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Thread: It was two years ago today...

  1. #1
    It was two years ago today that this was posted on the WOV forum:

    "(Alan) simply can't get past a die having six sides." -- Michael Shackleford May 12, 2015

    For the record, if you throw two dice on a table and you tell me that one of the dice is showing a 2, the chance that the other die is also showing a two is one out of 6. It will always be one out of six. Because I can't get past a die having six sides.

  2. #2
    Your stubbornness and ignorance is showing again, Alan.

  3. #3
    I'm sorry but two dice minus one die equals one die.

    When you tell me one die is a 2, that leaves one die with six sides.

  4. #4
    I hate this problem, because the way the problem was written was specifically designed to engender a wrong response. It's bad, misleading writing couched as intellectual trickery.

    If a piece of writing is leading most readers to a wrong conclusion consistently, then it's a bad piece of writing and should be rewritten. Putting together a word salad for the purpose of generating a "gotcha!" moment is juvenile.

  5. #5
    Originally Posted by redietz View Post
    I hate this problem, because the way the problem was written was specifically designed to engender a wrong response. It's bad, misleading writing couched as intellectual trickery.

    If a piece of writing is leading most readers to a wrong conclusion consistently, then it's a bad piece of writing and should be rewritten. Putting together a word salad for the purpose of generating a "gotcha!" moment is juvenile.
    Maybe so but the fact remains that the answer is one chance in eleven.
    Take off that stupid mask you big baby.

  6. #6
    Of course it was worded wrong. But the "narrow thinkers" could not realize or accept that it was worded wrong. They wanted one particular answer and came up with that particular answer even though the question as stated would not lead to that particular answer.

    To put it another way, they were so smart they got the wrong answer to the question.

  7. #7
    Originally Posted by quahaug View Post
    Originally Posted by redietz View Post
    I hate this problem, because the way the problem was written was specifically designed to engender a wrong response. It's bad, misleading writing couched as intellectual trickery.

    If a piece of writing is leading most readers to a wrong conclusion consistently, then it's a bad piece of writing and should be rewritten. Putting together a word salad for the purpose of generating a "gotcha!" moment is juvenile.
    Maybe so but the fact remains that the answer is one chance in eleven.
    No, the answer to another question was one chance in eleven.

    The answer to this question was one in six.

  8. #8
    If you don't understand the answer then the wording of the question won't matter anyway.
    Take off that stupid mask you big baby.

  9. #9
    Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson View Post
    Originally Posted by quahaug View Post
    Originally Posted by redietz View Post
    I hate this problem, because the way the problem was written was specifically designed to engender a wrong response. It's bad, misleading writing couched as intellectual trickery.

    If a piece of writing is leading most readers to a wrong conclusion consistently, then it's a bad piece of writing and should be rewritten. Putting together a word salad for the purpose of generating a "gotcha!" moment is juvenile.
    Maybe so but the fact remains that the answer is one chance in eleven.
    No, the answer to another question was one chance in eleven.

    The answer to this question was one in six.
    What was the exact wording of the original question?

  10. #10
    Originally Posted by a2a3dseddie View Post
    Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson View Post
    Originally Posted by quahaug View Post
    Maybe so but the fact remains that the answer is one chance in eleven.
    No, the answer to another question was one chance in eleven.

    The answer to this question was one in six.
    What was the exact wording of the original question?
    It was "Is Allen the most stubborn and obtuse person west of the Mississippi?"
    Take off that stupid mask you big baby.

  11. #11
    This was just another case of a pack of self-proclaimed "AP's" trying--and of course, subsequently failing--to project their misguided gambling superiority over the rest of the crowd.

    I guess wizard's embarrassing forum panhandling didn't teach these fools a thing.

  12. #12
    This is not a new word puzzle. I first saw it 20-25 years ago. I believe the original wording had a mixing or misuse of tenses that misdirected readers to the technically wrong answer.

    I think math guys tend to overlook the mixing of tenses and think nothing of it, while the writing guys focus on the tenses as defining the actual question. The word puzzle itself is a contorted, purposefully confusing presentation. Any editor would demand a rewrite.

    As someone who took technical writing and science writing and non-fiction writing and all that, I feel like it's no accomplishment to be able to confuse people. I actually edited some military reports that had a lot in common with this word problem: they were purposefully written to misdirect readers to a wrong conclusion.

  13. #13
    It really was a matter of reading comprehension.

    Had the question been worded differently the correct answer would have been different.

    But I'm afraid that those with the "wrong answer" failed to correctly read what the question stated and asked.

    I even provided the "correct question" that would have given the 1:11 answer. But the true stubborn people wouldn't even consider that different wording.

    Even the Wizard at one point said he wanted to talk to others about how the actual question was worded. He even conceded, in a round about way, that the actual wording of the question might have led to a different answer.

    Frankly I have another explanation for the widespread incorrect reasoning: SIMILAR QUESTIONS have been presented in statistics classes before and the NEW wording was mistaken to be one of those similar questions.

    Those who believed the answer was 1:11 failed to recognize that this question was indeed worded differently and the way this particular question was worded the true answer was 1:6.

  14. #14
    Not if you were using the dice I used to use in the game I ran in High School Alan.

  15. #15
    Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson View Post
    It really was a matter of reading comprehension.

    Had the question been worded differently the correct answer would have been different.
    This essentially hits the nail on the head.

    These clowns on WoV are far from the mensa geniuses they make themselves out to be. We see proof of that right here with the ramblings, lying, poor spelling, and the inability to consistently string together two comprehensive sentences so as to give clarity to their babbling. Heck, just look at the horse superstar axel rode in on, lack of education and all! Even his horse was stupid. jbjb can be manipulated into a vulgarity-laced rage without even trying; RS__ clearly has no writing OR memory based skills whatsoever, and seemingly exists only to defend his good pal "axel"; and then there's ozzy.....

    Case closed.
    Last edited by Rob.Singer; 05-12-2017 at 08:03 PM.

  16. #16
    Two dice equal 12 sides. If a 2 is showing on one, there are 11 sides left. Only one of which is a 2. The damn answer is 1 in 11.

    Case closed you wimps who work for a living and can't cut it in the gambling world.

  17. #17
    I hate to start this argument over again, but jbjb, that is so stupid I don't even believe you believe it. If a 2 is showing on one die, the other spots on that die are out of the equation, leaving one die with 6 spots, one of which is a 2.

    Unless you have x-ray eyes and can see all the sides of the dice.

  18. #18
    And that's the typical response from someone that doesn't understand conditional probability. Same reason you work for a living and can't gamble for one. Another typical casino loser.

  19. #19
    Original thread: http://wizardofvegas.com/forum/quest...o-dice-puzzle/

    Since we don't know anything about the condition for what the partner truthfully says is under the cup, the only way to repeat this process is by assuming he will only truthfully say at least one of the dice is a 2, if it's showing a 2. The question doesn't tell us what would have happened, had neither of the dice shown a 2. In this case, only 11 of the possible 36 combinations would count, as we don't know what would have happened had neither die been a 2.

    It's funny in one of the original threads here that Alan made, Rob agreed it was 1/11 until he saw others and me saying it was 1/11. Then he promptly switched to 1/6. "The enemy of your enemy is your friend" or something like that.

  20. #20
    Originally Posted by jbjb View Post
    Two dice equal 12 sides. If a 2 is showing on one, there are 11 sides left. Only one of which is a 2. The damn answer is 1 in 11.

    Case closed you wimps who work for a living and can't cut it in the gambling world.
    Are you fucking serious? If a 2 is showing on one die, you set that die aside. It's showing a 2. That leaves only the other die with six sides. So the chance of 2-2 can only be 1 out of 6.

    The problem with your interpretation is that we know ONE DIE IS SHOWING A 2. We are told ONE DIE IS SHOWING A 2. It doesn't matter which because there are only two dice. If one of the dice is showing a 2 we are only concerned with the second die -- and the chance of a 2 on that other die is 1/6.

    That leaves only the OTHER die which has SIX sides.

    And don't start flipping over the dice the way the Wizard did in his video. That's the biggest laugh in the world. Dice don't continue flipping after they come to rest. If a die came to rest, it's done.

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