The WoV Thread

[Mission146]

One thing is clear. None of you guys have any friends in real life.

I don't? That's news to me. I can name at least three.

[Ozzy]

https://wizardofvegas.com/forum/off-.../2/#post802205

That OnceDear is one Power Tripping Mother Fucker, eh?
No way OD is English.
That Mother Fucker is a straight out Nazi.
Hail Shackleford!!

But but, MODERATION in MODERATION !!....Lol at Comrade Dietz he/she comment. I think its a safe bet OnceDear is a he.

[Mission146]

A frustrating thing about the Wiz's position on allowing MotherfuckingDawg to post his fantasy BS is that it is the antithesis of what that place once stood for, 'the lair of the math boyz."

It's like giving front and center stage to a member of the "flat earth society" at a convention of cosmologists and astronomers.

I fear the new owners are telling the Wiz to do whatever it takes to attract more eyeballs to the site, even if what it takes is a train filled with two-headed calves careening off a bridge and bursting into flames on a convent in the valley below.

That's an interesting thought when you look at it from that angle. Could there not, perhaps, be some benefit in someone presenting a counter-position (and account) to what people claim the site, "Stands for?" Without allowing for opposing discourse to take place, all a person (or people) is doing is preaching unopposed.

Besides that, you guys would have MDawg censored based on the substance and angle of what he his discussing in his one thread. That's unfair. Argue against him all day long and that's perfectly fine, but unless you want to go with the very sparingly used Rule #20, once again, I don't see what rule MDawg's posting violates. You're an attorney, MrV, so as you should know---sometimes rules/codes/laws have unintended consequences, but you've just got to deal with them until the rule/code/law is changed.

On that note, maybe you could recall, I seem to think there was a case that went to SCOTUS once about a new law being created, but the law was such as to specifically adversely impact one individual person. I happened upon that case one day and I wish like hell I could remember what it was.

Anyway, the point is, discussion of betting systems has always been allowed. Trip reports have always been allowed. To disallow for the first would require a new rule, to Nuke for the second would require (and this is only arguably) the trip report(s) to be proven false while still keeping within the rules in one's attempt to do so.

In other words, sometimes you tie your own hands.

Anyway, you guys are all full of shit when it comes to conjecture about the owners. What was my Baccarat advice in that thread, partially, "The best way to play Baccarat is not to play Baccarat."

I'll say the same thing about any negative expectation game. The best way to play is not to. Do you think I'd still be getting paid by the owners if they didn't want people to post the truth on there? I'm literally on the site telling people that it's best NOT to gamble, but gamble within your means if you are going to.

Again, and this is coming from someone who actually works for them and isn't just spouting unfounded bullshit, the impression I get when it comes to WoV is that what happens, happens. I really don't think that site is anywhere near the top of their priorities.

[Ozzy]

A frustrating thing about the Wiz's position on allowing MotherfuckingDawg to post his fantasy BS is that it is the antithesis of what that place once stood for, 'the lair of the math boyz."

It's like giving front and center stage to a member of the "flat earth society" at a convention of cosmologists and astronomers.

I fear the new owners are telling the Wiz to do whatever it takes to attract more eyeballs to the site, even if what it takes is a train filled with two-headed calves careening off a bridge and bursting into flames on a convent in the valley below.

That's an interesting thought when you look at it from that angle. Could there not, perhaps, be some benefit in someone presenting a counter-position (and account) to what people claim the site, "Stands for?" Without allowing for opposing discourse to take place, all a person (or people) is doing is preaching unopposed.

Besides that, you guys would have MDawg censored based on the substance and angle of what he his discussing in his one thread. That's unfair. Argue against him all day long and that's perfectly fine, but unless you want to go with the very sparingly used Rule #20, once again, I don't see what rule MDawg's posting violates. You're an attorney, MrV, so as you should know---sometimes rules/codes/laws have unintended consequences, but you've just got to deal with them until the rule/code/law is changed.

On that note, maybe you could recall, I seem to think there was a case that went to SCOTUS once about a new law being created, but the law was such as to specifically adversely impact one individual person. I happened upon that case one day and I wish like hell I could remember what it was.

Anyway, the point is, discussion of betting systems has always been allowed. Trip reports have always been allowed. To disallow for the first would require a new rule, to Nuke for the second would require (and this is only arguably) the trip report(s) to be proven false while still keeping within the rules in one's attempt to do so.

In other words, sometimes you tie your own hands.

Anyway, you guys are all full of shit when it comes to conjecture about the owners. What was my Baccarat advice in that thread, partially, "The best way to play Baccarat is not to play Baccarat."

I'll say the same thing about any negative expectation game. The best way to play is not to. Do you think I'd still be getting paid by the owners if they didn't want people to post the truth on there? I'm literally on the site telling people that it's best NOT to gamble, but gamble within your means if you are going to.

Again, and this is coming from someone who actually works for them and isn't just spouting unfounded bullshit, the impression I get when it comes to WoV is that what happens, happens. I really don't think that site is anywhere near the top of their priorities.

So let me get this straight. You call us out with certainty, that were full of shit about Rusty and the Serbs, but refuse to state that Dog, is full of shit. You've been walking on eggshells and tap dancing, refusing to call out his bullshit. You are one of the guys that knows better, shame on you.

[Mission146]

So let me get this straight. You call us out with certainty, that were full of shit about Rusty and the Serbs, but refuse to state that Dog, is full of shit. You've been walking on eggshells and tap dancing, refusing to call out his bullshit. You are one of the guys that knows better, shame on you.

I'm not calling you out; it's the same standard. Evidence, or it's bullshit conjecture. Anytime someone says anything about the owners' motivations, unless there are discussions behind the scenes I don't know about, (and it's not like many people on these sites are terribly skilled at keeping private things private---hell, you'll get cancelled for doing that---before cancel culture was even a thing) it's pure conjecture.

I'm not suggesting that people don't have the right to their conjecture; people can say whatever they want to say. I'm simply suggesting that I actually have some experience with talking to ownership and management (other than Wizard) and so my conjecture, I would assume, is slightly better.

Anyway, I tend to defer to people who have more insight on a subject than I do. There's no need for you or anyone else to do so if you don't wish. Carry on.

[MisterV]

Were MuffdivingDawg to limit his discussion to a betting system that would be fine, but he doesn't.

He insults our intelligence by claiming he never loses.

He gives himself props by posting pictures of money, chips, and possibly fake Rolex watches.

He regales the board with unlikely / essentially impossible tales of tipping, winning and being comped: and the owners of the site not only allow it, they seem to lap it up, much as a cat will eat its own vomit (I saw my cat vomit a grasshopper it had eaten, then eat it again a day later, after it had dried out).

Weird scenes inside the gold mine ...

[kewlJ]

Let me know how to find that thread.

OK. What I'd do is find any post by kewlj then click on his name to see his profile.
https://wizardofvegas.com/member/kewlj/
Then click on the link to his list of posts, and seek out the last one. Then scroll down that thread to where I suspended him and my reason for doing so..

And this is how people are suppose to view threads at WoV? Search out by poster? News flash if the thread is not in that top 10 on main board, no one is reading. No one is finding it. You got me (and others from the response) on the technicality that you "hid" the thread. And "hid" is your word. I see no difference between hiding and removing.

I made analogies about both blackjack (super-duper count and 5% advantage) and Roulette (martingale) as examples of topics that would immediately be debunked by membership AND MANAGEMENT, and yet these claims by Mgoof are not only allowed to stand, but those challenging are often suspended or in my case asked to "agree" not to participate in that discussion. I mean come on. It would be like if you started suspending or seeking agreements for everyone who challenges 18 y.o.'s in a row.

All I can say is WoV is not what WoV was. I suppose you can say that about many forums, but with WoV, it is everything the forum was about and stood for, is gone. It has just been flipped on it's head. Now the forum is a game, trolling, guys like coach belly who ONLY troll on multiple forums. Guys like Mdawg who is this whole thing is about making a mockery of WoV and people seeing if they can play by the ever-changing rules right up to the line, enticing others to get suspended. That is what it is a game, not a legitimate forum about gambling and making gamblers better informed gamblers.

[kewlJ]

Were MuffdivingDawg to limit his discussion to a betting system that would be fine, but he doesn't.

He insults our intelligence by claiming he never loses.

He gives himself props by posting pictures of money, chips, and possibly fake Rolex watches.

He regales the board with unlikely / essentially impossible tales of tipping, winning and being comped: and the owners of the site not only allow it, they seem to lap it up, much as a cat will eat its own vomit (I saw my cat vomit a grasshopper it had eaten, then eat it again a day later, after it had dried out).

Weird scenes inside the gold mine ...

There are so many other smaller details that are also bullshit that haven't even been discussed or lightly discussed.

I did lightly discuss the bullshit about being banned at blackjack at 2 casinos and then reinstated later. Mission came to Mdawgs defense, with some obscure circumstance that this has occurred. But basically there is one scenario that this will occur and that is if the player is a losing player much, much bigger at some other game.

Now lets talk about almost every single day the pit compliments Mdawg on his play and tells him "he is the best player they have ever seen". Does anyone know how a pit managers job works? They are responsible for for their tables. they are graded on what the hold is for the tables, whether the tables report a win or loss. Now they are not going to get fired because some guy wins. That happens everyday. It is called variance. The casinos experience it just the same as every player (except Mdawg) experiences it. But while they won't get fired, it is not good for them to have tables that report a loss every day. So even if Mdawg was just the luckiest guy in the world, they are not going to be happy to see him and toast him like he is the king of the town.

There are just so many pieces that doesn't fit, but we are supposed to stand there, with a guys dick out and pee running down our leg and accept that it is raining. And now Oncedear is telling us we should ignore that dick with a stream of pee to our leg, because it is good reading and brings "views". That is the new WoV.

[jbjb]

One thing is clear. Most of you guys don't have any friends in real life.

I don't? That's news to me. I can name at least three.

I fixed it.

[kewlJ]

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So speaking of pieces of the puzzle that doesn't fit, these are the times (Las Vegas time) of Mdawgs posts yesterday at 2 forums, WoV and here. He posts on several more.....only counting up these 2.

You guys are gamblers and have visits to Las Vegas. Anybody else spend the day locked in your high end luxury suite in Las Vegas posting on an internet forums every few minutes for basically 17 hours? This is NOT the itinerary of a high end Vegas player in a high end Vegas comped suite. This is the day of a complete narcissist.

And yes, to be fair, I posted 16 times yesterday, 6 times in a 1 hour 22 minute period around lunch and 10 times in a 3 hour window from 8:31pm to 11:34 pm while watching TV in my home in the evening.

Ok, lunch break is over, back to work.

[MaxPen]

Hey Mdouche, I was reading the great Mdawg fairytale over at WoV in the LOSING BETTING SYSTEM section, when I noticed darkOz, step in to put up the $2500 that EV pulled out of, so it appears all systems are go on that alternative contest that really is has nothing to do with witnessing your actual play as described in the great fairytale.

So my question is why is it necessary for you and Mike to get paid for this witnessing of your play? If you get paid it is on, if you don't get paid it is off?

YOU should want to show the whole world and the 27 people listed that they are wrong and you are right and Mike should want to get to the bottom of this so as to stop making a mockery of his forum. Yet both are only willing to do so, if they get paid. Something scammy about that right there!

I always knew DarkOz is dumb as rocks. But Wtf??
He's donating money to MDog and Wiz??...lmao

What are the conditions for this? I don't want to wade thru all the pathetic crap over there to find out.

[MisterV]

Thanks for posting those time stamps, KJ: for me that is the final nail on that imposter's coffin, so to speak.

When I was working I NEVER posted on gambling forums from my office; I might come home for lunch (lived close by) and post but I was professional enough to compartmentalize work from recreation.

Plus I was busy and didn't want to fuck around with this stuff while earning my daily bread.

Oh, and the idea that he'd be able to stay in Las Vegas months at a time and not work is just beyond hysterically funny.

The fact that DawgShit posts as claimed establishes to me that he's a fraud: were he in fact a successful, wealthy as hell newly minted lawyer as he claims he'd be in his office working for himself and / or for his firm, not participating in his ongoing attempts to sully and essentially bring down WoV.

Gotta give that troll points for persistence, if nothing else.

[Ivyleaguegrad]

Thanks for posting those time stamps, KJ: for me that is the final nail on that imposter's coffin, so to speak.

When I was working I NEVER posted on gambling forums from my office; I might come home for lunch (lived close by) and post but I was professional enough to compartmentalize work from recreation.

Plus I was busy and didn't want to fuck around with this stuff while earning my daily bread.

Oh, and the idea that he'd be able to stay in Las Vegas months at a time and not work is just beyond hysterically funny.

The fact that DawgShit posts as claimed establishes to me that he's a fraud: were he in fact a successful, wealthy as hell newly minted lawyer as he claims he'd be in his office working for himself and / or for his firm, not participating in his ongoing attempts to sully and essentially bring down WoV.

Gotta give that troll points for persistence, if nothing else.

That is why I withdrew, being suspended? Who cares. The conditions were such that it could have been manipulated. If there was a play by play for each hand then there is a record. Otherwise does anyone think wizard would spot 1k extra chip? Commission wrong? No way. Just add up the bets and do the math yourself. Dawg could have signed off on the results and boom, you have a real record. Not only that , look at what he posted today, that he Isn’t going to bite the hand that feeds him? Are you serious? I made that offer because I figured it was a trivial amount for him. Now I’m starting to think he either had someone backing him, or the like. Darkoz even asked for an exact number win or lose and dawg swatted at him. If you notice he keeps repeating that the wizard will record how he sees fit. Hogwash. If anyone cares enough to go on truth passage you will see how dawg explains how he wins with patterns in his own words. If that’s the case, which is isn’t , then just post the record with the pattern. Just like the casino does on the virtual scoreboard. Not only to they give you pen and paper. They list the patterns in 3-5 ways or more depending on the type of board.

This is why I kept pushing for an exact bet list. The pm I sent meant nothing . I said I was willing to post to mimic him just to show it doesn’t work.

[BoSox]

Thanks for posting those time stamps, KJ: for me that is the final nail on that imposter's coffin, so to speak.

Gotta give that troll points for persistence, if nothing else.

Which of the two are you talking about? It seems that the obsessions run in both directions.

[MisterV]

LOL

I was referring to the rabid chihuahua, not the poodle.

[monet]

Holy fuck all is Richard Turner talented (Ricky Jay was too - look up Renaissance Man in the dictionary and you'll see his picture in the margin next to the definition of the term). Yes another great example you provided of you wouldn't believe it unless you saw it. Final verdict on dice control - I would not dismiss the possibility after seeing how talented some people are.

No doubt.
Richard Turner is currently a 6th degree Black Belt I believe.
He also has done many other things other than manipulate cards.
Pretty close to Super Human or at least Above Average.
Not sure about his Mob Stories as he could be embellishing.
Not sure about his wholesome image as he seems to be able to always refuse/defeat temptation.
He did have a dark period with drugs and what so it isn't impossible to believe that he just saw the light and never turned back.
Some rare individuals do have that strength.

About manipulating dice...
that is a proven fact.
A couple of the problems are how often can it be replicated inside a Casino Situation and how long before you get barred?
I think the major issue is the idea that some Average Joe can learn how to do it in a short period of time and be able to change the frequency of a 7 showing up.
That is the whole point to the so called talent.
The people selling books, videos and boot camps are obviously scamming.
Notice the difference between them and the David Blaine Story.
They say you can learn it for a certain dollar amount and a short period of time.

The David Blaine Story is more realistic.
15 hours a day throwing dice for 10 years.
This is what something like that would require IMO.
And the idea of infiltrating the other side of the fence to learn what they concentrate on in the security aspect.
That has changed a lot in the last 10 to 20 years.
Some Casinos have serious technology.
Other Casinos still don't have many of the cameras hooked up.
Pick your battles as usual.

Always fun to have these conversations hidden inside of all this jibber jabber.
Thanks for taking the time to respond tableplay.

[monet]

One thing is clear. None of you guys have any friends in real life.

I'm guilty of this.
I can teach you all how to lose friends and alienate people.
How many people have real or true friends though?
If you have one friend that would go through thick and thin and die for you that would be a true friend.
That's very Fucking Rare.
Ironically, that is what a real friend is.
There is no greater love than laying down your life for a friend.
Not even sure my wife would do this for me or vice versa.
My mind is more focused on this though.
10 years ago, no chance in Hell I would but these days I am certainly closer to save, protect or die for her.
I have been getting better for the last 37 years but it has been a very slow process.
The problem is that I'm starting to get too old for these types of things to matter.
You certainly want to start out in your youth with these sort of things ingrained into you.

Most of you think you have friends but in reality you have acquaintances that would turn their back on you in a moments notice.
It's the whole point of room 101 and 1984.
"Do it to Julia! Do it to Julia! Not me! Julia! I don't care what you do to her. Tear her face off, strip her to the bones. Not me! Julia!

[Mission146]

Were MuffdivingDawg to limit his discussion to a betting system that would be fine, but he doesn't.

He insults our intelligence by claiming he never loses.

He gives himself props by posting pictures of money, chips, and possibly fake Rolex watches.

He regales the board with unlikely / essentially impossible tales of tipping, winning and being comped: and the owners of the site not only allow it, they seem to lap it up, much as a cat will eat its own vomit (I saw my cat vomit a grasshopper it had eaten, then eat it again a day later, after it had dried out).

Weird scenes inside the gold mine ...

Again, I tend to doubt that the owners of the site pay any specific attention to his threads. As far as the content of his posts is concerned, I can't help but notice you can't cite any specific rule that they might be breaking. Even if the owners didn't want him there, then it would be a ban just because of the situation being a nuisance. You've got half of the people who DO bitch about him staying, you'll have the other half bitching and claiming how unfair it is if he gets Nuked.

The ownership (meaning, above Wizard) does the smartest thing that they could do, from what I can tell, they don't even get involved on this one. These guys are very kind people, (in my experience) but they're also very professional and are focused on SEO. Given the focus on SEO...yeah, I'm sure they'll take the page views...but you'll notice that politics is no longer permitted there. I don't know if that was a decision made by Wizard or the owners, but the point is, if they ONLY cared about traffic, then they wouldn't have got rid of the politics threads.

You guys must all be Millennials considering how much you all seem to want MDawg cancelled. That's not to say I don't if something is proven, but you don't censor people on conjecture. It's a pretty simple principle that most people are willing to apply, easily enough, when it comes to keeping something/someone they do like.

[monet]

Not only was the whole thing a massive overreaction on your part, but now you also look like an asshole. Good on you for apologizing, though. Next time make sure your ducks are all in a row; you'll be lucky if none of the ne'er do wells floating around these forums (no names) don't direct Wizard to your posts here. Again, I would never do that, but I'd get my ass to editing if I were you.

The only bullshit call was letting you back on WoV, well, and you getting Nuked to begin with, I suppose. In the Forum sense, you have become ridiculously volatile. You were great when you were getting the respect that comes from being one of the more prolific posters, but as soon as things didn't go your way, you lost it. I'm just relieved that you have more discipline than that (at least, it seems) in your life outside of the Forums as a card counter---or you would be fucked.

Anyway, you just throw your toys around like a petulant six-year old when you don't get your way about something. I don't mean to harp on this---and I'll only offer additional responses on this line if you respond to this post---but you've really got to start trying to get more information and other perspectives on things before coming to your assumptions and losing your shit.

Do you merely apologize for what you said, or do you now no longer mean some of it? Is there some of it you didn't mean to begin with?

Anyway, if you want to regain the respect you once had at WoV, then may I suggest become one of the most prolific posters again? Let's get some new Blackjack threads out of you. Let's get some threads about the weirdest things people have seen while AP'ing. Threads about the most unusual AP's we have known (without naming them) or the strangest things that we have seen in casinos.

Whether you like it or not, MDawg's thread is actually a good thread to the extent that it generates traffic and conversation. The detractors add to the traffic and conversation. I don't think that there's anything nefarious going on when it comes to ownership wanting to keep MDawg around---do you know HOW MANY sites they run with a fairly small team? I tend to think they'd be too busy to care about WoV very much. WoO is the money driver. I can't imagine ownership cares whether MDawg stays or goes and, for all I know, ownership hasn't even ever looked at that thread.

Anyway, if you want MDawg's thread buried, then do it by creating better and more interesting threads. That's all. You guys want to shut him down and then what will be going on at WoV, more cooking threads?

Oh, you're breaking down individual members.
Do Me Next!
Do Me Next!
Wait a second... that sounds pretty Fucking Gay.
Don't do me, don't do me.

[mcap]

One thing is clear. None of you guys have any friends in real life.

You’re just jealous I’ve been chatting with babes online all day.