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Thread: A New Low, Even For CET

  1. #1
    Obv a gimmick account; if any personnel are reading this it would be pretty easy for them to determine who I am, and I can't remember if there's anything I've posted on my regular account that I'd rather remain private (likely not a concern, but as you're about to learn, you can't be too careful with these people).

    So, couple of months ago, I'm staying at Harrah's LV. I enter the bathroom to shower. The remodeled rooms have heavy sliding glass doors. I slide the door open in a normal fashion (I wasn't upset or drunk or anything) and it hits the bumpers and explodes into tiny pieces. I'm not severely injured, but I have some fairly deep cuts on my hand that was opening the door, I still have the scars. Security comes up, takes a report, bandages me, and I expect that to be it.

    A few days later I check my Amex statement, and there it is: $1500 for the door. I call Harrah's, they give me the runaround. I call my host, he says there's nothing he can do. I open a case with Amex, they side with Harrah's, since I signed the form upon checkin that makes me responsible for any room damages*. I call the hotel injury lawyers on the billboard, their position is that since I didn't seek medical treatment at the outset, I'm SOL, and they don't want to deal with anything non-injury related.

    * Is this really a thing? I mean, if I turn the TV on and it explodes and catches fire, do I now owe them a new TV? If I fall through the floor am I on the hook for construction repairs?

    Obviously if I had any idea they would sink to this level, I would have gone straight to the hospital after it happened and milked them for everything I could. So now I'm open to any and all suggestions.

  2. #2
    Originally Posted by eff CET View Post
    Obv a gimmick account; if any personnel are reading this it would be pretty easy for them to determine who I am, and I can't remember if there's anything I've posted on my regular account that I'd rather remain private (likely not a concern, but as you're about to learn, you can't be too careful with these people).

    So, couple of months ago, I'm staying at Harrah's LV. I enter the bathroom to shower. The remodeled rooms have heavy sliding glass doors. I slide the door open in a normal fashion (I wasn't upset or drunk or anything) and it hits the bumpers and explodes into tiny pieces. I'm not severely injured, but I have some fairly deep cuts on my hand that was opening the door, I still have the scars. Security comes up, takes a report, bandages me, and I expect that to be it.

    A few days later I check my Amex statement, and there it is: $1500 for the door. I call Harrah's, they give me the runaround. I call my host, he says there's nothing he can do. I open a case with Amex, they side with Harrah's, since I signed the form upon checkin that makes me responsible for any room damages*. I call the hotel injury lawyers on the billboard, their position is that since I didn't seek medical treatment at the outset, I'm SOL, and they don't want to deal with anything non-injury related.

    * Is this really a thing? I mean, if I turn the TV on and it explodes and catches fire, do I now owe them a new TV? If I fall through the floor am I on the hook for construction repairs?

    Obviously if I had any idea they would sink to this level, I would have gone straight to the hospital after it happened and milked them for everything I could. So now I'm open to any and all suggestions.
    You should try contacting a personal injury attorney...hopefully you have pictures, bills and documentation of what happened....going 2 months after the fact isn`t gonna work in your favor, but a good lawyer will know what to do

  3. #3
    Probably too late--but put Amex on notice that they should not pay this charge as it is the subject of litigation.

  4. #4
    That is rediculous and you need to write a letter to corporate stating that the door was defective and they need to seek judgement in court. As well you will bring a case for personal damages related to the scarring and emotional trauma.
    Also point out the fact that there is numerous reasons for tempered glass explosions. If it happened while you had hold of the handle it could be as simple as no rubber washer between the metal and glass.
    https://www.thespruce.com/glass-show...itself-3972517

  5. #5
    Check this thread for a history of claims against Caesars.

    https://vegascasinotalk.com/forum/sh...rs+door+injury

  6. #6
    Originally Posted by Keystone View Post
    You should try contacting a personal injury attorney...hopefully you have pictures, bills and documentation of what happened....going 2 months after the fact isn`t gonna work in your favor, but a good lawyer will know what to do
    Originally Posted by eff CET View Post
    I call the hotel injury lawyers on the billboard, their position is that since I didn't seek medical treatment at the outset, I'm SOL, and they don't want to deal with anything non-injury related.
    I have pictures of the hand and shower door, but I'm not sure how much good that'll do me... if anyone knows of a specific lawyer that will take the case without the injury claim, please send me their info.

    Probably too late--but put Amex on notice that they should not pay this charge as it is the subject of litigation.
    Already contested the charge with them, twice with the appeal. They said the same thing in both, that I pretty much signed my life away when I checked in.

    That is rediculous and you need to write a letter to corporate stating that the door was defective and they need to seek judgement in court. As well you will bring a case for personal damages related to the scarring and emotional trauma.
    Also point out the fact that there is numerous reasons for tempered glass explosions. If it happened while you had hold of the handle it could be as simple as no rubber washer between the metal and glass.
    https://www.thespruce.com/glass-show...itself-3972517
    This is good info, thanks. Is there a specific contact at Caesars I should target? I have no experience with this sort of thing. Obviously the hotel manager was a dead-end.

    Check this thread for a history of claims against Caesars.

    https://vegascasinotalk.com/forum/sh...rs+door+injury
    It appears the main difference here is that Alan had a serious injury that he got documented medical attention for, whereas I just wanted to move on and not make a big deal of it. Definitely a lesson learned there.

  7. #7
    Don't have a contact. Ask them when you call the corporate offices. Also, start posting your story on their Facebook, Yelp, Twitter, and other sites you can think of.

  8. #8
    I came out of "forum retirement" only for this thread because I think it's important.

    There are several issues here. The first is the injury you suffered. If there are scars as you say the injury was not minor. There is still time to claim injuries.

    But I think the other issue is the elephant: being charged for damage. Frankly I can't imagine you'd be charged for damage unless you gave them cause.

    So I'm wondering if there's something in the security report that you don't know about? Do you have a copy of the report?

    When I was injured at Caesars the security officer wrote the report on a multi copy form and I was given my copy right then and there.

    I did a quick Google search for info about shower doors and yes they do break. Do you have any photos showing a faulty door or bumpers or assembly?

    By the way I never sought damages for my injury. I wanted my Tommy Bahama shoes, jeans and my Caesars jacket replaced.

    Also, while investigating legal requirements on doors I discovered that at the time EVERY DOOR ON A GUEST ROOM AT CAESARS PALACE was in violation of federal ADA regulations. And I told them that.

  9. #9
    Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson View Post
    I came out of "forum retirement" only for this thread because I think it's important.

    There are several issues here. The first is the injury you suffered. If there are scars as you say the injury was not minor. There is still time to claim injuries.

    But I think the other issue is the elephant: being charged for damage. Frankly I can't imagine you'd be charged for damage unless you gave them cause.

    So I'm wondering if there's something in the security report that you don't know about? Do you have a copy of the report?

    When I was injured at Caesars the security officer wrote the report on a multi copy form and I was given my copy right then and there.

    I did a quick Google search for info about shower doors and yes they do break. Do you have any photos showing a faulty door or bumpers or assembly?

    By the way I never sought damages for my injury. I wanted my Tommy Bahama shoes, jeans and my Caesars jacket replaced.

    Also, while investigating legal requirements on doors I discovered that at the time EVERY DOOR ON A GUEST ROOM AT CAESARS PALACE was in violation of federal ADA regulations. And I told them that.
    They did ask if I wanted a copy of the report. In retrospect I feel like an idiot for declining. It may be possible to still get a copy, if they keep it on record?

    I don't have any photos showing anything faulty; I just took a pic of the glass/floor and my hand.

    You mentioned in the other thread that the risk manager helped you reach a resolution; would you be willing to provide their contact info?

  10. #10
    It was the risk manager for Caesars Palace. I think there's probably one for each property.

    The risk manager contacted me after I emailed the president of Caesars Palace.

    I think you should phone your host and get the name, email and phone of the top guy and say "is this how you treat your guests?"

    You said you have a host. Are you Seven Stars or Diamond?

    I was Seven Stars at the time. I wrote "is this how you treat a Seven Stars player?" I wasn't suing them -- my clothes were covered with blood and I wanted them replaced. The shoes had a woven fabric and blood was all over and in them. Security actually seized my jacket and bagged it for being toxic.

    I also failed to go to a hospital. My doctor said if I had I would have received stitches to close the gash. But I had excellent insurance with a zero deductible.

    And yes, get that copy of the report. If the security guard wrote something like guest slammed the door you've got a problem.
    Last edited by Alan Mendelson; 02-26-2019 at 05:31 AM.

  11. #11
    Whoever the idiot is that started this thread....why are you telling us how incompetent you are? If the shower door exploded like you said it did--and if it produced any blood--then if you did not request emergency treatment or head out to an emergency room right away (which would have created an incident, treatment, and paper trail) then you deserve the $1500 charge on AMEX.

    What were you expecting--$200 in freeplay?

  12. #12
    First off, please do not troll Alan in this thread because he returned to assist this member with his CET issue. I am gong to delete the troll messages in this thread, and I will kick anyone who continues to troll here.

    Anyway, you should DEFINITELY fight this (which I know you've been trying), but I'll give you some suggestions where to go from here.

    It's important to know where you should NOT go. Your host is a good example. Hosts are required to pretend to care about you and your experience, but in reality, you're just a cold number to them. Basically, what is your ADT, and what commission are you earning them? They don't give a shit about making this right for you, unless you're a huge whale, where basically they have the discretion to eat the $1500 out of their own department. But that's clearly not the case here.

    You also shouldn't give up after being "given the runaround" at Harrah's, though I know it's maddening attempting to reach people there.

    You should focus upon the following individuals at the property, and see if you can get satisfaction with any of them:

    1) The hotel general manager. Attempt to reach him/her first. Make sure it's the actual general manager of the whole property, and not just some lackey who works as an assistant.

    2) The front desk manager. I don't mean the acting supervisor at the front desk. I mean the manager of the entire front desk. Try this person if you can't reach the general manager.

    3) The VIP check-in room manager. Again, make sure it's the manager of the VIP check-in room, not just the acting manager. I have this person's contact info, if you need it.

    These three people have some authority, and if they cannot get the $1500 waived, they can go to their bosses who can.

    I see exactly what happened here. You were erroneously blamed for trashing the room (whether intentionally or unintentionally), and by the contract you signed, they are correct that you're responsible if that's what happened.

    However, that's not what happened. You can't prove it, but the lack of anything else damaged, along with your immediate report to security, should be on your side.

    How should you approach it?

    Sometimes the best defense is a good offense.

    Tell them that this was a pretty bad injury to your hand, requiring ongoing medical care. Tell them that your friends, including a personal injury attorney you know, were pushing you to sue them, but you valued your relationship with Harrah's and didn't want to create trouble, nor did you want to waste the time and energy to do so.

    Tell them that you were shocked to get this bill, since you felt that you were being the nice one in this situation by not suing them or even asking them to file a claim against their insurance. You just wanted to drop it and deal with it on your own.

    Tell them that their own reports from security should indicate that you were coherent, not drunk, and not agitated. This was really due to a faulty door.

    Tell them that this is your final offer -- to remove the $1500 charge, or you will indeed file suit.

    This is tricky, because the second you mention "lawsuit", they panic and want to shove you to their attorneys.

    However, reiterate that you are talking them because you DON'T want to file suit, and simply want both sides to walk away from this. Offer to sign a document to where both sides hold each other harmless over this incident.

    If you need further assistance, let me know.

    Good luck.
    Check out my poker forum, and weekly internet radio show at http://pokerfraudalert.com

  13. #13
    Also, don't worry about what the personal injury attorney said. True, you didn't get medical attention months ago, but Harrah's doesn't know that.

    You need to bluff them and make them think you have a viable case.

    BTW, you are also welcome to appear on my PokerFraudAlert Radio show and publicize this.

    You can also threaten you are going to appear all over gambling podcasts and go to the local media about this. But only break out these threats if they are uncooperative.

    Keep repeating things like, "I am an honest person. I don't want any money out of this. I will pay my own bills. I just don't want you to treat me honestly, too."

    If you make yourself look like the opposite of the opportunistic jerk who squeezes them out of money with fake or exaggerated injuries, you will get some sympathy.

    Don't admit you have no copy of the security report. Say things like, "Check the security report and you'll see...", and then once they acknowledge having read the report, ask them for a copy of the report. Do not admit you don't have it, but rather claim that it's at your other residence and you want to reference it again.
    Check out my poker forum, and weekly internet radio show at http://pokerfraudalert.com

  14. #14
    Too much bluffing and hoping in that scenario.

    What I'm trying to understand is why AMEX sided with the hotel. Sure, hotel guests are responsible for room damage IF THEY PURPOSELY CAUSED IT OR IF IT WAS CAUSED BY RECKLESS BEHAVIOR. All you needed to tell AMEX is that the door was opened/closed in normal fashion and it gave out because it must have been ready to give out. I've had an AMEX card for most of my long life, and NOT ONCE have they not sided with me in these type of disputes. Plus they may have some sort of coverage for accidental damage.

    I'd try working this with AMEX before getting involved with the CET bureaucracy. Depending on how long you've been a customer and what your charging habits are, you'll probably find them far more loyal than CET would be.

  15. #15
    I'm afraid that there was something in the wording of the security report which put the liability on the guest. Frankly I've never heard of a guest being charged for room damage...except when TVs are stolen (as what happened when the Augustus Tower opened up for the first New Year's Eve).

    Dan is correct that the poster can still pursue a medical claim. Medical injuries can show up weeks or months later.

    But I still think the solution is just honestly reaching top management on the Amex charge.

  16. #16
    Bump....what was the end result of this.....
    Keep your friends close, keep your drinks closer...

  17. #17
    After getting zero response from everyone else Dan recommended I contact, I escalated to the hotel manager, who responded promptly and took the charges off. Sad that it took so long, but apparently that's where we are with CET. Also called Amex and told them to cancel my card after many years of patronage; told them if they can't provide the bare minimum of consumer protection then they're worthless to me.

  18. #18
    Originally Posted by eff CET View Post
    After getting zero response from everyone else Dan recommended I contact, I escalated to the hotel manager, who responded promptly and took the charges off. Sad that it took so long, but apparently that's where we are with CET. Also called Amex and told them to cancel my card after many years of patronage; told them if they can't provide the bare minimum of consumer protection then they're worthless to me.
    Good on CET and double good with Am Ex. See you at the Harrahs Diamond Lounge sometime.
    Keep your friends close, keep your drinks closer...

  19. #19
    Originally Posted by eff CET View Post
    After getting zero response from everyone else Dan recommended I contact, I escalated to the hotel manager, who responded promptly and took the charges off. Sad that it took so long, but apparently that's where we are with CET. Also called Amex and told them to cancel my card after many years of patronage; told them if they can't provide the bare minimum of consumer protection then they're worthless to me.
    Glad you finally got it resolved. Very frustrating for you, though.

    Did you see I also suggested contacting the hotel manager? That's where I go fairly quickly when I'm getting ignored or stonewalled.
    Check out my poker forum, and weekly internet radio show at http://pokerfraudalert.com

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