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Thread: October 1 shooting case gets dirty

  1. #1
    This is getting real dirty and is rapidly becoming a PR nightmare. Imagine the fallout from this MGM lawsuit against the shooting victims?

    https://www.reviewjournal.com/crime/...oting-victims/

  2. #2
    No shit but this forum would have us believe that the Casino is the upright, honest do gooders of society. This forum would have us believe that it's members are the good people of the world that do no wrong and have to expose all the frauds and evil bastards in the world. RS just posted that players colluding in poker should have no right to post in any forum. Now you see that even MGM will go as low to sue the victims so they can shop Judges in Federal Court instead of holding court inside the State. This city is full of wolves and if you are not a wolf you either need to get out or get eaten.

  3. #3
    Nothing "dirty" about it; strictly "business."

    It sounds to me like MGM is asking the court to enter a "declaratory judgment" that MGM has no liability.

    If successful it could save them / their insurer(s) a lot of money which would otherwise be spent defending against lawsuits and paying awards, if any.

    Declaratory judgments are not particularly unusual, nor is the filing in federal court odd or inappropriate; federal court is arguably a better venue than state court, given the numerous out of state victims and the amount in controversy.

    I do not know the answer however to the following: will the judge have the power to declare that they ARE liable, or only that there is enough evidence to submit the issue of liability to a jury at a future trial?
    Last edited by MisterV; 07-17-2018 at 07:59 AM.
    What, Me Worry?

  4. #4
    It may be strictly business but it sends a horrible message to the public.

    MGM now has to weigh the damage to its image against the cost of settling with shooting victims.

    If the insurance carrier went to federal court it would be different. But it's MGM... the new evil empire.

  5. #5
    Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson View Post
    If the insurance carrier went to federal court it would be different. But it's MGM... the new evil empire.
    I strongly suspect the decision to file was made by attorneys hired and paid for by MGM's insurer(S); lawsuits like this are not brought in the name of the insurance company, but in the name of the insured.
    What, Me Worry?

  6. #6
    Originally Posted by MisterV View Post
    Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson View Post
    If the insurance carrier went to federal court it would be different. But it's MGM... the new evil empire.
    I strongly suspect the decision to file was made by attorneys hired and paid for by MGM's insurer(S); lawsuits like this are not brought in the name of the insurance company, but in the name of the insured.
    That's too bad for the name MGM.

  7. #7
    Really sucks for MGM to get caught in the middle of this. I don't see any way how they can be held responsible for what happened, barring some crazy unknown information (like if they knew or suspected Paddock was going to go on a rampage....but, come on). On what basis are the victims and the victims' families claiming MGM is liable?
    #FreeTyde

  8. #8
    MGM will get what it deserves, esp. since all they've cared about since Oct. 1st has been "how we gonna get out of this pickle without losing our shirts and jobs!?"

    There was an agent shot six minutes BEFORE Paddock opened fire on the concert-goers. That's going to be their downfall. The MGM incompetents were afraid to confront the shooter. It is a cowardly bunch to say the least. And to sue the victims just to try and get a more "favorable" federal judge? Good luck with that, you spineless idiots.

  9. #9
    Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson View Post
    This is getting real dirty and is rapidly becoming a PR nightmare. Imagine the fallout from this MGM lawsuit against the shooting victims?

    https://www.reviewjournal.com/crime/...oting-victims/
    There is this feeling that if bad things happen to people, then someone must pay.

    If you trip over your own 2 feet on my driveway and break yoyur leg....I have no liability as long as my driveway has no hazards. You woyuld have to prove that I did something to cause your broken leg.

    The same with the hotels. Wa their standard of security any less than any hotels in the area? Did something slip by them that should have been caught?

    What if one by one 10 men walk into walmart over a period of an hour and then once all are in the building, blow themselves up. Is walmart liable.? I doubt it. Or what if little by little a single man over a period of a few days plants bombs all over the walmart....under binds of cloothigs, in the back corner of shelves behind merchandise.....and then remotely ignites them all at once....and 40 people die. Is walmart on the hook for this...I doubt it......although the general public will think that someone has to pay for the misfortune of others.

  10. #10
    Originally Posted by Rob.Singer View Post
    There was an agent shot six minutes BEFORE Paddock opened fire on the concert-goers. That's going to be their downfall.
    Really?!

    Not according the this timeline:

    http://www.latimes.com/nation/la-na-...119-story.html

    Please explain the basis for your claim.
    What, Me Worry?

  11. #11
    The optics of this are really bad.

    In reality, the "lawsuit" against the 1,000+ victims is just a technicality in order to prevent MGM's liability here. It does not seek any money from the victims.

    Still, MGM has to understand how bad this looks. There had to be a better way which would come off as more defensive than offensive.
    Check out my poker forum, and weekly internet radio show at http://pokerfraudalert.com

  12. #12
    Originally Posted by Dan Druff View Post
    The optics of this are really bad.

    In reality, the "lawsuit" against the 1,000+ victims is just a technicality in order to prevent MGM's liability here. It does not seek any money from the victims.

    Still, MGM has to understand how bad this looks. There had to be a better way which would come off as more defensive than offensive.
    I think it looks just fine, Keep in mind in this woeld we live in, juries findliability and hight payouts for the most fucked up things. I was on a jury like that and in my case all that was needed was i think 10 out of 12 jurors....so my vote was negated...it was a liability case as well. But my juty felt that someone was hurt and someone needed to pay.

    So if this case goes that way....its possible for the insurance company to just throw in the policy and not fight it..and just say....here is xxx dollars.....and if you are on the hook for more...it comes out of MGM.

    MGM could be looking at hundreds of millions of dollars to pay out above and beyond what insurance pays.

    So of course they will fight this with vigor. Especially since they feel they have a good case.

  13. #13
    the funny thingis,...this ties into the other thread about room checks.

    now that casinos have been put on notice.......I think they are now open to lawsuits should something like this occur because the room checks are such obvious ineffective window dressing that any court would see it as willfully ineffective from the beginning...and NOW they are accountable

  14. #14
    Originally Posted by MisterV View Post
    Originally Posted by Rob.Singer View Post
    There was an agent shot six minutes BEFORE Paddock opened fire on the concert-goers. That's going to be their downfall.
    Really?!

    Not according the this timeline:

    http://www.latimes.com/nation/la-na-...119-story.html

    Please explain the basis for your claim.
    It was just released today. I saw it on CNN.

  15. #15
    The early reports in 2017 showed the security guard, Campos, was shot before Paddock broke out the window and shot concert-goers; the link I provided, from the LA Times in early 2018, now show Campos being shot after Paddock broke out the window and started shooting outward.

    Conflicting reports; I assume the latter one is more accurate, i.e. that Campos was not shot six minutes before Paddock opened fire on the concert-goers.
    What, Me Worry?

  16. #16
    Do all of you still believe Paddock acted on his own?

  17. #17
    Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson View Post
    Do all of you still believe Paddock acted on his own?
    if there are cameras in the halls then that would be easy to figure out as far as soomeopne physically helping him bring the arms up to his room.

    as far as behind the scenes "planning" it......that is too unsubstantiated to even consider.

  18. #18
    There is more than just bringing the guns to the room. Was his attack self motivated? Was he supported by a group that helped to motivate and plan?

  19. #19

  20. #20
    Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson View Post
    There is more than just bringing the guns to the room. Was his attack self motivated? Was he supported by a group that helped to motivate and plan?
    do you plan to post as an ignorant person or does it jst happen.

    read my post. I addressed the possibility of someone or others helping him "plan".....so your fucking statementas if you are the only person who even thought of outside help is pathetic

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