The Adventures of MDawg (in progress)

[jbjb]

Why don't you guys just block and ignore those fools instead of responding to their trolling? Makes life much easier. We're forced to hear enough outlandish stories while at the tables so why subject yourself to them here?

[MisterV]

It's a character flaw within the actor...but tewlj is blaming the victim.

So, you claim I have "a character flaw," do you?

What "flaw" do you claim I have, exactly?

While what I did was arguably a bit "chicken shit" and / or "third grade," it did not rise to the level of showing "a character flaw."

Someone can only poke a bee hive with a stick so many times before they get stung.

I believe that what you consider to be my "flaw," if such there be, is my apparent inability to tolerate a month long exposure to seemingly impossible brags and claims blasted daily across the forums in oreder to generate attention for the claimant.

[MDawg]

Probably this issue should just die, because it's not going to get into this guy's head.

May an alcoholic solve his own alcoholism? Is an alcoholic able to just wake up one morning and pull himself up by the bootstraps and stop drinking? No! Why? Because he has a bad head, and a bad head cannot cure itself. Alcoholics need the help of a higher power to cure themselves.

Similarly, this guy, he has some sort of self loathing that leads to lashing out to pull down others, even where there is no benefit to himself. Will any amount of talk or reasoning convince the guy that he has a bad head? No.

Just like UNKewlJ - the guy is obviously mentally ill, manic as hell unable to shake recurring thoughts of MDawg, R.Singer, whatever out of his head. DarkOz is no better - may he ever ignore any comment and let it go? Never!

These guys are all somehow off. Misfits, all. Self loathing and envious of anyone who is actually doing anything. And - again - it's one think to not let it go and talk on and on about how this or that must be a lie etc. etc. So what, that goes with the territory in internet forums. Although - to the level UNKewlJ obsesses over it - not normal! REDietz can't seem to let go of his absurd obsession with anonymity either. Repetitive manic thoughts from many of these guys. But still, if you want to say once or twice that you don't believe something, and then ignore, fine!

But to pick up the phone and bring outside authorities into it, shows a committed level of depravity.

[MisterV]

Not sure who specifically you're referring to, sounds like both KJ and myself, so I'll respond.

In the late nineties I was drinking way too much; one morning I woke up to find I'd puked the bed and had slept in my own vomit.

Hello, wake up call: I decided then and there to quit drinking and I have not consumed alcohol since; no outside help involved, just self control.

A couple years previously I decided to quit smoking tobacco cold turkey, without outside help: I haven't touched the stuff since.

"A bad head;" "self-loathing" my ass: you know nothing about me in the real world, boyo.

So far as me picking up the phone and bringing in outside authorities: WTF?

I sent an email with some links to the two casinos you claimed you were raping on a daily basis: quit trying to spin the facts.

"Depravity?"

Really?

It's not like I'm some asshole out there claiming I always win big money playing negative expectation casino games: now THAT'S depravity!

[coach belly]

I believe that what you consider to be my "flaw," if such there be, is my apparent inability to tolerate a month long exposure to seemingly impossible brags and claims blasted daily across the forums in oreder to generate attention for the claimant.

MDawg wasn't poking your hive with a month-long exposure to his trip reports.

You returned from a 21-month hiatus, and within the first week back you wrote this...

He is determined; crazy as a shit-house rat perhaps, but determined nonetheless.

Quite the unrepentant, unapologetic and unhinged attention whore.

[accountinquestion]

Not sure who specifically you're referring to, sounds like both KJ and myself, so I'll respond.

In the late nineties I was drinking way too much; one morning I woke up to find I'd puked the bed and had slept in my own vomit.

Hello, wake up call: I decided then and there to quit drinking and I have not consumed alcohol since; no outside help involved, just self control.

A couple years previously I decided to quit smoking tobacco cold turkey, without outside help: I haven't touched the stuff since.

"A bad head;" "self-loathing" my ass: you know nothing about me in the real world, boyo.

So far as me picking up the phone and bringing in outside authorities: WTF?

I sent an email with some links to the two casinos you claimed you were raping on a daily basis: quit trying to spin the facts.

"Depravity?"

Really?

It's not like I'm some asshole out there claiming I always win big money playing negative expectation casino games: now THAT'S depravity!

He's an idiot. Why respond to him? The world is full of people who drank too much when they were younger then all at once decided it wasn't so fun and either quit or cut it way back. Myself included. I read first paragraph of mdawgs shit then wrote it off as 2bit troll bullshit. You should do the same. He's not even a good troll IMO. Maybe my standards are way off.

[The Boz]

In all the years since the internet was born no one has come across unexposed as MDawg has on gambling forums.

Singer may have claimed unbelievable stuff, but who he was in the “real” world was quickly exposed. While it didn’t change his claims, we knew who he was. And Rob never hid it, from Alan’s interviews to the ones he did with the Wizard.

But this MDawg character makes claims that most know are impossible, and are by far the biggest ever of an anonymous poster on these forums.

So one of the questions is should he be allowed to post these claims on both this forum and the Wizards under the guise of an anonymous poster?

My thought is he makes a mockery of both math and common sense. And again, most of us know it. But he also brings up many ethical questions in regards to not only these forums, but the internet in general. People can claim anything they want on the internet and dream of people believing them, envying them, respecting them and much more. But MDawg takes it to degrees above most, especially when it comes to gambling and claims about his life.

So I’m asking the thoughts of others if his real name should be exposed if one knows exactly who he is? Not only his name and address, but also the firm he works for, who his father is, his fathers net north based on public records, his wife’s name and much more?

It was done to Rob “Singer”, so should it be done to MDawg? I was exposed multiple times and I’m a small fish compared to “MDawg”. And at this point I really don’t care if anyone knows my history, my life and where I live. And if anyone comes after me they are obviously a crazy who deserved what they get. Is MDawg in the same situation?

IF someone has found out exactly who he is, are they right or wrong exposing him after all the warning signs he was given about exposing his tales?

I’m thinking most will be against it in general, but I’m putting it out there if he is a special case, like some think Rob was when they posted things about him. Some of which were true, and other things that could never be proven.

Of course all of this is speculation someone paid an investigator to find out if the guy posting so much information on the internet to prove he was legitimate was a real person.

[monet]

I don't read 99% of the posts so it doesn't bother me.
I guess some of you are hooked into reading the posts.
I understand but find it funny when people call for banishment.
It's sort of like Howard Stern in the 80s and 90s and the FCC and other calling for his banishment.
As he and others said... just change the channel or turn off the radio.
Nobody is forced to read any posts... including mine.
Anyways... I got to drive through somewhat rush hour traffic to bet more hockey.
See you all later!

[The Boz]

My point is Rob was exposed, on many fronts including addresses and tax records. Including unproven claims of fraud charges.

Christopher Mitchell had his home address, previous porn star career and more exposed on one of Dan’s forums.

Is “MDawg” different? And why do you feel this way?

And IF someone paid to find this information out and has it, should they expose it? And if you think they shouldn’t, also explain why?

[MaxPen]

In all the years since the internet was born no one has come across unexposed as MDawg has on gambling forums.

Singer may have claimed unbelievable stuff, but who he was in the “real” world was quickly exposed. While it didn’t change his claims, we knew who he was. And Rob never hid it, from Alan’s interviews to the ones he did with the Wizard.

But this MDawg character makes claims that most know are impossible, and are by far the biggest ever of an anonymous poster on these forums.

So one of the questions is should he be allowed to post these claims on both this forum and the Wizards under the guise of an anonymous poster?

My thought is he makes a mockery of both math and common sense. And again, most of us know it. But he also brings up many ethical questions in regards to not only these forums, but the internet in general. People can claim anything they want on the internet and dream of people believing them, envying them, respecting them and much more. But MDawg takes it to degrees above most, especially when it comes to gambling and claims about his life.

So I’m asking the thoughts of others if his real name should be exposed if one knows exactly who he is? Not only his name and address, but also the firm he works for, who his father is, his fathers net north based on public records, his wife’s name and much more?

It was done to Rob “Singer”, so should it be done to MDawg? I was exposed multiple times and I’m a small fish compared to “MDawg”. And at this point I really don’t care if anyone knows my history, my life and where I live. And if anyone comes after me they are obviously a crazy who deserved what they get. Is MDawg in the same situation?

IF someone has found out exactly who he is, are they right or wrong exposing him after all the warning signs he was given about exposing his tales?

I’m thinking most will be against it in general, but I’m putting it out there if he is a special case, like some think Rob was when they posted things about him. Some of were true, and other things that could never be proven.

Of course all of this is speculation someone paid an investigator to find out if the guy posting so much information on the internet to prove he was legitimate was a real person.

Singer exposed himself. Way different than exposing someone who wishes to be anonymous. Even with all I know about Singer I chose to never expose anything that hadn't already been exposed. I also could have fully broken him but allowed him to bow out semi gracefully.

Just my opinion but I would just let MDog talk to himself. I don't pay attention to him. So maybe I am wrong and don't fully understand the problem people have with him.

[coach belly]

And if you think they shouldn’t, also explain why?

It would violate the forum rules and terms of service,
which you agreed to when you signed up to the forum.

I'm not sure if those things are enforced, and membership here
probably doesn't matter to anyone who violates the terms anyway.

But, isn't doxxing illegal?

[redietz]

My point is Rob was exposed, on many fronts including addresses and tax records. Including unproven claims of fraud charges.

Christopher Mitchell had his home address, previous porn star career and more exposed on one of Dan’s forums.

Is “MDawg” different? And why do you feel this way?

And IF someone paid to find this information out and has it, should they expose it? And if you think they shouldn’t, also explain why?

As I chow down yesterday's BOGO Buffalo Wild Wings (since I could not locate one of them fancy 5K buffets MDawg's buddy suggested), I agree with Boz regarding the MDawg effect, if you will. MDawg brings up some interesting ethical questions, not so much about himself, but about how others tolerate or react to him.

MDawg made a mockery of the WoV forum pretty effectively while also getting Shackleford to create Rube Goldberg posting rules that protect him. That's quite an accomplishment. I suspect it's because Shackleford is too lazy to really monitor the forum on a post by post basis, so he'd rather coast by with rules that allow MDawg to clearly mock the alleged math-based raison d'etre of that forum. MDawg is effectively trolling all APs, or even any recreational math-based casino goers.

He's tried to do the same thing here, with recruiting wing men and all that, and he's had some success. The mocking here comes through less clearly unless you get mickey and Axelwolf and kewlJ rumbling with the dawg.

The question is, why do site owners tolerate gambling fantasy on their sites when, like Witteles, you're a math-immersed poker pro or, like Shackleford, your whole gig is math? Why do they allow their readers to have to cope with a dominant poster who thumbs his nose at math? That, in my opinion, is the real question for debate.

But, to Boz's point. Should MDawg be exposed? If you'll notice, the Dawg doesn't directly go after me, probably because I'm a real person who frequents LV as many a hundred days a year, so odds are if I want to figure out who he is, I can, with or without my retired P.I. brother-in-law's guidance.

Book plug for the brother-in-law:

https://www.amazon.com/Serious-Surve.../dp/0873646657


I have zero issue with doxxing anyone who steps on my toes, and I have said this on many occasions. I'll stick your name in USA Today if properly motivated. So I have no reticence regarding "Doxxing the Dawg (that should be an album title)." But I have suspicions about why he's involved in this gig, and I have no issue with the rationales. He has, however, taken it more than a mite too far. If you're going to prove that somebody's girlfriend is cheating on them, it's best to not provide them with crayon-drawn caricatures of the alleged cheating as your proof.

I realize MDawg may have Shackleford in his pocket, and I do not appreciate my fine "Adventures of E.R.Dietz" thread being locked on MDawg's command, more or less, but I'm not going to blow up his car for it. At least not this week.

And for those who wonder about who keeps tabs on whom in LV, I will let you in on a little secret. Remember when, after 9/11, all the people visiting LV and checking in to hotels automatically went into a fed data base that was actively monitored. And same with manifests for incoming planes. Remember that stuff? It has not disappeared. And the feds are not beyond sharing that information. So bear that in mind the next time you think you can hide in LV.

[kewlJ]

So I’m asking the thoughts of others if his real name should be exposed if one knows exactly who he is? Not only his name and address, but also the firm he works for, who his father is, his fathers net north based on public records, his wife’s name and much more?

It was done to Rob “Singer”, so should it be done to MDawg? I was exposed multiple times and I’m a small fish compared to “MDawg”. And at this point I really don’t care if anyone knows my history, my life and where I live. And if anyone comes after me they are obviously a crazy who deserved what they get. Is MDawg in the same situation?

IF someone has found out exactly who he is, are they right or wrong exposing him after all the warning signs he was given about exposing his tales?

My view:

No Mdawg should not be exposed and forced to reveal his real name. These forums are anonymous forums. Without that you will have absolutely zero participation by real advantage players. Many/most already don't won't participate (at least on open forums), but force them to use real name and none would.

There is a difference with Rob Singer. He chose to have people know who he was. So he himself opened the door to people looking into his personal finances to see that they not only didn't match, but absolutely conflicted with his claims. He chose to reveal who he was 20 years ago, long before he stole the double up bug claim and tied it to a ridiculous claim of 1.5 million dollar Newell, so he probably didn't anticipate how he was exposing himself, but never-the-less he exposed himself.


As far as proving claims, again this is an anonymous message board. It is the only way it works. So no one is required to prove claims. I myself have claims of very modest success over my 11 years in Vegas, that some don't believe. That is fine. It is up to everyone to figure out for themselves who is credible, knows what they are talking about and claims fall within the realm of possibility based on math.

And here in lies the problem. When claims are so extreme as to defy math and I'll say reasonable probably (not possibility as I would like to say), and the claims just keep going everyday for years, and years, growing in number (money won, never a losing session), there comes a time when the person needs to prove their claims, to satisfy the forum administrators that provide the platform for such claims.

That is where we are here. Both Wizard and Dan Druff have basically said, "time to put up or shut up". And they have that right. I would argue they have that responsibility when claims get to this level. I mean how often have you seen either forum owner/administrator make that call. I have never seen it. So it is not calling out every claim. There are plenty of claims that don't seem likely, that no one is asked to prove. But when it gets to this extreme, defying the math, for this kind of money and this length of time...YES. Otherwise it just makes a mockery of the forum and the math, which I am now certain is the intent with this Mdawg person.

[kewlJ]

I guess, I should amend the above where I said how often have we seen Wizard and Dan Druff call on members to, show something in regards to extreme claims. I said I have never seen it. How quickly we (I) forget the great Rob Singer now that he is gone. Both Wizard and Dan Druff called on Singer to produce something, some kind of supporting evidence in the last year. And rightfully so. Of course he couldn't, tried and failed at fabricating something and that is why he has disappeared. So it worked just as it should have. So Mdawg is number 2 that I can recall for each forum. And again, I will say rightfully so, in my opinion.

[accountinquestion]

MaxPen is right.. not sure why people care much. Just ignore him. People choose to believe all sorts of fantasies. If the existence of mdawg makes thing think otherwise, how are we going to do anything to counter this? It flies in the face of common gambling sense and everyone knows it is bullshit on some sort of levels.

If he didn't have access to the pictures of the chips then he wouldn't be listened to. It may very well be the guy is very wealthy through some weird occurance and loses yet lies about it to get validation on a forum of gamblers. Why care?

[BoSox]

So I’m asking the thoughts of others if his real name should be exposed if one knows exactly who he is? Not only his name and address, but also the firm he works for, who his father is, his fathers net north based on public records, his wife’s name and much more?

It was done to Rob “Singer”, so should it be done to MDawg? I was exposed multiple times and I’m a small fish compared to “MDawg”. And at this point I really don’t care if anyone knows my history, my life and where I live. And if anyone comes after me they are obviously a crazy who deserved what they get. Is MDawg in the same situation?

IF someone has found out exactly who he is, are they right or wrong exposing him after all the warning signs he was given about exposing his tales?

My view:

No Mdawg should not be exposed and forced to reveal his real name. These forums are anonymous forums. Without that you will have absolutely zero participation by real advantage players. Many/most already don't won't participate (at least on open forums), but force them to use real name and none would.

There is a difference with Rob Singer. He chose to have people know who he was. So he himself opened the door to people looking into his personal finances to see that they not only didn't match, but absolutely conflicted with his claims. He chose to reveal who he was 20 years ago, long before he stole the double up bug claim and tied it to a ridiculous claim of 1.5 million dollar Newell, so he probably didn't anticipate how he was exposing himself, but never-the-less he exposed himself.


As far as proving claims, again this is an anonymous message board. It is the only way it works. So no one is required to prove claims. I myself have claims of very modest success over my 11 years in Vegas, that some don't believe. That is fine. It is up to everyone to figure out for themselves who is credible, knows what they are talking about and claims fall within the realm of possibility based on math.

And here in lies the problem. When claims are so extreme as to defy math and I'll say reasonable probably (not possibility as I would like to say), and the claims just keep going everyday for years, and years, growing in number (money won, never a losing session), there comes a time when the person needs to prove their claims, to satisfy the forum administrators that provide the platform for such claims.

That is where we are here. Both Wizard and Dan Druff have basically said, "time to put up or shut up". And they have that right. I would argue they have that responsibility when claims get to this level. I mean how often have you seen either forum owner/administrator make that call. I have never seen it. So it is not calling out every claim. There are plenty of claims that don't seem likely, that no one is asked to prove. But when it gets to this extreme, defying the math, for this kind of money and this length of time...YES. Otherwise it just makes a mockery of the forum and the math, which I am now certain is the intent with this Mdawg person.

KJ, your use of the word "certain" is part of your persona and is to be taken lightly.

[BoSox]

Why don't you guys just block and ignore those fools instead of responding to their trolling? Makes life much easier. We're forced to hear enough outlandish stories while at the tables so why subject yourself to them here?

I agree with the above quote. Especially since the ownerships are determined to stay out of it.

[Mission146]

My point is Rob was exposed, on many fronts including addresses and tax records. Including unproven claims of fraud charges.

Christopher Mitchell had his home address, previous porn star career and more exposed on one of Dan’s forums.

Is “MDawg” different? And why do you feel this way?

And IF someone paid to find this information out and has it, should they expose it? And if you think they shouldn’t, also explain why?

Christopher Mitchell is engaged in the outright sale of gambling systems.

Rob Singer exposed his own identity and promoted his video poker, "System," or whatever you would call it---special plays and whatnot. Honestly, I'd have more a beef with Singer if it had been proven that he did the DUB and continued to promote his system after that.

As far as I can tell with MDawg, he's not trying to sell any sort of Baccarat system. It would also seem that he would prefer to post anonymously. From reading a few of his posts, it doesn't seem that his, "System," even follows any real consistent set of rules that are set in stone...so there's nothing for him to sell. He talks about betting into streaks and things like that, but in his most recent WoV post (and I think one prior) he was supposedly down a good bit and took a big shot. The most recent post would have it that he bet 9k on Player and won, but implies that it would have been game over for the day at -28k had he lost.

Unless I'm missing something, MDawg's play seems pretty erratic...and that's just based on how he reports it, not on my guessing as to anything. The only real consistency I can find is that he seems somewhat content to take small wins and is not afraid of sustaining a comparably big loss. To the extent that any real, "System," exists, that tendency can lead to a high probability of winning an individual, 'Session,' however you care to define that.

As far as whether his claims are bullshit, or not, I'd say everyone is free to make their own conclusions. The claims themselves, at this point and only in my opinion, cannot be mathematically proven to be absolutely untrue. It would seem that for anyone inclined to prove them untrue would be forced to, "Expose," him in some way not directly related to the, "System," itself.

How would this come about? I guess someone would want to try to figure out who he is and disprove that he has the sort of money that he claims to have, etc. etc. Personally, I see no reason that anyone should want to do that. If MDawg's claims were patently untrue and he got his rocks off by bragging about things that are not happening as an anonymous poster on various gambling forums, that would be kind of sad. Perhaps more sad would be for someone to be so bothered by these postings that they would spend time and money in order to disprove them.

You certainly wouldn't want to see it get so pervasive that you end up with 100 anonymous posters with an equivalent to, "Adventures of MDawg," thread, but even if that happened, there are responses to that from an Admin standpoint. The easiest and quickest response to that would be to consolidate all of those threads into one thread just called, "Trip Reports," and then everyone has to post there rather than create new threads just for their own reports. Of course, I hypothesize, because it obviously hasn't gotten to that point yet.

For any of MDawg's, "Detractors," for lack of a better term, I tend to agree with MaxPen---just ignore him. His thread is 368 pages and over 3,700 posts and he certainly didn't put them all there. If someone thinks that the goal of his thread is to draw attention to himself, then you certainly don't rectify that by giving him more of it.

Like I said before, the veracity of his claims and my personal opinion of them makes me neither richer nor poorer.

[Mission146]

KewlJ also makes a good point. You either want to protect people who intend to post anonymously from Doxxing or you don't. It creates a pretty slippery slope when we start coming up with justifications for that protection not to apply.

[GOD]

My point is Rob was exposed, on many fronts including addresses and tax records. Including unproven claims of fraud charges.

Christopher Mitchell had his home address, previous porn star career and more exposed on one of Dan’s forums.

Is “MDawg” different? And why do you feel this way?

And IF someone paid to find this information out and has it, should they expose it? And if you think they shouldn’t, also explain why?

As I chow down yesterday's BOGO Buffalo Wild Wings (since I could not locate one of them fancy 5K buffets MDawg's buddy suggested), I agree with Boz regarding the MDawg effect, if you will. MDawg brings up some interesting ethical questions, not so much about himself, but about how others tolerate or react to him.

MDawg made a mockery of the WoV forum pretty effectively while also getting Shackleford to create Rube Goldberg posting rules that protect him. That's quite an accomplishment. I suspect it's because Shackleford is too lazy to really monitor the forum on a post by post basis, so he'd rather coast by with rules that allow MDawg to clearly mock the alleged math-based raison d'etre of that forum. MDawg is effectively trolling all APs, or even any recreational math-based casino goers.

He's tried to do the same thing here, with recruiting wing men and all that, and he's had some success. The mocking here comes through less clearly unless you get mickey and Axelwolf and kewlJ rumbling with the dawg.

The question is, why do site owners tolerate gambling fantasy on their sites when, like Witteles, you're a math-immersed poker pro or, like Shackleford, your whole gig is math? Why do they allow their readers to have to cope with a dominant poster who thumbs his nose at math? That, in my opinion, is the real question for debate.

But, to Boz's point. Should MDawg be exposed? If you'll notice, the Dawg doesn't directly go after me, probably because I'm a real person who frequents LV as many a hundred days a year, so odds are if I want to figure out who he is, I can, with or without my retired P.I. brother-in-law's guidance.

Book plug for the brother-in-law:

https://www.amazon.com/Serious-Surve.../dp/0873646657


I have zero issue with doxxing anyone who steps on my toes, and I have said this on many occasions. I'll stick your name in USA Today if properly motivated. So I have no reticence regarding "Doxxing the Dawg (that should be an album title)." But I have suspicions about why he's involved in this gig, and I have no issue with the rationales. He has, however, taken it more than a mite too far. If you're going to prove that somebody's girlfriend is cheating on them, it's best to not provide them with crayon-drawn caricatures of the alleged cheating as your proof.

I realize MDawg may have Shackleford in his pocket, and I do not appreciate my fine "Adventures of E.R.Dietz" thread being locked on MDawg's command, more or less, but I'm not going to blow up his car for it. At least not this week.

And for those who wonder about who keeps tabs on whom in LV, I will let you in on a little secret. Remember when, after 9/11, all the people visiting LV and checking in to hotels automatically went into a fed data base that was actively monitored. And same with manifests for incoming planes. Remember that stuff? It has not disappeared. And the feds are not beyond sharing that information. So bear that in mind the next time you think you can hide in LV.

It’s all fun and games until you dox the wrong guy, and he takes it out on people you love. Some of you need to realize that many in the AP world are criminals that have little to no remorse. Everyone thinks forum games are funny online until shit hits the fan in real life. Personally I hope MDawg turns out to be a criminal who retaliates with violence for doxing him