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Thread: Harley Davidson Slot - Spin Bank

  1. #21
    I just set my mega meter using a frequency of 196 and called it a day. All my mega data was so far off the par sheet, and I don't chase them anyway, so I thought it best to just reduce the meter to what is known... Errors would be in my favor anyway...

    I'm tempted to gather more data on the bonus / bonus, mini, and maxi frequency... Those numbers get used a lot more, at least by me.

  2. #22
    This is Barney,

    I used LIDs suppercomputer to see what it show for advantageoous number to play of banked games and it had great difficulty but showed:
    1. Mini banked games about 48
    2. Maxi banked games about 112
    3. Mega banked games about 145

    I can't stand by all of these numbers because data input into it may be flawed because goat ate some of my notes before inputing into suppercomputer.



    Thank you very much

  3. #23
    What is LIDs suppercomputer?

  4. #24
    A computer program that is a dinner planner for guys holding an ounce of weed.

    Gotta address those damned munchies.
    What, Me Worry?

  5. #25
    A lot of people on twitter have followed my line on the harley's. I have the game broke down my own way but it's been effective. I'm making some pretty good money on the harley's and like to hang around wherever they have $4 max harley's. Preferably in a spot where there are a cluster of casinos that have them. A few stats for now:

    Value of the freespins. Based on a 2000 spin sample space. The reels are different for the freespins and even says so on the machine.

    One mini freespin is worth 1.37 units.
    One maxi freespin is worth 2.6 units.
    One mega freespin is worth 2.3 units.

    That's right. A maxi freespin is worth more than a mega freespin. As one guy put it, mega 3X = mega deception.
    Last edited by mickeycrimm; 08-07-2018 at 08:03 AM.
    "More importantly, mickey thought 8-4 was two games over .500. Argued about it. C'mon, man. Nothing can top that for math expertise. If GWAE ever has you on again, you can be sure I'll be calling in with that gem.'Nuff said." REDIETZ

  6. #26
    Originally Posted by Barney View Post
    This is Barney,

    I used LIDs suppercomputer to see what it show for advantageoous number to play of banked games and it had great difficulty but showed:
    1. Mini banked games about 48
    2. Maxi banked games about 112
    3. Mega banked games about 145

    I can't stand by all of these numbers because data input into it may be flawed because goat ate some of my notes before inputing into suppercomputer.



    Thank you very much
    I think this pretty much concludes that Barney is not Rob Singer. No way in hell would Rob Singer have any harley stats. BTW, Barney, your numbers on the mini and maxi are slightly off and the maxi is way off.
    "More importantly, mickey thought 8-4 was two games over .500. Argued about it. C'mon, man. Nothing can top that for math expertise. If GWAE ever has you on again, you can be sure I'll be calling in with that gem.'Nuff said." REDIETZ

  7. #27
    10,000 spins in the main game showed a 64.2% return.
    "More importantly, mickey thought 8-4 was two games over .500. Argued about it. C'mon, man. Nothing can top that for math expertise. If GWAE ever has you on again, you can be sure I'll be calling in with that gem.'Nuff said." REDIETZ

  8. #28
    This is Barney,

    A 64% returns. No wonders why it beat the shits out of me when doing the research thing!


    Thank you very much

  9. #29
    Nobody is playing Harleys for the base game. That's for sure.

  10. #30
    Okay, so far, through empirical evidence Bonus/Bonus lands on the 1st and 3rd reels every 13 spins.
    Through empirical evidence the mini symbol lands on the 5th reel every 17 spins, maxi 52, mega 92.
    Through empirical evidence the base game has a 64.2% return.
    Through empirical evidence a mini freespin is worth 1.37 units, maxi 2.6, mega 2.3.
    Through the par sheet numbers you hit Bonus/Bonus/Mini every 220 spins, Bonus/Bonus/Maxi every 675 spins, Bonus/Bonus/Mega every 2553 spins.

    Okay, now we go to work on the meter rates. The mini symbol lands every 17 spins. That means 1.37 units is going into the meter every 17 spins, except when you catch Bonus/Bonus/Mini. In that case you get the free games but it doesn't add one more spin to the mini free games. It works the same way with Maxi and Mega.

    Every 13 times you catch the Mini symbol on the 5th reel you will catch Bonus/Bonus with it. That means you will put an average of 12 freespins into the mini meter per 220 games.

    12 X 1.37 = 16.44
    16.44/220 = 7.47%
    And that is our meter rate for the mini.

    Using the same formula maxi meter rate is 4.6%, mega meter rate is 2.4%

    The mini freespins reset to 7. So they are worth:

    7 X 1.37 = 9.59
    9.59/220 = 4.36%

    Maxi freespins reset to 8 games. Using the same formula the 8 games are worth 3.08%.
    The mega resets to 10 games. Using the same formula the 10 free games are worth 0.9%

    So now we add everything up.

    Base Game = 64.2%
    Mini meter rate = 7.47%
    7 spins at reset = 4.36%
    Maxi meter rate = 4.6%
    8 freespins at reset = 3.08%
    Mega meter rate =2.4%
    10 freespins at reset = 0.9%

    Total = 87.01%

    There is only guessing as to what the $10,000 Wheel Jackpot is worth percentagewise. Some banks are progressive with either a .5% or 1% meter. My guess is the 10K reset money represents no more than 1%. So we have a game that is around 89% at best. This is about appropriate for a revenue shared game. Another thing we don't know is does a 40 cent bettor have the same chance at the Wheel Jackpot as a $4 bettor.

    I just use the 87.01% figure for calculating plays which I will get into in the next post.
    "More importantly, mickey thought 8-4 was two games over .500. Argued about it. C'mon, man. Nothing can top that for math expertise. If GWAE ever has you on again, you can be sure I'll be calling in with that gem.'Nuff said." REDIETZ

  11. #31
    Alan, you've seen some of us AP's throw around the term "vulturable." Harley Davidsons are a vulturable game. At reset the meters will show:

    Mega 10
    Maxi 8
    Mini 7

    But some ploppies get on this game, run the numbers up, then get up and walk off. That's where the "vulturing" comes in for AP's. A vulture flies around looking for something to eat. An AP, when he is in a casino, will walk by a harley bank and check the numbers looking for something to eat (play at an advantage), just like a vulture. When I see something like what is in the pic below I grab a seat.
    Attached Images Attached Images  
    "More importantly, mickey thought 8-4 was two games over .500. Argued about it. C'mon, man. Nothing can top that for math expertise. If GWAE ever has you on again, you can be sure I'll be calling in with that gem.'Nuff said." REDIETZ

  12. #32
    Finding this one was fun. It was even more fun when the Maxi hit in about 8 spins.

    Name:  20180527_103524.jpg
Views: 1441
Size:  1.11 MB

  13. #33
    Originally Posted by Prozema View Post
    Finding this one was fun. It was even more fun when the Maxi hit in about 8 spins.

    Name:  20180527_103524.jpg
Views: 1441
Size:  1.11 MB
    Yeah, I'd like to play about 10 of those a day. LOL!
    "More importantly, mickey thought 8-4 was two games over .500. Argued about it. C'mon, man. Nothing can top that for math expertise. If GWAE ever has you on again, you can be sure I'll be calling in with that gem.'Nuff said." REDIETZ

  14. #34
    I just checked my spreadsheet vs the MC numbers and the only place we don't match is the Mega.

    I used the same Mega hit frequency (1 in 2553) and derived the appearance of the mega symbol (every 196 spins).

    This makes the mega meter worth 1.1% which doesn't matter much and errors in my favor when I decide to play.

  15. #35
    Originally Posted by Prozema View Post
    I just checked my spreadsheet vs the MC numbers and the only place we don't match is the Mega.



    I used the same Mega hit frequency (1 in 2553) and derived the appearance of the mega symbol (every 196 spins).
    Maybe you are both right, and the HDs you guys have encountered have had their Megas configured differently by slot management.

  16. #36
    I don't think so. MC observed the frequency of the mega symbol. I calculated it. That's why we are different.

  17. #37
    Originally Posted by Prozema View Post
    I don't think so. MC observed the frequency of the mega symbol. I calculated it. That's why we are different.
    It would be interesting to know your observed Mega frequency (and to compare it to the derivation you made along with comparing it to Mickey's observed Mega frequency).

  18. #38
    My mega data was way off... But I never bothered to resolve the difference because I don't chase megas at any number. I just don't have that kind of time. If you decide to chase a mega I would recommend budgeting at least 3 hours and not be surprised if it took 9 or 10...

  19. #39
    Originally Posted by Prozema View Post
    My mega data was way off... But I never bothered to resolve the difference because I don't chase megas at any number. I just don't have that kind of time. If you decide to chase a mega I would recommend budgeting at least 3 hours and not be surprised if it took 9 or 10...
    I will not be chasing this jackpot. My interest is from a configuration standpoint - i.e. gaining some insight into game to game (casino to casino) variability.
    I only vulture HDs if the mini is "really really high".

  20. #40
    I tracked the mega symbol landing though 5000 spins and it landed every 89 spins. A twitter poster named counteverything put up a screenshot of a mega play where he made 5715 spins and the mega symbol landed 51 times for an average ofevery 112 spins. Another twitter poster did 2700 spins and averaged every 76 spins. Thats an overall average of 89 spins though 12,700 games. One thing is for sure the mega symbol lands about twice as much as the 196 figure. I adjusted my number to 92 to be on the conservative side.

    This is how I calculated the mega meter rate.

    2553/92 = 27.75 then subtract 1
    26.75 X 2.3 = 61.525
    61.525/2553 = 2.4%
    "More importantly, mickey thought 8-4 was two games over .500. Argued about it. C'mon, man. Nothing can top that for math expertise. If GWAE ever has you on again, you can be sure I'll be calling in with that gem.'Nuff said." REDIETZ

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