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Thread: APs Wrongly Prosecuted - Keno - They're Suing Harrah's

  1. #161
    Originally Posted by Bob21 View Post
    APs see anybody that disagrees with their world view as being a troll. APs are kind of like a cult. They want everybody to think the same way.
    This is an outright fucking lie, maggot. No more playing footsy with your ass. You're just a punk ass troll.
    "More importantly, mickey thought 8-4 was two games over .500. Argued about it. C'mon, man. Nothing can top that for math expertise. If GWAE ever has you on again, you can be sure I'll be calling in with that gem.'Nuff said." REDIETZ

  2. #162
    Originally Posted by Bob21 View Post
    Originally Posted by Spock View Post
    But wait! That can't be true because Boob21 read articles! Lots and lots of articles! If you read those articles you might think differently, (but probably not).

    Of course Boob can't supply a SINGLE one of those, but just trust him. He's right, everyone else is wrong.

    It looks to me like he's trying to tie the Game King button hustle with the Keno one.

    And Boob, so you know, I'm not an AP. I just hate jackasses that believe they know everything. (<----- that would be YOU)
    Hey, Spock, or should I say Spook. Lol. I’ve noticed that’s kind of an AP thing to do, meaning slightly twist a person’s handle and think that makes you clever. Spock/Spook, you can believe whatever you want to... it doesn’t mater to me. No matter how many articles I post, it won’t prove anything. You think these guys were incencent since that’s the way you’re wired. In your world, the casinos are always in the wrong.

    At the very least, I think these five people are unethical since they took advantage of a computer bug. What they did is similar to getting free food out of a vending machine when it’s malfunctioning. An AP would probably think this is an advantage play...I think it’s unethical. This is what makes you and me different.

    Regardless of how these five people found this play (either by an inside sources or through blind luck), they knew what they did is take advantage of a bug in the machine’s program. They were making 5 times the payout so they knew something was wrong with the program. Therefore, they tried to stay under the radar for as long as possible.

    I’m surprised the judge didn’t make these people pay this money back to the casino, like the judge did in the Phil Ivey edge sorting case. But as we all know, each judge is different. Btw, judges have ruled in the favor of the caisbo when a bug happens in a big jackpot payout. I know this gets APs upset too.

    To be able to sleep at night, you need to believe what you believe. I don’t want to post an article that might make you doubt your beliefs. I can tell this case is very important to you. I think they are guilty, but I can’t prove it. No article will do that. And at the very least, I think these 5 people have no ethics.

    Usually I just roll my eyes at people claiming the ethical high ground, but I looked more closely at Bob21's postings.

    I'm sure he realized that his "free food out of a vending machine" analogy above was half a step off. If he instead compared it to "free cigarettes out of a cigarette machine," both in addictive correlation and ethics, he would have been closer to the real world mark. But that would have been less helpful to the casino industry, so he went with food.

    And then we can get into the ethics of someone posting anonymously, blathering opinions that have no real world fallout for his actual self. Is that ethical? Going to bat for an industry from the safety of anonymity? Why not take things in a truly ethical direction and put your real name on your postings, so everyone can attach a face to the opinions? That would be the truly ethical thing to do. Have the courage of your convictions, or opinions, or blather. Sitting somewhere behind a pseudonym, with no ramifications for whatever you spout, isn't quite as ethical as standing up and taking responsibility for your opinions, and the consequences of those opinions.

    Instead, Bob21 is afraid to use the same pseudonym across forums. That's hilarious.

    I guess that's the difference between someone like Bob21 and me. According to him, ethical counts for something. Compared to him, I'm ethical. Who knew? And unafraid. He's a coward -- defending an exploitative industry without absorbing any of the real world consequences of having defended that industry.

    How manipulative is someone who can't even use the same alias in different anonymous venues? Sorry, that was a rhetorical question.

    Yeah, Bob21, you're a real ethical warrior.

    LOL.
    Last edited by redietz; 03-13-2019 at 05:53 AM.

  3. #163
    Originally Posted by redietz View Post
    Originally Posted by Bob21 View Post
    Originally Posted by Spock View Post
    But wait! That can't be true because Boob21 read articles! Lots and lots of articles! If you read those articles you might think differently, (but probably not).

    Of course Boob can't supply a SINGLE one of those, but just trust him. He's right, everyone else is wrong.

    It looks to me like he's trying to tie the Game King button hustle with the Keno one.

    And Boob, so you know, I'm not an AP. I just hate jackasses that believe they know everything. (<----- that would be YOU)
    Hey, Spock, or should I say Spook. Lol. I’ve noticed that’s kind of an AP thing to do, meaning slightly twist a person’s handle and think that makes you clever. Spock/Spook, you can believe whatever you want to... it doesn’t mater to me. No matter how many articles I post, it won’t prove anything. You think these guys were incencent since that’s the way you’re wired. In your world, the casinos are always in the wrong.

    At the very least, I think these five people are unethical since they took advantage of a computer bug. What they did is similar to getting free food out of a vending machine when it’s malfunctioning. An AP would probably think this is an advantage play...I think it’s unethical. This is what makes you and me different.

    Regardless of how these five people found this play (either by an inside sources or through blind luck), they knew what they did is take advantage of a bug in the machine’s program. They were making 5 times the payout so they knew something was wrong with the program. Therefore, they tried to stay under the radar for as long as possible.

    I’m surprised the judge didn’t make these people pay this money back to the casino, like the judge did in the Phil Ivey edge sorting case. But as we all know, each judge is different. Btw, judges have ruled in the favor of the caisbo when a bug happens in a big jackpot payout. I know this gets APs upset too.

    To be able to sleep at night, you need to believe what you believe. I don’t want to post an article that might make you doubt your beliefs. I can tell this case is very important to you. I think they are guilty, but I can’t prove it. No article will do that. And at the very least, I think these 5 people have no ethics.

    Usually I just roll my eyes at people claiming the ethical high ground, but I looked more closely at Bob21's postings.

    I'm sure he realized that his "free food out of a vending machine" analogy above was half a step off. If he instead compared it to "free cigarettes out of a cigarette machine," both in addictive correlation and ethics, he would have been closer to the real world mark. But that would have been less helpful to the casino industry, so he went with food.

    And then we can get into the ethics of someone posting anonymously, blathering opinions that have no real world fallout for his actual self. Is that ethical? Going to bat for an industry from the safety of anonymity? Why not take things in a truly ethical direction and put your real name on your postings, so everyone can attach a face to the opinions? That would be the truly ethical thing to do. Have the courage of your convictions, or opinions, or blather. Sitting somewhere behind a pseudonym, with no ramifications for whatever you spout, isn't quite as ethical as standing up and taking responsibility for your opinions, and the consequences of those opinions.

    Instead, Bob21 is afraid to use the same pseudonym across forums. That's hilarious.

    I guess that's the difference between someone like Bob21 and me. According to him, ethical counts for something. Compared to him, I'm ethical. Who knew? And unafraid. He's a coward -- defending an exploitative industry without absorbing any of the real world consequences of having defended that industry.

    How manipulative is someone who can't even use the same alias in different anonymous venues? Sorry, that was a rhetorical question.

    Yeah, Bob21, you're a real ethical warrior.

    LOL.
    This has got to be one of the dumbest posts I’ve read in a while. What does logging into different forums with different handles have anything to do with ethics? I could see it if I was trying to accomplish something by doing this. None of my handles have anything to do with my other handle. All my handles state what I think. Am I unethical since I use different passwords to log onto different acounts? In your world view, I probably am.

    This is another thing you’ve got to love about APs. They have this code of ethics, which they constantly call each other out on, but they themselves violate. Look at kJ, he called me out for using different handles, but used a sock puppet to get access to a site he was banned on. Who does that but a person who has little ethics? If Dan should ban me on this site, I’m not coming back. I’m not creating a sock puppet to get back on.

    Btw, I know several APs who use different handles on different sites. Three is Three on BJTF and Dummy on blackjackinfo. Has he violated some moral code amongst APs?

    Most APs will stoop to almost any level to take advantage of a casino. This is why the judge ruled against Phil Ivey in the edge sorting case. My guess is if this same judge was presiding over this case, it might have gone different.

    Btw, where is this code of ethics book APs live by? It appears to be very different from what is considered normal. APs use false names, make up stories, hide their ID, but somehow this is ethical. I guess it is in their world.

  4. #164
    Listen Ditz, not everyone is trying to sell some form of sports betting or subscriptions for personal gain. Who the fuck here cares about your back in the day sports betting history? It’s for your benefit not to be anonymous. Trying to get gamblers to pay for your betting picks is an indication you’re a broken-down shoe and have nothing to lose. Most would never be on one of these forums if they had to use their real name. Just imagining nut jobs like you tracking me down is a freighting thought.

    How about giving your friends here a lock on a game that’s current without a fee?

    It’s getting played out when every chance you get you want jump on everyone that’s anonymous.

  5. #165
    Originally Posted by blackhole View Post
    Listen Ditz, not everyone is trying to sell some form of sports betting or subscriptions for personal gain. Who the fuck here cares about your back in the day sports betting history? It’s for your benefit not to be anonymous. Trying to get gamblers to pay for your betting picks is an indication you’re a broken-down shoe and have nothing to lose. Most would never be on one of these forums if they had to use their real name. Just imagining nut jobs like you tracking me down is a freighting thought.

    How about giving your friends here a lock on a game that’s current without a fee?

    It’s getting played out when every chance you get you want jump on everyone that’s anonymous.
    The only thing played out is seeing you massacre the English language day after day....Freighting is when you transport goods from one place to another....frightening is something that invokes fear...spend some of those millions you like to brag about on a “English made easy for Imbeciles” book.....get it dummy?

  6. #166
    Originally Posted by Keystone View Post
    The only thing played out is seeing you massacre the English language day after day....Freighting is when you transport goods from one place to another....frightening is something that invokes fear...spend some of those millions you like to brag about on a “English made easy for Imbeciles” book.....get it dummy?
    Someone get a mop please. The drool is all over the place.

  7. #167
    Originally Posted by blackhole View Post
    Originally Posted by Keystone View Post
    The only thing played out is seeing you massacre the English language day after day....Freighting is when you transport goods from one place to another....frightening is something that invokes fear...spend some of those millions you like to brag about on a “English made easy for Imbeciles” book.....get it dummy?
    Someone get a mop please. The drool is all over the place.
    I got NOTHING? Name:  89421760-C2F5-4B6A-8CEA-0C2EB19B1A6A.gif
Views: 582
Size:  328 Bytes

  8. #168
    Originally Posted by Bob21 View Post
    Originally Posted by redietz View Post
    Originally Posted by Bob21 View Post

    Hey, Spock, or should I say Spook. Lol. I’ve noticed that’s kind of an AP thing to do, meaning slightly twist a person’s handle and think that makes you clever. Spock/Spook, you can believe whatever you want to... it doesn’t mater to me. No matter how many articles I post, it won’t prove anything. You think these guys were incencent since that’s the way you’re wired. In your world, the casinos are always in the wrong.

    At the very least, I think these five people are unethical since they took advantage of a computer bug. What they did is similar to getting free food out of a vending machine when it’s malfunctioning. An AP would probably think this is an advantage play...I think it’s unethical. This is what makes you and me different.

    Regardless of how these five people found this play (either by an inside sources or through blind luck), they knew what they did is take advantage of a bug in the machine’s program. They were making 5 times the payout so they knew something was wrong with the program. Therefore, they tried to stay under the radar for as long as possible.

    I’m surprised the judge didn’t make these people pay this money back to the casino, like the judge did in the Phil Ivey edge sorting case. But as we all know, each judge is different. Btw, judges have ruled in the favor of the caisbo when a bug happens in a big jackpot payout. I know this gets APs upset too.

    To be able to sleep at night, you need to believe what you believe. I don’t want to post an article that might make you doubt your beliefs. I can tell this case is very important to you. I think they are guilty, but I can’t prove it. No article will do that. And at the very least, I think these 5 people have no ethics.

    Usually I just roll my eyes at people claiming the ethical high ground, but I looked more closely at Bob21's postings.

    I'm sure he realized that his "free food out of a vending machine" analogy above was half a step off. If he instead compared it to "free cigarettes out of a cigarette machine," both in addictive correlation and ethics, he would have been closer to the real world mark. But that would have been less helpful to the casino industry, so he went with food.

    And then we can get into the ethics of someone posting anonymously, blathering opinions that have no real world fallout for his actual self. Is that ethical? Going to bat for an industry from the safety of anonymity? Why not take things in a truly ethical direction and put your real name on your postings, so everyone can attach a face to the opinions? That would be the truly ethical thing to do. Have the courage of your convictions, or opinions, or blather. Sitting somewhere behind a pseudonym, with no ramifications for whatever you spout, isn't quite as ethical as standing up and taking responsibility for your opinions, and the consequences of those opinions.

    Instead, Bob21 is afraid to use the same pseudonym across forums. That's hilarious.

    I guess that's the difference between someone like Bob21 and me. According to him, ethical counts for something. Compared to him, I'm ethical. Who knew? And unafraid. He's a coward -- defending an exploitative industry without absorbing any of the real world consequences of having defended that industry.

    How manipulative is someone who can't even use the same alias in different anonymous venues? Sorry, that was a rhetorical question.

    Yeah, Bob21, you're a real ethical warrior.

    LOL.
    This has got to be one of the dumbest posts I’ve read in a while. What does logging into different forums with different handles have anything to do with ethics? I could see it if I was trying to accomplish something by doing this. None of my handles have anything to do with my other handle. All my handles state what I think. Am I unethical since I use different passwords to log onto different acounts? In your world view, I probably am.

    This is another thing you’ve got to love about APs. They have this code of ethics, which they constantly call each other out on, but they themselves violate. Look at kJ, he called me out for using different handles, but used a sock puppet to get access to a site he was banned on. Who does that but a person who has little ethics? If Dan should ban me on this site, I’m not coming back. I’m not creating a sock puppet to get back on.

    Btw, I know several APs who use different handles on different sites. Three is Three on BJTF and Dummy on blackjackinfo. Has he violated some moral code amongst APs?

    Most APs will stoop to almost any level to take advantage of a casino. This is why the judge ruled against Phil Ivey in the edge sorting case. My guess is if this same judge was presiding over this case, it might have gone different.

    Btw, where is this code of ethics book APs live by? It appears to be very different from what is considered normal. APs use false names, make up stories, hide their ID, but somehow this is ethical. I guess it is in their world.
    You seemed have lost by playing the illegal card so now you want to play the ethical card in the same game and cal it a wild card to boot. That's fine if you want to talk about ethics the AP game but lets stick to one game at a time and use one card at a time.

  9. #169
    Originally Posted by blackhole View Post
    Listen Ditz, not everyone is trying to sell some form of sports betting or subscriptions for personal gain. Who the fuck here cares about your back in the day sports betting history? It’s for your benefit not to be anonymous. Trying to get gamblers to pay for your betting picks is an indication you’re a broken-down shoe and have nothing to lose. Most would never be on one of these forums if they had to use their real name. Just imagining nut jobs like you tracking me down is a freighting thought.

    How about giving your friends here a lock on a game that’s current without a fee?

    It’s getting played out when every chance you get you want jump on everyone that’s anonymous.


    Sorry, blackhole, you're just another anonymous coward, as Singer likes to say. All this time, all these years on this forum, and you have yet to find one single solicitation by me to anyone. Zero. Nada. None.

    The problem with you, blackhole, is that you have no gambling expertise, so your presumed expertise on this forum is debunking people who do. You don't know what the hell you're doing in terms of gambling. You never have. Nothing wrong with that. Keep up the good work.

    Being on this forum does me zero good -- unless I'm somehow soliciting people. And God knows, if you had any evidence I ever solicited anyone on any forum, you'd have put it right here for all to see. But you haven't. I wonder why.

    Go ahead. Try to hire me. Use some new names, some other forums, some backdoor PMs. Use anonymous handles. Use real names. See what responses you get. Or maybe you already have...and you already received your responses.

  10. #170
    Blackhole's entire line of arguing that I'm not anonymous on this site because I'm selling something is absurd.

    I've been on this site since 2011. In eight years, if blackhole had encountered one instance of me soliciting someone, or PMing them in an attempt to get some kind of business, or drumming up business on this site or others, he would have simply posted it. If he really believed I was here to get some kind of business, the obvious way to prove that -- without a doubt -- would be to engage me or have someone else engage me. Then post the interaction. Wham bam, absolute proof. Not hard to do.

    But blackhole either did that and failed, or he won't do it because he knows what the answer will be.

    So you have an anonymous dude, who could easily prove or disprove his premise, who refuses to prove what he's claiming. And he'll keep claiming that's what I'm doing when he could easily pin it down one way or the other.

    Man, that is sleazy and dishonest.

  11. #171
    Originally Posted by AxelWolf View Post
    Originally Posted by Bob21 View Post
    Originally Posted by redietz View Post


    Usually I just roll my eyes at people claiming the ethical high ground, but I looked more closely at Bob21's postings.

    I'm sure he realized that his "free food out of a vending machine" analogy above was half a step off. If he instead compared it to "free cigarettes out of a cigarette machine," both in addictive correlation and ethics, he would have been closer to the real world mark. But that would have been less helpful to the casino industry, so he went with food.

    And then we can get into the ethics of someone posting anonymously, blathering opinions that have no real world fallout for his actual self. Is that ethical? Going to bat for an industry from the safety of anonymity? Why not take things in a truly ethical direction and put your real name on your postings, so everyone can attach a face to the opinions? That would be the truly ethical thing to do. Have the courage of your convictions, or opinions, or blather. Sitting somewhere behind a pseudonym, with no ramifications for whatever you spout, isn't quite as ethical as standing up and taking responsibility for your opinions, and the consequences of those opinions.

    Instead, Bob21 is afraid to use the same pseudonym across forums. That's hilarious.

    I guess that's the difference between someone like Bob21 and me. According to him, ethical counts for something. Compared to him, I'm ethical. Who knew? And unafraid. He's a coward -- defending an exploitative industry without absorbing any of the real world consequences of having defended that industry.

    How manipulative is someone who can't even use the same alias in different anonymous venues? Sorry, that was a rhetorical question.

    Yeah, Bob21, you're a real ethical warrior.

    LOL.
    This has got to be one of the dumbest posts I’ve read in a while. What does logging into different forums with different handles have anything to do with ethics? I could see it if I was trying to accomplish something by doing this. None of my handles have anything to do with my other handle. All my handles state what I think. Am I unethical since I use different passwords to log onto different acounts? In your world view, I probably am.

    This is another thing you’ve got to love about APs. They have this code of ethics, which they constantly call each other out on, but they themselves violate. Look at kJ, he called me out for using different handles, but used a sock puppet to get access to a site he was banned on. Who does that but a person who has little ethics? If Dan should ban me on this site, I’m not coming back. I’m not creating a sock puppet to get back on.

    Btw, I know several APs who use different handles on different sites. Three is Three on BJTF and Dummy on blackjackinfo. Has he violated some moral code amongst APs?

    Most APs will stoop to almost any level to take advantage of a casino. This is why the judge ruled against Phil Ivey in the edge sorting case. My guess is if this same judge was presiding over this case, it might have gone different.

    Btw, where is this code of ethics book APs live by? It appears to be very different from what is considered normal. APs use false names, make up stories, hide their ID, but somehow this is ethical. I guess it is in their world.
    You seemed have lost by playing the illegal card so now you want to play the ethical card in the same game and cal it a wild card to boot. That's fine if you want to talk about ethics the AP game but lets stick to one game at a time and use one card at a time.
    Hey, we have different opinions. That’s all. Based on the limited information I had at the time, I said I thought they were probably guilty, but the prosecution didn’t have enough evidence to convict them.

    After I’ve researched this some more, I have changed my mind and think they are probably innocent as charged but they definitely didn’t do any typical AP play. They took advantage of a bug in a program, which I guess is technically legal.

    I also said based on the evidence the casino and gaming company had at the time, I can see why they thought they were guilty.

    With all this said, I could be wrong. They could be guilty but did a good job covering their tracks. At the very least what they did crossed the boundaries of what most people would consider ethical.

    They weren’t playing a fair game and happened to score a big win. I think we can all agree on that.

  12. #172
    I realize there are a lot of side arguments here about ethics, advertising services, IRS regulations, carrying cash, etc., but after reading the additional info I still think these APs did nothing wrong playing a keno game with enhanced payoffs.

    Now, if in the future it's determined they were fed inside info about machines that were "enhanced" outside of official channels then everything changes.

    But as of now it looks to me that they found a machine with an enhanced pay table and played it. Again they are not responsible for filing CTRs and there's nothing illegal about betting less to avoid W2Gs and hand pays.

  13. #173
    Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson View Post
    I realize there are a lot of side arguments here about ethics, advertising services, IRS regulations, carrying cash, etc., but after reading the additional info I still think these APs did nothing wrong playing a keno game with enhanced payoffs.

    Now, if in the future it's determined they were fed inside info about machines that were "enhanced" outside of official channels then everything changes.

    But as of now it looks to me that they found a machine with an enhanced pay table and played it. Again they are not responsible for filing CTRs and there's nothing illegal about betting less to avoid W2Gs and hand pays.
    Just to be clear. The payoffs were five times what the paytable showed on the machine so these people knew these machines had a bug in them. They also knew had to trigger this bug so these machines paid off five times what they were supposed to.

    They did not find some machines that had favorable pay tables...they found some machines that were basically spitting out cash, as long as you knew the magic code to make them do this.

    I don’t see this as much different than an ATM accidentally spitting out more cash than is in your account. And this has happened. When it does, the person has to pay this money back to the bank. That person is not guilty of anything, but they also can’t keep the cash.

    This is how the judge ruled in the Phil Ivey edge sorting case. He said Phil didn’t cheat, but he also couldn’t keep the money he won since he didn’t play the game in a fair way. I know some people don’t agree with this ruling. I’m just saying if you’d apply this same logic to this case, these people should be giving this money back to the casino. They didn’t cheat, but they also weren’t playing a fair game.

  14. #174
    Originally Posted by Bob21 View Post

    Look at kJ, he called me out for using different handles, but used a sock puppet to get access to a site he was banned on. Who does that but a person who has little ethics? If Dan should ban me on this site, I’m not coming back. I’m not creating a sock puppet to get back on.

    Btw, I know several APs who use different handles on different sites. Three is Three on BJTF and Dummy on blackjackinfo. Has he violated some moral code amongst APs?
    OK, you freaking A-hole, let's get a couple things straight here. Don't freaking compare me to your fraud friend Three at BJTF. Three is a fraud! He is a lifelong low limit player, who ran some sort of family business and played blackjack recreationally at the red chip level for decades. Then all of the sudden he announced ahead of time that he was going to transform himself (or his image) and be known as one of the blackjack greats. Next thing you know he says he is a fulltime professional player, and he starts feeding this bull-shit super-duper count down everyone's throat with all sorts of claims that were and continue to be mathematical impossible. 500% increase over traditional card counting, playing with no variance....just win regularly.

    I and two other known professional players called these claims out. I was banned. The other left on their own when Norm decided to protect Three and this fraudulent misleading mathematical impossible bullshit. Your Hero Three said nothing. Finally several years later Noted blackjack mathematician and expert Don Schlesinger, finally was able to call out and debunk all of Three's claims.

    This freaking guy intentionally lied and made shit up, shit that was mathematically impossible for the purpose of misleading players. And a whole bunch of new, young players were mislead. He is not an AP, he is a fraud and a shithead. (very similar to the Singer situation here)

    And when he changed names when he went to BJinfo, it was specifically to avoid a confrontation with me. He tried to hide his identity, so I wouldn't go off on him.

    Now you are going to compare that to me using a sockpuppet (spiderman) at BJTF, so that I could share my experiences with cheating involving an ASM at a casino here in Las Vegas and warn other players? I went back to that forum where I was banned ONLY to share this experience and warn other players. At the very least bring it to their attention so players could decide for themselves. And this wasn't an accusation that I took lightly. I tracked some 200 shoes of results to make sure I knew damn well what I was talking about. And then I acquired the ASM model in question at great expense, had it shipped half way around the world to make sure the equipment had the capability of performing the cheating that I was accusing. The only thing I was wrong about was this capability is not built in when it leaves the factory, but it is very easily reprogrammed. So easy, that has to be intentional.

    So anyway, you are going to compare a guy who intentionally lied for the purpose of misleading many players throughout the community with me, who went back under a sockpuppet to warn members of the community about a specific cheating situation?

    Bob21, I have gone easy on you, but you are an asshole. You are a troll and I believe either a casino employee or have some sort of association with the casino Industry. Yeah, you might be a recreational card counter on the side (many dealers and pit are), but your loyalty lies with the casino industry.
    Last edited by kewlJ; 03-13-2019 at 09:39 AM.

  15. #175
    The reason most AP's use the same handle on different forums is that we build up credibility over years, decades of participating on different forums. You know exactly who you are talking to and dealing with. No one is hiding...except from the casino industry that wants to shut us down. We aren't hiding and we aren't running.

    In my own case, a decade ago, when I did something on these forums to protect myself (the fake death thing) after I was robbed at gunpoint outside my home, I was very unpopular among my AP friends and peers. Some still hold that against me even today. At that time, several members of the community recommended that I stop posting for 6 months or a year and then re-emerge under a new handle. I wouldn't do that. I wouldn't run or hide. That is a troll thing to do. Real AP's use the same handle, so people in the community know who they are.

  16. #176
    Originally Posted by Bob21 View Post
    The reason that crowd doesn’t like me is because I respect casinos and believe for the most part they’re doing things right. So yes, I defend them. We’re the parasite adding no value. They are the ones adding value by providing a gaming experience people enjoy. This always upsets APs when I call us parasites, but I think that’s a good description of what we do.
    And while I am at it, let me address THIS bullshit.

    "the casinos do the right thing and we are the parasites".


    Have you been to Las Vegas? And I am not talking about the strip. Go to some of the local outlying casinos that cater to the locals on a Friday evening. Places like some of the Boyd properties, LongHorn, Bighorn, Jokers Wild, the casinos in downtown Henderson, Jerry's Nugget, Lucky Club, Cannery, The wild wild west, Silver7, Ellis Island.

    The places that feed player booze (long past the legal limits) until they have no idea what they are doing.

    The places offering paycheck cashing bonuses so Daddy will cash and spend his paycheck long before he makes it home to pay the rent and feed the kids.

    The places that cash Government check, including tax refunds.

    The places that for years (until direct deposit) cashed social security checks so seniors would blow their money before they paid the rent.

    The casino industry doesn't do the right thing....the casino industry is a predatory industry!

  17. #177
    Originally Posted by kewlJ View Post
    The reason most AP's use the same handle on different forums is that we build up credibility over years, decades of participating on different forums. You know exactly who you are talking to and dealing with. No one is hiding...except from the casino industry that wants to shut us down. We aren't hiding and we aren't running.

    In my own case, a decade ago, when I did something on these forums to protect myself (the fake death thing) after I was robbed at gunpoint outside my home, I was very unpopular among my AP friends and peers. Some still hold that against me even today. At that time, several members of the community recommended that I stop posting for 6 months or a year and then re-emerge under a new handle. I wouldn't do that. I wouldn't run or hide. That is a troll thing to do. Real AP's use the same handle, so people in the community know who they are.
    Okay kJ, I get all that. Other than not understanding the AP code of ethics (someone forget to give me the manual, lol), explain to me how using different handles on different sites is some violation of an ethical code. Bosox just made a post about me on BJTF and said all my handles are very consistent. This shows I have no agenda. If I’d do it again, I’d probably use the same handle, but I’d still say the same things. I only have one handle for each site. I’ve never tried to keep my different handles a secret.

    The day I registered on BJTF I was just trying to access some link from a post and it said I don’t have access to this link without registering. So what did I do? I randomly typed in a bunch of letters and numbers to register. I didn’t give it much thought, just like I don’t with my passwords.

    Now when I registered here, I did think about it. I registered here mainly because I wanted to ask Moses a question about his count since he talked about it so much. I didn’t want to use dbs since I thought he might not take me seriously and he’d just start calling me names. This is what some APs do when they see who is asking a question. So I used the handle I thought I was using on bj21, but I got it wrong by a couple numbers.

    I really didn’t know this handle thing was that big of a deal. But I know see it is. It’s got Bosox so upset he made a special post about me on BJTF. I’m not going to reply or deal with that site anymore. Bosox has some serious problems if this handle thing gets him so upset.

    Anyway, I can’t go back in time to correct my different handles so it is what it is. I can tell this has the AP community in a frazzle, which doesn’t take much.

    And btw, I don’t really consider myself an AP as such. I’m more a part time red chip counter on weekends. And I didn’t lie when I said I like your posts. I’ve got a lot out of them and always enjoy your stories on your experiences. I think I’ve mentioned that from more than one handle. Lol

  18. #178
    I am not going to speak for or answer for BoSox. Ask him. But I suppose he was frustrated and annoyed at the multiple handle thing just like I am. Regardless of whether you did so unintentionally or not, it is just annoying. All I can say is almost all legitimate AP's use the same handle or a very slight variation. And generally the trolls use multiple handles.

    In my own case, I knew something was up with you when you got here. The way you were kissing Moses ass, my first though was that you were a moses sock puppet. I was wrong about that I guess, but I knew something wasn't right with all your ass kissing and playing both sides. After some interaction, I decided just to ignore you, and pay little attention to you.

    So then I go to BJinfo, and spend time and effort responding to a member that seemed sincere, only to later (yesterday) find out it is you. WTF?

    I mean as an AP that wants to share my experiences, I am suppose to spend mega time, going through posts with different handles, trying to figure out who is who and who is legit and who is trolling? I mean come on!

  19. #179
    Kj, one more comment about Three being my hero. Where did that come from? He is constantly attacking me, and he’s even had me on “ignore” for a while. He once took a screen shot to show me I was on his ignore list. This is when he replied to one of my posts. You can’t make this stuff up...showing someone you’re on their ignore list while replying to their post. That’s a classic. I wonder if that approach is in some AP manual. Lol

  20. #180
    Originally Posted by Bob21 View Post
    Kj, one more comment about Three being my hero. Where did that come from? He is constantly attacking me, and he’s even had me on “ignore” for a while. He once took a screen shot to show me I was on his ignore list. This is when he replied to one of my posts. You can’t make this stuff up...showing someone you’re on their ignore list while replying to their post. That’s a classic. I wonder if that approach is in some AP manual. Lol
    I didn't say you were his hero. I said he is your hero.

    You know what, as much as I am not fond of Three, I give him credit for recognizing that you are/were a problem.

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