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Thread: Advantage play / cheating / crime....where is the line?

  1. #481
    Part of the problem with all this is that when a person says they are ahead xxx amount after 4 years, you are expecting they are talking a very large sample size. Now Rob initially said 200 sessions, then dropped to 150-200 and later switched to the lower end of 150 sessions over that 4 years. So that is like 37 sessions a year. Not the kind of sample size you would expect from a professional player making a 4 year claim.

    But you have to remember, these numbers (4 years) have also changed. Rob's initial claim was 10 years and a million dollars for the Singer progression system. Actually at first he said 900 and some thousand and then went as high as 1.5 million. THESE were the claims I began challenging. I can't help it if the claims are constantly changing.

    The bottom line to all this is maybe Rob's claim of the double up bug is true. That is for everyone to decide for themselves whether they find that credible. I don't. I can't accept that without some sort of supporting proof from this person, who has made 100's of unsubstantiated claims. If he has proof and wants to present it, I reserve the right to change my mind. I even reserve the right to change mu opinion bases on new information which is why I hope he gets the platform he desires to keep explaining.

    But this other claim that I call the Singer progression claim, he calls Singer SPS, is hog wash. It goes against mathematic principals. It did when he made the claim and it still does no now. And being that he is doubling down on that claim in recent days, I have the right to continue to challenge that claim. And being on the positive side of variance or the bell curve does not make it a legitimate system or claim. That is voodoo stuff.
    Last edited by kewlJ; 05-22-2019 at 10:03 AM.

  2. #482
    Originally Posted by kewlJ View Post
    Originally Posted by mickeycrimm View Post

    If the misquotes were a one-off it would be no big deal. But KJ is twisting to much stuff around. Rob claims to have played about 150 sessions with SPS and KJ changes that to Rob claiming he went 150-0 with SPS.
    Mickey, you are doing exactly what you are accusing me of doing, twisting things I said. Here is the quote:

    Originally Posted by kewlJ View Post
    Now you with these new adjusted numbers of total win of $375 you are trying to tell us that you have experiences 150 winning goals of $2500 (that would be 375k), while not experiencing any loses of the entire 57k bankroll,
    I clearly said any losses of the entire 57k bankroll!

    Now the first part, I was a bit wrong. Rob said he played 150 so I divided his total win claim of 375 by 150 sessions and came up with exactly $2500 which was his win goal. If he was stopping at $2500 he would have needed to have hit the $2500 win goal every single one of those sessions to reach his $375k claim. Rob has since explained that sometimes he won more than the win goal and sometimes he stopped playing with a loss, so he would not of necessarily had to win every session.

    But that is separate from the fact that he claims he never lost the entire 57k in 150 sessions and THAT is what I clearly said. We all sometimes misinterpret what people say. I do it. You do it. (you just did). It doesn't mean that most of us are intentionally setting out to lie. I take exception to that pathological liar comment. There are members here (and former) members that are pathological liar and constantly twist and manipulate. It just so happens you are now coming to the defense of one of them. No label's for him?
    Your own quote of yourself here is evidence of your twisting things around. Rob didn't tell you he had 150 winning goals in 150 sessions. He always said his system produced a $2500 win "or higher" about 85% of the time. Rob has said for years that while he ran the entire 57K though the machines he kept pulling tickets out on certain hands and pocketing the money. Consequently his biggest loss was 33K. That is something I happen to know. It is not "coming to Rob's defense." It's just pointing out the facts. It's just telling the goddam truth.

    I'm not coming to anyone's defense. I'm just pointing out what the real facts are as you twist the shit out of it. I'm a neutral observer in this and my opinions are based on the facts as I know them. You are not neutral. You are bound and determined to discredit Rob's story anyway you can. You are coming up with all kinds of far fetched bullshit and misrepresenting the facts. Quit misrepresenting the facts and you won't get called a pathological liar.

    And get to work finding the person/persons that gave Rob the sequence. I'm sure he's sitting on pins and needles worried about you finding that person. Come to think of it, do you really think Rob would seek someone out to get the sequence then publicly claim that he discovered it on his own years before? The person he supposedly got the information from could easily debunk Rob on that when/if he got wind of the story. He could shoot Rob's story down in a heartbeat. Do you really think Rob would not be aware that this person/persons could easily debunk him if he lied about it? This story is going to continue to spread. The gambling world is a small world. Everybody knows everybody or knows of them. So put out a reward or something for this phantom person to come forward.
    "More importantly, mickey thought 8-4 was two games over .500. Argued about it. C'mon, man. Nothing can top that for math expertise. If GWAE ever has you on again, you can be sure I'll be calling in with that gem.'Nuff said." REDIETZ

  3. #483
    I have a question for Rob. In 2009, when you discovered that a worldwide memo had been sent out telling the casinos to disable the double ups you knew the play was over. You couldn't have known about Kane and Nestor at that point. How long was it after the play ended that you first found the story about Kane and Nestor?
    "More importantly, mickey thought 8-4 was two games over .500. Argued about it. C'mon, man. Nothing can top that for math expertise. If GWAE ever has you on again, you can be sure I'll be calling in with that gem.'Nuff said." REDIETZ

  4. #484
    Mickey: "They say Jesus walked on the water."

    KJ: "Mickey is now claiming that Jesus couldn't swim."
    "More importantly, mickey thought 8-4 was two games over .500. Argued about it. C'mon, man. Nothing can top that for math expertise. If GWAE ever has you on again, you can be sure I'll be calling in with that gem.'Nuff said." REDIETZ

  5. #485
    Jesus was a figment of someone's drugged up imagination. Wise up!!!!!!

  6. #486
    Hmmmm--should I watch paint dry or read i more of KJ's rants. Really--let it go already. We all get your position. Whether anyone agrees or not, your position is pretty clear.

  7. #487
    Originally Posted by mickeycrimm View Post
    I have a question for Rob. In 2009, when you discovered that a worldwide memo had been sent out telling the casinos to disable the double ups you knew the play was over. You couldn't have known about Kane and Nestor at that point. How long was it after the play ended that you first found the story about Kane and Nestor?
    The irony is I went into the Silverton to play shortly after Kane must have been arrested, asking for DU to be turned on, and an attendant told me all about it upon denying my request. Didn't mention names. I quietly played for a few minutes then walked out. I never knew who got caught until reading about it around 2012. I did read bits about it on forums, and along the way I did see that memo from IGT at the Silverton and Hard Rock.

    jbjb, Jesus is a well-written about real/historicle person. If he's a "figment of someone's drugged-up imagination" then so are you.
    Last edited by Rob.Singer; 05-22-2019 at 11:36 AM.

  8. #488
    I'm not asking anyone to accept my play strategy as a legitimate system. It was developed for me and my abilities. In fact, after trying to teach it to hundreds of people, I found that they found it very complex, and very few people had the aptitude to grasp every part of it, which is absolutely necessary in order to be consistently successful using it. This is why I tell and told players to use it as a baseline type of approach, and to apply their own comfort levels to making it a better strategy for them. That's what sling does....what many people do.

    Re: the mostly irrelevant argument over the150-200 sessions I played from 2000-early 2004: I tried to play every week but I know I did not, for various family reasons etc. I have no idea exactly how many, and nobody would by now. There should be no complaining over such a stat. Use 175 or any other number if you want. I kept a cumulative total along with weekly results on my site then. You should've kept up.

  9. #489
    Advantage Play and not illegal. Waiting for a Ploppy who has no idea how Scarab works to stop at Game 9 with a bunch of Scarab Wilds which didn't pay out, so they leave in disgust(When I first played Scarab, I got a line of Scarabs, that didn't pay. I was baffled why my libe of full Scarabs paid nothing. I only kept playing because I was already on Game 8 out of 10 and I assumed that something good would happen on Game 10 and those non paying Scarabs turned into a bunch of WILDS and I won like $50 on a .75 bet! Someone who doesn't know better would have thought the game was a rip off when they got a full line of Scarabs abd left in disgust) an Advantage Player would just play ONE game and reap in the unsuspecting last player's wilds and get a huge payout.

    Borderline illegal. Watching someone get a bunch of multipliers on UX Machine and claiming that ANOTHER machine had been giving out Jackpots for the last hour and that you think the player with the multipliers on his UX machine should play on it. He blindly leaves to go to the other "Jackpot," machine without even VERIFYING if it has been paying Jackpots for real and you play his multipliers and get a huge payout.

    Illegal. Cashing out TITO from players who forgot about them even for literally a few seconds. On a gambling website it was said that two friends were playing on opposite side of slot banks. One friend excitedly told his friend he won the Major $900 prize on just .50 his friend went to his friend's slot to congratulate him on his big win and they chatted for about 30 seconds when he realized he left his money in his machine when he went to congratulate his friend. He rushed over and the TITO had already been taken.

  10. #490
    Originally Posted by jbjb View Post
    Jesus was a figment of someone's drugged up imagination. Wise up!!!!!!
    So you believe our whole dating system is based on a person who is a figment of someone’s imagianging? Wow, that person must have some kind of power to impact the way we tell time 2019 years later.

    In case you didn’t know, our dating system is based on the historical figure Jesus Christ. The term BC means Before Christ.

  11. #491
    Originally Posted by Bob21 View Post
    Originally Posted by jbjb View Post
    Jesus was a figment of someone's drugged up imagination. Wise up!!!!!!
    So you believe our whole dating system is based on a person who is a figment of someone’s imagianging? Wow, that person must have some kind of power to impact the way we tell time 2019 years later.

    In case you didn’t know, our dating system is based on the historical figure Jesus Christ. The term BC means Before Christ.
    Our days of the week are mostly named after Norse gods.

  12. #492
    Originally Posted by smurgerburger View Post
    Originally Posted by Bob21 View Post
    Originally Posted by jbjb View Post
    Jesus was a figment of someone's drugged up imagination. Wise up!!!!!!
    So you believe our whole dating system is based on a person who is a figment of someone’s imagianging? Wow, that person must have some kind of power to impact the way we tell time 2019 years later.

    In case you didn’t know, our dating system is based on the historical figure Jesus Christ. The term BC means Before Christ.
    Our days of the week are mostly named after Norse gods.
    Ok, so you want to go down that road. Here’s something interesting most don’t know about the week. It comes from the Bible and God’s creation week. There is no other explanation for why we have a week on our calendar.

    Think about it. All the other events on our calendar relate to something that can be explained astronomically. A day is the length of time earth requires to rotate around its axis in relation to the sun. A month is the time it takes the moon to revolve around the earth. A year is the time it takes the earth to revolve around the sun.

    A week? It has no astronomical meaning. The modern 7 day week was adopted by the Roman Empire for religious purposes. It’s to celebrate God’s creation week...He took six days to create the universe and everything in it, and then rested on the seventh day.

    So you learned something new today: The historical reason behind why we have a week on our calendar. I wonder if jbjb thinks God is a figment of someone’s imagination, or if a week is really a figment of our imagination?

  13. #493
    Originally Posted by smurgerburger View Post
    Originally Posted by Bob21 View Post
    Originally Posted by jbjb View Post
    Jesus was a figment of someone's drugged up imagination. Wise up!!!!!!
    So you believe our whole dating system is based on a person who is a figment of someone’s imagianging? Wow, that person must have some kind of power to impact the way we tell time 2019 years later.

    In case you didn’t know, our dating system is based on the historical figure Jesus Christ. The term BC means Before Christ.
    Our days of the week are mostly named after Norse gods.

    Excellent point. And let's not forget the months.

    I recommend books by Bart Ehrman, currently the James A. Gray Distinguished Professor of Religious Studies at UNC, for understandable, accessible reading regarding these topics. I think the general consensus is that Jesus of Nazareth probably existed (sans super powers). What surprised me most about the academic literature I read is that the people in seminary schools have much more progressive, non-super-powered thinking than one would expect, given their commitment to various faiths.

  14. #494
    After perusing Wikipedia for one minute I learned that the Romans had an eight day week before adopting the seven day week, perhaps borrowed from the Hebrews. Some scholars think the Hebrews got it from the Babylonians but this is uncertain.

    The week obviously has practical value or it would not have been universally adopted (in various forms).

    I honestly don't know why you think this has any bearing on the question of whether the Hebrew god or any other gods or Jesus existed.

  15. #495
    Glad to see this discussion has taken a different path. But fear not--when kew picks up his gadget we'll be treated to another 10 posts that say the exact same thing as all his other posts. To get around that annoyance, why don't we all close our eyes, start screaming bloody murder!, and shout out my name inside-out and backwards half a dozen times. That oughta do it.

    Everything's been said about this that can be said. If there's any further questions pm me, email me or a few of you can call me. It's clear fromwhat people are saying, most forums want to suppress anything Rob Singer, some media outlets have heard of me and not the DU issue, and the community has mostly moved on. That's fine with me. I've got other issues to pursue anyway. I'm fully satisfied knowing I was able to exploit this flaw like no one else, and I never had any legal problems throughout. If anything, I should be gloating like no one ever has. Everyone in the anti-Singer community has always ridiculed and made fun of my play strategy accomplishments. Who's laughing now?

  16. #496
    Originally Posted by Bob21 View Post
    Originally Posted by smurgerburger View Post
    Originally Posted by Bob21 View Post

    So you believe our whole dating system is based on a person who is a figment of someone’s imagianging? Wow, that person must have some kind of power to impact the way we tell time 2019 years later.

    In case you didn’t know, our dating system is based on the historical figure Jesus Christ. The term BC means Before Christ.
    Our days of the week are mostly named after Norse gods.
    Ok, so you want to go down that road. Here’s something interesting most don’t know about the week. It comes from the Bible and God’s creation week. There is no other explanation for why we have a week on our calendar.

    Think about it. All the other events on our calendar relate to something that can be explained astronomically. A day is the length of time earth requires to rotate around its axis in relation to the sun. A month is the time it takes the moon to revolve around the earth. A year is the time it takes the earth to revolve around the sun.

    A week? It has no astronomical meaning. The modern 7 day week was adopted by the Roman Empire for religious purposes. It’s to celebrate God’s creation week...He took six days to create the universe and everything in it, and then rested on the seventh day.

    So you learned something new today: The historical reason behind why we have a week on our calendar. I wonder if jbjb thinks God is a figment of someone’s imagination, or if a week is really a figment of our imagination?
    Good post. Also, worship was changed from the Sabbath to the first day of the week to celebrate the risen Lord. This disbelief was also predicted- "Behold I lay in Zion a Stumblingblock ...."

  17. #497
    Originally Posted by slingshot View Post
    Originally Posted by Bob21 View Post
    Originally Posted by smurgerburger View Post

    Our days of the week are mostly named after Norse gods.
    Ok, so you want to go down that road. Here’s something interesting most don’t know about the week. It comes from the Bible and God’s creation week. There is no other explanation for why we have a week on our calendar.

    Think about it. All the other events on our calendar relate to something that can be explained astronomically. A day is the length of time earth requires to rotate around its axis in relation to the sun. A month is the time it takes the moon to revolve around the earth. A year is the time it takes the earth to revolve around the sun.

    A week? It has no astronomical meaning. The modern 7 day week was adopted by the Roman Empire for religious purposes. It’s to celebrate God’s creation week...He took six days to create the universe and everything in it, and then rested on the seventh day.

    So you learned something new today: The historical reason behind why we have a week on our calendar. I wonder if jbjb thinks God is a figment of someone’s imagination, or if a week is really a figment of our imagination?
    Good post. Also, worship was changed from the Sabbath to the first day of the week to celebrate the risen Lord. This disbelief was also predicted- "Behold I lay in Zion a Stumblingblock ...."
    Yeah, the seven day week is interesting. Most don’t think about it or even know where it came from. They just experience it week after week. It comes from Jew/Christian beliefs, which comes from God’s creation week in Genesis.

    Does it prove God exists? Of course not. Does it prove God created the university and everything in it in six days and rested on the seventh day? Of course not, even though it’s the best, most scientific reason for why we exist.

    Another interest fact. When communist Russia formed they tried to eradicate anything to do with Christianity and God so they abolished the seven day week and went to a five day week. It didn’t last long and they went back to the seven day week. Thus, showing how powerful the seven day week is. And it all comes from God’s seven day creation week, which most idiots - and scholars - make fun of.

  18. #498
    Originally Posted by Bob21 View Post
    Originally Posted by slingshot View Post
    Originally Posted by Bob21 View Post

    Ok, so you want to go down that road. Here’s something interesting most don’t know about the week. It comes from the Bible and God’s creation week. There is no other explanation for why we have a week on our calendar.

    Think about it. All the other events on our calendar relate to something that can be explained astronomically. A day is the length of time earth requires to rotate around its axis in relation to the sun. A month is the time it takes the moon to revolve around the earth. A year is the time it takes the earth to revolve around the sun.

    A week? It has no astronomical meaning. The modern 7 day week was adopted by the Roman Empire for religious purposes. It’s to celebrate God’s creation week...He took six days to create the universe and everything in it, and then rested on the seventh day.

    So you learned something new today: The historical reason behind why we have a week on our calendar. I wonder if jbjb thinks God is a figment of someone’s imagination, or if a week is really a figment of our imagination?
    Good post. Also, worship was changed from the Sabbath to the first day of the week to celebrate the risen Lord. This disbelief was also predicted- "Behold I lay in Zion a Stumblingblock ...."
    Yeah, the seven day week is interesting. Most don’t think about it or even know where it came from. They just experience it week after week. It comes from Jew/Christian beliefs, which comes from God’s creation week in Genesis.

    Does it prove God exists? Of course not. Does it prove God created the university and everything in it in six days and rested on the seventh day? Of course not, even though it’s the best, most scientific reason for why we exist.

    Another interest fact. When communist Russia formed they tried to eradicate anything to do with Christianity and God so they abolished the seven day week and went to a five day week. It didn’t last long and they went back to the seven day week. Thus, showing how powerful the seven day week is. And it all comes from God’s seven day creation week, which most idiots - and scholars - make fun of.
    Volumes can and have been written. The book of Job- believed to be the oldest book written-even before Genesis- is extremely interesting. Well, enough. Just couldn't let this one pass by.

  19. #499
    Originally Posted by slingshot View Post
    Originally Posted by Bob21 View Post
    Originally Posted by slingshot View Post

    Good post. Also, worship was changed from the Sabbath to the first day of the week to celebrate the risen Lord. This disbelief was also predicted- "Behold I lay in Zion a Stumblingblock ...."
    Yeah, the seven day week is interesting. Most don’t think about it or even know where it came from. They just experience it week after week. It comes from Jew/Christian beliefs, which comes from God’s creation week in Genesis.

    Does it prove God exists? Of course not. Does it prove God created the university and everything in it in six days and rested on the seventh day? Of course not, even though it’s the best, most scientific reason for why we exist.

    Another interest fact. When communist Russia formed they tried to eradicate anything to do with Christianity and God so they abolished the seven day week and went to a five day week. It didn’t last long and they went back to the seven day week. Thus, showing how powerful the seven day week is. And it all comes from God’s seven day creation week, which most idiots - and scholars - make fun of.
    Volumes can and have been written. The book of Job- believed to be the oldest book written-even before Genesis- is extremely interesting. Well, enough. Just couldn't let this one pass by.
    Good point slingshot. I like Job too. It’s one of my favorite books in the Bible. It has several references to dinosaurs, showing man lived with dinosaurs. Many scholars, even religious scholars, miss this because they’ve been told by so-called scientist that dinosaurs and man didn’t live at the same time. This obviously isn’t true...all you need to do is read Genesis and study human records to see dinosaurs and man lived at the same time.

    The best example of a dinosaur in the Bible is the behemoth in Job. By the way he’s described, he sounds like a brontosaurus. It makes sense that God would describe dinosaurs in Job since he was trying to explain how great his creation was to Job, and dinosaurs were some of God’s most magestic creatures.

  20. #500
    Originally Posted by smurgerburger View Post
    After perusing Wikipedia for one minute I learned that the Romans had an eight day week before adopting the seven day week, perhaps borrowed from the Hebrews. Some scholars think the Hebrews got it from the Babylonians but this is uncertain.

    The week obviously has practical value or it would not have been universally adopted (in various forms).

    I honestly don't know why you think this has any bearing on the question of whether the Hebrew god or any other gods or Jesus existed.
    sumgerburger, thanks for following up and pointing out to the group I was right. You remind me of many people I come across when I give my seminars at universities. You basically proved me right, showing that the Romans adapted the week due to its Christian roots. I don’t know if you know this, but while the Romans put Jesus to death, they also eventually converted to Christianity, which is why they went to the seven day week.

    You’re right this doesn’t prove God exists. Excellent point! You’re really on top of things. The only reason I brought up the week is because you pointed out that our days of the week were named after Norse God’s, as if that’s relevant to anything.

    As far as scoloars wondering if the Hewbews adopted it from the Babylonians, of course some will think this. The Bible is the most study book in the world and most so-called scholars are trying to prove something wrong in it. The problem is they can’t, so they resort to speculation. The Bible is a historical accurate book, all the way back to Genesis. No this doesn’t prove God exists.

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