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Thread: Golden Gate Players Cub gives me wrong person's card, and I unknowingly earned them offers on it

  1. #1
    Complete nightmare at the Golden Gate on the 4th of July in downtown Vegas.

    Had never been there before. Decided to get a card there and run some video poker. At the last second, before leaving the desk, I asked the woman to make me 2 more duplicate cards. She obliged, and handed me the two extra cards, making a total of 3.

    I ran VP for about 3 hours, losing $227 in the process. I was in for $300, and it was 9pm. I thought there would be fireworks downtown, so I cashed out my $73 ticket and went outside.

    Fail. There were no fireworks. I waited 25 minutes, and nothing. Idiots like me were standing there waiting, which made me especially think there would be fireworks. But there were none. Only thing close was a near-fight between a government-hating, homeless-looking, ranting weirdo and a middle-aged dude with a USA shirt on.

    At about 9:25, I went back into the Golden Gate to continue running the VP. I was shocked when the player screen said, "Hi Todd! You have 0 points!"

    I earned 2765 points, and I saw them count up. So I knew that something was wrong. I tried to pull the card and reinsert several times, but still 0 points. Then I thought it meant 0 points this session, but going through the menu I realized that, indeed, I had 0 total points. WTF???

    Then I thought to myself, "I wonder if perhaps one of these three cards isn't really mine, and they gave me someone else's card!"

    Indeed, that's what happened.

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    The above are the three cards I was given. Two were in my name, and ended with 792. The third was in the name of "Ariana Lopez", and ended with 793. I was unfortunate enough to grab the Ariana card to play with, obviously believing that all 3 were identical and mine. Notice that Ariana's card number is exactly one sequentially after mine.

    Since it was a new card, Ariana had to have established her card AFTER me. Presumably, Ariana must have gone to the other Players Club rep (there were two), an extra card printed for her must have been left in the machine, and the rep helping me must have accidentally grabbed that card instead of one of mine.

    I marched right over to the Players Club and asked them to help me. The same woman who made my cards was there.

    She had the nerve to deny it and blame me, claiming that she only gave me two cards, and I must have picked up Ariana's card somewhere in the casino! LOL!!!

    I asked her, "What are the chances that I would have accidentally picked up a card exactly one number higher than mine?"

    She wouldn't answer that.

    I also challenged her to check the camera, showing that she gave me three cards, and not two. She wouldn't agree to do that, either, but oddly kept blaming me.

    I then asked for a supervisor, who came down.

    I explained to the supervisor that I had two concerns:

    1) I wanted the points I earned, which were worth $27.65.

    2) The bigger concern: I wanted the offers I earned from my video poker play on a new card. These would be worth far more than $27.65. (For those who don't know, by "offers" I mean mailed weekly/monthly offers of freeplay, hotel rooms, and comp food.)

    At first the supervisor seemed helpful. She said that she would return the 2765 points to my card, and would also transfer over my play. However, she said that this "wasn't a priority" and that I would have to wait over 5 hours until 3am to see it done.

    When I asked why it wasn't a priority to fix a mistake THEY caused, she replied, "Well, you are a priority, I just have higher priority things to do right now."

    I found it hard to believe that she couldn't find time relatively soon to get this done. I threatened to never return if she didn't fix this, citing that I'm a Seven Stars member at Caesars, as well as hold other premium cards at other properties (which I showed).

    The supervisor responded, "We would hate to lose you as a customer, but that's up to you. I'm telling you I will get it done by 3am. If you don't like that and don't wish to return, that's your choice."

    When I brought up that they needed to make this a priority because it was their mistake, the supervisor also blamed me, stating that I probably picked up the card at the machine I was playing at! I told her to check the camera, and she would see that no females were anywhere near the machine I played for the entire time (which was true).

    I was very unhappy. I wanted closure on this. I wouldn't be back downtown for weeks, or perhaps longer, and wanted to know this was taken care of (especially the offer part). I had a feeling I was being bullshitted, and that in reality some (or all) of this wasn't going to be done . I especially had doubts that they could manually move the play over from Ariana to me.

    I asked for her manager, and was told to go over to the pits and ask for the casino manager, which I did.

    CONTINUED NEXT POST...
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  2. #2
    I found the casino manager at the pits.

    At first he seemed very logical and helpful.

    He immediately agreed that it was absurd for the Players Club to blame me for this situation.

    "Clearly they were the ones who gave you that other card, and it wasn't your fault. I don't know why they would try to say that you caused it, and I'm going to talk to them about that," he said.

    He further agreed that the "non-priority" thing was also absurd. He agreed that it should be taken care of immediately.

    All right! Finally I was talking to someone with some sense!

    "Let me look into this for about 5 minutes, and I'll get back to you," he said.

    Before he left, I reiterated that the most important thing to me was that I got the offers I earned from my play, and that the second-most important was to get the $27.65 in points I earned. He said he understood.

    I waited for about 15 minutes, and he returned.

    "Okay, so good news for you," he said.

    "I got the process started to transfer the $27.65 in points. It will take up to an hour, but they will definitely be there by then. Also, for all your trouble, I also had them put $30 in freeplay on your account."

    Sweet!

    But wait?

    What about the offers? Did he forget that the offers were my main concern?

    That's when it all broke down.

    "As I said, I put all your points back on your card, plus I gave you $30. So I think you've been taken care of," he replied when I asked about the offers.

    "Yes, I understand and I appreciate that. But the offers are what's most important to me. I want the offers I earned through my play," I answered.

    "I know that, and for that I called my boss, who is off today with her family for the 4th of July. I interrupted her family time because you're an important customer. She said she will call you tomorrow about it."

    "Okay, that's fine," I said back. "So she will get that play transferred over so I get the right offers?"

    "Well, actually we can't do that," he replied. "It's against Gaming regulations to transfer play from one card to another."

    "Oh, I'm not saying to take it away from the other card. I'm fine if Ariana Lopez gets offers, too. That's between you and her. I just want to make sure I get those same offers," I explained.

    "Unfortunately, that's also illegal. We can't do that, either," he said.

    "Huh?? So if you can't transfer my play from her card to mine, and you can't copy over my play from her card, then how is it possible to fix this?"

    "Again, you need to talk to my boss tomorrow, and she will take care of it," he repeated.

    "I understand that. But you just told me that the only two possible solutions are illegal," I pointed out.

    "I didn't say that. You said it, not me", was his bizarre response.

    "No, YOU just said it!", I replied. "You said that my play can't be transferred or copied, and unless I'm missing something, those are the only two ways I can get credit for this play!"

    "Sir, you're the one saying that," he reiterated.

    "But if those two things are illegal, then how could they possibly get my play onto my card? It sounds like there's no legal way to do it," I responded.

    "Again, sir, you're the one saying that, not me."




    I felt like tearing my hair out.

    I tried to go at this a different way.

    "Okay, let's take a hypothetical where John Smith gets a new card and is given the wrong card and plays on it, how would you be able to transfer over his play?", I asked, hoping that he could give me an answer if I left myself out of the story (thus avoiding the impression he was making promises).

    "I don't deal in hypotheticals," he coldly answered.

    UGGGGGGGGGGGGGGH!!!!!!

    I finally gave up. I confirmed with him that his boss would be calling me the next day (July 5), and he promised me she would. He even verified my phone number, and pointed out again that he "interrupted her with her family" because this was so important, and thus she would definitely be calling me once she got back in the following day.

    I walked over to the cashout machine to turn my $73 ticket into cash.

    My pocket had two papers in it, but neither were the ticket.

    In all the commotion and hubbub with pulling cards out of my pocket, the ticket fell somewhere, and got lost. Someone at the Golden Gate had a nice find that evening.

    Damnit.

    TO BE CONTINUED NEXT POST...
    Check out my poker forum, and weekly internet radio show at http://pokerfraudalert.com

  3. #3
    I awaited my call on July 5th.

    Surely if I was important enough to interrupt the manager with her family on the 4th, I was important enough to get a call back when she came to work on the 5th, right?

    Uhhhhhhhhhhhhhh......... that would be a negative.

    I waited five days, and on July 10, I had to go back downtown for something unrelated, so I stopped by the Golden Gate.

    I told the story to the acting manager at the pits (a woman who was nice, but didn't have much power), who then referred me to a host. The host was semi-helpful, but again seemed too dismissive of the offers thing. Like the night casino manager described in the previous post, she was too fixated on the fact that I was given my points back, and was trying to avoid discussion of the offers.

    Finally, I hammered it home that the offers were of the most concern, and she told me she would look into it and get back to me.

    A short time later, I got a call from the "head of player development". I told him the whole story.

    He acknowledged that there were "multiple failures here on our part", including handing me the wrong card, blaming me for it, not being clear about whether or not they would fix my offers, and the failure to call me back.

    He said he would look into it further and call me back in 30 minutes.

    He called back as promised, and stated the following:

    1) He believes all of my story, and in fact some of the notes on the account seem to back up both what happened and the poor way it was handled.

    2) It is indeed a Gaming violation to manually insert slot play into the rating system. He insisted that Gaming requires ratings on all machines to be automatic with no human intervention. I don't know if that's true, but everyone there was insisting that. They can manually rate table games, but not machines. So apparently it's illegal to manually place coin-in ratings onto my players club account (and also illegal to REMOVE it from Ariana's account!)

    3) In order to fix this, he said he would give me a "courtesy rating" on my account, which would be similar to a table rating, but without directly indicating any kind of table play. He insisted that this "courtesy rating" would fix the offer situation, and that I would get offers "as good or better than" I would have gotten if this mess had never occurred. This was important to me, and in fact I told him that there was a friend playing on the machine next to me, also with a new card, and that we would compare offers after this. He insisted that I should get better offers than the friend, who ran similar coin-in to me.


    So that's it.

    He said I'll start seeing offers for September, presumably arriving next month.

    We shall see.
    Check out my poker forum, and weekly internet radio show at http://pokerfraudalert.com

  4. #4
    How the hell are you always getting into these crazy situations? Damn.

    I wouldn't hold my breath about the offers thing. That sounds like some scandalous shit right there. They (almost always) just say whatever you want to hear. Chances are you'll get a shit offer, your friend will get a better offer, you'll complain (rightfully so), they'll say he played differently or some other metric used to generate offers than you did, you'll say "No, we did the same thing", they'll say you did something different, you'll ask what the difference is, and they won't tell you what it was because offers are generated because that's secret marketing information // "the computer/formula generates offers, we don't manually do it so I can't help you there".

    Hoping for the best, but I wouldn't be expecting it. =\
    #FreeTyde

  5. #5
    Makes you wonder if the Lopez chick is a friend or relative of the boothling.

    On a side note, I got a mailer from GG a few days ago for 6 free nights with 100 in free bets and some food offers. How I earned this, I have no idea. I've never played there except for a few (less than 5) of the free bets/match play coupons and slot free play from the ACG or LVA book. Not that I'll use the offers, but now I better check the name!

  6. #6
    Originally Posted by RS__ View Post
    How the hell are you always getting into these crazy situations? Damn.
    Exactly my thought. Have you ever had a trip to Vegas that went smoothly?

    Maybe it's just a habit that I picked up years ago but whenever I get a card or a voucher or any paperwork from a casino or a bank or the DMV I check to be sure it's mine. Yes that includes player cards.

    Cash out tickets either get cashed out immediately or go into my wallet.

    A host has the power to give you any offer and you should be sure the host gets you what you expect.

    A couple years ago my TR number was recorded as placing a small bet at Roulette at Caesars. There was no way to remove it and it killed my Theo and my offers for a year. And I wasn't even in Vegas when my TR number was recorded at the roulette game.

  7. #7
    This could become REALLY rotten like 15 day old rotten fish if Ariana is a scumbag who uses offers she knows she didn't earn. :/ There are a lot of people who will cash in offers they know they didn't pay for. It's horrible that the Player's Club gave you someone else's Player's Club card and didn't offer to check the camera. Shame on them! And they had the audacity to blame you for their mistake! What scumbags! Pizza Hut had a Motto a long time ago saying something like,"Never ever blame customers. You will not win!" That PC should adapt that Motto!

  8. #8
    I wish I'd only had that problem! I'd just hit 4 A's/kicker for $500 and pocketed it in my wallet for $700+. Instead of leaving, I decided to play "just one more $100" before I left. Ever done that, Alan? After losing $40, I decided best to run home. Reached for wallet to pocket $60- GONE! Went back to VP machine - surprised to see wallet- only all hundies were gone. Took them two hours to find someone to check cameras
    , then was told no one was seen near machine!

  9. #9
    I'd have offered you $100 in free play and a comp meal at their top restaurant to end this GG-caused mess. Now you're out of sight/out of mind....which is exactly where they want you to stay. But if you're not happy with the marketing-generated offers, you'll be back on their case. Not good management. Keep pressing and you'll get equal to or more than you want/deserve. Is it worth it though, time wise and aggravation wise?

  10. #10
    Originally Posted by jbjb View Post
    Makes you wonder if the Lopez chick is a friend or relative of the boothling.

    On a side note, I got a mailer from GG a few days ago for 6 free nights with 100 in free bets and some food offers. How I earned this, I have no idea. I've never played there except for a few (less than 5) of the free bets/match play coupons and slot free play from the ACG or LVA book. Not that I'll use the offers, but now I better check the name!
    I would have bet they wouldn't call him back after the original go-round. It's good they eventually made things right, but I have to say, I would be more annoyed at the lost voucher than anything else. I lost one voucher in my life -- for $80 -- and it annoyed the living hell out of me.

    Anyway, my post is to thank jbjb for the GG offer information, because I was considering using the ACG coupons end of the month, and now I figure I'll give them a shot since I'll be downtown anyway.

    I miss the GG piano bar and $1 shrimp cocktails. They were classic.

  11. #11
    Has anyone ever really managed to get a casino to show them the tapes? I once subpoenaed them and they still wouldn't produce them. Has anyone really ever seen the tapes?

  12. #12
    Originally Posted by Tasha View Post
    This could become REALLY rotten like 15 day old rotten fish if Ariana is a scumbag who uses offers she knows she didn't earn. :/ There are a lot of people who will cash in offers they know they didn't pay for. It's horrible that the Player's Club gave you someone else's Player's Club card and didn't offer to check the camera. Shame on them! And they had the audacity to blame you for their mistake! What scumbags! Pizza Hut had a Motto a long time ago saying something like,"Never ever blame customers. You will not win!" That PC should adapt that Motto!
    Wait what? Of course Ariana will cash the offers she receives and it does not make her a scumbag. She will have no idea what occurred. Her reaction will likely be that GG is very generous with their offers. Future play and offer amounts will only confuse her even more.

    While clearly the error was GG's, Todd has some responsibility here too. A player is suppose to check his card(s), when handled to him and when playing.


    Keep us posted, Todd. But I would be willing to bet your September offers are dwarfed by your friend who played similar coin-in. Although there are extenuating circumstances with that too. Is your friend female? Asian? At many casinos offers for the same exact coin-in can vary according to sex, nationality and zip code. I know....sounds like it should be illegal, but it is fact.

  13. #13
    Is there a camera at the players club? There might be a general camera in case of violence but a camera on the boothlings? I think that's a long shot to begin with.

    Regnis I know that casino personnel view the tapes bit I don't know if the rest of us can. When a Fire Bet chip was knocked off its position the pit boss at The Rio had security check the tapes to verify the bet was made and to see how it got lost. At issue was $5,000 because the shooter made all six.

  14. #14
    Originally Posted by regnis View Post
    Has anyone ever really managed to get a casino to show them the tapes? I once subpoenaed them and they still wouldn't produce them. Has anyone really ever seen the tapes?
    I have witnessed them show another player the "tape" over a discrepancy. It was shown to him right there two steps away from the table on a tablet computer.

  15. #15
    Originally Posted by slingshot View Post
    I wish I'd only had that problem! I'd just hit 4 A's/kicker for $500 and pocketed it in my wallet for $700+. Instead of leaving, I decided to play "just one more $100" before I left. Ever done that, Alan? After losing $40, I decided best to run home. Reached for wallet to pocket $60- GONE! Went back to VP machine - surprised to see wallet- only all hundies were gone. Took them two hours to find someone to check cameras
    , then was told no one was seen near machine!
    I was playing $1 9/6 JoB Spin Poker ($45 max bet) one night and on one of the lines I pulled a club royal for $4000. The attendant paid me and said to me "hope to be back later." About and hour later I held AKJT in clubs and low and behold, up jumped the Q of clubs and two other cards for THREE ROYALS and a $12,000 hit! Yeah, quitting to come back later or staying makes no difference!! But that's for another thread. Let's not taint this one with nonsense.

  16. #16
    Originally Posted by kewlJ View Post
    Originally Posted by regnis View Post
    Has anyone ever really managed to get a casino to show them the tapes? I once subpoenaed them and they still wouldn't produce them. Has anyone really ever seen the tapes?
    I have witnessed them show another player the "tape" over a discrepancy. It was shown to him right there two steps away from the table on a tablet computer.
    I'm surprised Kewl. I had a craps game stopped for at least a half hour, probably longer,the gaming commission involved, and they could have looked at the video (I realize old guys like me still call it "tape") and over-ruled the 7-out call at a nominal cost. They lost more by having the game stopped for that long and all the players leaving, and all they had to do was show the video. I would assume that they would have wanted to save the video as when the stick erroneously called 7-out on a spinning die, I grabbed his stick as he went to sweep the dice away and it settled on 10.

    When I filed a complaint with the gaming commission and subpoenaed the tape, they refused to provide them. We ultimately settled so I didn't have to pursue the production of the video. It made me wonder if they really had any video.

  17. #17
    Originally Posted by jbjb View Post
    Originally Posted by slingshot View Post
    I wish I'd only had that problem! I'd just hit 4 A's/kicker for $500 and pocketed it in my wallet for $700+. Instead of leaving, I decided to play "just one more $100" before I left. Ever done that, Alan? After losing $40, I decided best to run home. Reached for wallet to pocket $60- GONE! Went back to VP machine - surprised to see wallet- only all hundies were gone. Took them two hours to find someone to check cameras
    , then was told no one was seen near machine!
    I was playing $1 9/6 JoB Spin Poker ($45 max bet) one night and on one of the lines I pulled a club royal for $4000. The attendant paid me and said to me "hope to be back later." About and hour later I held AKJT in clubs and low and behold, up jumped the Q of clubs and two other cards for THREE ROYALS and a $12,000 hit! Yeah, quitting to come back later or staying makes no difference!! But that's for another thread. Let's not taint this one with nonsense.
    You used the best system that I know of---hit the button at the right time. Nice going.

  18. #18
    Originally Posted by regnis View Post
    Has anyone ever really managed to get a casino to show them the tapes? I once subpoenaed them and they still wouldn't produce them. Has anyone really ever seen the tapes?
    To be honest, they didn't seem concerned and even the person responsible for the cameras,(according to them) was off that day. Unfortunately, the bottom line is I should have been careful- or even better- gone home after the hit!

  19. #19
    Originally Posted by jbjb View Post
    Originally Posted by slingshot View Post
    I wish I'd only had that problem! I'd just hit 4 A's/kicker for $500 and pocketed it in my wallet for $700+. Instead of leaving, I decided to play "just one more $100" before I left. Ever done that, Alan? After losing $40, I decided best to run home. Reached for wallet to pocket $60- GONE! Went back to VP machine - surprised to see wallet- only all hundies were gone. Took them two hours to find someone to check cameras
    , then was told no one was seen near machine!
    I was playing $1 9/6 JoB Spin Poker ($45 max bet) one night and on one of the lines I pulled a club royal for $4000. The attendant paid me and said to me "hope to be back later." About and hour later I held AKJT in clubs and low and behold, up jumped the Q of clubs and two other cards for THREE ROYALS and a $12,000 hit! Yeah, quitting to come back later or staying makes no difference!! But that's for another thread. Let's not taint this one with nonsense.
    I just realized you were referring to my play. I tried that all this year and if I had left after winning,I would be +$4,000. Probably more, but that was the most I could remember.

  20. #20
    Regnis are you saying a 7 out call was made while a die was still spinning?

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