My Advantage Video Poker Play

[Rob.Singer]

And wouldn't a professional gambler use a Schedule C and be aware of how their taxes are filed?

The point is simply this: I addressed the question to Rob.

OF COURSE any professional gambler would only file schedule C, and THEY WOULD KNOW WHAT THAT IS. These phonies who are nothing more than armchair "AP's" have unwittingly exposed themselves time and time again. That's why RS__ keeps the baloney flowing and why jbjb has such ridiculous claims. Neither one really knows a thing about any of this.

[jbjb]

I use the Schedule C. I paid $129,000 in taxes in 2012, my best year.

The only one making ridiculous claims is Singer. Never once in ten plus years shown anything.

[alpax]

Do table game players even have to pay taxes at all? I thought it was only for 300 for 1 payouts or its progressives greater than $13,000.

[jbjb]

Do table game players even have to pay taxes at all? I thought it was only for 300 for 1 payouts or its progressives greater than $13,000.

They withhold taxes at that threshold. After that, it's the honor system. I keep accurate record and pay what's owed.

One other thing I haven't seen mention. Being that we are "self employed", we're supposed to pay quarterly.

[Alan Mendelson]

Gosh. I wish I paid $129,000 a year in taxes.

[slingshot]

A big part of my strategy was to avoid greed. That's why I set it up as a trip to different locations throughout Nevada from the Phx. area each week for 10 years. Many of my sessions were short because of early hits, and each time I immediately left for home whether tired, hungry, or both. The #1 goal was to bring the profit home and put it plus my bankroll (which I always withdrew the day I left for Nv.) back into the bank, in order to maintain an exact & precise financial account tht coincided directly back to my contemporaneous log that I kept for the IRS. I certainly could have begun another session at any point in time, but when I began playing professionally it was to be all about a short weekly trip so that I could be home far more often than I was when I lived and traveled all over the world for the job I left.

So each session quit was at least $2,500? And if I played 5c---$2.00 that would be $200? Thanks.

[jbjb]

Gosh. I wish I paid $129,000 a year in taxes.

It was unusual and way way over expectation. And 90% of it was table games wins.

[Rob.Singer]

So each session quit was at least $2,500? And if I played 5c---$2.00 that would be $200? Thanks.

Each session WON and quit was at least $2500. The only comparable play I can address a win goal on is 1c thru $1 because you can have the exact same ratios when going up in denomination (1c, 2c, 5c, 10c, 25c, $1). In this case your win goal would be $25--or one 100th of what mine is. I never worked out any other combinations.

[Rob.Singer]

I use the Schedule C. I paid $129,000 in taxes in 2012, my best year.

The only one making ridiculous claims is Singer. Never once in ten plus years shown anything.

Of course everyone's supposed to believe a nameless big deal with no proof of anything other than being a story-telling armchair AP. And next time, make up the entire story at once so others don't have to keep coaxing you to fill in the blanks.

[Alan Mendelson]

I am just in awe about a casino gambler paying $129,000 in taxes. This would mean that after deductions and after losses, his net-net income from gambling was in the range of $300-thousand.

Now, I can understand that happening if someone hit Megabucks and chose to take yearly installments, or if someone won a major WSOP bracelet event or two.

But even our Rob Singer has reported yearly profits of ONLY about $100,000 per year (on average).

To pay $129,000 a year in taxes after deductions means there was a whole lotta winning going on!

[alpax]

They withhold taxes at that threshold. After that, it's the honor system. I keep accurate record and pay what's owed.

One other thing I haven't seen mention. Being that we are "self employed", we're supposed to pay quarterly.

Understood, you probably own a ton of assets and will need to report income to the IRS to be able to upkeep them. I've always assumed you can fly under the table since you need different aliases and facial disguises as part of living as an AP.

Gosh. I wish I paid $129,000 a year in taxes.

I wish I earned that much let alone as a tax amount. jbjb is right, there is much more money from the tables and probably is out earning Bob Dancer who quoted to be looking at under six figures for this year with the Ultimate X play gone from the Palms casino.

[Alan Mendelson]

The "problem" with table games is that you have to "bet big" in order to win big. There are few bets at table games that return jackpots.

Consider blackjack -- the favorite game of APs. You hit a blackjack and the return is $3 for every $2 you bet. You would have to bet $2,000 to win $3,000.

At video poker you can bet $5 and win $4,000.

You can take 1/4 of the $2,000 blackjack bet -- which is "just" $500 and bet that at $100/coin video poker and get two-pair on Bonus or Jacks and double your money.

While you are spared W2Gs with most table game bets, the reality is the return on your bets will be small but the risk can be just as large.

[alpax]

The advantage blackjack card counter does not worry about betting big. Their bankroll will grow to a point that they will eventually get to betting big amounts as their endgame.

Casino operators pay attention to how wide the "spread" is of which players increase their bets when the count is in their favor. Now and days they can spot amateurs in about a dozen rounds.

jbjb is the expert so he/she can fill in more details than I ever can. I am still mind boggled about the Mississippi Stud play. Cashing out those chips will also be a challenge since they keep track of how much chips were in the rack every 2 hours or so.

Blackjack players do not worry about W2Gs since the most they can win is 4 split double downs each one which still will not reach the 300 for 1 table game requirements. I was wrong about an earlier post about the progressive W2G, it is $5000 not $13000.

Video Poker has much higher variance than Blackjack, due to more possible outcomes. The win rate is about 44% while Blackjack is more closer to 50%.

[Alan Mendelson]

I think you missed my point. To have a table games profit of about $300,000 to require a tax bill of $129,000 means there were a large number of winning bets at high amounts. For example 100 blackjacks with $2,000 bet over and above all other losses and expenses. THAT has filled me with awe.

Let me put it simply: to have a tax bill of $129,000 from casino gambling is freaking amazing.

[jbjb]

Alan, I'm not going to discuss my BPs betting, but I don't work done. And bj isn't the only game we play. Get a few $100 max bet quads on Mississippi Stud alone pay $40,000 each. Full houses, $10,000 each. Just like having that freakishly great vp session where everything you hold turns into a high paying hand, that's how that year went. Again, highly unusually and unexpected so don't be awed by it.

[Alan Mendelson]

Well if Mississippi Stud you did get lucky. That game has high variance and again you had profits of $300,000 over and above losses and expenses? Wow!! I have a right to be in awe!!!

[jbjb]

Yes, high variance even the way we play it with information. This was also before there was much heat on the game. It's quite tough to get a "good" game these days with big bets out now. Most casinos are wise to the play nowadays.

[Alan Mendelson]

Information? At Mississippi Stud? You shouldn't have brought that up again. You should have quit while you were ahead.

[Count Room]

Video Poker has much higher variance than Blackjack, due to more possible outcomes. The win rate is about 44% while Blackjack is more closer to 50%.

Actually it's much worse than that for video poker. With the exception of the low-variance games like Bonus Poker and JoB paying 2 for 1 for a two pair, most VP games have a win rate closer to 1 out of 8 hands when you hit a 3-of-a-kind or better (13% or so). 30% of the hands are merely high pair/2-pair pushes. This is only in reference to non wild-card games.

[OneHitWonder]

After that, it's the honor system. I keep accurate record and pay what's owed.

The thing that gets me about the tricky, manipulative and generally speculating souls, is how honest they want to appear at the last second, or at least call it honesty.

Like the people of "there go I but for the grace of God", and "why me who survived the cancer?". Hell, unless you've solved the mystery of universe, can not be sure of any such grace in first place.

Me, I say f the government. I want a piece of the universe.