Rob Singer: $325 Free Play

[Alan Mendelson]

Dicepunk thanks for joining and for posting.

Rob my experience has been this: with about $325 Free Play I will cash out $200 to $400 playing $1 7/5 or 8/5 Bonus or Aces and Faces.

SPECIFICALLY what method do you advise to beat that? Let's start at 25cents and not five or ten cents.

Specifically give me the instructions with game, denominations played, cash out, etc. Make it step by step so I can compare it to running it thru the machine once.

[Count Room]

LOL about the earthquake evacuation.

More serious question for Rob:

On your SPS and RTT you seem to advocate stepping all the way back down to the lowest denomination (even when playing one of the final levels) when slightly ahead in terms of overall bankroll. Wouldn't ratcheting back one denomination to play as you win smaller hands lower the risk?

EXAMPLE: I use the exact play structure you mentioned in the quote. I go all the way down to 50c BP and immediately hit a full house on the very first hand for 40 credits. I am $17.50 (35 credits at 50 cents) ahead of the 50c BP level. Wouldn't it be safer to immediately play off that $17.50 (70 credits at 25 cents) at 25c BP and see if I can profit there...steadily lowering denomination as I win instead of continuing to play 50c BP in the hopes of going all the way back to the beginning from the highest denomination?

You've talked about the soft profits with every win at a certain denomination level (40 credits or more) in your SPS. Why not immediately use that money at the next lower denomination for a lower risk way to climb back to the beginning level?

NOTE: I am not saying the structure of the credits and denominations should be any different than proposed; I am wondering if it would be safer to use small wins if you have a small surplus at...say...the 4th level to use as more ammunition at the 3rd level.

EDIT: Another term for what I am describing would be "backtracking" back up the denominational levels one-by-one with small wins (or perhaps 2 or more levels with a quad) as long as the higher levels are "full of the assigned credits" instead of being deep in the progression and only jumping back to the very lowest level even from the last level.

I am bumping up this $325 thread along with my question for Rob so it doesn't get buried under the pile of threads forever.

[arcimede$]

Alan, IIRC the SPS system requires 400 credits per level. If you started at .05 and progressed 4 levels (.05/.10/.25/.50) it would take $20 + $40 + $100 + $200 = $360. That's pretty close to your $325.

Remember you have two games at each level. BP would be half the credits at each level and then a high variance game like DDB/TDB/SDB for the other half of the credits. Since your base level is 5% of what Singer claims to use then your win goal should be 5% ($2500) = $125.

If you wanted to start at .25 then everything bumps up ... $100+$200+$400+$800 = $1500 to play 4 levels and the win goal goes up to $625.

[Rob.Singer]

Alan, IIRC the SPS system requires 400 credits per level. If you started at .05 and progressed 4 levels (.05/.10/.25/.50) it would take $20 + $40 + $100 + $200 = $360. That's pretty close to your $325.

Remember you have two games at each level. BP would be half the credits at each level and then a high variance game like DDB/TDB/SDB for the other half of the credits. Since your base level is 5% of what Singer claims to use then your win goal should be 5% ($2500) = $125.

If you wanted to start at .25 then everything bumps up ... $100+$200+$400+$800 = $1500 to play 4 levels and the win goal goes up to $625.

Several misstatements here. First, SPS bankroll requires 3X 400 credits at each denomination. What you're explaining is what's USED for a single session. And that's misleading also, because SPS is ONLY playable at 6 levels, not four.

Then, BP uses 25% of a denomination's total credits, with 75% on the advanced game.

Finally, if a session bankroll consists of $1500, the win goal would be $50 in ARTT and RTT. Four levels is not playable in SPS.

[redietz]

Several misstatements here. First, SPS bankroll requires 3X 400 credits at each denomination. What you're explaining is what's USED for a single session. And that's misleading also, because SPS is ONLY playable at 6 levels, not four.

Then, BP uses 25% of a denomination's total credits, with 75% on the advanced game.

Finally, if a session bankroll consists of $1500, the win goal would be $50 in ARTT and RTT. Four levels is not playable in SPS.

Arci,

Didn't you read the 2015 manual!?! Shame on you!!

[Alan Mendelson]

While Rob did those detailed videos with me about his special plays (you can see them starting here: http://alanbestbuys.com/id194.html ) I don't recall anywhere that anyone can see the actual play-by-play, step-by-step explanation of his overall strategies.

[regnis]

Arci,

Didn't you read the 2015 manual!?! Shame on you!!

Give arci a break. he has the manual, but the decoder was on back order.

[redietz]

Give arci a break. he has the manual, but the decoder was on back order.

Good one, regnis. I got my decoder ring from a box of Corny Flakes. Or maybe it was Fruity Loops. Either way, without a decoder, you're up the creek without a paddleboat.

[Rob.Singer]

While Rob did those detailed videos with me about his special plays (you can see them starting here: http://alanbestbuys.com/id194.html ) I don't recall anywhere that anyone can see the actual play-by-play, step-by-step explanation of his overall strategies.

For sure SPS strategy is very complicated, but for ten years it was very clearly & precisely detailed in step-by-step fashion on my site. And no red, it has never changed at all. What you see now and then is critics pretending they know all about it, so they make untrue claims.

Alan, I did just go thru ARTT step-by-step, and I've done it here twice before over the years. I've also explained RTT. People always understand them at the machines so maybe that's why it isn't so simple in writing.

[arcimede$]

I was writing from memory which is why I started the description with "IIRC". Actually, the only thing I got wrong from previous descriptions from Singer was the number of credits of BP. The claim that you can't play at less that 6 levels is quite strange as Singer has claimed in the past that he played only 3 times at 6 levels out of around 300 sessions and also often skipped the 5th level. As usual, the truth about his play is somewhat malleable.

[redietz]

So we await the detailed, step-by-step written instructions for Alan to follow. Let's start our own Doomsday Clock at 5:20 PM EST on June 17th. It shouldn't take too long to decide on the appropriate strategy and to email Alan the instructions.

Here we go....

[Rob.Singer]

I was writing from memory which is why I started the description with "IIRC". Actually, the only thing I got wrong from previous descriptions from Singer was the number of credits of BP. The claim that you can't play at less that 6 levels is quite strange as Singer has claimed in the past that he played only 3 times at 6 levels out of around 300 sessions and also often skipped the 5th level. As usual, the truth about his play is somewhat malleable.

You got all three wrong only in typical fashion, you're too proud to admit it.

Explain how you arrived at a $625 win goal using a $1500 BR.

It's a six level strategy, not your four (which is funny in itself in that you skipped right over that one) and not five. What you're selectively trying to spin in order to save face (which laughably, everyone can see BTW) is that one of SPS rules states that you do not have to go to the 6th level only if your avg. year-to-date winnings is not at least $2500/week including losing sessions.

You may now weep, but let's hope you learned your lesson on this. Similar to how you learned the lesson of your life last Aug.

[Alan Mendelson]

Calm down Rob. That was not an appropriate response to Arc.

In all fairness to Arc, I wonder if anybody really knows your system the way YOU know it. I've known you for years and I have no idea what it is which is why I am asking now.

There is no need to be overly critical.

Tell you what, Rob: how about writing it out, step by step, with the appropriate budget that fits, and post it here or email to me for your section on the main website?

I very much want to have it spelled out. Your own website is gone and my site will provide an archive for it since Google archives all my pages.

[Rob.Singer]

He gets what he deserves and asks for--always. He lied about the strategy simply because he always attempts to be the knowledgeable critic of how I play. Only he got caught again. It's not a question of how difficult SPS is to learn. Either you know it or you don't, but if you're gonna lie about it then it comes back in your face.

When you ask for the step-by-step details, what are you asking about? Are you prepared to play up to a 6-level 1c thru $1 or $1 thru $100 SPS, or would you prefer starting at quarters and playing 4-7 levels of ARTT or RTT? You can also start at nickels but I believe you balked at that. And if you want to know the steps in ARTT I just recently took the time to write them here in detail. But in the other thread you dismissed the steps.

If you want to know SPS step-by-step it's a huge effort, and as you've just seen, Mr. Balls-on right know-it-all had to embarrass himself when he flubbed up everything he claimed to know about it. Are you ever going to play it? I do have it on a flash drive of my site and I could mail it to you.

[Alan Mendelson]

Rob my invitation to you is simply this: whatever descriptions you write I will post publicly. You can do them yourself on the forum or send me the articles and I will make them part of my permanent site.

[Rob.Singer]

I've posted the most detailed step-by-step process in ARTT. I don't have time to write up SPS but the drive can be sent in.

[arcimede$]

As one can clearly see from Robbie's reaction, I caught him in a complete lie. That is what you get with Singer. Do I need to provide a link to his claim that he only played a 6th level 3 times? How can something be required and only be played 1% of the time? In addition, he also claims to have played the 5th level less than 10% of the time. In other words, a 4 level system should work over 90% of the time. Duh.

I suspect he doesn't want anyone trying his system because it would fail at a mathematically computable rate. That would make it obvious his past claims were all lies.

[Rob.Singer]

Arci, I suspect you're on your jealousy=more lying trip again because you are such a lonely person these days, constantly looking for attention.

[Rob.Singer]

For Alan: I read a comment in another thread that suggested I train you on my strategy when we have dinner in Nov. or Dec. Redietz has got to believe that to be the best approach because he thinks it's too complicated from afar. I hope you would like to do that.

I'm a little concerned about arci though. When he got called out for making up 3 things about my strategy, he then turned to pretending a 6 level methodology that doesn't always need to go higher than the first level in order to win the session goal, can be played at just four (along with ignoring his weird win goal from a $1500 BR flub). That's like the sobbing genius saying he doesn't really need over 100% games to be the brutal AP winner he claims he is!

Oh well. One would expect there are a lot more important aspects of life for him to be turning to at times like these, but if lying and envy and hate does it for him, who am I to deny him?

[Alan Mendelson]

Rob you're still the master of insults.

Stop it boys.