The WoV Thread

[Ozzy]

^^ That bozo Rusty Shackleford doesn't deserve credit for anything! This is a great opportunity for Dunce Dear, to come moderate this forum. Come to think of it, we don't need a dictator over here BBB, OD, Flash Gordon and Herr Dieter need not apply !

[Tasha]

Oncedear resigned yesterday and after being a hard working WOV Admin, he only got TWO pages. That seems like a punch in the face to only get TWO pages after being a Member for 8 years and an Admin for 5. Reminds me of the time a hard working Walgreens Member for about 35 years in the same spot, transferred and didn't even get a goodbye party. Sad.

[jbjb]

Aceside on WoV:

"There are no other ways, as far as I know. I mean legal ways."

Considering the stupidity of him over on BJTF, he's got a lot to learn about legal advantage play.

[JSTAT]

Aceside on WoV:

"There are no other ways, as far as I know. I mean legal ways."

Considering the stupidity of him over on BJTF, he's got a lot to learn about legal advantage play.

Hey jbjb, have any advantage play for us peons?

[jbjb]

Aceside on WoV:

"There are no other ways, as far as I know. I mean legal ways."

Considering the stupidity of him over on BJTF, he's got a lot to learn about legal advantage play.

Hey jbjb, have any advantage play for us peons?

Big difference between you and him.

[Tasha]

I felt offended when Axelwolf brought me up out of nowhere and insulted me by saying,"Nathan/Kentry/Karen Nathan wouldn't understand either," when the Newbie asked something like,"Why does the Poster who have the most posts and threads on here get a lot of negative responses? I don't understand." Why bring me up randomly like that and insult me like that? :/

[AxelWolf]

I felt offended when Axelwolf brought me up out of nowhere and insulted me by saying,"Nathan/Kentry/Karen Nathan wouldn't understand either," when the Newbie asked something like,"Why does the Poster who have the most posts and threads on here get a lot of negative responses? I don't understand." Why bring me up randomly like that and insult me like that? :/

I knew that was a sock puppet account and you came to mind first, I guess it was good old Marcus Clark.

Sorry, Tasha... my bad.

[jdaewoo]

I felt offended when Axelwolf brought me up out of nowhere and insulted me by saying,"Nathan/Kentry/Karen Nathan wouldn't understand either," when the Newbie asked something like,"Why does the Poster who have the most posts and threads on here get a lot of negative responses? I don't understand." Why bring me up randomly like that and insult me like that? :/

Let me try to explain it to you. You create a lot of bullshit accounts and spew inane nonsense with them. Axel saw a bullshit account spewing inane nonsense. Therefore he assumed it was you.

I realize you don't understand what I just wrote so I'll just say you're a begging degenerate and need to ban yourself from every casino accessible by bus.

[Tasha]

I felt offended when Axelwolf brought me up out of nowhere and insulted me by saying,"Nathan/Kentry/Karen Nathan wouldn't understand either," when the Newbie asked something like,"Why does the Poster who have the most posts and threads on here get a lot of negative responses? I don't understand." Why bring me up randomly like that and insult me like that? :/

I knew that was a sock puppet account and you came to mind first, I guess it was good old Marcus Clark.

Sorry, Tasha... my bad.

Thank you for acknowledging your mistake. I accept your apology.

Edit. The WOV Suspension List formally says that Sock WAS Marcusclark.

[AxelWolf]

Edit. The WOV Suspension List formally says that Sock WAS Marcusclark.

Yes, apparently so. How awkward and embarrassing. The guy got caught making up stories. He was shunned, shamed, and banned. Yet he can't stay away.

[Tasha]

Edit. The WOV Suspension List formally says that Sock WAS Marcusclark.

Yes, apparently so. How awkward and embarrassing. The guy got caught making up stories. He was shunned, shamed, and banned. Yet he can't stay away.

I was wondering why Marcusclark was banned in the first place. He was a popular Poster who contributed a lot and one day, poof, he was gone suddenly. He had posted more in about a year than People who had been on WOV for multiple years. He even sucked up to the Admins.

I have empathy about him coming back after being banned since I also came back under multiple names, all getting banned before finally stopping for good.

[kewlJ]

In other news over at WoV, the great Mdog has now taken to telling everyone what the weather is in Las Vegas everyday. Today he did so in multiple threads. Save me opening the sliding door to the balcony and seeing for myself each morning.

At least something useful from that stupid Fantasy adventure thread.

[jdaewoo]

Alan still beating the "APs don't make money" drum.

Alan:

1) Loves gambling and being in a casino more than anything in the world
2) Has cunts like darkoz spell out in explicit detail how to game mail for huge profit
3) Is too stupid to understand
4) Decides that since he's too stupid to understand that it doesn't exist
5) But thinks winning for years on end at the retarded game of baccarat is totally doable

Never change Alan. Stay broke.

[smurgerburger]

Alan pities those without 401ks.

[kewlJ]

Alan still beating the "APs don't make money" drum.

Alan:

1) Loves gambling and being in a casino more than anything in the world
2) Has cunts like darkoz spell out in explicit detail how to game mail for huge profit
3) Is too stupid to understand
4) Decides that since he's too stupid to understand that it doesn't exist
5) But thinks winning for years on end at the retarded game of baccarat is totally doable

Never change Alan. Stay broke.

Yes, now Alan is harping on the "secret AP decoder ring". When he thinks he has come up with something clever, he mentions it multiple times as he has done with this decoder ring comment. But the truth is that it is just another example of Alan's contempt for AP's, who make money, where he doesn't. He just can't hide that contempt. None of the anti-AP folks can.

I used to actually feel sorry for someone like Alan. But the truth is he has been on these various forums, populated by AP's for....ever. And some AP's have bent over backwards to help Alan see the light. More so than I have seen for anyone else (which means others must feel sorry for him also). And Alan just refuses.

For you horseracing enthusiasts, Alan is the horse in the starting gate that when the gate opens, the horse "refuses". He just stands there. I guess the other analogy would be the old you can lead a horse to water, but can't make him drink. Hum....I guess I am having a horse day today. One more: when it comes to casino gambling, Alan is a horse's ass.

[redietz]

Alan still beating the "APs don't make money" drum.

Alan:

1) Loves gambling and being in a casino more than anything in the world
2) Has cunts like darkoz spell out in explicit detail how to game mail for huge profit
3) Is too stupid to understand
4) Decides that since he's too stupid to understand that it doesn't exist
5) But thinks winning for years on end at the retarded game of baccarat is totally doable

Never change Alan. Stay broke.

I just do not get it with Alan.

He was/is a fine journalist. A fine, experienced writer. But not when it comes to gambling. It's goddamn amazing. I'm not sure what the problem is exactly, but it must fall into either (1) having lost so much money that he just can't grasp that some people have not or (2) a kind of intellectual arrogance -- if he can't do it, nobody can. Both options seem ridiculous, as certainly Alan can't be so invested in his losses that they overwhelm his judgement. And he knows he's not the expert on everything. If journalism teaches you anything, it's that.

KewlJ was witness to the whole "package" ordeal. I sent Alan copies of standings from years of "Tipsters or Gypsters?" published in Las Vegas, copies of pages from Playbook newsletter (distributed nationally on newsstands for decades) with my ads and records, copies of interviews I'd done published in regular newspapers, published op-eds I'd written regarding gambling, a copy of a paper I presented at the National Conference on Gambling and Risk-Taking, an article published in The Humanist, all stuff that couldn't be faked and could all be verified with a couple of phone calls. He wanted no part of it.

That "tracking two tables" with KewlJ was the worst of irrationality, though. I used to be able to watch six or more football games simultaneously and keep ballpark stats in my head for every game and know down-and-distance for every game without any graphics. Looking back, that's seems much more difficult than tracking two tables.

[redietz]

One last note. I never really clean out my mailbox here much, so I stumbled onto an old PM to Alan. It's still here. About six/seven years ago (I'd have to check which), I won something called the Race to the Super Bowl at an offshore. The prize was 25K in wagers on the SB. I purposefully (I know, I was a bad, sarcastic boy) posted that I was thinking about betting $25-$35 on the SB and would appreciate anyone's ideas on what to take. I "accidentally" skipped the K after the 25 and 35.

Well, of course, as planned, Singer chimed in with what a cheap penny ante fake I was to solicit advice for $25 - $35 in wagers. I then said, "Um, I forgot the K." Singer refused to believe it.

What he didn't know was that I had sent Alan a link to the splash page from the offshore announcing that I had won. Alan suggested I post the link in this forum. I said, no, I'm not gonna do that. Let people think what they want. But if he wanted to do it, and set Singer straight, he could do it. Well, he didn't do it.

[jdaewoo]

I think it's the losses. If it's a fait accompli that gambling in a casino comes with heavy losses then he can mentally write off the heavy losses as the price of entertainment. The thought that he could have walked a different path, spent just as much time in his favorite environment, and made money instead of torching it is just too much for him to mentally bear.

He seems to be fine with the thought of a big bettor magically crushing the inherent house edge though. Maybe he likes the fantasy of "I would have won if I just had more money" because he can just shrug off the fact that he wasn't born a millionaire. It also let's him stick it to the APs in his mind because he just can't fathom that any of them are self made millionaires.

Oh Alan, if you only you knew ...

[kewlJ]

I just do not get it with Alan.

He was/is a fine journalist. A fine, experienced writer. But not when it comes to gambling. It's goddamn amazing. I'm not sure what the problem is exactly, but it must fall into either (1) having lost so much money that he just can't grasp that some people have not or (2) a kind of intellectual arrogance -- if he can't do it, nobody can. Both options seem ridiculous, as certainly Alan can't be so invested in his losses that they overwhelm his judgement. And he knows he's not the expert on everything. If journalism teaches you anything, it's that.

KewlJ was witness to the whole "package" ordeal. I sent Alan copies of standings from years of "Tipsters or Gypsters?" published in Las Vegas, copies of pages from Playbook newsletter (distributed nationally on newsstands for decades) with my ads and records, copies of interviews I'd done published in regular newspapers, published op-eds I'd written regarding gambling, a copy of a paper I presented at the National Conference on Gambling and Risk-Taking, an article published in The Humanist, all stuff that couldn't be faked and could all be verified with a couple of phone calls. He wanted no part of it.

That "tracking two tables" with KewlJ was the worst of irrationality, though. I used to be able to watch six or more football games simultaneously and keep ballpark stats in my head for every game and know down-and-distance for every game without any graphics. Looking back, that's seems much more difficult than tracking two tables.

I don't know that Alan was a fine journalist. He says he was. Interviewed Presidents and Queens and all that. Maybe others have witnessed Alan as a journalist/reporter, but I really haven't, not that I want to. I did see a couple minutes of one of his informercials and personally I am not impressed with that crap. If a company is paying you to review their product that is not real journalism. Anyway, moving on.

"The package": This occurred early in my time on this forum. I have no idea what was in this package sent to Alan, or what it proves or doesn't prove about redietz. All I know is Alan agreed to be the arbitrator and told redietz where to send this information (package). And then the tap dancing began, like nothing I have ever seen. "I only get to the office every few days" then "I only get to the office once a week", then "once every other week", then "once a month", then "once every 3 months" and finally, "I don't have keys to the office", followed by "the office is permanently closed".

As for tracking two tables, when conditions are right to do so: This is probably my biggest regret of anything I have shared about what I do. It is something that numerous other professional level players have employed but was never mentioned much. I forget why I mentioned it, I think as an example of something that can improve results dramatically. And when challenged, I took the stupid step to explain, just how I do it, in detail, right down to where to sit. That could have come back to haunt me. It didn't, but it could have.

Opportunities for this technique are now greatly reduced, not because I mentioned it, just because of circumstances of fewer and fewer real blackjack tables, replaced by all kinds of new games with higher house edge. Post covid (and I think that just happened to be the timing) more casinos have gone to electronic versions of blackjack, including the stadium type set up, replacing the lower limit tables in the pit. Fewer BJ tables equals less opportunity for this technique.

Part of my mistake was due to that I had never before encountered anti-AP haters and deniers like Alan and Rob before. It was my nature to think they didn't understand and try to explain it, but in reality, they didn't want to understand, and nothing said would make a difference. It was like trying to tell a flat-earther, that the earth isn't flat, and they won't fall off.

[kewlJ]

I think it's the losses. If it's a fait accompli that gambling in a casino comes with heavy losses then he can mentally write off the heavy losses as the price of entertainment. The thought that he could have walked a different path, spent just as much time in his favorite environment, and made money instead of torching it is just too much for him to mentally bear.

He seems to be fine with the thought of a big bettor magically crushing the inherent house edge though. Maybe he likes the fantasy of "I would have won if I just had more money" because he can just shrug off the fact that he wasn't born a millionaire.

See this plays right into the Mdawg narrative, that pisses me off so much. Early on Mdawg denied doing anything that gave him an advantage and implied that because he had a large bankroll, that alone was able to overcome the negative EV, house advantage. This is the general thought process and false narrative of the progressive wagering crowd.

So I complained to Shackleford and Mikes response to me was "that if he had a large bankroll, he too could register many small wins before a much larger loss came along, wiping everything out". I was dumbfounded. Of course! That is the way a progression works. But Mike was using this as justification for allowing this false narrative that this was a winning "system", which in turn could tend to harm other players (contradictory to what he stated was the purpose of his forum).

Singer's whole deal started with Progression wagering claims also, before he eventually stole a real claim by Nestor and Kane.

If no one stands up and say No that is not the way it works, you get people like Alan and many others believing it. I know a lot of AP's don't care. the more losing players, the better for us. But come on the math has to matter.