal.
https://www.blackjackinfo.com/knowle...ding-legality/
I understand you know nothing regarding AP, but "beating the casinos every day" is not how it works. You do realize (I hope) that AP means Advantage Play....and in getting an Advantage, you can't just get an advantage out of thin air, and start pounding away.Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson
Hole-carding, next-carding, etc. are all legal, as long as you don't do something illegal to obtain that information, ie: spooking, using a device (like a mirror), collusion, etc.
It bewilders me how much Alan pretends to act like he knows what AP is....but he really has no idea about any of it. A few of his posts in this thread are proof of that.
I do know what Advantage Play means. I have an advantage and make an advantage play every time I got to a casino and play only my free play and no money out of my pocket.
But I also know that having an advantage on a pay table means nothing unless you can control the outcome with an RNG.
You can claim to be an Advantage Player because you scout for abandoned multipliers or even if you hunt for unskilled dealers who expose cards -- but how much is that play worth? This is why I asked the question in the other thread: does your AP pay more than a job at In N Out? And while you can work at In N OUt 40 hours per week, how many "advantage plays" do you get out of the unskilled dealer?
You can expect to make several thousand dollars an hour playing against an unskilled dealer (flasher). A lot of work to find one, but once you do, you will pretty much rape that casino until they figure it out.
[q]But I also know that having an advantage on a pay table means nothing unless you can control the outcome with an RNG. [/q]
I'm not talking about those poor games, like Full Pay DW, DB, DDB, etc. I considered grinding FPDW, before I realized it was worth ~$8/hour. This quote also shows you don't know what AP is: "means nothing unless you can control the outcome with an RNG".
I don't scout for abandoned multipliers. It is worth too little and there is far too much competition. Although, (in the past) if I had nothing else to play, I would occasionally wander the strip and look for some.
Alan, this guy's telling you that you don't know what "advantage play" is when in fact it is he who stumbles over the term, and you can tell he really doesn't have much to do with it other than ramble on about the "theory". The wizard's weaker-by-the-day forum is absolutely loaded with people who get off talking about how great a theory AP is. It's a dreamer's fantasy. That's why advantage play is and has never been anything more than a silly state of mind. The way these guys talk about it, you'd think the casinos would all be out of business by now with all these incompetent casino managers, pit bosses, and dealers. Yup....those are the dumb ones, and anonymous, chest-pounding/story-telling gamblers on welfare are able to outsmart all of them at will.
Oh, and once again the "FPDW is an $8/hour play" arises up. Other than being a theory by people who have very little bankroll, let's see some proof that anyone but the casinos has ever consistently made money off of the machines. And yes, the only reason there's not more of them at higher denoms is Business 101: they provide too low a profit margin when other games get played just as much and do not.
No wonder the wizard's site flounders.
This was my thinking 10 years ago. Obviously the first game people learn is Three Card Poker. Even I thought, "well yeah, maybe once an hour you'll see a hole card." Boy was I mistaken! There were/are dealers that do this on EVERY HAND! Now obviously the game type, speed and which card you see is what's relevant to your advantage. I suggest reading Eliot Jacobson's blog at APheat.net. Just read any of the various hole carding blogs. And these aren't "theories" as Rob puts it. They are hard, cold facts. Next time in Vegas, go from casino to casino and watch the careful dealing procedure of most carnival games and you'll now know why they are that careful.Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson
Now as for the VP aspect, I can't vouch for any of that as I don't do much. Obviously the multiplier issue is only going to be profitable in a location with many many machines and many many suckers who leave them behind. Tourist spots like Vegas aren't a good location for this. But I suggest this, if you see one, play it off.
And lastly, if I could make more money working a job, I'd work a job, but....I'll NEVER work a real job again as long as I live.
Last edited by jbjb; 08-12-2015 at 06:03 AM.
I do like to play Ultimate X when I play VP. There are three Ultimate X games where I play. Two of them never have any winners (I don't want to start a discussion of whether the games really are random). On the third one which I play, I always check all of the different games on the machine to see if there are any good multiplier hangers. After I play that multiplier down, I switch to my favored game DDB.
I am not an AP in VP, nor could I be even if I wanted to with the pay tables we have. But I guess for that one spin I am.
The other two machines---you could play till you are old and grey and never have a winner. And I already am old and grey. But that's for another thread.
I happened to be in Vegas during a few bonus days. I ended the year with more than twice the GGWP points than my number of tier credits.
To me I thought of it as a bonus for play I was already making anyways.
You are absolutely correct that it is a bonus on top of your regular play. And there are bonus events thru the year but I didn't take advantage of them. Bonus events can give you hundreds of thousands of GGWU points.Originally Posted by Luckylisa
You are an AP if you say you are an AP. Just like the rest of them. At CET, Jean Scott plays their bad pay tables then goes to the buffet and stuffs her purse with rolls and fruit. Together with any comps and free play, she self-values the goodies just enough to claim an "over 100% play" and VOILA....we have an AP!Originally Posted by regnis
So don't sell yourself short regnis. There's so much wiggle room out there, and it's enuf for everybody!
Every time I sit down at an 8/5 $5 Bonus game at Caesars Palace I have an over 100% play:
the game returns 99.17%
my hotel room is free (value $300 ??)
I watch all the free movies I want (5 X 13.95)
I get at least a $100 dining credit
I might also get another promotion valued between $300 and $600 (back in the old days they went up to $2500)
Care to add on Reward Credits, Great Gift Wrap Up Points?
BUT THE REALITY IS when I look at my checkbook I don't always come out ahead. In fact, as of year end 2014 I never had a profitable year. But if you define an AP by the theoretical of what I can "pocket" yes I am an AP too. But a poor one. LOL
OK--- I've added AP to my business cardOriginally Posted by Rob.Singer
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