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Thread: About tournaments

  1. #1
    In another thread about sports picks mickeycrimm pointed out that forum member redietz did pretty well in one sports picking tournament and Rob in his usual acerbic style called tournament winners chumps, or something to that effect.

    Dan asked us to create separate threads instead of polluting existing ones, so that's what I'm doing here.

    First, give credit to redietz for winning or finishing high in tournaments. Second there's no need to belittle anyone over tournament results.

    Tournament play is not necessarily real play because tournaments have rules and conditions that might not be the same in the "real world." I think we all know that.

    Blackjack, slot, video poker, craps tournaments all have special conditions that make their play different than elsewhere on the casino floor.

    My best example is about a craps tournament at Red Rock. I wasn't in it but I met the winner about three months later when he returned to the casino. I found out he was the winner because he had several thousand dollars in promo chips at the craps table.

    Winning that tournament was not because he was some great player or shooter. The way he told the story he won because he made some huge lay bets (bets to lose) when others were putting all their chips on bets to win.

    Then I recall a slot tournament at NYNY several years ago when the session winners all used the same machine.

    So give credit where is due. And understand all terms and conditions.
    Not a member, effective January 28, 2019

  2. #2
    Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson View Post
    In another thread about sports picks mickeycrimm pointed out that forum member redietz did pretty well in one sports picking tournament and Rob in his usual acerbic style called tournament winners chumps, or something to that effect.

    Dan asked us to create separate threads instead of polluting existing ones, so that's what I'm doing here.

    First, give credit to redietz for winning or finishing high in tournaments. Second there's no need to belittle anyone over tournament results.

    Tournament play is not necessarily real play because tournaments have rules and conditions that might not be the same in the "real world." I think we all know that.

    Blackjack, slot, video poker, craps tournaments all have special conditions that make their play different than elsewhere on the casino floor.

    My best example is about a craps tournament at Red Rock. I wasn't in it but I met the winner about three months later when he returned to the casino. I found out he was the winner because he had several thousand dollars in promo chips at the craps table.

    Winning that tournament was not because he was some great player or shooter. The way he told the story he won because he made some huge lay bets (bets to lose) when others were putting all their chips on bets to win.

    Then I recall a slot tournament at NYNY several years ago when the session winners all used the same machine.

    So give credit where is due. And understand all terms and conditions.

    Playing in sports handicapping contests isn't like participating in one-shot craps or poker tournaments that are sealed off from the real world. Sports handicapping contests are connected to and referencing the real world.

    Most sports handicapping contests are season-long. They are not "short-term." Casino tournaments are short-term, taking place in a day or a weekend. These are two very different endeavors. Most sports contests, at the least, take three months.

    Not playing in contests that are free or low cost, when you know more than everyone else, would be silly. The contests can be a distraction, but they don't distract me because they are not a focal point. I might take an extra hour to revisit games I have no interest in, but that's about it. Would I play in a forced-choice college football handicapping contest if there were a sizeable fee? Not unless there was some freedom regarding which games to choose.

    Would I play in a college version of the Superbook Contest? Definitely yes. You would be choosing five games a week from an entire schedule. In fact, I was in something called The World Cup of Handicapping at Caesars Palace way back. It was a one-week college and NFL contest with a $1,000 entry fee. I finished 12th, I think, in the college part. Top 10 cashed. I was 15-5 ATS that weekend in the 20 college games I chose, but 16-4 was the cashing cutoff. A record of 18-2 won the college contest. I believe, since it was a one-weekend event, the World Cup was referred to as a "tournament," which was appropriate given its short-term nature.

    I entered and cashed in Bally's season-long college contest the years they had it. Bally's forced you to choose 10 games out of 20 listed each week. That is also "forced choice," as there are 50-some lined games most weeks, so your options picking from just 20 of the lined games were limited. Some weeks, there were only one or two games I had any interest in among the 20 listed.

    In the Retro Road Trip thread, I posted some photos of my records in "Tipsters or Gypsters?" annual publications. Those were not "contests." Those were simply my records those years handicapping as monitored by former Seattle Times reporter, Mike McCusker, who published "Tipsters or Gypsters?" for almost two decades. "Tipsters or Gypsters?" was also known as the McCusker Report.
    Last edited by redietz; 11-26-2018 at 06:38 AM.

  3. #3
    I guess I should point this out. What Argentino is doing, picking five games a week with one best bet and a parlay, is really contest-style handicapping. People actually gambling would never limit themselves to a set number of games each week. The idea of doing that is pretty silly, when you think about it. So if you are gambling contest-style, but contest players are chumps, well, that's healthy self-criticism, I guess.

    I understand that Argentino is not a big fan of Fezzik, the two-time Superbook Contest winner. I respect Fezzik, but I'm not a big fan, either, mainly because I know some things most people do not know. In any event, it is odd that someone who dislikes Fezzik, and who has disdain for contests, would basically choose the same games-per-week format that the Superbook employs and that made Fezzik famous. Why would one do that, especially since it makes zero sense from an actual real gambling perspective?

    Food for thought, eh?


    And finally, in case it's not clear, there is no real equivalency between casino blackjack or craps tournaments and sports handicapping contests. They are not even close to similar.
    Last edited by redietz; 11-26-2018 at 07:44 AM.

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