Alan Mendelson Going For The Jugular

[mickeycrimm]

Now I'm confused. The wired article clearly says the DU option has to be activated by an attendant at the casino. It's not something a player can activate. Now you're telling me Rob activated it, while he was playing? This doesn't line up with the wired article

Have you ever played VP with the DU feature activated?

In those days I got irritated at machines where the double up feature was turned on. LOL! Little did I know. I would switch machines or if no other machines were avaialble I would request them to turn it off. In other words, the DU was already on when I sat down on the machine.

[AxelWolf]

PS. I've actually found multiple bugs on machines and I know nothing about programming or anything like that.

[AxelWolf]

Now I'm confused. The wired article clearly says the DU option has to be activated by an attendant at the casino. It's not something a player can activate. Now you're telling me Rob activated it, while he was playing? This doesn't line up with the wired article

Have you ever played VP with the DU feature activated?

In those days I got irritated at machines where the double up feature was turned on. LOL! Little did I know. I would switch machines or if no other machines were avaialble I would request them to turn it off. In other words, the DU was already on when I sat down on the machine.

but those that you're referring to are not the same type of machines Rob was playing(correct?)

Rob, what color is the cabinet the double up bug is on?

[AxelWolf]

Have you ever played VP with the DU feature activated?

In those days I got irritated at machines where the double up feature was turned on. LOL! Little did I know. I would switch machines or if no other machines were avaialble I would request them to turn it off. In other words, the DU was already on when I sat down on the machine.

but those that you're referring to are not the same type of machines Rob was playing(correct?)

Rob, what color is the glass the double up bug is on? Perhaps I've been looking at the wrong ones?

[Ozzy]

Apparently you haven't read what I have been saying.
------------------------------------------------
Apparently you didn't have to hit jackpots, any win could be multiplied from the lowest to the highest denomination(that I still haven't confirmed 100%). Rob was asked why he was risking the jackpot method when just about everyone else thinks it would have been much better to avoid that.

Maybe Rob is a little bit smarter than everybody

I believe you're at least slightly smarter than Nathan

Not smarter then Billryan😬

[kewlJ]

It took an addicted gambler feverishly pressing buttons moving up and down denominations, playing different games going in and out of the menu to accidentally find the glitch. Who else moves up and down denominations with their system?

How do we absolutely know that is what it took and that this was found by "accident" by Kane/Nestor? I am sure prosecutors looked hard for a connection to anyone on the inside (like a programmer) and found no connection. But that doesn't mean there absolutely wasn't.

With these two guys not being the brightest bulbs in the pack, it seems much more likely to me that they were tipped to this play than actually "stumbled" upon it.

Maybe a distant relative or friend from years before that needed to find someone just dumb enough to be the guy to execute the play for a cut.

Maybe it was payment for a debt owed to one of these guys (that seems unlikely as these guys were always broke and scrounging).

But it is just sort of hard to believe these guys stumbled on to this.

[mickeycrimm]

I read this entire thread and the one thing that stuck out to me the most as weirdest was Posters asking the Member for proof of research that he repeatedly said he didn't have as he only looked up that research once and didn't print it out or anything like that.

Thank you cookie monster and welcome.

You know why THAT stood out as weird to you? Because it is. No one demanding that I put up that proof really wanted to see that proof because they aren't interested in the truth. They can't handle the truth! Ok, sorry...slipping into movie reference. Seriously any one on this forum that wanted to see the information that I and MaxPen described can look it up for themselves. You know what it would cost? 1 freaking dollar! That's right it is $1 for a 5 day trial.

So no, no one wanted to see that information. They all already know what I said is true. They were just hoping to get me to post copies of the actual information because that is illegal.

The other thing quite common on this site, especially with this Rob Singer character, is that whenever it is time for him to put up anything ranging from proof of something to a bet, he always and I mean always ties it to a condition that he knows can't or won't be met.

In this case, this was his golden opportunity to prove to everyone....shove it in everyone's face that what he was saying was true. He should have been jumping at that opportunity but instead he tied it to a condition he knew couldn't be met, because it is illegal for me to have met it. And that really tells you all you need to know. Everything else is just posturing. Again, He had the chance to end this once and for all and prove everyone wrong and not only refused but tied it to a condition that he knew could not be met. There really is nothing else to argue about or say. That is game, set, match.

I guarantee you I was using the background searches looking into Rob long before you were. I didn't go with just one site. I never seen anything about food stamps.

[mickeycrimm]

And by the way, Mickeycrimm is now doing the exact same thing as Singer. No real surprise is it. Crimm is demanding I show proof of my claims of advantage player, because he knows that I can't and wont. I am an active professional player. I cannot and will not show anything that could put my career in jeopardy. No advantage player would or does. It is almost shocking to see another advantage player demand that. Shows how far Crimm has sunk.

When an advantage player makes a claim involving money or success, people have to decide for themselves based on two things. 1.) is the claim possible by mathematic principles or does it defy the math and 2.) Has this member demonstrated the knowledge that he knows what he is talking about or is he just talking.

No one being honest will say that I don't know what I am talking about when it comes to blackjack and card counting. No matter how much someone may dislike me for other reasons, no one being honest can say that. Of course honesty and this forum, parted ways a long, long time ago.

You demand proof yet won't provide proof. For some reason you think others should provide proof but you yourself are exempt from showing proof. So I'm supposed to take your word for it just because you talk a good game? You don't do that and neither do I.

KJ you're nothing but a rat asshole troll on this site. Go fuck yourself.

[mickeycrimm]

Finding it is the hard part.

Yes, I think you're a little late to the party on that aspect. I think the odds are astronomical, and I said that more than once. And yet, someone actually found it.

It took an addicted gambler feverishly pressing buttons moving up and down denominations, playing different games going in and out of the menu to accidentally find the glitch. Who else moves up and down denominations with their system?

Rob Singer moves up and down denominations with his system. In fact he knows more about multi-denom machines and their locations than anyone I've seen on the internet.

Rob's system used these denoms:

$1, $2, $5, $10, $25

Rob knew where all the machines with these denoms were located. He wrote quite a bit about it on this forum. I've also seen machines that were:

5 cent, 10 cent, 25 cent, 50 cent, $1, $2 $5.

[AxelWolf]

I read this entire thread and the one thing that stuck out to me the most as weirdest was Posters asking the Member for proof of research that he repeatedly said he didn't have as he only looked up that research once and didn't print it out or anything like that.

Thank you cookie monster and welcome.

You know why THAT stood out as weird to you? Because it is. No one demanding that I put up that proof really wanted to see that proof because they aren't interested in the truth. They can't handle the truth! Ok, sorry...slipping into movie reference. Seriously any one on this forum that wanted to see the information that I and MaxPen described can look it up for themselves. You know what it would cost? 1 freaking dollar! That's right it is $1 for a 5 day trial.

So no, no one wanted to see that information. They all already know what I said is true. They were just hoping to get me to post copies of the actual information because that is illegal.

The other thing quite common on this site, especially with this Rob Singer character, is that whenever it is time for him to put up anything ranging from proof of something to a bet, he always and I mean always ties it to a condition that he knows can't or won't be met.

In this case, this was his golden opportunity to prove to everyone....shove it in everyone's face that what he was saying was true. He should have been jumping at that opportunity but instead he tied it to a condition he knew couldn't be met, because it is illegal for me to have met it. And that really tells you all you need to know. Everything else is just posturing. Again, He had the chance to end this once and for all and prove everyone wrong and not only refused but tied it to a condition that he knew could not be met. There really is nothing else to argue about or say. That is game, set, match.

I guarantee you I was using the background searches looking into Rob long before you were. I didn't go with just one site. I never seen anything about food stamps.

for the record, someone else other than KJ saw the same thing, I believe(I'll have to ask again just to make sure I'm understanding correctly). That person is not known to make up s***. If they sat they seen it, then I absolutely believe it was there.

[mickeycrimm]

PS. I've actually found multiple bugs on machines and I know nothing about programming or anything like that.

I was just going to say tht Rob's DUB was not the only bug that's ever been found. The old Williams multi-game machines come to mind.

[AxelWolf]

Finding it is the hard part.

Yes, I think you're a little late to the party on that aspect. I think the odds are astronomical, and I said that more than once. And yet, someone actually found it.

It took an addicted gambler feverishly pressing buttons moving up and down denominations, playing different games going in and out of the menu to accidentally find the glitch. Who else moves up and down denominations with their system?

Rob Singer moves up and down denominations with his system.

Exactly. I made a joke before how it takes an addicted Gambler who's feverishly moving up and down denominations feverishly moving in and out of the menu and jamming in bills.

[AxelWolf]

It took an addicted gambler feverishly pressing buttons moving up and down denominations, playing different games going in and out of the menu to accidentally find the glitch. Who else moves up and down denominations with their system?

How do we absolutely know that is what it took and that this was found by "accident" by Kane/Nestor? I am sure prosecutors looked hard for a connection to anyone on the inside (like a programmer) and found no connection. But that doesn't mean there absolutely wasn't.

With these two guys not being the brightest bulbs in the pack, it seems much more likely to me that they were tipped to this play than actually "stumbled" upon it.

Maybe a distant relative or friend from years before that needed to find someone just dumb enough to be the guy to execute the play for a cut.

Maybe it was payment for a debt owed to one of these guys (that seems unlikely as these guys were always broke and scrounging).

But it is just sort of hard to believe these guys stumbled on to this.

if you read the article, it just makes total sense.

[kewlJ]

You demand proof yet won't provide proof. For some reason you think others should provide proof but you yourself are exempt from showing proof. So I'm supposed to take your word for it just because you talk a good game? You don't do that and neither do I.

KJ you're nothing but a rat asshole troll on this site. Go fuck yourself.

Mickeycrimm, there is something very, very wrong with you now since your "bromance" with Singer.

I first encountered you at WoV. I was super impressed by your AP ability and story. And I have to admit, I found your posting while intoxicating somewhat funny. When you were banned I argued against it because, while you clearly broke the rules, I thought you were one of the few members that it would have been worth it to bend the rules for. I argued there could and should have been a way to keep such a valuable poster. And there was, but Mike, wouldn't have it. He is way too rigid like that.

After I was banned at WoV, with the Norm fiasco, you went to Norm's forum and created and account and reamed him a new asshole for what he did at WoV and of course you were banned. That was your intent. And you seemed to know all about the T3 situation, so you must have looked into that and knew I was right. I didn't ask you to go to BJTF and stick up for me like that. But I appreciated it and frankly thought it was damn funny.

Then I encountered you at GF, and we seemed to be on the same side on most discussions. Like this forum, there was a lot of AP vs non-Ap (larryS) discussions so naturally we (and some others now here) were on the same side. Once that forum imploded with the owner being a loon (and sockpuppet guy himself), YOU invited me to this forum. I remember you saying you thought I would enjoy it.

And on this forum for years, again, you and I were on the same side of most discussions because things broke down as AP vs non-AP. You not only never questioned me, but supported my claims because you knew they were true, just like I knew your were. And you still know it. But all of the sudden you form this bromance with Singer and now I am your enemy. I guess the enemy of your new boyfriend is now your enemy.

I don't know what is going on with you and Rob and I don't care. Some people have suggested that maybe you are just hoping Rob's DU bug claim is true and he will throw you a bone of a current machine location. Some sort of deal or promise like that. Others have said you were just so beaten up by Singer for years with him getting the best of you that you jumped at the chance for it to end. Like I said, it is none of my business why. There isn't a doubt in your mind that I am who I say and my claims true, just as I know who you really are. So just stop with the dishonest bullshit. Does whatever alliance you made with Rob really require you to sell out and lie about everything just as he does? Shame on you mickeycrimm. You are better that that. I know you are.

[AxelWolf]

PS. I've actually found multiple bugs on machines and I know nothing about programming or anything like that.

I was just going to say tht Rob's DUB was not the only bug that's ever been found. The old Williams multi-game machines come to mind.

Yea, I come across bugs that just seemed almost impossible for it to have happened. It has to be The Perfect Storm scenario that just seems impossible to have found. I'll give a fictitious example something similar. Let's just say you cash out a ticket for exactly $11.11 and for some reason you notice a screen flicker, so then you take that ticket and put it back in the machine and cash it out again to see if the machine will flicker, but then there's nothing. So then you play a spin hitting something that gives you your money back for exactly $11.11 now you cash that ticket out and see another screen flicker so now you re-enter it into the machine and for some unknown reason you now have 111.11 and this all works with only that exact scenario and ticket amount. What is the f****** odds of that happening?

After you find one glitch you start to pay attention to anything that might be off. Once you notice something a little different you start trying to figure out why and how that's happening, you then start to experiment with different things in order to recreate it, once you figure that out you move on and figure out just how best to exploit it. I could only imagine what could happen if somebody had more advanced computer knowledge.

[acescracked_1210]

I read this entire thread and the one thing that stuck out to me the most as weirdest was Posters asking the Member for proof of research that he repeatedly said he didn't have as he only looked up that research once and didn't print it out or anything like that.

Hi Tasha.

[mickeycrimm]

You demand proof yet won't provide proof. For some reason you think others should provide proof but you yourself are exempt from showing proof. So I'm supposed to take your word for it just because you talk a good game? You don't do that and neither do I.

KJ you're nothing but a rat asshole troll on this site. Go fuck yourself.

Mickeycrimm, there is something very, very wrong with you now since your "bromance" with Singer.

I first encountered you at WoV. I was super impressed by your AP ability and story. And I have to admit, I found your posting while intoxicating somewhat funny. When you were banned I argued against it because, while you clearly broke the rules, I thought you were one of the few members that it would have been worth it to bend the rules for. I argued there could and should have been a way to keep such a valuable poster. And there was, but Mike, wouldn't have it. He is way too rigid like that.

After I was banned at WoV, with the Norm fiasco, you went to Norm's forum and created and account and reamed him a new asshole for what he did at WoV and of course you were banned. That was your intent. And you seemed to know all about the T3 situation, so you must have looked into that and knew I was right. I didn't ask you to go to BJTF and stick up for me like that. But I appreciated it and frankly thought it was damn funny.

Then I encountered you at GF, and we seemed to be on the same side on most discussions. Like this forum, there was a lot of AP vs non-Ap (larryS) discussions so naturally we (and some others now here) were on the same side. Once that forum imploded with the owner being a loon (and sockpuppet guy himself), YOU invited me to this forum. I remember you saying you thought I would enjoy it.

And on this forum for years, again, you and I were on the same side of most discussions because things broke down as AP vs non-AP. You not only never questioned me, but supported my claims because you knew they were true, just like I knew your were. And you still know it. But all of the sudden you form this bromance with Singer and now I am your enemy. I guess the enemy of your new boyfriend is now your enemy.

I don't know what is going on with you and Rob and I don't care. Some people have suggested that maybe you are just hoping Rob's DU bug claim is true and he will throw you a bone of a current machine location. Some sort of deal or promise like that. Others have said you were just so beaten up by Singer for years with him getting the best of you that you jumped at the chance for it to end. Like I said, it is none of my business why. There isn't a doubt in your mind that I am who I say and my claims true, just as I know who you really are. So just stop with the dishonest bullshit. Does whatever alliance you made with Rob really require you to sell out and lie about everything just as he does? Shame on you mickeycrimm. You are better that that. I know you are.

Always fun watching you squeal like a pig. All those times I stuck up for you didn't matter to you over the DUB. You threw me under the bus in your hatred of Singer. So fuck off and die bitch. Singer didn't write anything about me that was worse than what you put in this post of yours right here. Do you really think you can beat me up, you fucking punk? Rob couldn't do it and neither can you. You're a little snowflake pussy wimp. Eat my dust.

[kewlJ]

I am sure your response surprises no one. Still sad to see. What a shame.

[Bob21]

Finding it is the hard part.

Yes, I think you're a little late to the party on that aspect. I think the odds are astronomical, and I said that more than once. And yet, someone actually found it.

It took an addicted gambler feverishly pressing buttons moving up and down denominations, playing different games going in and out of the menu to accidentally find the glitch. Who else moves up and down denominations with their system?

Axel, you ask “who else moves up and down demonations with their system?” This probably describes about 90% of slot players. Maybe a little exaggeration, but all these betting systems are based on some variant of martingale....and to some extent all gamblers have tired it at some time.

As far as finding it, the way Kane found it made more sense to me, than the way Rob claims he found it. A lot more sense! Obviously, I can’t prove if either story is correct (in terms of how it was found), but Kane’s made more sense. Kane never said he was actively looking for a “bug”, that is, until he stumbled on it, and then he tried feverishly with his buddy Nester to recreate what he stumbled upon.

Now Rob claims he was actively looking for it. In a post last year, he said he’d stay after his vp play was over and spend about 15 mins looking for “bugs”, or “something that looked like a bug”. That story just didn’t add up to me.

On a side note, what’s the difference between a “bug”, and “something that looks like a bug”? They both sound like a “bug” to me. Things that look like bugs are probably considered “bugs”. I don’t think there are two words that describe “bugs”, so I found it curious that Rob said this.

Again “bugs” as complex as the one Kane found are usually stumbled on, they aren’t actively looked for. This is an important distinction for me; it’s maybe not for others.

I can’t prove anything and I don’t care much. I’m just saying I’m surprised Rob’s story that he was actively looking for bugs passed so many people’s “sniff test”.

All the rest of Rob’s story that people tried to pick up made total sense to me, although I’d have thought if he found it, he’d have exploited it for much more than 2.8 million over 5 years. I mean there was virtually no way of getting caught if you were only semi-smart.

Anyway, an interesting discussion. I don’t need any “proof” from anybody on anything. I make up my mind based on the story.

[mickeycrimm]

I read this entire thread and the one thing that stuck out to me the most as weirdest was Posters asking the Member for proof of research that he repeatedly said he didn't have as he only looked up that research once and didn't print it out or anything like that.

Hi Tasha.

LOL! Nice catch.