Getting convinced that Bob Dancer doesn't know much about modern CET

[bigfoot66]

Bigfoot over the years my hosts had very little knowledge of how to play any game. And you think they'd know the odds of drawings?

Years ago I had a host at Caesars who asked me to meet him at a locals' casino to show him how to play craps.

Hosts are either salespeople or order takers. I doubt they have any inside info to help a gambler.

They probably don't know every piece of the puzzle, but I think they have access to a lot of information that could be useful. For example:

1) This Baccarat Tournament has a prize pool of $500,000, and we expect 100 people to qualify for entry. If you earn 10,000 points I can get you an invitation.

2) The new boss is easier on giving airfare reimbursement, so the published rules say you need 8,000 points to earn airfare but I can give it to you as long as you earn 6,000 points.

3) We are running a great promotion next month that we haven't announced yet, If you move your trip back a week I can give you an extra $500 in freeplay.

4) I was able to give you a lot more last time because you were playing machine #1854 which generates theo a lot faster than #1856 which you played this time.

I am not a hosted player so I may be completely wrong, or (more likely) I have the right idea but these are poor examples. But it seems obvious to me that the host has access to a lot of casino information that is not publicly available. Some of this information could probably help you make more profitable gambling decisions. If your host likes you and is willing to bend the rules a bit, he might give you more information than he is supposed to.

Heck, I had a front desk clerk tell me my ADT the last time I was at a CET property because I tipped her a couple of dollars. I am speculating but it does seem like a very plausible scenario.

[jbjb]

...Just remember to bring along the anti-bacterial wipes the next time you think you'll be playing one of the machines he's pushed the buttons on.

Better yet, just wear surgical gloves.

[RS__]

Bigfoot is right......but it doesn't matter, the Singers and Alans will come back and dispel anything that has truth to it.

Rob, you must have gotten shafted by the casinos/hosts if you don't know what they do or can do for you.

[Alan Mendelson]

They probably don't know every piece of the puzzle, but I think they have access to a lot of information that could be useful. For example:

1) This Baccarat Tournament has a prize pool of $500,000, and we expect 100 people to qualify for entry. If you earn 10,000 points I can get you an invitation.

If the host can get you an invitation for 10,000 it's not a gift. It's because that's the threshold for an entry.

2) The new boss is easier on giving airfare reimbursement, so the published rules say you need 8,000 points to earn airfare but I can give it to you as long as you earn 6,000 points.

Maybe in the good old days, but not with CET today.

3) We are running a great promotion next month that we haven't announced yet, If you move your trip back a week I can give you an extra $500 in freeplay.

Yes, we are tipped off to promotions before they are announced. I was told about JLo at New Year's last year before it was announced and I was told about Ariana this year before it was announced. But to think that a host would discourage a trip? That will never happen.

4) I was able to give you a lot more last time because you were playing machine #1854 which generates theo a lot faster than #1856 which you played this time.

This is absolute fiction. Hosts don't know about machines which generate theo. They will be able to see if you're a $5 video poker player or a $25 video poker player, but when it comes to telling you about specific machines that's fiction.

I am not a hosted player so I may be completely wrong, or (more likely) I have the right idea but these are poor examples. But it seems obvious to me that the host has access to a lot of casino information that is not publicly available. Some of this information could probably help you make more profitable gambling decisions. If your host likes you and is willing to bend the rules a bit, he might give you more information than he is supposed to.

Since you're not a hosted player you are going by hearsay. There are a limited number of strings that a host can pull for you. They can't help you make profitable gambling decisions because they just don't have the info, unless you consider tipping you off that a drawing or a tournament is coming up? And I consider that type of gambling info near worthless. Maybe the "AP community" considers that info valuable -- I certainly don't.

Where a host really becomes valuable is when you need an extra room, or two, or you need adjoining rooms -- or separated rooms when you book many. The best trick a host ever pulled for me at Caesars was about 10 years ago when I had six rooms -- all comped -- so I could fly in my brother and sister and their wives and kids and we could all have Thanksgiving dinner together at the old Nero's. And my host joined us for dinner too, since he was going through a divorce. And the entire thing was comped including the wine he ordered. But he wouldnt have done it for me if I hadn't had the play to justify it.

Heck, I had a front desk clerk tell me my ADT the last time I was at a CET property because I tipped her a couple of dollars. I am speculating but it does seem like a very plausible scenario.

I doubt front desk clerks have access to that info at a CET property, but if you say you did I won't argue.

[bigfoot66]

She made it clear that most desk clerks can't access the info but since she worked the vip checking she had more access. I could see the screen, there was a number for just that property and then another number that was my general adt.

[rymetymeuk]

YOU WILL ALWAYS GET MORE LUCRATIVE OFFERS FROM MARKETING-GENERATED MAILINGS THAN YOU EVER WILL FROM SPEAKING TO ANY HOST.


This is not my experience at all. I am going to Vegas for my 35th in 8 days and my mailers are $75 freeplay. my host is giving me $500 free play and $300 f&b.. so I must be the exception here then?

And I also agree with everyone here about Dancer, I can't stand the man.

[bigfoot66]

Btw you say that my host comments are hearsay...it's worse than that, it's pure speculation. I'm usually wrong and may well be wrong here too.

[bigfoot66]

Seems like a lot of people who can't stand dancer religiously devour his publications.

[Alan Mendelson]

I've played at Bellagio a couple times now. Every offer came thru a host. I haven't received my first email or mailer yet.

[jbjb]

I've played at Bellagio a couple times now. Every offer came thru a host. I haven't received my first email or mailer yet.

MGM properties offers are based on play from a few months back. It'll probably take a couple more before you start seeing any.

[Rob.Singer]

I'm shaking my head. Room upgrades, extra rooms etc. can be very easily obtained from the VIP check-in areas, either on the phone or in person. Sometimes they will talk to a host about the request themself, and sometimes they don't have to. The point is to stay away from any direct contact with a host. They'll make you believe you're their best friends at your "home away from home" yet the more they cheerfully give you, the more bleak your computer future will look. Note: all the massive amounts of griping from the 7-Stars comp hounds on this forum.

[Alan Mendelson]

I'm shaking my head. Room upgrades, extra rooms etc. can be very easily obtained from the VIP check-in areas, either on the phone or in person.

Let's talk about my big Thanksgiving weekend from years ago at Caesars.

I had a room for me and my wife.
I had a second room for my two kids.
I had a third room for my sister and her husband from New Jersey.
I had a fourth room for their two kids.
I had a fifth room for my brother and his wife from New Jersey.
I had a sixth room for their two kids.

We all had dinner at Nero's -- all 13 of us (my host joined us, it was his day off) at one specially arranged table. And everything was totally comped.

Now, Mr Singer, do you expect that the extra free rooms could "be very easily obtained" at the VIP check-in area when my relatives flew in? By the way, they arrived in Vegas before I did. Do you think the comps would have been easily obtained either when everyone arrived or departed without a host?

What kind of a dream world do you live in?

I'm shaking my head.

[Dan Druff]

Alan is mostly right about hosts, especially with CET.

They are very good when it comes to getting you extra rooms or upgrading your existing room. I mean, this doesn't work much for me, as I am overcomped, but for most others that's what hosts are good for.

Regarding hosts giving you offers, you're not going to get many (or any) from a host which exceed what the marketing computer would offer you. Perhaps you will at the beginning, when the marketing computer hasn't yet generated offers for you yet. However, at CET, for the most part hosts will not be able to give you offers exceeding what the computer gave you, aside from play-dependent RFB.

In some cases, hosts will give you LESS than you can get through the general booking number. For example, I am entitled to 5 nights comped at CET properties through my Seven Stars benefit, if I book with the CCS (800 number). If I attempt to book through a host, I will only get 4. I've discussed this before out here. One host even explained this to me, in that the CCS has a different block of rooms to give away, and operate under different rules than they do.

[Alan Mendelson]

Alan is mostly right about hosts, especially with CET.

They are very good when it comes to getting you extra rooms or upgrading your existing room. I mean, this doesn't work much for me, as I am overcomped,

For at least a year now (or is it two, or three years?) you've been telling us you are "overcomped." When will you be "undercomped" because you are not getting offers, and hosts won't touch you?

[Dan Druff]

For at least a year now (or is it two, or three years?) you've been telling us you are "overcomped." When will you be "undercomped" because you are not getting offers, and hosts won't touch you?

Never.

As soon as I am getting less value from being a Seven Stars than I am spending to get there, I will quit playing.

The money I would have to spend to "get offers" at this point would not come close to being worth it.

BTW, I believe I am getting better offers than you were getting recently for Rincon (prior to being no-offered)! I am getting $120 freeplay per period (like twice a week), but I haven't bothered to take advantage of it.

This is because I played at Rincon a lot this year, so I am not overcomped at the particular property.

[Alan Mendelson]

When Rincon cut me off I was getting $80 per week plus something on Fridays -- ranging from $60 up to, if I recall, $300. In reality, I was getting the minimal amount on Fridays.

[Rob.Singer]

Let's talk about my big Thanksgiving weekend from years ago at Caesars.

I had a room for me and my wife.
I had a second room for my two kids.
I had a third room for my sister and her husband from New Jersey.
I had a fourth room for their two kids.
I had a fifth room for my brother and his wife from New Jersey.
I had a sixth room for their two kids.

We all had dinner at Nero's -- all 13 of us (my host joined us, it was his day off) at one specially arranged table. And everything was totally comped.

Now, Mr Singer, do you expect that the extra free rooms could "be very easily obtained" at the VIP check-in area when my relatives flew in? By the way, they arrived in Vegas before I did. Do you think the comps would have been easily obtained either when everyone arrived or departed without a host?

What kind of a dream world do you live in?

I'm shaking my head.

You're shaking your head because you choose to be blind to what's really going on with your relationship with Caesar's.

First, what you just told me about all those rooms is you have to be a huge loser at CET. Anyone could get what you have who has those kind of numbers attached to his/her name. And you don't know how much you could have received from the VIP check-in because you're so fascinated with "that oh-so-special feeling" of having a host....your caring friend from your wonderful "home away from home".

Bringing a host to your family dinner is sappy and non-sensible. All they care about is that you keep losing.

[Alan Mendelson]

That's right Rob, I lost that year. My host also offered me his kidney when I needed a transplant. Fuck off.

[Rob.Singer]

If all these misled 7-Stars All-Stars here were concerned about how to win MONEY from the casinos instead of worrying to death about why they're not getting this tidbit or that bunch of craps "for free", then I'd say you're doing your job. Instead, we constantly get treated to a crew of comp worry-warts and an "overcomped" obfuscator who generally have poor judgement and a bad disposition when it comes to casinos. Why people continue to joust with a bankrupt corporation is a mystery.

You folks are the cure to what ails Caesar's.

[redietz]

Rob's trying to provide the voice of conscience on Alan's shoulder.

I've never had the tendency break my usual patterns whether winning or losing, so the implication that people go out of control is alien to me, but I appreciate Rob's advice in a general sense. I don't think it's necessary to micro-manage other people's gambling, however. If Alan more or less adheres to his usual stakes and usual routines, win or lose, you can't criticize him for gambling. If he goes whack job nuts and puts 10K on the Texans to win their division (inside joke for regnis), well then, maybe some calm advice is in order.

I have no idea how much Alan wagers per trip and all that, and I really do not want to know. I have no interest. My sense is that blowing 90K before the end of the year would be way out of normalcy. We should all have confidence that Alan is not a whack job and let it go at that.