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Thread: The Big Hurt Is Coming

  1. #21
    Originally Posted by Rob.Singer View Post
    Originally Posted by AxelWolf View Post
    Originally Posted by Rob.Singer View Post
    So Heather did a great job and got all the bugs worked out of the video-conferencing software. Mike decided to do the interview today as soon as he saw everything was working fine on both ends. I wasn't prepared for that as I just came in from a motorcycle ride but we did it anyway. It's about a half hour in length.

    I expect there'll be the usual drama and criticism whenever I show up: my nose is big, I look stupid, I sound dumb, etc. etc. But we both agree it was a fantastic interview.

    Bring on the hurt!
    Sigh.

    Rob. I know you'll be reading. Mike actually invited me to be there while he interviewed you.
    I didn't think there was enough investigation done prior to this interview.

    Mike played softball with you, I would have never allowed that, I probably would have pulled the microphone away from Mike.

    One of many questions would have been.... if you lied about all that other stuff in the past keeping up that ruse for years, why should anyone believe anything you say now?

    You point blank said on the other Forum (not an exact quote) What Nestor and Kane did was illegal and I believe you said something about how they should have went to jail. Why would you say something like that in the first place? Something like that could have certainly been used against you in a court of law, basically you admitted you thought it was illegal, or at least that it could be illegal. You talk about trying to throw people off the trail, the best way to throw people off the trail is to just to keep quiet, be normal, and talk about normal things. Yet, you went out of your way to be deceptive and cantankerous to everyone on the forums for like 9 years in order to throw us off the trail, vent your anxiety, cover your ass or however you want to put it. Yes, I know Rob can't respond here, I will copy and paste it to another forum.
    axel: First, as I told Mike today, the reason I released this info to you was because after 15+ years of being totally silent on something of this magnitude, I HAD to let it out. I was a professional video poker player...it was necessary to tell someone--even a top critic. Secondary is whether anyone would believe me or not. The cover-up lying for all the years gave me an untrusting reputation, yes. But it all worked. Maybe not the best approach. But again, being believed or not on the DU bug has no effect on what we're doing tomorrow.

    I also see where Alan and all his AndrewG wisdom is still hung up on the RV. Fact is, if we cashed out everything we have in retirement funds I could buy two of those stupid things, with money from our careers. He couldn't see that of course because he pours all his into alimony payments and the poker machines.

    Regarding why I said what Kane/Nestor did was illegal: first, silence is not golden in every scenario. These guys clearly did something I still believe was illegal--using other people's pre-existing vp winners to collect many of their jackpots on. I never did and would never do that. THAT'S the main reason for what I said on this forum.

    PS: go back and read the Wired article. I just told Mike one of the few things they got right is how the bug flowed freely in at least 99 released versions of IGT GameKings between 2002-mid 2009. If I recall, it said the bug was like a cockroach, infecting every version of software released until caught. That should help.
    but the double up feature that you describe that's always on with the arrows pointing down came out way before 2002. I'm not a hundred percent sure when the don't ask me again version came out but I never saw that version until after 2009 as a matter of fact I want to say I didn't even notice it until about 2012.

  2. #22
    Originally Posted by Rob.Singer View Post

    kew, we purchased the 2011 Newell in early 2013. How I handled that much cash is probably different than the next guy, who handles it different etc. But now maybe some people can see where I came up with the $640,000 escrow on the Fezzik challenge. I lied in my Gaming Today article, saying I withdrew it from my retirement account.
    Rob, I don't want to get into name-calling, but see the part I highlighted....you admitting you lied. You have done that over and over and over, including admitting that you intentionally lied several times during the interview. Can you see how we are way beyond taking you at your word for just about anything? How hard would it be for you to show a bill of sale for the RV? I mean we all know it wasn't 1.5 million. But whatever just put it up.

    Rob one thing I will give you credit for. In the interview you said something about you resented AP's, because you tried to be a VP AP in the 1990's and failed. And that is why you attacked AP's back in the early 2000's when you had your column. I think that was about the most honest thing you ever said. Only thing is I think it has been a 20 year thing.
    Dan Druff: "there's no question that MDawg has been an obnoxious braggart, and has rubbed a ton of people the wrong way. There's something missing from his stories. Either they're fabricated, grossly exaggerated, or largely incomplete".

  3. #23
    Originally Posted by AxelWolf View Post
    Why do you need to analyze a 50/50 proposition? Other than the length entertainment value (perhaps getting free drinks) and other certain circumstances, there is absolutely no reason to use the double up feature.
    Absolutely no reason?...other than entertainment value, and an undefined number of other circumstances? LOL...so much for absolutes.

    You're an ass.

    I did a search and found a page about the Double-Up feature on the WOO website.

    https://wizardofodds.com/ask-the-wiz...ker/double-up/

    In light of that information, I'm even more surprised about how little Shack knew about the Double-Up...he seemed pretty clueless in the interview.

  4. #24
    Anyway, I am not going to rehash anymore. There is no point.

    Congrats Rob on the platform you were given to yet again make your claim, while offering nothing to support it.

    In the absence of someone asking Mike his opinion, which is what I thought this was about, seems like a big waste of time to me. Maybe someone will still ask Mike.
    Dan Druff: "there's no question that MDawg has been an obnoxious braggart, and has rubbed a ton of people the wrong way. There's something missing from his stories. Either they're fabricated, grossly exaggerated, or largely incomplete".

  5. #25
    Originally Posted by AxelWolf View Post
    Originally Posted by Rob.Singer View Post
    Originally Posted by AxelWolf View Post
    Sigh.

    Rob. I know you'll be reading. Mike actually invited me to be there while he interviewed you.
    I didn't think there was enough investigation done prior to this interview.

    Mike played softball with you, I would have never allowed that, I probably would have pulled the microphone away from Mike.

    One of many questions would have been.... if you lied about all that other stuff in the past keeping up that ruse for years, why should anyone believe anything you say now?

    You point blank said on the other Forum (not an exact quote) What Nestor and Kane did was illegal and I believe you said something about how they should have went to jail. Why would you say something like that in the first place? Something like that could have certainly been used against you in a court of law, basically you admitted you thought it was illegal, or at least that it could be illegal. You talk about trying to throw people off the trail, the best way to throw people off the trail is to just to keep quiet, be normal, and talk about normal things. Yet, you went out of your way to be deceptive and cantankerous to everyone on the forums for like 9 years in order to throw us off the trail, vent your anxiety, cover your ass or however you want to put it. Yes, I know Rob can't respond here, I will copy and paste it to another forum.
    axel: First, as I told Mike today, the reason I released this info to you was because after 15+ years of being totally silent on something of this magnitude, I HAD to let it out. I was a professional video poker player...it was necessary to tell someone--even a top critic. Secondary is whether anyone would believe me or not. The cover-up lying for all the years gave me an untrusting reputation, yes. But it all worked. Maybe not the best approach. But again, being believed or not on the DU bug has no effect on what we're doing tomorrow.

    I also see where Alan and all his AndrewG wisdom is still hung up on the RV. Fact is, if we cashed out everything we have in retirement funds I could buy two of those stupid things, with money from our careers. He couldn't see that of course because he pours all his into alimony payments and the poker machines.

    Regarding why I said what Kane/Nestor did was illegal: first, silence is not golden in every scenario. These guys clearly did something I still believe was illegal--using other people's pre-existing vp winners to collect many of their jackpots on. I never did and would never do that. THAT'S the main reason for what I said on this forum.

    PS: go back and read the Wired article. I just told Mike one of the few things they got right is how the bug flowed freely in at least 99 released versions of IGT GameKings between 2002-mid 2009. If I recall, it said the bug was like a cockroach, infecting every version of software released until caught. That should help.
    but the double up feature that you describe that's always on with the arrows pointing down came out way before 2002. I'm not a hundred percent sure when the don't ask me again version came out but I never saw that version until after 2009 as a matter of fact I want to say I didn't even notice it until about 2012.
    Just another hole in the block of Swiss cheese. I'm sure it will get filled with some baffling bullshit soon enough.
    I'm going to give this round to Rob. He got what he wanted. A forum, besides here, to tell his story.

  6. #26
    Originally Posted by coach belly View Post

    In light of that information, I'm even more surprised about how little Shack knew about the Double-Up...he seemed pretty clueless in the interview.
    I think you misunderstood what Mike said. I took it, as an AP Mike saw no value in doubling up any win, so he never pressed yes when offered. AP stands for advantage player. That means +EV plays. a 50/50 bet is not +EV. all it does is increase variance.


    I also wouldn't count on the fact that Mike knew so little about this play. I suspect he knew a lot more than he let on. Mike was playing the part of the interviewer. His job, as he saw it, was to act as though he knew nothing about the play to get Rob to explain it in as much detail as possible so people could decide forthemselves whether Rob was credible or not. And he did that.

    But now that the interview is over, I would like to hear the interviewer's opinion on the subject. But that's just me.
    Dan Druff: "there's no question that MDawg has been an obnoxious braggart, and has rubbed a ton of people the wrong way. There's something missing from his stories. Either they're fabricated, grossly exaggerated, or largely incomplete".

  7. #27
    Originally Posted by AxelWolf View Post
    Originally Posted by Rob.Singer View Post
    Originally Posted by AxelWolf View Post
    Sigh.

    Rob. I know you'll be reading. Mike actually invited me to be there while he interviewed you.
    I didn't think there was enough investigation done prior to this interview.

    Mike played softball with you, I would have never allowed that, I probably would have pulled the microphone away from Mike.

    One of many questions would have been.... if you lied about all that other stuff in the past keeping up that ruse for years, why should anyone believe anything you say now?

    You point blank said on the other Forum (not an exact quote) What Nestor and Kane did was illegal and I believe you said something about how they should have went to jail. Why would you say something like that in the first place? Something like that could have certainly been used against you in a court of law, basically you admitted you thought it was illegal, or at least that it could be illegal. You talk about trying to throw people off the trail, the best way to throw people off the trail is to just to keep quiet, be normal, and talk about normal things. Yet, you went out of your way to be deceptive and cantankerous to everyone on the forums for like 9 years in order to throw us off the trail, vent your anxiety, cover your ass or however you want to put it. Yes, I know Rob can't respond here, I will copy and paste it to another forum.
    axel: First, as I told Mike today, the reason I released this info to you was because after 15+ years of being totally silent on something of this magnitude, I HAD to let it out. I was a professional video poker player...it was necessary to tell someone--even a top critic. Secondary is whether anyone would believe me or not. The cover-up lying for all the years gave me an untrusting reputation, yes. But it all worked. Maybe not the best approach. But again, being believed or not on the DU bug has no effect on what we're doing tomorrow.

    I also see where Alan and all his AndrewG wisdom is still hung up on the RV. Fact is, if we cashed out everything we have in retirement funds I could buy two of those stupid things, with money from our careers. He couldn't see that of course because he pours all his into alimony payments and the poker machines.

    Regarding why I said what Kane/Nestor did was illegal: first, silence is not golden in every scenario. These guys clearly did something I still believe was illegal--using other people's pre-existing vp winners to collect many of their jackpots on. I never did and would never do that. THAT'S the main reason for what I said on this forum.

    PS: go back and read the Wired article. I just told Mike one of the few things they got right is how the bug flowed freely in at least 99 released versions of IGT GameKings between 2002-mid 2009. If I recall, it said the bug was like a cockroach, infecting every version of software released until caught. That should help.
    but the double up feature that you describe that's always on with the arrows pointing down came out way before 2002. I'm not a hundred percent sure when the don't ask me again version came out but I never saw that version until after 2009 as a matter of fact I want to say I didn't even notice it until about 2012.
    I'm really no expert on what came out when. But what I described was what I saw and played.

    In my career, when software updates are released as newer versions then they are available for some or most of the older versions also. VP machines go thru constant software and some firmware updates/upgrades. And while the floors may or may not have had a lot of infected machines, I picked only one and only played it (with very few exceptions) at every casino I hit. I know and knew nothing about the rest of the machines.

  8. #28
    Originally Posted by AxelWolf View Post
    Originally Posted by Rob.Singer View Post
    Originally Posted by AxelWolf View Post
    Sigh.

    Rob. I know you'll be reading. Mike actually invited me to be there while he interviewed you.
    I didn't think there was enough investigation done prior to this interview.

    Mike played softball with you, I would have never allowed that, I probably would have pulled the microphone away from Mike.

    One of many questions would have been.... if you lied about all that other stuff in the past keeping up that ruse for years, why should anyone believe anything you say now?

    You point blank said on the other Forum (not an exact quote) What Nestor and Kane did was illegal and I believe you said something about how they should have went to jail. Why would you say something like that in the first place? Something like that could have certainly been used against you in a court of law, basically you admitted you thought it was illegal, or at least that it could be illegal. You talk about trying to throw people off the trail, the best way to throw people off the trail is to just to keep quiet, be normal, and talk about normal things. Yet, you went out of your way to be deceptive and cantankerous to everyone on the forums for like 9 years in order to throw us off the trail, vent your anxiety, cover your ass or however you want to put it. Yes, I know Rob can't respond here, I will copy and paste it to another forum.
    axel: First, as I told Mike today, the reason I released this info to you was because after 15+ years of being totally silent on something of this magnitude, I HAD to let it out. I was a professional video poker player...it was necessary to tell someone--even a top critic. Secondary is whether anyone would believe me or not. The cover-up lying for all the years gave me an untrusting reputation, yes. But it all worked. Maybe not the best approach. But again, being believed or not on the DU bug has no effect on what we're doing tomorrow.

    I also see where Alan and all his AndrewG wisdom is still hung up on the RV. Fact is, if we cashed out everything we have in retirement funds I could buy two of those stupid things, with money from our careers. He couldn't see that of course because he pours all his into alimony payments and the poker machines.

    Regarding why I said what Kane/Nestor did was illegal: first, silence is not golden in every scenario. These guys clearly did something I still believe was illegal--using other people's pre-existing vp winners to collect many of their jackpots on. I never did and would never do that. THAT'S the main reason for what I said on this forum.

    PS: go back and read the Wired article. I just told Mike one of the few things they got right is how the bug flowed freely in at least 99 released versions of IGT GameKings between 2002-mid 2009. If I recall, it said the bug was like a cockroach, infecting every version of software released until caught. That should help.
    but the double up feature that you describe that's always on with the arrows pointing down came out way before 2002. I'm not a hundred percent sure when the don't ask me again version came out but I never saw that version until after 2009 as a matter of fact I want to say I didn't even notice it until about 2012.
    Originally Posted by kewlJ View Post
    Originally Posted by coach belly View Post

    In light of that information, I'm even more surprised about how little Shack knew about the Double-Up...he seemed pretty clueless in the interview.
    I think you misunderstood what Mike said. I took it, as an AP Mike saw no value in doubling up any win, so he never pressed yes when offered. AP stands for advantage player. That means +EV plays. a 50/50 bet is not +EV. all it does is increase variance.


    I also wouldn't count on the fact that Mike knew so little about this play. I suspect he knew a lot more than he let on. Mike was playing the part of the interviewer. His job, as he saw it, was to act as though he knew nothing about the play to get Rob to explain it in as much detail as possible so people could decide forthemselves whether Rob was credible or not. And he did that.

    But now that the interview is over, I would like to hear the interviewer's opinion on the subject. But that's just me.
    I kind of hate when people say it is 50/50. When it most certainly is not thru a series of consecutive attempts. MustangSally even made a very good case on how it is a house advantage on the first attempt in this thread on the WoV.

    https://wizardofvegas.com/forum/ques.../2/#post465155

  9. #29
    Originally Posted by kewlJ View Post
    His job, as he saw it, was to act as though he knew nothing about the play
    I didn't mean the play...he didn't seem to understand anything about the Double-Up feature.

    I'll let someone else ask him if it was an act...could be taken as an insult.

  10. #30
    Originally Posted by coach belly View Post

    I'll let someone else ask him if it was an act...could be taken as an insult.
    Why? are you afraid of him? You are a member of WoV in good standing aren't you? At the end of the interview Mike said he welcomed discussion, so ask him.
    Dan Druff: "there's no question that MDawg has been an obnoxious braggart, and has rubbed a ton of people the wrong way. There's something missing from his stories. Either they're fabricated, grossly exaggerated, or largely incomplete".

  11. #31
    Originally Posted by coach belly View Post
    the Wizard of Odds has never bothered to analyze it?
    Originally Posted by AxelWolf View Post
    Why do you need to analyze a 50/50 proposition?
    Originally Posted by MaxPen View Post
    I kind of hate when people say it is 50/50. When it most certainly is not thru a series of consecutive attempts. MustangSally even made a very good case on how it is a house advantage on the first attempt in this thread on the WoV.

    https://wizardofvegas.com/forum/ques.../2/#post465155
    Apparently the feature is/was worthy of analysis.

  12. #32
    Originally Posted by coach belly View Post

    I'll let someone else ask him if it was an act...could be taken as an insult.
    Originally Posted by kewlJ View Post
    Why?
    Are you asking why it could be taken as an insult to ask him if he was playing dumb?

  13. #33
    Originally Posted by coach belly View Post

    Originally Posted by kewlJ View Post
    Why?
    Are you asking why it could be taken as an insult to ask him if he was playing dumb?
    You don't have to phrase it THAT way. YOU are a master at word-smithery, so just say something like you were surprised he wasn't more familiar with the play.
    Dan Druff: "there's no question that MDawg has been an obnoxious braggart, and has rubbed a ton of people the wrong way. There's something missing from his stories. Either they're fabricated, grossly exaggerated, or largely incomplete".

  14. #34
    Here's the video in case some of you didn't see it:

    Check out my poker forum, and weekly internet radio show at http://pokerfraudalert.com

  15. #35
    Just watched a second time and there is something else that struck me. Mike tried really hard to give Rob the opportunity to apologize, first to Dancer specifically and then a second opportunity to anyone else. Rob declined the second opportunity saying there was nothing he wanted to apologize for. I don't know how much Mike reads this forum. I suspect not regularly, but probably enough to know some of the attacks Rob has made to various people and family members. Plus Mike dealt with that on his forum and likely knows from other forums. In case Rob didn't get it, That is what Mike was giving you an opportunity to express some regret for.

    So anyway, lets re-look at that situation because Singers story has changed in the last 16 months. So for years, even decades, Singer told this tale of 10 years, a million dollars playing his super-duper progression system. A tale that mathematically couldn't be true and Rob now admits wasn't true. And yet, he viscously attacked anyone challenging that claim and the fact that it defied math. Let me say that again, he viscously attacked anyone that challenged a claim, he now admits was false, or as he says a "cover". I mean I am just the latest of a long list that includes Redietz, Axelwolf, Arci and Armede$ before my time on this forum, plus many more, even Mickeycrimm. Maybe mickeycrimm worst of all because Rob was so relentless. And of course many more on this forum, WoV, other forums and even in his column.

    One more time: Rob viscously attacked people that were challenging a claim he now admits was a lie. Does that make any sense to anyone? And this went on for decades?

    Rob's answer now is that this was all just trolling on internet forums because that is what forums are about. And with that in mind, why would anyone think this latest thing, the double up bug is anything more than more of that trolling. I mean the guy is flat out telling you everything he has said to this point is a lie, and yet he wants people to believe this latest claim. This is literally the modern Boy who cried Wolf story. And astonishingly I guess a few do. Not many, but a few.
    Last edited by kewlJ; 05-11-2020 at 10:21 PM.
    Dan Druff: "there's no question that MDawg has been an obnoxious braggart, and has rubbed a ton of people the wrong way. There's something missing from his stories. Either they're fabricated, grossly exaggerated, or largely incomplete".

  16. #36
    I hope you don't lose any MORE sleep over this kew.

  17. #37
    Originally Posted by Rob.Singer View Post
    I hope you don't lose any MORE sleep over this kew.
    Can I ask you, do you think this interview went well, Rob?

    You postponed your summer trip and plans 2 weeks for this interview, so it must have been important to you.
    Dan Druff: "there's no question that MDawg has been an obnoxious braggart, and has rubbed a ton of people the wrong way. There's something missing from his stories. Either they're fabricated, grossly exaggerated, or largely incomplete".

  18. #38
    I'm not even going to waste time on it.

    All joking, put downs, or whether he's telling the truth or not aside, I really don't care. It's not going to affect my life whatsoever.

  19. #39
    Well at least this forum got a plug at the end. That couldn't hurt.

    I think.
    Check out my poker forum, and weekly internet radio show at http://pokerfraudalert.com

  20. #40
    Questions to Rob:

    1) Would you be willing to call the IRS and have them send you a tax return from one of those years, and then scan and post the relevant parts here (complete with IRS stamps/markings)? Obviously you can redact the parts with your SSN or whatever.

    2) Alternatively, can you show a proof of purchase for that RV, or some kind of proof that you are the registered owner?

    3) Did you or did you not pay with a players card when you did this trick?

    4) How many casinos did you do this at, and how often did you visit the same casino?

    5) You said in the video that you got a few $100k winners using this trick. If you were so worried about getting in trouble, which you seemed to be, why did you hit these machines for such high denomination wins, where the chance of them examining your play was higher?
    Check out my poker forum, and weekly internet radio show at http://pokerfraudalert.com

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