Page 36 of 50 FirstFirst ... 2632333435363738394046 ... LastLast
Results 701 to 720 of 982

Thread: Advantage play / cheating / crime....where is the line?

  1. #701
    Originally Posted by mickeycrimm View Post
    I would be wary of putting the play down in an Indian Casino. They operate under a different set of laws.
    I vividly remember that scene in the new black jack movie (Inside the Edge: A Professional Blackjack Adventure) where KC is told (at an Indian casino), "you should think very carefully about your next move because it's not going to be very good for you if you make the wrong decision" by an Indian Casino pit boss on hidden camera.
    Last edited by tableplay; 06-02-2019 at 08:29 AM.

  2. #702
    Originally Posted by mickeycrimm View Post
    I would be wary of putting the play down in an Indian Casino. They operate under a different set of laws.
    Yes, and because of that unknown is why I only worked it in one state and not at Indian casinos. Those two Indian casinos where I found the flaw 3-1/2 years ago in Az. in low limit machines---I didn't cash out either machine. Just got up and left, seed money and all. I did go back to check a high limit machine at one place but it didn't work, and my trying was a mistake.

    The point I was trying to emphasize above but didn't clearly say was that it took about 3 dozen casino visits to confirm to myself that the "older" machines wouldn't cooperate. I had no idea like we do today that only a certain generation and above had this flaw built in. I spent lots of frustrating and disappointed time trying to figure out why some machines just wouldn't work.

    Red, I appreciate what you're trying to claim, but the only part that's true is my misleading GT readers in HOW I was hitting those jackpots from 2004-on. From '01 to '03 I was 100% honest reporting. SPS worked just fine so I ran with that going forward. What should I have done--quit writing? It was not an easy decision, just as my choice to create diversions for my mind by becoming the most nasty, most insulting character on Internet gaming forums. It was a LOT to deal with, with no one to discuss it with.

    I didn't meet Alan until right near the end of the play. He never had any idea about anything until I recently told him. But he misled no one, and all he's done is explain parts of my successful strategy.

  3. #703
    If any of you believe Robs BS, you're stupid!!

    Next he'll be telling is how he discovered hole carding and taught Grosjean everything he knows. Wise up!!!

  4. #704
    Originally Posted by mickeycrimm View Post



    I think Rob believes in his system and thats why he has stuck to his guns all these years. Can I tell you that it works. Sure can't.
    And Alan believes he saw 18 y.o.'s in a row.

    Believing something doesn't make it so. Not when the math says otherwise.

    And frankly his continuing to double down on this claim makes it harder to believe anything he says. THAT is what credibility is.

  5. #705
    Originally Posted by kewlJ View Post
    Originally Posted by mickeycrimm View Post



    I think Rob believes in his system and thats why he has stuck to his guns all these years. Can I tell you that it works. Sure can't.
    And Alan believes he saw 18 y.o.'s in a row.

    Believing something doesn't make it so. Not when the math says otherwise.

    And frankly his continuing to double down on this claim makes it harder to believe anything he says. THAT is what credibility is.
    I never said believing in it makes it so. I said I think he believes in his system. You can argue it to death, like I did for 13 years, but you are never going to change his mind.
    Last edited by mickeycrimm; 06-02-2019 at 05:44 PM.
    "More importantly, mickey thought 8-4 was two games over .500. Argued about it. C'mon, man. Nothing can top that for math expertise. If GWAE ever has you on again, you can be sure I'll be calling in with that gem.'Nuff said." REDIETZ

  6. #706
    Kew simply doesn't want what I say to be true because he has a deep personal dislike of me, which any clinical psychologist will tell him completely biases his views. He keeps trying to claim "the math" says it's impossible for my strategy to perform as I've reported it to have during those four years. This is where a bit more education in advanced mathematics would have served him well. What you learn is there are limits to what math can tell us, because all it is is a tool. That is why it is human beings who created formulas, calculations, and the wherewithal to come up with them.

    Everything isn't black & white kew, regardless of how much you wish it was in order to satisfy your craving for bias when it comes to me. You don't like it when I or anyone else questions your claims, calls you on your bs, or criticizes anything about you.

    I would say Grow Up, then come back and try again.

  7. #707
    Originally Posted by mickeycrimm View Post
    Originally Posted by kewlJ View Post
    Originally Posted by mickeycrimm View Post



    I think Rob believes in his system and thats why he has stuck to his guns all these years. Can I tell you that it works. Sure can't.
    And Alan believes he saw 18 y.o.'s in a row.

    Believing something doesn't make it so. Not when the math says otherwise.

    And frankly his continuing to double down on this claim makes it harder to believe anything he says. THAT is what credibility is.
    I never said believing in it makes it so. I said I think he believes in his system. You can argue it to death, like I did for 13 years, but you are never going to change his mind.
    I think Rob thinks his system is better than just "flat betting". I do not believe Rob actually and truly thinks his system is a long term money maker. Mickey, if you had a system that actually worked as he would have us believe, would you stop playing it? Sure you would take the time to enjoy the money and family, however, you wouldn't stop playing it. If he has time for the forums he has time to play.

  8. #708
    Originally Posted by AxelWolf View Post
    Originally Posted by mickeycrimm View Post
    Originally Posted by kewlJ View Post

    And Alan believes he saw 18 y.o.'s in a row.

    Believing something doesn't make it so. Not when the math says otherwise.

    And frankly his continuing to double down on this claim makes it harder to believe anything he says. THAT is what credibility is.
    I never said believing in it makes it so. I said I think he believes in his system. You can argue it to death, like I did for 13 years, but you are never going to change his mind.
    I think Rob thinks his system is better than just "flat betting". I do not believe Rob actually and truly thinks his system is a long term money maker. Mickey, if you had a system that actually worked as he would have us believe, would you stop playing it? Sure you would take the time to enjoy the money and family, however, you wouldn't stop playing it. If he has time for the forums he has time to play.
    I think that after I made almost 3 million easy dollars over 5 1/2 years, then that play died, I would pretty much be through with video poker.
    "More importantly, mickey thought 8-4 was two games over .500. Argued about it. C'mon, man. Nothing can top that for math expertise. If GWAE ever has you on again, you can be sure I'll be calling in with that gem.'Nuff said." REDIETZ

  9. #709
    I remember when Rob announced his retirement from "professional video poker play" I blasted him with "Who in the hell would retire a winning system?" In hindsight, and knowing what I know now, Rob wasn't retiring from his system play, he did that in 2004 when he found the glitch. He was retiring from the game king glitch because it wasn't available anymore. He pretty much didn't need video poker anymore.

    If it were me, and I was grinding out 100K a year working legitimate advantages, then found a glitch that made me 500K a year for several years, then the play ended, there would be no way I would go back to the regular grind. With my financial position at that point I would have little incentive to go back to a grind play.
    "More importantly, mickey thought 8-4 was two games over .500. Argued about it. C'mon, man. Nothing can top that for math expertise. If GWAE ever has you on again, you can be sure I'll be calling in with that gem.'Nuff said." REDIETZ

  10. #710
    Originally Posted by mickeycrimm View Post
    I remember when Rob announced his retirement from "professional video poker play" I blasted him with "Who in the hell would retire a winning system?" In hindsight, and knowing what I know now, Rob wasn't retiring from his system play, he did that in 2004 when he found the glitch. He was retiring from the game king glitch because it wasn't available anymore. He pretty much didn't need video poker anymore.

    If it were me, and I was grinding out 100K a year working legitimate advantages, then found a glitch that made me 500K a year for several years, then the play ended, there would be no way I would go back to the regular grind. With my financial position at that point I would have little incentive to go back to a grind play.
    And you, mickey, probably wouldn't publicly comment on an actual video poker AP's recent death by proclaiming "eat dirt" with his family reading and mourning, thereby getting axed by Gaming Today. Can't blow one's cover, eh?

  11. #711
    Originally Posted by Rob.Singer View Post
    Kew simply doesn't want what I say to be true because he has a deep personal dislike of me, which any clinical psychologist will tell him completely biases his views. He keeps trying to claim "the math" says it's impossible for my strategy to perform as I've reported it to have during those four years. This is where a bit more education in advanced mathematics would have served him well. What you learn is there are limits to what math can tell us, because all it is is a tool. That is why it is human beings who created formulas, calculations, and the wherewithal to come up with them.

    Everything isn't black & white kew, regardless of how much you wish it was in order to satisfy your craving for bias when it comes to me. You don't like it when I or anyone else questions your claims, calls you on your bs, or criticizes anything about you.

    I would say Grow Up, then come back and try again.
    And I Will always believe the math is skewed by casino action- I've seen too much week after week to disregard it. There's days when a small profit is the best option.

  12. #712
    Originally Posted by mickeycrimm View Post
    I remember when Rob announced his retirement from "professional video poker play" I blasted him with "Who in the hell would retire a winning system?" In hindsight, and knowing what I know now, Rob wasn't retiring from his system play, he did that in 2004 when he found the glitch. He was retiring from the game king glitch because it wasn't available anymore. He pretty much didn't need video poker anymore.

    If it were me, and I was grinding out 100K a year working legitimate advantages, then found a glitch that made me 500K a year for several years, then the play ended, there would be no way I would go back to the regular grind. With my financial position at that point I would have little incentive to go back to a grind play.
    There's a world of difference in how you play and how Rob's system supposedly works. You have to drive from place to place, walk around the whole casino, check these and those machines, etc. etc. That's a grind.

    Rob's purported system isn't a grind in the same way. It'd be like being able to hole-card blackjack at nearly any casino, 24/7, heat-free. I'm sure you don't need me to explain how....I don't even have the words to describe this theoretical system....it would just be purely amazing. Talk about how much $3.5 million is....it's peanuts compared to what you could make using his system (if it worked as advertised).
    #FreeTyde

  13. #713
    Originally Posted by AxelWolf View Post
    Originally Posted by mickeycrimm View Post
    Originally Posted by kewlJ View Post

    And Alan believes he saw 18 y.o.'s in a row.

    Believing something doesn't make it so. Not when the math says otherwise.

    And frankly his continuing to double down on this claim makes it harder to believe anything he says. THAT is what credibility is.
    I never said believing in it makes it so. I said I think he believes in his system. You can argue it to death, like I did for 13 years, but you are never going to change his mind.
    I think Rob thinks his system is better than just "flat betting". I do not believe Rob actually and truly thinks his system is a long term money maker. Mickey, if you had a system that actually worked as he would have us believe, would you stop playing it? Sure you would take the time to enjoy the money and family, however, you wouldn't stop playing it. If he has time for the forums he has time to play.
    It's not easy to understand unless you walk in another's shoes. Forums consume time--time sitting in an easy chair like right now, or time taking a break on the computer in-between running errands or working around the house. There is no 5-hour drive each way associated with any of that. As I've agreed to in the past, there was and is a lot of things I would do differently in vp had I lived in LV. There's also our retirement income stream that we prepared for years ago, which affected how aggressive I went after profiting from my play regardless of the method I used. If either my wife was gone or we didn't have this income and savings, you can bet the house that the casinos would have seen a lot more of me and I wouldn't have stopped going regularly.

  14. #714
    Originally Posted by Rob.Singer View Post
    Kew simply doesn't want what I say to be true because he has a deep personal dislike of me, which any clinical psychologist will tell him completely biases his views. He keeps trying to claim "the math" says it's impossible for my strategy to perform as I've reported it to have during those four years. This is where a bit more education in advanced mathematics would have served him well. What you learn is there are limits to what math can tell us, because all it is is a tool. That is why it is human beings who created formulas, calculations, and the wherewithal to come up with them.

    Everything isn't black & white kew, regardless of how much you wish it was in order to satisfy your craving for bias when it comes to me. You don't like it when I or anyone else questions your claims, calls you on your bs, or criticizes anything about you.

    I would say Grow Up, then come back and try again.
    Rob, this response is a cop-out. Sure, it is easy to attack and put me down because I didn't have the opportunity to go to college. You only know that because I am honest about my life. I never claimed to be one of the math experts. I don't need to be. Others smarter than me (and apparently you) fill that role. Others with more education and mathematical expertise than you and not a single one of them thinks your 'system' is anything but voodoo nonsense and wishful thinking.

  15. #715
    Furthermore, if your 'system' had any merit to it, you would be able to explain it without all the put-downs and attacks that only serve as a deflection because you can't explain it.

    I have asked 100 times what makes your negative expection play into a winning strategy because progression betting CAN NOT do that.

    So let's make it 101. Can you give us anything mathematically factual besides 'you are smarter than me and everyone else including all the gambling math experts.'

  16. #716
    Originally Posted by mickeycrimm View Post
    Originally Posted by Rob.Singer View Post
    That's why there ARE vulnerable machines out there--IGT first warned it's worldwide customers, the memo told them that a fix was coming, then they sent out new chips to all. It was up to each and every casino to manually go around and change the upgraded chip in each and every affected machine....on the planet. Just knowing how people in business generally operate, there'd be zero chance of 100% compliance from the get-go. This is why Barona and Peppermill Corp. have policies of never enabling the DU option in any machines again. And it's for sure there are others.

    Back then it wasn't just walk in, sit down, and destroy. You had to sit at a mid-2002 or later machine, but by 2005 these were plentiful because they were anti-glare/flat screen/tito, and everybody wanted them. The older coin-droppers/curved tube screens were updated but did not have the software bug. Today it's slightly more challenging since newer machines without the bug have come out after mid-2009, but by and large a majority of those 2002-2009 machines remain on casino floors. If you steer clear of machines that do everything but give you a back rub you have a better chance of coming across one.

    I've not seen the DU option advertised and always played to a winning hand to see if it was turned on. Most aren't, but back then there was little problem getting it enabled. I've found it a bit more difficult these days, although you can find it already activated here and there.

    That's another thing--4 and 5 denomination machines these days are usually gonna have different pay tables on the lower denoms vs. the higher one or two. But if you find one of these it all comes down to how creative you are with your movements, because to make money you'll have to make this play an awful lot at that one machine. I was always concerned some yahoo nobody might accidentally see me making some odd moves, but it was all just in my head. This is what led me to my one-and-done approach at only higher limits, but it was probably not necessary. If I had lived in Nv. I would have surely changed my strategy.
    You can add this post to the list of evidence that Rob actually did put this play down.
    Mickey, I don’t see how this post adds ”evidence that Rob actually did put this play down.” All it does it gives Rob’s opinion that this play could still be out there and gives some details on this play that were mostly known from the wired article.

    I obviously don’t know if Rob exploited this play or not. Based on Rob’s timeline, he said he looked for this play for “better part of 4 years, not really knowing what I was doing or looking for”. This means that Rob was looking for this type of play for at least two years before it even existed. This is putting the pieces together from Rob’s posts and the wired article.

    Most people would give up looking for something like this if they hadn’t found it after looking for it for two years, let alone four years. Again, this doesn’t prove or disprove if Rob exploited this play. Just something interesting to think about.

  17. #717
    Originally Posted by Bob21 View Post
    Originally Posted by mickeycrimm View Post
    Originally Posted by Rob.Singer View Post
    That's why there ARE vulnerable machines out there--IGT first warned it's worldwide customers, the memo told them that a fix was coming, then they sent out new chips to all. It was up to each and every casino to manually go around and change the upgraded chip in each and every affected machine....on the planet. Just knowing how people in business generally operate, there'd be zero chance of 100% compliance from the get-go. This is why Barona and Peppermill Corp. have policies of never enabling the DU option in any machines again. And it's for sure there are others.

    Back then it wasn't just walk in, sit down, and destroy. You had to sit at a mid-2002 or later machine, but by 2005 these were plentiful because they were anti-glare/flat screen/tito, and everybody wanted them. The older coin-droppers/curved tube screens were updated but did not have the software bug. Today it's slightly more challenging since newer machines without the bug have come out after mid-2009, but by and large a majority of those 2002-2009 machines remain on casino floors. If you steer clear of machines that do everything but give you a back rub you have a better chance of coming across one.

    I've not seen the DU option advertised and always played to a winning hand to see if it was turned on. Most aren't, but back then there was little problem getting it enabled. I've found it a bit more difficult these days, although you can find it already activated here and there.

    That's another thing--4 and 5 denomination machines these days are usually gonna have different pay tables on the lower denoms vs. the higher one or two. But if you find one of these it all comes down to how creative you are with your movements, because to make money you'll have to make this play an awful lot at that one machine. I was always concerned some yahoo nobody might accidentally see me making some odd moves, but it was all just in my head. This is what led me to my one-and-done approach at only higher limits, but it was probably not necessary. If I had lived in Nv. I would have surely changed my strategy.
    You can add this post to the list of evidence that Rob actually did put this play down.
    Mickey, I don’t see how this post adds ”evidence that Rob actually did put this play down.” All it does it gives Rob’s opinion that this play could still be out there and gives some details on this play that were mostly known from the wired article.

    I obviously don’t know if Rob exploited this play or not. Based on Rob’s timeline, he said he looked for this play for “better part of 4 years, not really knowing what I was doing or looking for”. This means that Rob was looking for this type of play for at least two years before it even existed. This is putting the pieces together from Rob’s posts and the wired article.

    Most people would give up looking for something like this if they hadn’t found it after looking for it for two years, let alone four years. Again, this doesn’t prove or disprove if Rob exploited this play. Just something interesting to think about.
    This looks as if you're trying too hard. If you were a real player instead of an armchair gambler, you'd be able to comprehend how for someone committed to looking for and finding/exploiting something....anything in vp machines, it's not that inconvenient doing it after playing a weekly session and before going home. And if I hadn't come across this I would still be looking just as fervently.

    You are also no Inspector Gadget, as you seem to want others to see you as. If you understood what goes on with a play like this, how it affects one's approach, what kind of a person along with what level of life-training it takes to keep quiet as well as exploit a play such as this for so long, you'd understand where someone knowledgeable in gambling like mickey is coming from. And please tell me where the EXACT steps to putting this play down have ever been printed in any article.

    Nothing like this can be 100% proven. Those who can use their heads but have a hatred of or bias towards me for all my past forum antics, will never want to say they believe this even if they really do. And I say this because there are others here who've had to put up with my nonsense, but who are able to separate the bs from what makes sense.

    Red, I know when I put that "eat dirt" comment into print it wasn't my best day. But I did NOT get "fired" from writing my GT article. Eileen told me to start writing the details of what went into my strategy that was supposedly providing me with so many jackpots, and I told her I didn't detail it in my books nor would I put it into my column. That was with my resignation email. Besides, I was never paid a penny for any of my 350 or so articles at my request, not theirs. They wanted to pay me $100/. I think my articles were worth 10 times that. Have you seen how much that paper has shrunk since I left?

  18. #718
    Originally Posted by maxx71 View Post
    This looks as if you're trying too hard. If you were a real player instead of an armchair gambler, you'd be able to comprehend how for someone committed to looking for and finding/exploiting something....anything in vp machines, it's not that inconvenient doing it after playing a weekly session and before going home. And if I hadn't come across this I would still be looking just as fervently.

    You are also no Inspector Gadget, as you seem to want others to see you as. If you understood what goes on with a play like this, how it affects one's approach, what kind of a person along with what level of life-training it takes to keep quiet as well as exploit a play such as this for so long, you'd understand where someone knowledgeable in gambling like mickey is coming from. And please tell me where the EXACT steps to putting this play down have ever been printed in any article.

    Nothing like this can be 100% proven. Those who can use their heads but have a hatred of or bias towards me for all my past forum antics, will never want to say they believe this even if they really do. And I say this because there are others here who've had to put up with my nonsense, but who are able to separate the bs from what makes sense.

    Red, I know when I put that "eat dirt" comment into print it wasn't my best day. But I did NOT get "fired" from writing my GT article. Eileen told me to start writing the details of what went into my strategy that was supposedly providing me with so many jackpots, and I told her I didn't detail it in my books nor would I put it into my column. That was with my resignation email. Besides, I was never paid a penny for any of my 350 or so articles at my request, not theirs. They wanted to pay me $100/. I think my articles were worth 10 times that. Have you seen how much that paper has shrunk since I left?
    Yeah, they definitely do not appreciate your work, and that's why you should give them your terms and see what would they say the next time.
    His work isn't worth a hill of beans. Wise up!!

  19. #719
    Originally Posted by RS__ View Post
    Originally Posted by mickeycrimm View Post
    I remember when Rob announced his retirement from "professional video poker play" I blasted him with "Who in the hell would retire a winning system?" In hindsight, and knowing what I know now, Rob wasn't retiring from his system play, he did that in 2004 when he found the glitch. He was retiring from the game king glitch because it wasn't available anymore. He pretty much didn't need video poker anymore.

    If it were me, and I was grinding out 100K a year working legitimate advantages, then found a glitch that made me 500K a year for several years, then the play ended, there would be no way I would go back to the regular grind. With my financial position at that point I would have little incentive to go back to a grind play.
    There's a world of difference in how you play and how Rob's system supposedly works. You have to drive from place to place, walk around the whole casino, check these and those machines, etc. etc. That's a grind.

    Rob's purported system isn't a grind in the same way. It'd be like being able to hole-card blackjack at nearly any casino, 24/7, heat-free. I'm sure you don't need me to explain how....I don't even have the words to describe this theoretical system....it would just be purely amazing. Talk about how much $3.5 million is....it's peanuts compared to what you could make using his system (if it worked as advertised).
    What I do is not really a grind at all. I don't have a schedule and hit the casinos only when I want to. And I don't walk, I mosey. LOL!

    Yes, if the system worked you could make millions. But only if you are willing to put in the time. I've never maxed out my potential because I'm not willing to put in the hours to do it.
    "More importantly, mickey thought 8-4 was two games over .500. Argued about it. C'mon, man. Nothing can top that for math expertise. If GWAE ever has you on again, you can be sure I'll be calling in with that gem.'Nuff said." REDIETZ

  20. #720
    Originally Posted by redietz View Post
    Originally Posted by mickeycrimm View Post
    I remember when Rob announced his retirement from "professional video poker play" I blasted him with "Who in the hell would retire a winning system?" In hindsight, and knowing what I know now, Rob wasn't retiring from his system play, he did that in 2004 when he found the glitch. He was retiring from the game king glitch because it wasn't available anymore. He pretty much didn't need video poker anymore.

    If it were me, and I was grinding out 100K a year working legitimate advantages, then found a glitch that made me 500K a year for several years, then the play ended, there would be no way I would go back to the regular grind. With my financial position at that point I would have little incentive to go back to a grind play.
    And you, mickey, probably wouldn't publicly comment on an actual video poker AP's recent death by proclaiming "eat dirt" with his family reading and mourning, thereby getting axed by Gaming Today. Can't blow one's cover, eh?
    I was one of the first to criticize Rob for that obit. But I don't think Rob was fired over that. If GT found it so offensive then why did they publish it? I think Chuck di Rocco relished the controversy that Rob brought. When he died of course now Rob is dealing with someone else with different ideas.
    "More importantly, mickey thought 8-4 was two games over .500. Argued about it. C'mon, man. Nothing can top that for math expertise. If GWAE ever has you on again, you can be sure I'll be calling in with that gem.'Nuff said." REDIETZ

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Similar Threads

  1. What is your advantage play? All the details.
    By Alan Mendelson in forum Las Vegas
    Replies: 26
    Last Post: 07-17-2017, 05:23 PM
  2. My advantage play in AC is finished
    By lucky in forum Eastern US & Non-US Casinos
    Replies: 113
    Last Post: 02-02-2016, 11:20 PM
  3. advantage play on credit lines?
    By Alan Mendelson in forum Las Vegas
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 10-11-2014, 07:18 PM
  4. Is this the ULTIMATE casino ADVANTAGE play??
    By Alan Mendelson in forum Las Vegas
    Replies: 77
    Last Post: 02-04-2013, 12:57 PM
  5. Replies: 0
    Last Post: 07-17-2011, 11:29 AM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •