Tipping discussion MOVED HERE

[Rob.Singer]

Valet: I choose to have this extra service. At casinos it's free, so I tip for it.

Cocktail Waitress: Same thing.
Bell Hop: Same thing.

Restaurant Server: This one's different. These folks are doing what they're already paid to do, but they interact with you multiple times in order that they make sure you got what you want the way you want it, and also to make your dining experience as enjoyable and pleasant as humanly possible. I tip gererously for this, and there's of course times the experience was bad and no tip was left.

Housekeeping: I don't tip the maintenance people who make sure my room has properly working stuff in it; I don't tip the security guards who make sure the hotel's guests are safe; & I don't tip the people who make sure our rooms are clean. It is all included in the price of the room, comped or not. I believe the reason people tip housekeeping and not the others I mentioned is because there's the possibility you will bump into these people during your stay. And since housekeeping has the slimy practice of putting tip envelopes in rooms, the intimidation factor purposely gets cranked up. However, if I request a special service like an extra pillow or more towels, I always tip the person who brings them.

[Alan Mendelson]

Rob how you can draw the line between housekeeping and a car valet and a restaurant wait person? They're all paid by the hotel/casino, yet you tip the car valet and the waitress but not the housekeeper? And you don't tip the floor people who give you the hand pay and also have access to your social security number?

Wouldn't it serve you right if one of those floor people who you stiff gets angry and decides it's your social security number they give to their Cousin Vinny to sell on the black market?

It think this post you made on the "Quit While You're Ahead" thread explains everything about you:

gambling addiction no longer haunts me as it did when I began as an AP, and not doing what the casinos want and expect me to do is a creed I strictly follow. This is what works for me.

I think you don't tip floor people because it reminds you of your addiction and perhaps you blame them because they used to say "see you soon with another" or "hit that royal" when they gave you a handpay.

But what did housekeeping do to hurt you? Unless it's because the housekeepers might be foreigners and minorities -- and we know how you feel about them!

[dicepunk]

While waiting for the attendant to show up on a hand-pay, I'll get my tip ready and have it in my shirt pocket to pullout once the big money is in my hand. I hate when they breakdown the last hundred of the payout into twenties, thinking your gonna tip them in twenties. That's the reason I have only a $10 bill in my pocket ready to go. It's not like they're taking my order and bringing me my dinner. I don't mind tipping, I just won't tip a lot $wise. Call me cheap.

[dicepunk]

And since housekeeping has the slimy practice of putting tip envelopes in rooms, the intimidation factor purposely gets cranked up.

Slimy practice? I find it convenient. I'd rather place my tip in an envelope for the housekeeper. Must be weak minded if you consider that intimidation.

[redietz]

I understand what Rob is saying here. If the service provided is one of his choosing, like valet (as opposed to self park) or going to a restaurant (as opposed to drive through), he tips. If the service provided has been paid for as a packaged entity unto itself, and he has no say in all of the aspects of that entity, then he will not tip for separate aspects of it, such as the housekeeping aspect of buying a room.

It's unusual, but his logic is pretty clear.

[Rob.Singer]

Alan, you always try very hard to break down my common sense posts, and while I know how much you love to argue, you're once again on the losing side here. I was going to answer your same question again, but red did a good job deciphering the secret code I must have used.

You ask how I can differentiate between what housekeeping does vs. valet & the wait staff? I already explained that but 2 or 3 times might do it. Valet: I choose the service. Wait staff: there's multiple interactions with them as they try to make your dining experience a great experience. Housekeeping: simply a part of the hotel room fee.

Of course, you skipped over the correlation between security guards, maintenance people, and housekeeping. There's your answer if you want to see it.

Not sure what being an AP addict has to do with tipping. That's a swing-and-a-miss.

Those housekeeping envelopes: first, I don't care if it's Lupe or Maria or Rosarita or Malcom who takes care of my room. In fact, when I see envelopes the 1st thing I do is rip them up and throw them out. But there's apparently some people here who do get intimidated by those envelopes with names on them, and because they're afraid of what these third-worlders might think of them if they knew who tore their begging envelopes up, they take the safe road and leave tips....many of which are undoubtedly reluctant ones.

You people need to take control of your own lives and stop allowing what you feel is political correctness control what you do. Then again, some of you just might start leaving tips at the front desk for security, maintenance, and accounting. Figures.

[Alan Mendelson]

I understand what Rob is saying here. If the service provided is one of his choosing, like valet (as opposed to self park) or going to a restaurant (as opposed to drive through), he tips. If the service provided has been paid for as a packaged entity unto itself, and he has no say in all of the aspects of that entity, then he will not tip for separate aspects of it, such as the housekeeping aspect of buying a room.

It's unusual, but his logic is pretty clear.

So you agree and defend this logic?

[redietz]

I have to cogitate, as Jed Clampett used to say. Rob's logic is internally consistent, while your logic of tipping hand pays but not security is inconsistent. At least he has rhyme and reason as opposed to cultural fashion of the moment. I mean, I have no idea if people tip this way or that in various countries; I'll have to do the research. But tipping housekeeping or hand pays because it's what Americans do at this particular point in time is not my idea of why I should tip. Rob at least has traveled enough internationally to be able to put American tipping behaviors in some kind of overall context. I have not, to be frank.

One thing Rob has going for him is that his style puts the brakes on "tipping creep," which we have all seen recently. Tipping Starbucks counter help is an example. Tipping at sports ticket windows is another from the casino side of things. These were rare 30 years ago. Why are we experiencing this tipping creep? Is it because those in service positions no longer make reasonable money vis-a-vis the upper class?

I'm not totally against housekeeping tips, mind you, but as I said, I need to cogitate and come up with some reasonable rules for this.

[Alan Mendelson]

I have a rule about tipping housekeepers: always leave a tip.
I've also tipped casino security on the occasion when they walk me to my car. At Pechanga the security officer did not accept my tip because he said their rules prohibited them from accepting tips.

[Rob.Singer]

Alan, I think you'd have tipped Ted Bundy if he gave you advice on how to pick up girls....

[Chimp]

Is it because those in service positions no longer make reasonable money vis-a-vis the upper class?.

It's because they have become APs. And the tip jars are their form of vulturing. Lol

[redietz]

Or how to dump them....