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Thread: At last... a royal flush!

  1. #1
    It took something like 170,000 hands but I finally got a royal flush Saturday night at Harrah's Rincon. I was dealt three to the royal, Ten, Jack, King of hearts with a pair of tens playing 8/5 Bonus. Dropping the pair of tens to hold three to the royal wasn't even worth a thought as a pair of tens is a non-paying hand.

    Royals are supposed to hit about one out of 42,000 hands playing this game -- so I am way, way behind. As I was waiting for my check I thought "why didn't I get this in December when I had a lot of losses to offset it for taxes?"

    Earlier in the session I was dealt four to the royal twice. Later, on a different machine after a break, I hit quad aces again playing Bonus-- and that was my first quad aces in about four trips. I was dealt two aces, and on the draw got two more aces plus a deuce. Of course I have to wonder if I would have gotten the same cards had I been playing double double bonus on that machine and not bonus?

  2. #2
    Yay!!! It has been a long and grinding wait, but there you are and (maybe) here you go!! Maybe another is just around the bend.

    Congrats and good luck in 2012.

    A friend of mine in a similar drought (yeah, about 200,000 hands) just hit one a couple of weeks ago. She was happy and relieved -- thought the gods were against her.

    Congrats!

  3. #3
    Congratulations! And what I found most refreshing about what you've been going thru & just did is how you've regularly kept everyone on LVA and/or here consistently informed on your bad luck & losses WITHOUT coming up with a miraculous good luck streak that allowed you to have the courage to tell people that you've been losing.

    I bring this up because, as I'm sure everyone always notices, folks like arcimedes and fedomalley ALWAYS make up stories of having been involved in horrible losing streaks--then suddenly busting out of them with a series of miraculous hits so thhe can say they're slightly ahead for the year while they & other math phonies can claim how the math works if you just "give it the chance". As I said, you kept all informed in real time, while arci could never do that for fear he'd not be impressing anyone any more. And fedo? He & his similarly seriously addicted wife have no clue how to even begin to have the guts to say how much they really lose.
    Last edited by Rob.Singer; 01-08-2012 at 07:08 PM.

  4. #4
    Thanks Rob and redietz. And Rob, my losing streak continues. Even last night's royal flush doesn't end it. In fact, I need three more royals to come very quickly in order to get close to what would be considered to be "long term expected return" for 8/5 Bonus.

    Last night after I hit the royal, several of the managers at Rincon and slot floor people came over to me to congratulate me on the win, and all of them commented about how my drought had been broken. Yes, they all knew I was keeping count-- 170,000 hands without a royal. As you know I had an unusual number of straight flushes over the past year and they -- and I -- would always say "maybe the next straight flush will be a royal." I didn't tell you this before but twice in the last year I was dealt suited Ten,J,Q,K and picked up the 9 for a SF but not the ace for the royal. One of those came on that night when I had four SFs in less than two hours.

    Today, I was discussing that Royal and what it really meant to me. Actually it was like climbing Mt Everest -- I did it, I got another royal. And frankly, I don't know if I still have much enthusiasm for video poker anymore.

    I think it's a game to lose -- unless you have extreme discipline to quit when you are ahead, which is part of your system, Rob. And something I want to learn to follow.

    As I told you, I hit that royal only on "free play" money -- so last night I was always ahead. But over my "career" as a video poker player (amateur, never a pro) I only have net losses.

    Here's something else to consider: At Rincon there is a very wealthy gentleman who frequently plays the $100 VP machine, 5 coins = $500. While waiting for my check last night I got into a conversation with one of the floor people and I asked "that guy who plays the $100 game, what's his starting bankroll?" It turns out his starting bankroll is $50K but he often draws on a credit line at the casino. Then I was told that a few nights before he was up something like $180,000 but would not quit without hitting a royal... and finished the night with a loss of $18,000. Imagine that-- being up $180,000 only to finish with a loss of 18-thousand dollars.

    It's sick. I think I'm going back to playing poker tourneys where I can buy in for $60 and spend a few hours at a table with other players making chit-chat between hands. I think that's a much more sane thing to do. Cash games where you buy in for $200 also seem like a more reasonable way to get entertainment.

  5. #5
    What that guy did on the $100 machine is no different than what the normal players do on much lower denomination machines--all the time. There's just a lot more of the latter.

    Having the discipline is extremely hard, but once you conquer it then it too becomes addictive because it feels so good to consistently leave with a profit. You just have to decide how much you want to leave with at a minimum, determine if your session bankroll can support that win goal, then learn how to render the casino lures irrelevant so you can leave when you choose to.

    I noticed you took a check. Never do that is my rule. I also hope you did not hand out any tips. That's just giving away some of your profit to people who would never tip you for not hitting that royal.

  6. #6
    Rob, of course I took a check. I wasn't going to walk around with that much cash. And yes, I tipped. I always tip. I know that we have differences on the subject of tipping. But why would you want to walk around with so much cash??

  7. #7
    With me it's always been a mindset of understanding that a person doesn't look any different carrying $50,000 than they do twenty bucks. It's also a reason I've always valet parked, and casinos are some of the safest places on earth anyway. I told you why I never take a check--it's simply a matter of tossing their policy of not cashing a person's check without a thorough personal review right back at them. What's good for the goose is good for the gander. All part of my overall control over the casinos I play in rather than feeling they're controlling me. Self-confidence goes a long way in this game, and the player needs every bit of it they can get.

    All you did by tipping is just give your money away for nothing. Where does it get you? Are you afraid they won't pay your next jackpots, or you'll have to wait a little longer next time? That wait should be used to savor the win anyway, so the longer the better. Are you concerned that your regular troupe of "friends" who work there and know you might look at you crossed-eyed or something? So what--another Singer lesson is you don't go to casinos to make friends or have a good time. You go to casinos for one thing only--to make money. Consistent winning will never come until all these things sink in. AP's pretend they have the advantage only the casinos hold--the math. But it is I who has the only true advantage a player can possibly hold over the casinos: common sense enough to always do exactly the opposite as the casinos and their employees want and expect you to do.
    Last edited by Rob.Singer; 01-09-2012 at 08:53 AM.

  8. #8
    Yeah, I used to tip some, but after a couple of modest tips that were met with less than enthusiasm, I just stopped. Really no point to it.

    I'm stunned that some people tip when cashing sports tickets. Maybe it's a fear of looking uncool. The only thing I'm looking for when cashing sports tickets is, "How do I wrangle a free lunch?"

  9. #9
    Rob, I tip in casinos for a handpay, and for the valet, and for room service, for the same reason I tip in restaurants. By the way, "automatic tips" are now added to some room service checks, so I always look for this so that I don't over-tip.

  10. #10
    And I also tip for the same things you do except for handpays. What's the reason or point in doing that if not due to intimidation because you're right next to the people expecting part of your handpay along with the cash just happening to be visible and available? It's just like all the people who fool themselves into tipping casino cashiers. Do you tip your BANK cashiers? Again, it's all a matter of simple common sense. What's even worse is people who are having a losing session, are behind for the year, or are behind lifetime and they STILL feel they must give out a part of their handpays!

  11. #11
    Rob, I understand that "professionals" have a different outlook on tipping than the rest of us who are casual players. There are professional poker players who do not tip because they feel that the tourney fee should cover the tips for the dealers.

    But we know that the casino floor people who give you the handpays -- and the dealers in casino games -- have low base salaries and depend on their tips for income. I do not leave a casino and walk into the general manager's office and tip him at the end of my stay. I do not walk into the front office and start tipping the accounting staff after I had a big win.

    I tip the dealers knowing that their pay structure includes tips, just as I tip the housekeeping staff.

    I guess as a recreational player it doesn't matter to me if I tip 1% of jackpot wins. And I am thankful that I can tip 1% on jackpot wins.

    Oddly enough table game players probably over tip compared to slot/video poker players. Consider this: at a $25 craps game, a player who makes a $10 passline bet for the dealers next to his $25 line bet is actually tipping 40% of his passline bet. And even if the craps player playing 5X odds on that $25 passline bet (total bet $130) that $10 "for the boys" still represents 7.7%.

  12. #12
    Not picking specifically on you, but over the years talking to hundreds of vp players who automatically gave away a part of their win as tips---their #1 reason was always "but they make so little". They also accepted that this was simply an excuse for being intimidated by the situation as I described earlier.

    This of course is weak reasoning, because the floor slugs earn more than burger flippers or frech fry cookers, yet does anybody tip them? Besides, why be at all concerned with who makes what in a casino? Do you not see that you go into them to win money for yourself & your family and not hope you hit winners so you can increase the wages of their employees?

    It all has to do with intimidation, and few ever admit to that. I wonder if after a win playing vp on-line someday, you'll still feel obligated to share some of your winnings with their employees. Maybe if you start an account up and mail in a big check to MGM or CAESARS at year's end?

  13. #13
    I tend to agree with Rob here, but it does make an interesting debate. Why not tip the burger guys or floor sweepers in the supermarket? Their salaries are lower than the hand pay floor people. The mores of casino culture say one should tip. But the mores of supermarket culture say one should not. Where do these particular curious and inconsistent mores come from?

    I tip valet. If I wreck the place, I tip housekeeping. I tip servers in restaurants and cocktail waitresses. I tip the shoeshine guy. I don't mind drawing the line at hand pays. I'm not tipping a cashier at the bank, so I'm not tipping a casino cashier. And no race or sports teller is getting a tip -- same as cashier.

  14. #14
    The sportsbook tipping or not tipping custom was recently interesting to me. I just collected today on those three small bets I won over the weekend all at the same book, but there wasn't a single sign that a tip was expected.

    However, when I collected on my parlay bets up in Reno/Tahoe recently where each was in the low 5 figures and I only accept cash, there was the same style of overboard congratulations by what seemed an excessive number of boothlings & suits, that irritating hanging around until every last dollar was placed safely into my wife's purse, and finally the stares & grumbling to one another as we walked away and out of their sight. I can honestly say, my wife was VERY uncomfortable in each similar situation and she said it was because she felt these people hated us after we declined to hand over some of our winnings to them. Of course that is the main reason people tip in casinos, but she is thankful I was there because these situations do not bother me at all.
    Last edited by Rob.Singer; 01-10-2012 at 07:05 PM.

  15. #15
    Rob, I have never tipped, even with bigger tickets than that -- and I have tortured them by asking loudly for lunch, dinner, whatever, and being a pain until I got it. So I guess I'm hard core. "You're not gonna give me lunch!?! You're gonna let me just walk out of here with 35K of your money??? You don't want me in your casino with your money?"

    I'm tough when it comes to lunch.

  16. #16
    I didn't even think of asking for a comp, and only because I associate comps with machine play. That's how distant I really am from the sportsbetting game, but I'm good at it when I'm really motivated.

  17. #17
    Next time you cash a big ticket, ask for a lunch or dinner comp. They want you to stay in the place with their money, so they'll try to oblige. The ticket person won't have the clout to write it, though, it'd have to be the manager. Sometimes they say they can't, but they can.

    My favorite story is when I bet $4500 in Harrah's on the strip and asked for a hamburger. It was 11 AM, and there was absolutely nobody but me in the place. Nobody. The ticket writer said I'd have to bet 5K to get a hamburger. I said, waitamminit, I'm the only person in the sports book, I just bet 4500 on one game, and you begrudge me a hamburger? I said, okay, I made a mistake on my ticket. Give me the money back. Since I was still standing at the window, they had to, by law, give me my money back. So I took the cash, went to the Rio (which had the identical lines) and got a buffet out of it.

  18. #18
    Hey Alan, Congrats on your RF. And breaking the streak. I wouldn't worry to much about the RF coming just a tad to late ie. 2011 tax offset. You have well over 11 months to offset the RF win for EOY 2012.

    Sorry, just had to say it. lol
    Last edited by Rew10; 01-13-2012 at 11:36 PM.

  19. #19
    I dropped by to see what's going on and saw this. Congrats on ending the streak.

    PS. I also see Singer continues to pollute the site with his constant stream of nonsense. However, it is quite humorous when you can see the continued use of logical fallacies and a complete misunderstanding of randomness. Chuckle, chuckle.

  20. #20
    Thank you Arc. I really "needed" that Royal. I felt that I was doomed to never get one again. But I also have a new outlook about "royals." And now I laugh at the concept that royals come about one in 40-thousand hands. It's a nice concept but "luck" (or what you might call variance) means a lot more.

    And I must be the "straight flush king" because I got two straight flushes on my last two sessions. One was dealt, 5 high in spades. And one was a one-card draw, 8-high in diamonds and I needed the 6d.

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