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Thread: Have you ever been up 25% of your bankroll?

  1. #21
    I must have been conning myself because I never even spoke about it to anyone other than my playing partner. I was happy to be just an anonymous guy playing craps. I didn't try to sell the system or teach it, and I knew nobody would take the time to properly learn and train anyway. It sometimes pays to be compulsive. I tried for 15 years to teach my playing partner to throw and he was physically unable to do so. Finally, he just stood in the corner to which I was shooting to make sure that I had a good unimpeded landing area. He stopped throwing and didn't touch the dice for years.

  2. #22
    AP's have no choice but to call anyone who can do anything they can't do or don't understand, a "huckster" or "con artist". It's part of the justification responsibility that comes with such a belief.

    I don't believe in the ability to control or even influence the dice, simply because I understand the physics that must be overcome to accomplish such a feat----and because there's just too many failed gamblers out there like Wong and Scoblete who must resort to taking other people's money thru snake-oil means in order to gain even a sliver of acceptance.

  3. #23
    All I've ever said about dice influencing is that it's possible, and I have seen three (maybe four) players (out of thousands) who I think actually have the skill. Regnis might be the fifth.

    What amazes me is that there are so many who say it's IMPOSSIBLE. It's not IMPOSSIBLE. It's very, very difficult. And it's not a skill that can be performed 100% of the time.

    (Do card counters ever make a mistake in their count? Do expert video poker players ever make the wrong hold? Do sports handicappers ever miss an injury, or a training report, or news about drug use? I don't think anyone is perfect.)

    What I have also always said is: since craps is a random game it doesn't hurt to try to get the dice to show the numbers that will help you win.

    We all really try. Even darksiders try to get a 7-out.

    What's the point of playing if you don't try to win?

    Regarding the videos of so-called Dice Controllers and Dice Influencers: I agree. I am yet to see one of these videos that shows true DI. The three shooters I saw do not have videos on YouTube and they don't teach classes either.

  4. #24
    Why isn't there some kind of dice influencing competition where the best dice influencers get together at a non-casino location, and compete to control the dice?

    Has there ever been such a thing done?
    Check out my poker forum, and weekly internet radio show at http://pokerfraudalert.com

  5. #25
    Who in their right mind would attend such a thing?

    Reminds me of the occasional mega-promos with limited seating whose purpose may be to identify advantage players rather than draw people in for a limited time promo.

  6. #26
    Back in the late 1990s, before dice influencing caught on, and when the DI schools were just starting, I went to a "convention" of DIs in Vegas. It was relatively small. It's where I met Frank Scoblete (but he wouldn't remember me because he was meeting so many people at the time).

    There were demonstrations made by a few of the "big name" DIs. But what they demonstrated would not be what would impress any of the critics of DI. All they did was avoid throwing 7s. NEVER could they throw a number on command.

    It seems that avoiding sevens is not enough for the critics of DI. It seems that the critics of DI want something more... like being able to say "my next number will be a hard 8" and then the DI goes on to shoot 4-4. Well, folks, it just doesn't happen that way.

    One more thing: even DIs throw sevens. Everyone throws a seven. And for some reason, those who do attempt dice influencing and dice control are held to a higher standard about the number of 7s they might throw.

    Look... according to the math the 7 appears one out of 6 rolls. If you have a DI who can roll the dice with a better seven to rolls ratio then he's good with me.

  7. #27
    Alan, if a "DI" can't throw a hard 8 on demand, then how on earth can they avoid throwing a 7?

    No doubt this entire DI fascination grew it's roots in claims from after-the-fact random rolls---and in a few up-front claims that were corroborated by cooperating random rolls. People who sell gambling advice aren't all that stupid. Seems clear that people like Scoblete etc. seized upon this sleazy opening to make money off of unsuspecting craps players, simply because they have never and know they CAN never win at that game on a consistent basis.

  8. #28
    Maybe it's the name "DI" or "DC" that puts people's expectations a little out of whack. In blackjack or slots or video poker, an AP is looking for an edge of a couple of percentage points. They don't claim that they can win every hand or every pull of the handle. They simply are looking for that small edge.

    If the odds of throwing a 7 are 1 in 6, and someone can throw a 7 only 1 in 10, you do the math.

    The idea that you can throw a certain number on demand is not realistic, and anyone that says they can will have to show me. But I will tell you that I could (past tense) throw a higher percentage of 10's and 8's and hard ways than the odds dictate, and do it regularly for 15 years.

  9. #29
    The problem I have with DI is physicists say it is impossible.

  10. #30
    Originally Posted by Rob.Singer View Post
    AP's have no choice but to call anyone who can do anything they can't do or don't understand, a "huckster" or "con artist". It's part of the justification responsibility that comes with such a belief.
    Do you mean like calling Dancer, Paymar and Scott hustlers?

  11. #31
    Originally Posted by mickeycrimm View Post
    The problem I have with DI is physicists say it is impossible.
    Mick--they still say you can't make a baseball curve. My eyes and the hole in my bat when I couldn't hit the curve tell me otherwise.

  12. #32
    Originally Posted by mickeycrimm View Post
    Do you mean like calling Dancer, Paymar and Scott hustlers?
    I've never called them "hustlers". They are simple liars who do so in order to sell anything gambling related to keep gambling money in their pockets. True "experts" would NEVER need other people's money and would NEVER do anything other than play the game they say they can win money at whenever they require additional funds. It is very similar to the idiots who call claiming to have "sure winners" in sports betting, as they desperately try to get you to buy their services because they are leading "experts". But what they don't want or expect anyone to figure out is that all they have to do is BET MORE MONEY on their own "locks". Then after their "big winners" hit, there would be absolutely no need whatsoever to go out begging for other people's money.

  13. #33
    Originally Posted by regnis View Post
    Maybe it's the name "DI" or "DC" that puts people's expectations a little out of whack. In blackjack or slots or video poker, an AP is looking for an edge of a couple of percentage points. They don't claim that they can win every hand or every pull of the handle. They simply are looking for that small edge.

    If the odds of throwing a 7 are 1 in 6, and someone can throw a 7 only 1 in 10, you do the math.

    The idea that you can throw a certain number on demand is not realistic, and anyone that says they can will have to show me. But I will tell you that I could (past tense) throw a higher percentage of 10's and 8's and hard ways than the odds dictate, and do it regularly for 15 years.
    regnis, I believe you believe you can do that. If so, can you please explain how you hold and throw the die specifically and differently in order to produce a higher % of 10's & 8's as well as 7's? Are you able to throw them at the same speed from the same spot into the same spot in the same trajectory while hitting the same spots at the other end somehow, as well as making them respond in the same manner as they bounce, enough time so as to alter the odds?

  14. #34
    Originally Posted by Rob.Singer View Post
    Alan, if a "DI" can't throw a hard 8 on demand, then how on earth can they avoid throwing a 7?
    There are 30 ways to throw anything but a 7. There is only one way to throw a hard 8.

  15. #35
    Originally Posted by mickeycrimm View Post
    The problem I have with DI is physicists say it is impossible.
    Absolutely not true. In fact, physics shows it is possible. The breakdown (failure) is in the skill of the human who throws the dice.

    "Sharpshooter" wrote a book all about the physics and how it is possible. Unfortunately for most of us, we don't have the physical skill.

  16. #36
    Originally Posted by Rob.Singer View Post
    you hold and throw the die specifically and differently in order to produce a higher % of 10's & 8's as well as 7's? Are you able to throw them at the same speed from the same spot into the same spot in the same trajectory while hitting the same spots at the other end somehow, as well as making them respond in the same manner as they bounce, enough time so as to alter the odds?
    This is in fact what DI is all about. Now, how many people can really do that? I've seen three. And if you could hold and throw the dice with a specific orientation, with the same trajectory while hitting the same spots with the same force, you would repeat the same number or numbers. Again, some variance is okay because if you set the dice for the V combination (3, 3) and the rotation goes off by one face on each die the result would be 3,3 or 1,2 or 4,4 -- but NO 7. Or the result would be 5,1 or 6,5 or 6,2 or 1, 2 -- but NO 7.

    Here... want to see what I can do: It's not legal but I can do it. I did it once for the crew at the Gold Strike in Jean just after the dice sliding scandal broke at Wynn. The LVRJ interviewed me about it.
    Last edited by Alan Mendelson; 01-12-2017 at 12:38 PM.

  17. #37
    Originally Posted by Rob.Singer View Post
    regnis, I believe you believe you can do that. If so, can you please explain how you hold and throw the die specifically and differently in order to produce a higher % of 10's & 8's as well as 7's? Are you able to throw them at the same speed from the same spot into the same spot in the same trajectory while hitting the same spots at the other end somehow, as well as making them respond in the same manner as they bounce, enough time so as to alter the odds?
    Like any muscle memory type skill, you have good and bad days, although my bad days were still better than a random shooter. Look at Tiger Woods---for whatever reason he has lost the ability to control his swing. Look at a pitcher who one day can't throw strikes. These are no different that the mechanics of throwing a pair of dice.

    I had various sets and different trajectories and speeds depending upon location (i.e. what casino I was at), the table bounce, and the number that was needed. Also taken into account was if I were to miss my spot or turn my hand (you cant make a perfect throw every time), what would the result be. Then you could adjust your set in a way that would avoid that error resulting in a 7. No--none of this was easy. It is a full time job. Like anything else, if you want to be good at it you have to put in the time.

    However, as I have said before, if I got in the zone and was able to tune out everything around me, the muscle memory took over and I basically could keep throwing almost the exact same throw for extended periods. It was times like that where I had 18 8's and 14 4's that we could put a big hurt on the casino.

    On the rare days where I didn't have it, I went home, took a few days off, ran a few practice rounds, and was back in when I felt comfortable. Not every day was great, but there was not even one day that the random shooters were better.

    I only stand right side next to stick as it is the shortest throw. Any other position I would try to use my "controlled throw" but I was nowhere near as confident or effective.
    Last edited by regnis; 01-12-2017 at 12:56 PM.

  18. #38
    For Rob Singer: a great baseball hitter has a .300 batting average. You know what that means-- less than one third of the time he has a hit that gets him on base. How much better than .300 does a craps shooter need to be great?

  19. #39
    I can't wrap my head around that comparison Alan. And after reading what regnis said it gets more difficult. Because even if a pre-programmed robot were given dice to throw in the same manner every time, I can't believe the expected number wouldn't appear any more often than random.

    Of course, a video of his (or anyone else who says they can accomplish DI/DC) shooting on one of his good days would be very convincing IF their odds-breaking results were the result. Is there any such video anywhere? I wouldn't think regnis would have done one, but the money grubbers like Scoblete & Wong might, since they sell it.

  20. #40
    I didn't know Ferguson claimed to be a dice influencer. How long has he claimed that?

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