$2 FullPay dueces downtown

[Rob.Singer]

So it's running it's expected course. I wonder if they achieved their objective. Maybe Dancer can report on that too. That's the most interesting part of this.

The first thing I do when I go to any casino is ask if they could turn on the double up feature. I hit it (Lady Luck) up twice before they closed around 2006. This is the type of place that could still be vulnerable, as they were closed for years including the time when the IGT memo and fix came out.

[kewlJ]

This is the type of place that could still be vulnerable, as they were closed for years including the time when the IGT memo and fix came out.

Downtown Grand is owned by 5th Street Gaming, who owns other casinos in the Vegas area. They got the memos.

[Rob.Singer]

This is the type of place that could still be vulnerable, as they were closed for years including the time when the IGT memo and fix came out.

Downtown Grand is owned by 5th Street Gaming, who owns other casinos in the Vegas area. They got the memos.

That's MSNBC-type posturing kew, which makes you again look silly. Aside from the obvious 5th St. Gaming revelation, the point was, were any or all the machines attended to within a closed casino? Were any machines in-transit at the time? Each of these situations lend to a higher probability that a machine or 3 or more was missed.

Please wise up.

[kewlJ]

That's MSNBC-type posturing kew, which makes you again look silly. Aside from the obvious 5th St. Gaming revelation, the point was, were any or all the machines attended to within a closed casino? Were any machines in-transit at the time? Each of these situations lend to a higher probability that a machine or 3 or more was missed.

Please wise up.

YOU wise up Rob. The only thing you have right here is that one off us looks silly. Have you even been inside Downtown Grand? I am guessing not because if you had, you would know the machines are not 25 year old machines that had been sitting for 10 years. The machines were all brand new, late model, when they opened.

The property changed hands several times while it was closed. The machines that were in there during Lady Luck era are long gone. I don't know if the go back to the manufacturer or are sold, possible to some other casino or what, but they weren't just sitting there for 10 years.

A better "angle" would have been to do a little research and see if you could determine where some of those machines went. But just to make a statement about them sitting there idol for 10 years is ludicrous.

[Rob.Singer]

The answer kew is you're tossing out things hoping one of your nonsensical whims will stick. It's simply another case of you not wanting something that I said to be as insightful as it really is.

Lady Luck had a lot of machines that were put in after the newer generation came out in '02. Common business sense says machines stick around in situations like they went thru. It took 3-1/2 years for the machines at Casino Monte Lago to be taken out, and unlike LL/DTG, there was no ongoing prospect of re-opening soon. And I've been in DTG last year asking for DU. The attendant said he'd be back but no one showed. That's why I asked the question here. Chances are that they did not put all new machines in while they were closed for years and when they re-opened as DTG. Casinos who operated straight thru that period didn't do that so why would you claim they did.

If you can point me to a site that gives accurate info on Lady Luck/DTG machines' history I'll research it. But you can't, can you. That was your silly inner MSNBC talking again.

[kewlJ]

OMG Rob, you are doing the Alan shuffle.

I didn't say I knew where the machines went, so don't try to turn it by issuing a challenge of something I never said. I said "a better angle would be to maybe try to find out where they did go".

Lady Luck was closed for 10 years Rob. It wasn't a short term closure where it was expected they would be open in a couple years. And like I said the property changed hands several times during that period.

The fact is that you said something really stupid, speculating that the current machines were sitting there idol for a decade and now might be susceptible to the double up bug because they "missed getting the memo", when all evidence says otherwise....new machines and a company that operates other casinos and gaming outlets in Las Vegas area. So they would have gotten the memos. So I am not surprised you are trying to wiggle out now.

And you know Rob, this kind of thing is exactly what I am talking about with credibility. You will spin this in that I am attacking you because I don't like you. But the fact is that you just aren't credible in most things that you say.

[jbjb]

The "Alan Shuffle" haha I love it!

[tableplay]

Whatever the players' speed and accuracy for however long, I hope they bring the house down soon so we can get a true explanation for all this. I'm still surprised they haven't slowed the FPDW machines down. Even more surprised it's lasted this long.

According to your buddy Dancer:

"As of today, Monday, they are down to 8 $1 FPDW games. The other 30 or so machines that used to have $1 or $2 FPDW on them are 15-11-4-4-3."

Good ole APDW. Once found it in the 50-play variety with good players club (and could play penny denom if desired).

[redietz]

This "debate" is just silly. Lady Luck closed, I believe, in late 2005. Downtown Grand opened late 2014. It would be a very, very unusual business strategy to pump $100 million into renovating a property and retain machines more than 10 years old. Video poker machines, if I recall correctly, ballpark at about 15K each. So a place the size of the Lady Luck, maybe holding a max of what, a 100 video poker machines on the high end? You do the math.

The problem with some people's "common sense" is the lack of common sense. I don't think what television news somebody watches has much to do with the math of doing business or common sense, but, you know, that's just common sense.

Here's a brilliant fucking idea. Somebody ask them. "How many 10-year-old machines did you keep after spending $100 million on renovations?" Oh right, I'll be there Monday. I'll ask them.

Oh yeah, the property was described as "gutted" in multiple articles. So we're talking removing and storing 100 more-than-10-year-old video poker machines, then reinstalling them onto brand new carpeting and flooring to spiff up the place.

As some folks like to say, "It's not impossible. it could have happened."

[kewlJ]

This "debate" is just silly. Lady Luck closed, I believe, in late 2005. Downtown Grand opened late 2014. It would be a very, very unusual business strategy to pump $100 million into renovating a property and retain machines more than 10 years old. Video poker machines, if I recall correctly, ballpark at about 15K each. So a place the size of the Lady Luck, maybe holding a max of what, a 100 video poker machines on the high end? You do the math.

The problem with some people's "common sense" is the lack of common sense. I don't think what television news somebody watches has much to do with the math of doing business or common sense, but, you know, that's just common sense.

Here's a brilliant fucking idea. Somebody ask them. "How many 10-year-old machines did you keep after spending $100 million on renovations?" Oh right, I'll be there Monday. I'll ask them.

This is correct. If 5th Street Gaming just wanted to re-open Lady Luck, they would have done that. That is not what they were doing. They wanted everything new. They thought they were going to be the bright, shiny, new spot in the downtown area. New Name, new rooms, new restaurants, new everything. You don't do that and then using 20 year old outdated machines, the very thing that brings people in and generates the revenue.

Even if someone didn't know this, and was walking in DTG for the first time, you can tell just from the players card software and setup that these are newer model machines.

[Rob.Singer]

OMG Rob, you are doing the Alan shuffle.

I didn't say I knew where the machines went, so don't try to turn it by issuing a challenge of something I never said. I said "a better angle would be to maybe try to find out where they did go".

Lady Luck was closed for 10 years Rob. It wasn't a short term closure where it was expected they would be open in a couple years. And like I said the property changed hands several times during that period.

The fact is that you said something really stupid, speculating that the current machines were sitting there idol for a decade and now might be susceptible to the double up bug because they "missed getting the memo", when all evidence says otherwise....new machines and a company that operates other casinos and gaming outlets in Las Vegas area. So they would have gotten the memos. So I am not surprised you are trying to wiggle out now.

And you know Rob, this kind of thing is exactly what I am talking about with credibility. You will spin this in that I am attacking you because I don't like you. But the fact is that you just aren't credible in most things that you say.

What's going on here is you really do not know what you're talking about, and you're trying to squirm out of it by evoking the name of someone who obviously still haunts you for all your ridiculous, unsubstantiated claims that have caused you to scramble around the internet forums for years, trying desperately to get others to believe your crap.

Take this as yet another teachable moment that effectively combats all of your cringe worthy BS. The casino was not closed for "10 years" unless that alternate math you use in your bj claims also accepts 2006-2013 being "10 years". And it was continually on the cusp of being re-opened within a year during that entire time. That dictates chances are that machines stayed on. Unless, of course, anyone has a hair on their ass like you always do about the intelligence I bring forward in issues such as this. I know you get irritated by how I present these things. And you're not alone.

[Rob.Singer]

This "debate" is just silly. Lady Luck closed, I believe, in late 2005. Downtown Grand opened late 2014. It would be a very, very unusual business strategy to pump $100 million into renovating a property and retain machines more than 10 years old. Video poker machines, if I recall correctly, ballpark at about 15K each. So a place the size of the Lady Luck, maybe holding a max of what, a 100 video poker machines on the high end? You do the math.

The problem with some people's "common sense" is the lack of common sense. I don't think what television news somebody watches has much to do with the math of doing business or common sense, but, you know, that's just common sense.

Here's a brilliant fucking idea. Somebody ask them. "How many 10-year-old machines did you keep after spending $100 million on renovations?" Oh right, I'll be there Monday. I'll ask them.

Oh yeah, the property was described as "gutted" in multiple articles. So we're talking removing and storing 100 more-than-10-year-old video poker machines, then reinstalling them onto brand new carpeting and flooring to spiff up the place.

As some folks like to say, "It's not impossible. it could have happened."

You're failing if you're trying to help kew. LL closed in 2006. DTG opened in 2013. And all casinos LEASE machines for long periods of time. In cases where casinos close with the expectation of another entity purchasing it and re-opening, machines do not not leave. 10 yr. old machines are not OLD these days since the 2002-2005 generations arrived. In established casinos, there are far more of those than there are "new" ones. Go ahead and research it like kew tries to give the perception he would do. I do it all the time because I'm looking for certain age machines.

Asking DTG helps but it's doubtful any 2013 employees are still there. I just called and two casino supervisors said they had no idea.

[PIGGY BANKER]

This "debate" is just silly. Lady Luck closed, I believe, in late 2005. Downtown Grand opened late 2014. It would be a very, very unusual business strategy to pump $100 million into renovating a property and retain machines more than 10 years old. Video poker machines, if I recall correctly, ballpark at about 15K each. So a place the size of the Lady Luck, maybe holding a max of what, a 100 video poker machines on the high end? You do the math.

The problem with some people's "common sense" is the lack of common sense. I don't think what television news somebody watches has much to do with the math of doing business or common sense, but, you know, that's just common sense.

Here's a brilliant fucking idea. Somebody ask them. "How many 10-year-old machines did you keep after spending $100 million on renovations?" Oh right, I'll be there Monday. I'll ask them.

Oh yeah, the property was described as "gutted" in multiple articles. So we're talking removing and storing 100 more-than-10-year-old video poker machines, then reinstalling them onto brand new carpeting and flooring to spiff up the place.

As some folks like to say, "It's not impossible. it could have happened."

I just called and two casino supervisors said they had no idea.

Are you mentally fatigued?

[mickeycrimm]

Dancer is on the big play at The Palms currently

Whats the big play at the Palms?

[Rob.Singer]

This "debate" is just silly. Lady Luck closed, I believe, in late 2005. Downtown Grand opened late 2014. It would be a very, very unusual business strategy to pump $100 million into renovating a property and retain machines more than 10 years old. Video poker machines, if I recall correctly, ballpark at about 15K each. So a place the size of the Lady Luck, maybe holding a max of what, a 100 video poker machines on the high end? You do the math.

The problem with some people's "common sense" is the lack of common sense. I don't think what television news somebody watches has much to do with the math of doing business or common sense, but, you know, that's just common sense.

Here's a brilliant fucking idea. Somebody ask them. "How many 10-year-old machines did you keep after spending $100 million on renovations?" Oh right, I'll be there Monday. I'll ask them.

Oh yeah, the property was described as "gutted" in multiple articles. So we're talking removing and storing 100 more-than-10-year-old video poker machines, then reinstalling them onto brand new carpeting and flooring to spiff up the place.

As some folks like to say, "It's not impossible. it could have happened."

I just called and two casino supervisors said they had no idea.

Are you mentally fatigued?

I got lots of time right now Pig. Fatigued? I'm in my prime.

This should have been a simple question with easy yes/no answers from those of you here who went to DTG recently: "Has anyone asked for DU or not"? And I gave my reason why, which I submitted after reading all the history of what went on there over the recent years. But we have a person here who thrives in conflict on the internet, and he gets severely agitated whenever anyone brings up a point about LV before he ever gets close to it.

[mickeycrimm]

I think this is what the timeline looks like

On Friday, 11 July, DTG installs FPDW with denoms from 25 cents to $2 on all their video pokers, excluding bartops. Card is worth .2%. It brings in a lot of players.

On Friday, 18 July, video poker is disqualified from receiving points.

On Saturday, 19 July, the $2 denoms were changed from FPDW to APDW.

So that would leave denoms of 25 cent, fifty cent, and $1.

We'll see how long that lasts. Getting rid of the $2 denom probably got rid of the bigger bankrolled players that don't care for $1 denom because they won't work that cheap.

[redietz]

This "debate" is just silly. Lady Luck closed, I believe, in late 2005. Downtown Grand opened late 2014. It would be a very, very unusual business strategy to pump $100 million into renovating a property and retain machines more than 10 years old. Video poker machines, if I recall correctly, ballpark at about 15K each. So a place the size of the Lady Luck, maybe holding a max of what, a 100 video poker machines on the high end? You do the math.

The problem with some people's "common sense" is the lack of common sense. I don't think what television news somebody watches has much to do with the math of doing business or common sense, but, you know, that's just common sense.

Here's a brilliant fucking idea. Somebody ask them. "How many 10-year-old machines did you keep after spending $100 million on renovations?" Oh right, I'll be there Monday. I'll ask them.

Oh yeah, the property was described as "gutted" in multiple articles. So we're talking removing and storing 100 more-than-10-year-old video poker machines, then reinstalling them onto brand new carpeting and flooring to spiff up the place.

As some folks like to say, "It's not impossible. it could have happened."

You're failing if you're trying to help kew. LL closed in 2006. DTG opened in 2013. And all casinos LEASE machines for long periods of time. In cases where casinos close with the expectation of another entity purchasing it and re-opening, machines do not not leave. 10 yr. old machines are not OLD these days since the 2002-2005 generations arrived. In established casinos, there are far more of those than there are "new" ones. Go ahead and research it like kew tries to give the perception he would do. I do it all the time because I'm looking for certain age machines.

Asking DTG helps but it's doubtful any 2013 employees are still there. I just called and two casino supervisors said they had no idea.

LOL. Yeah, "all casinos LEASE machines for long periods of time." Yeah, let's examine that statement. First of all, we're talking video poker, not all machines. But to give certain people a break, let's say we're talking all machines. According to Global Gaming Business magazine, 85% of domestic slot machines are owned by casinos and 15% are leased, as of 2018. Video poker is more one-sided.

[mcap]

Rob you are starting to sound almost exactly like Rachel Maddow trying to explain away your dumbass comments. Wise up, you’re embarrassing yourself

[kewlJ]

Singer is continuing to tap dance. If you want to score him points for the technicality that I said it was closed for a decade when it was 7 years 8 months fine. I didn't look it up. I just used the decade time frame as a generality. Everything else he is completely wrong about and making shit up. "Continually on the cusp of being re-opened within a year during that entire time" is complete bullshit. Completely made up.

I moved to Vegas in 2009 and was making several trips a year prior to that and Lady Luck was never on the cusp of re-opening. It was always much closer to complete demolition that re-opening. There were numerous "demolition" deadlines that were missed, as you would see these stories on the local news at night. Plus I play downtown 2-3 times a week and one of my regular stops is 2 blocks from DTG. I know when a place is "on the cusp of re-opening". Saying Lady Luck was continually on the cusp of re-opening is like saying The Western is continually on the cusp of re-opening. It's nonsense.

Now Rob says "he looks for the older machines all the time". I don't doubt that. But the machines in DTG are not the older models. Again, you can tell this from the players card technology and system. This is a system that has only been around a few years. And this is the timeline for when the machines were installed. They were newer generation machines. New when the place opened.

[Rob.Singer]

Kew, wipe the sweat away and stop crying. Maybe it'll enlighten you. I'm so sad that I had to catch you in a lie about "10 years".

Machines from '02-'05 are not "old machines". And I invite you to read the casino's history on the web. It explains a timeline of expecting to re-open and then setback after setback until they finally opened again.

Rest better tonight.