Anyone received info on the 2015 Seven Stars program yet?

[Dan Druff]

Looks like the Annual Gift is gone, too. Not that I'm crying. It was cheap and the selection was poor.

So looks like Luckylisa was right.

[Dan Druff]

Wow, can't believe the negative changes to the Experiences program. $500 for 250,000 tier - literally 80% less than last year.

Dan, I may end up joining you in the comp whore category - without markedly better offers/promos, there will be virtually no reason to earn more than 150k tier.

I suppose there is a small 'perk' here - after 150k, I won't feel as driven to hit 2500 or 5000 rc per day.

BTW, the host I spoke to in early March said that they were going to do away with experience points, and instead have "really great" experiences at the 250k, 500k, 1m, and 2m levels. I posted about this before. He even read me the notice he received about it. Looks like they changed their minds, and just decimated the signature experience value instead.

Pretty sure there's going to be a big backlash. Getting the popcorn ready.

[synergistic]

That's still how they're describing it in their notices to hosts - the PH host who posts on the other forums said each level would be exponentially better than the last. I really dislike the obscene misuse of the word exponential from a company whose business is to handle numbers.

[Alan Mendelson]

Absolutely no reason to play after reaching 150K points.

[carolinajacket]

Exactly. I wonder why they would make such an apparently stupid move.

[nerakil]

I think the first experience credit is still worth it for 100K tier credits (at least for me). It is twice as costly as 2014, but the Pier Shops in AC is an option, and AC runs 5X RCs every Thursday, making all 9/6 JoB machines +EV.

https://www.totalrewards.com/sevenst...periences-2015

[JustaDiamind]

have you been to the Pier shops lately ?? its nothing special anymore... unless you are looking for a Gucci bag..

[Luckylisa]

Also gone are limos between the airport and property.

[carolinajacket]

And that one hurts.

[FABismonte]

I think the first experience credit is still worth it for 100K tier credits (at least for me). It is twice as costly as 2014, but the Pier Shops in AC is an option, and AC runs 5X RCs every Thursday, making all 9/6 JoB machines +EV.

https://www.totalrewards.com/sevenst...periences-2015

Unless I am reading it wrong, I believe the first experience credit now costs 250K tier credits. So, five times as costly as 2014.

FAB

[FABismonte]

That may be. On the other hand, it might vary by property.

Personally, I would miss the free movies a lot. I saw three movies this past weekend, plus we signed on to Wifi for a computer we brought along. No charges.

The April 2015 sevenstarsinsider.com newsletter states that Rincon no longer includes free movies in their "media credit" allowance. Complimentary wifi, though continues.

FAB

[nerakil]

Unless I am reading it wrong, I believe the first experience credit now costs 250K tier credits. So, five times as costly as 2014.

FAB

You're misreading it. The first experience credit is at 250K tier, not 250K on top of the 150K to make 7*. Last year the first credit was at 200K tier.

[Alan Mendelson]

You're misreading it. The first experience credit is at 250K tier, not 250K on top of the 150K to make 7*. Last year the first credit was at 200K tier.

That is still a lot of additional "coin in" for the same $500 gift card that we got in 2014 at 200K. For a video poker player, that extra 50,000 tier points is another $500,000 of coin in. The $500 gift card represents one-tenth of one percent of that extra $500,000 of coin in.

Even if you are playing 9/6 Jacks (if you can find it) which pays 99.6% it raises your theoretical return to only 99.7%. If you want to add in Reward Credits -- they are the same one-tenth of one percent of your play. So now, Gift Card + Reward Credits and your theoretical return on 99.6% Jacks or Better is a "generous" 99.8%.

If there is a 5X multiplier on Reward Credits then you are theoretically getting 100.2%... BUT... and I have to emphasize the BUT... those Reward Credits may not be equivalent to US DOLLARS on an even or 1-to-1 basis.

For example, RCs are discounted for free play. And when used to purchase merchandise the merchandise is often at full retail (inflated) prices. The only time the RCs are at par with US Currency is when you use them to pay your hotel bill or eat in a hotel restaurant and that REQUIRES that you are in the casino so you are "trapped" by the system.

Frankly, I don't think it's worthwhile to chase after a $500 gift card by reaching 250,000 tier points and risking a loss and not reaching the theoretical return.

Besides, 9/6 Jacks and even 8/5 Bonus and Aces and Faces are rare these days.

[Dan Druff]

From what I can tell, you get your first $500 experience at 250k tiers (meaning 100k past basic Seven Stars), and your second one after another FULL 250k tiers, and the same with additional experince points (another 250k tiers each).

So this really is the ultimate in diminishing returns:

First 150k tier points: Earn Seven Stars, impossible to calculate exact value, but definitely in the thousands, and WAY above $500. Let's say we put Seven Stars value at $5000. That means you get about 3 cents value per tier earned.

Next 100k tier points: $500 experience point, so you're earning a measly $500 for 2/3 as many tiers earned as basic Seven Stars, which is really lousy. This means you are getting just 0.5 cents value per tier earned for this award.

Next 250k tier points: $500 experience point, but requires a whopping 250k tiers to earn! This means you are getting a horrendous 0.2 cents per tier earned for this award.

So earning tiers 250k-500k, you are getting about 15x LESS rewards than earning your first 150k. Even if you want to say Seven Stars is worth less than $5000, even if you assign it a value of $3000, you're still earning 9x LESS rewards from 250-500k than your first 150k.

BTW, to show you how easily Seven Stars' value can add up:

- You get unlimited hotel stays, provided minimum 2 days in between reservations. This can be worth several thousand, even if you don't spend that much time at the casino, considering the rooms will usually go for well over $100 (and sometimes over $200) per night, including resort fees. Even if you want to say you would get some comps anyway as a non-Seven-Stars, you will not get the blanket comping and flexibility that Seven Stars gives you. And if you stay at Caesars on New Years, the two nights of Dec 30-31 are worth close to $1000 alone.

- The annual trip gives you $1200 in airfare and $500 in food credit. Even if you don't want to take a gambling trip, you can use this trip as a way to take a road trip on your own, and fly back from where you want (this is allowed)

- You have $500 to spend on food in $100 increments

- Annual cruise is worth a lot more now, due to a change in NCL's booking policies. Without getting into detail, they've innovated a way to sell out their cruises and avoid giving last-minute bargain deals, so getting a spot on the ship in a balcony room is quite expensive these days. While this isn't free (you have to pay taxes and non-commissioned fare), you still save a ton. As an example, some cruises right now are selling balcony rooms for $4100, and you get it for like $680. So this by itself is a huge savings if you like cruising and are interested in some of Norwegian's itineraries.

And of course, when you earn Seven Stars, you automatically get full benefits for both THIS year and NEXT year.

Anyway, I have no idea what CET is thinking here. This experience point for 250k thing is a huge slap in the face of their most frequent players.

[Alan Mendelson]

Dan it is very "simple" to figure out what CET is "thinking here." They can no longer afford to give away money, benefits, trips, perks. The company is in bankruptcy. That's all that's going on.

[synergistic]

NCL Penthouse back on the table for two credits, thankfully - for folks who like to cruise, this is arguably the best redemption value available this year.

Fortunately, we love cruising, and while we would never spring for a Penthouse suite, it sounds like a fantastic way to do Alaska, where we would at least pay for a balcony. I can't value it anywhere near the over $5000 (sometimes over $8000!!) the suite would actually cost, but it's definitely better than $1000 in airfare.

[Dan Druff]

You're correct that this is by far the best value (if you enjoy cruising).

However, I should warn you that a penthouse suite isn't as nice as you might picture. (I'm not being condescending, as I'm not sure if you are familiar with NCL suites and their categories.)

A penthouse suite on NCL is usually around 450-570 square feet. Here is the floor plan from the NCL Dawn:



Or, by comparison, it's somewhat smaller than a standard room at the Caesars Augustus tower.

So it's a nice room to have on a cruise ship, but it's not the type of room that will "wow" you when you walk in.

It's about double the size of a standard balcony room.

With that said, you get also get a $300 spa credit and an unlimited soda package, so this is a great deal for $1000 worth of experience credits.

You are also correct in that these rooms usually go for $5000-$8000 per couple.

BTW, I don't know if NCL will do this again (because they changed so many things in 2015), but last year they ran several "free upgrade" promotions, to where you could upgrade your 7 Star Oceanview Alaska room to a balcony room (which is a HUGE upgrade). I did this last year.