Robotic Arm and Dice Control

[Alan Mendelson]

Yes. If someone built a robotic arm that "threw" two dice the same way consistently it would prove dice control.

If two dice were set the same way every time and thrown to the same spot on the table every time and hit the back wall the same way every time you would have control. Only the dice set would have to be changed to attain the desired number.

A robotic arm would prove DC and DI are possible.

Unfortunately no human can duplicate the exact same toss like a robotic arm. So the best we humans can do is try to minimize the movement of the dice.

Minimizing movement means influencing the dice as much as possible. So we try for soft throws at the same angle while trying to reach the back wall hitting under the pyramids in the center where the wall is flat.

We can never attain the perfection of a robotic arm but we can try.

First rule is try to limit the rotation of the dice and the speed and angle of the throw. Second rule is to hit the back wall in the space under the pyramids. Then hope for luck.

But I am sure you will see that the harder you work at controlling the throw the luckier you will be with the results.

And remember no one said you have to hit the pyramids.

[redietz]

This is an excellent point, and I can't believe nobody else thought of it, but we didn't. Robotic arms would demonstrate the possibility of human dice control. That brings up another interesting point. I think we have to assume that there's a good chance some casino, somewhere, somehow, also thought of this and probably has tested it already.

P.S. It really bothers me that I didn't consider this. I have a small glass sculpture of a forearm and hand throwing two dice, and anyone who owns that really needed to think of it.

[jbjb]

AHigh tried this, remember?

[regnis]

Why do you think they used to call me "TOBOR"?

[Alan Mendelson]

I don't think Ahigh from the WOV forum had a true robotic arm. Ahigh is not close to a dice controller based on his videos -- his throws are erratic.

[jbjb]

Ya know, I've never watched. Just build a solid platform and have some mechanical device push the dice off of it at the exact same speed and exact same setup.

[jbjb]

If proven to really work, you'd stand out more than a card counter actually adding and subtracting out loud at a table and betting accordingly. At that point, all casinos will just make you pick them up and throw them and no setting allowed.

[OneHitWonder]

Robotic arms would demonstrate the possibility of human dice control.

Lol.

A simple physics proof of a few lines already out there on the advanced science forums a decade ago. For the totally uninitiated, a matter of translation and rotation. Take your pick. Pick one to control: rotational craziness (in flight) versus translational craziness (in flight) off the sponge. Energy, momentum, drag, etc, aren't physical quantities which can be held. Hell, no one has even seen energy, or knows what it is. For everything known about light, eg, nobody knows what it is either, though we "see" it all the time. Either you pin it down to a point, or you let it go and guess where is the photon. In between, literally all hell breaks loose. We still don't know theoretically does it travel with constant velocity. Even that stuff is a debate in a debate in another debate.

Forum people have no clue. All you have to do is ask the real academics. Shackleford is a complete twit who still even wouldn't get anything out of asking. No wonder his forum is half-dead, and was a joke all along. How comically funny can people get? F***. Now, the Donald is in on the action.

[jbjb]

...Forum people have no clue. All you have to do is ask the real academics. Shackleford is a complete twit who still even wouldn't get anything out of asking. No wonder his forum is half-dead, and was a joke all along. How comically funny can people get? F***. Now, the Donald is in on the action.

Aww, did someone piss in your Wheaties this morning?

[Alan Mendelson]

Ya know, I've never watched. Just build a solid platform and have some mechanical device push the dice off of it at the exact same speed and exact same setup.

But that would not simulate anything meaningful. You want the robot to throw two dice to the exact same spot with the exact same speed an angle adjusted to bounce off the table and reaching the back wall with the same rotation. That is what "dice influencing" tries to do.

Having two dice slide down a shoot ala what was done on WOV is pointless.

[Alan Mendelson]

If proven to really work, you'd stand out more than a card counter actually adding and subtracting out loud at a table and betting accordingly. At that point, all casinos will just make you pick them up and throw them and no setting allowed.

Are you familiar with me being thrown out of MGM and NYNY and Bellagio because it APPEARED that I was controlling the dice?

[jbjb]

Are you familiar with me being thrown out of MGM and NYNY and Bellagio because it APPEARED that I was controlling the dice?

Yes I've read your stories. Casinos throw people out for all sorts of reasons. Was your incidents at the advent of the DI movement? I doubt they'd toss you now.

[jbjb]

But that would not simulate anything meaningful. You want the robot to throw two dice to the exact same spot with the exact same speed an angle adjusted to bounce off the table and reaching the back wall with the same rotation. That is what "dice influencing" tries to do.

Having two dice slide down a shoot ala what was done on WOV is pointless.

It's a stepping stone. If it doesn't work here, it'll never work with a robot.

[Alan Mendelson]

It's a stepping stone. If it doesn't work here, it'll never work with a robot.

To the contrary. It won't work with a simple slide. Only a robot could have enough control.

[jbjb]

To the contrary. It won't work with a simple slide. Only a robot could have enough control.

Then it'll never work.

[Alan Mendelson]

Of course it would work with a robot. It's basic physics: for every action there is an equal and opposite reaction. If you have a controlled shot that hits the same place on the table it will react the same way. Once that is demonstrated all of you naysayers will at least say "dice control is possible." That doesn't mean a human can do it. But it would make the WOV forum wake up to realize it is possible.

To date the only thing that has been demonstrated on the WOV forum -- and everywhere on YouTube -- is fake dice control. The reason for that may be that so few people can do it, and I am sure no one can do it consistently enough that it could be videotaped several times in a row.

On WOV we've seen countless videos from "Ahigh" which has dice bouncing all over the layout and he called that a controlled shot. I laughed my butt off at that.

Then there was the video of the slide down the chute but each time the dice came to rest on different faces and that was because the slide down the chute was not controlled or uniform.

Looking at that "evidence" and the other videos on YouTube all you could say was dice control and dice influencing is a hoax.

It may be a hoax that it can be taught. But the science behind it is real.

As I said, having a human actually do it is the issue.

[redietz]

Why do you think they used to call me "TOBOR"?

Regnis, I watched "Eighth Man" religiously. You're in good shape as long as you don't run into "Samantha Seven."

[regnis]

Showing our age red

[Rob.Singer]

Aren't you spitting into the face of Frank Scoblete by inferring no human can control dice? He gets laughed at enough for this nonsense just about everywhere else.

[Alan Mendelson]

I've told Frank that I reject the use of the phrase dice control. I know that he uses it interchangeably with dice influencing. The bottom line is NO ONE actually believes in control.

But if a robot can be shown to control dice then we might be able to convince the naysayers that INFLUENCING is possible.

Right now few believe even in influencing.