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Thread: Singer RV Receipt

  1. #161
    Originally Posted by unowme View Post
    Originally Posted by Bob21 View Post
    Originally Posted by The Boz View Post
    Damn, 1 day away and look what I miss.

    Count me as closer to Mickey in that I’m still not sure. And still consider it possible Singer is fucking with everyone. Just not in the way many are thinking.

    I will say if people are willing to wager significant money, it isn’t hard to prove. Even without a wager, the way it is bothering some, get in a car or plane and go meet him. The hell with terms and details, either he or a close family member owns the RV listed on the sales slip or they don’t.

    Surely a small amount to spent to prove the guy a liar once and for all. That would be priceless to a few for some reason.
    Boz, from day one Rob’s story made no sense. They were holes in every part of it.

    One of the main things Rob said that was incorrect is on the statue of limitation. There is none on tax fraud, so Rob could be spending time in jail if his story is true. And Rob knew this was cheating because of what happened to Kane and Nestor.

    That’s the ironic thing about this play. If Rob truly did it, he’d have taken it to his grave since he wouldn’t want the IRS coming after him, and spending his last days in jail. But if he didn’t do it, he has nothing to worry about, so he could spend time trolling this group and having fun.

    By Rob coming out and saying he did it almost proves he didn’t do it.
    I don't follow this place very closely, but I've known of Rob for a long time...going back to the days of Las Vegas Advisor Fezzik's Place (a sports betting forum) and Free For All. I've always thought he was a jerk, but not stupid. Did he actually admit here that he never paid taxes on his 'double up' bug winnings?

    And to give a little context to the bet I've proposed here, it reminds me of the $50K bet between Singer and Fezzik (a prominent handicapper and sports bettor) that never actually happened....probably in the 2008 timeframe It was a riot, but it was Fezzik who backed out. Funny, redietz was posting on those forums then and so was Alan Mendelson (As MoneyLA). Those were the days.
    That Rob committed tax fraud appears to be another made up fact by KJocchio. Put up some evidence, KJocchio.
    Question: Do you know why KJ is so happy?
    Answer: He's got maxpenis in his ass.

  2. #162
    Originally Posted by MaxPen View Post
    Originally Posted by mickeycrimm View Post

    He offeredd to let you see it in Boulder. You could have ended everything right then by going and seeing whether he had it or not. But no you punked out like you always do. Have you forgotten that Rob said the RV will be available for inspection in Phoenix this fall when he puts it up for sale. We'll see what kind of excuse you use then.
    That logic is the reason Pop Tarts come with instructions.
    Singer offered you guys to come see an RV in Boulder and you didn't call his bluff. He's offered you guys to go see an RV in Phoenix this fall and once again you chickenshits won't call his bluff. You and KJocchio are nothing but a couple of whiny little bitches
    Question: Do you know why KJ is so happy?
    Answer: He's got maxpenis in his ass.

  3. #163
    Originally Posted by Bob21 View Post
    Originally Posted by AndrewG View Post
    Originally Posted by Bob21 View Post

    No, but that pretty much goes without saying. I mean if he’d paid taxes on it, he’d show us his tax returns that he won $2.8 MM in gambling winnings over 4 years. I mean he claimed it was so important to him to get this story out that he couldn’t hold it in. If that’s the case, he’d show us his tax returns.

    Also, Rob would know that showing steady winnings of this magnitude would set off alarm bells at the IRS. I can assure you his tax returns would be flagged for auditing. This would smell of laundering money, and being involved in the drug trade or something like that, so it would be looked into. This is why it’s almost better keeping some of it off his tax returns, even if he did it. But then if Rob did that, he knows he could go to jail for tax fraud. Again, there is no statute of limitations for tax fraud, and I’m sure Rob knows that.

    Again, it’s called common sense stuff. If Rob did this, I doubt if he claimed $2.8 million on his taxes for gambling winnings. And if he didn’t claim this amount and he won this amount, he could go to jail. This has come up before. There are about 100 things you could point to that make no sense in Rob’s story.

    Look, nothing can ever be proved or disproved so people are wasting their time thinking it can be proved or disproved. This is why our standard in court is “beyond a reasonable doubt.”

    Being a scientist, I have had a hard time explaining to people nothing can ever be proved. I see people bringing this up again and again on this site and they don’t get it, nothing can ever be proven! It’s impossible to prove something.

    Look up the definition of prove in scientific terms. Btw, that’s why conspiracy theories abound. Even though I believe the moon landing occurred, I can’t prove it. And there are people out there that still think it was a hoax, and no one can prove they are wrong, no matter how much tv footage you show them. You can’t “prove” it happened.

    This is why Rob’s story can continue no matter how ridiculous it becomes. There’s always gonna be some possible reason for this or that.

    Hopefully Rob doesn’t go off in the twilight zone or UFO explanations for why this or that happened. So far Rob’s story has mostly delt in reality to explain things. And he’s actually getting some people to believe him, like Boz and Mickey, so it’s somewhat working.
    Bob21 you might be a scientist but you're missing some points about the tax law. If you believe Mr Singer's story then you would know his money is clean because the big wins came with W2Gs.

    In the past Mr Singer claimed he paid for the RV with cash. I asked why he would keep cash on clean money? Makes no sense.

    He then launched a story about other accumulated wealth being used to pay for the RV in cash. Again, other accumulated wealth from his job and investments being held as cash also makes no sense.

    You don't risk cash on clean money... especially a million dollars or more in a home safe.

    Then there is the cash problem at the RV dealership. Even if Mr Singer kept clean money as cash and accepted the risk of loss, the RV dealership would report the cash transaction.

    These are just holes in his story that can't be filled with rational thinking or explanations.

    He dug a hole for himself with his blanket explanation that he keeps no records longer than necessary.

    You know what he'd also keep? Every service report on a million dollars plus RV because the next buyer will want to see them. It's like with a Rolls Royce: you don't buy a Rolls without the service records.
    Andrew, good points! But your first point is wrong: "If you believe Mr Singer's story then you would know his money is clean because the big wins came with W2Gs." It doesn't matter if the big wins came with W2Gs or if they didn't, it's still "dirty money". If you don't believe me reread the wired article. Kane and Nester had to give back the money, and spend time in jail. It didn't matter that they got W2Gs with their big wins. This money was seen as "dirty" by our government. Kane and Nester ended up avoiding a long jail sentence, but they weren't able to keep the money. I think Kane was able to keep some of his, since he said he spent it or he hid it well.

    But make no bones about it, all the money "won" through the DUB was "dirty money". And it doesn't matter who "won" it that way, or how much was "won" at a time. Even though the machines had a bug in them that doesn't make it legal to exploit them. As many people on this site have already pointed out, if you find a bug in a ATM that spits out cash that doesn't make it legal to take it.

    This would have been Rob's biggest problem if he truly exploited the DUB. How to get all this "dirty money" back into circulation? That's not easy. Ask all the big drug dealers. This is how they get caught many times. Trying to get "dirty money" make into circulation. Go try to make a deposit at a bank for $9,900 every day and see what happens. Even if you do it for less, it will set off alarm bells if large cash deposits happen regularly.

    Note that Rob also said he won a lot of money without W2Gs. I mean theoretically, someone could win using the DUB without ever having to get a W2G. The DUB allowed you to win as much or as little as you wanted. As Nester said, it was like "printing money". If I was in the same situation, I'd have won a small amount over many casinos. It's not hard to see how someone could easily win $10,000 a day with the DUB and never get a W2G. But the trick would be getting it into circulation.

    I'm surprised more people didn't bring this up. Once the DUB is found, the easy part is getting the money. The hard part is getting it into circulation so you can buy something big. Like you said, he would NOT have been able to go into a RV dealership and lay out $1.3 million in cash and buy a Newell. They would have had to report him, and he would have known that.

    That's why I continue to say, if he really did it and made this amount of money, he'd have taken it to his grave, because all that money he "won" was "dirty", and he would have know that. There is no way any intelligent person would risk having this come back to bite him by bragging about it. The last thing anybody wants is the IRS sniffing in your finances.

    Now if he didn't do it, then he has nothing to worry about. He can brag all he wants and make up any story he wants and nothing will happen to him. Nobody went to jail bragging about catching the biggest fish, or telling whoppers. All Rob is guilty of is telling whoppers, and that doesn't get you thrown in jail.

    That's why the biggest tell that it didn't happen is Rob saying it did happen. If it did happen, I can assure you Rob or anybody in his position would take it to their grave, and never tell anybody.
    All you have to do to clean up cash won from gambling is file and pay taxes on it.
    Question: Do you know why KJ is so happy?
    Answer: He's got maxpenis in his ass.

  4. #164
    Originally Posted by mickeycrimm View Post
    Originally Posted by MaxPen View Post
    Originally Posted by mickeycrimm View Post

    He offeredd to let you see it in Boulder. You could have ended everything right then by going and seeing whether he had it or not. But no you punked out like you always do. Have you forgotten that Rob said the RV will be available for inspection in Phoenix this fall when he puts it up for sale. We'll see what kind of excuse you use then.
    That logic is the reason Pop Tarts come with instructions.
    Singer offered you guys to come see an RV in Boulder and you didn't call his bluff. He's offered you guys to go see an RV in Phoenix this fall and once again you chickenshits won't call his bluff. You and KJocchio are nothing but a couple of whiny little bitches
    I don't travel in search of unicorns either.
    But I wouldn't expect some dude who spent a majority of his life on the road chasing nickels to comprehend.
    How long was your brain deprived of oxygen? Because your pegging the absurd meter full red.

  5. #165
    Originally Posted by mickeycrimm View Post
    Originally Posted by MaxPen View Post
    Originally Posted by mickeycrimm View Post

    He offeredd to let you see it in Boulder. You could have ended everything right then by going and seeing whether he had it or not. But no you punked out like you always do. Have you forgotten that Rob said the RV will be available for inspection in Phoenix this fall when he puts it up for sale. We'll see what kind of excuse you use then.
    That logic is the reason Pop Tarts come with instructions.
    Singer offered you guys to come see an RV in Boulder and you didn't call his bluff. He's offered you guys to go see an RV in Phoenix this fall and once again you chickenshits won't call his bluff. You and KJocchio are nothing but a couple of whiny little bitches
    Mickey would go out of his way to "call his bluff" and waste his time. He genuinely suggests that but at least he wouldn't be a bitch!

  6. #166
    Originally Posted by MaxPen View Post
    Originally Posted by mickeycrimm View Post
    Originally Posted by MaxPen View Post

    That logic is the reason Pop Tarts come with instructions.
    Singer offered you guys to come see an RV in Boulder and you didn't call his bluff. He's offered you guys to go see an RV in Phoenix this fall and once again you chickenshits won't call his bluff. You and KJocchio are nothing but a couple of whiny little bitches
    I don't travel in search of unicorns either.
    But I wouldn't expect some dude who spent a majority of his life on the road chasing nickels to comprehend.
    How long was your brain deprived of oxygen? Because your pegging the absurd meter full red.
    You are obsessed with me. You can't get me off your mind. Now, I'm not gay so you better stick with KJ. He tells me you are quite the rump roaster.
    Question: Do you know why KJ is so happy?
    Answer: He's got maxpenis in his ass.

  7. #167
    Originally Posted by BoSox View Post
    Originally Posted by AndrewG View Post
    Originally Posted by Bob21 View Post

    No, but that pretty much goes without saying. I mean if he’d paid taxes on it, he’d show us his tax returns that he won $2.8 MM in gambling winnings over 4 years. I mean he claimed it was so important to him to get this story out that he couldn’t hold it in. If that’s the case, he’d show us his tax returns.

    Also, Rob would know that showing steady winnings of this magnitude would set off alarm bells at the IRS. I can assure you his tax returns would be flagged for auditing. This would smell of laundering money, and being involved in the drug trade or something like that, so it would be looked into. This is why it’s almost better keeping some of it off his tax returns, even if he did it. But then if Rob did that, he knows he could go to jail for tax fraud. Again, there is no statute of limitations for tax fraud, and I’m sure Rob knows that.

    Again, it’s called common sense stuff. If Rob did this, I doubt if he claimed $2.8 million on his taxes for gambling winnings. And if he didn’t claim this amount and he won this amount, he could go to jail. This has come up before. There are about 100 things you could point to that make no sense in Rob’s story.

    Look, nothing can ever be proved or disproved so people are wasting their time thinking it can be proved or disproved. This is why our standard in court is “beyond a reasonable doubt.”

    Being a scientist, I have had a hard time explaining to people nothing can ever be proved. I see people bringing this up again and again on this site and they don’t get it, nothing can ever be proven! It’s impossible to prove something.

    Look up the definition of prove in scientific terms. Btw, that’s why conspiracy theories abound. Even though I believe the moon landing occurred, I can’t prove it. And there are people out there that still think it was a hoax, and no one can prove they are wrong, no matter how much tv footage you show them. You can’t “prove” it happened.

    This is why Rob’s story can continue no matter how ridiculous it becomes. There’s always gonna be some possible reason for this or that.

    Hopefully Rob doesn’t go off in the twilight zone or UFO explanations for why this or that happened. So far Rob’s story has mostly delt in reality to explain things. And he’s actually getting some people to believe him, like Boz and Mickey, so it’s somewhat working.
    Bob21 you might be a scientist but you're missing some points about the tax law. If you believe Mr Singer's story then you would know his money is clean because the big wins came with W2Gs.

    In the past Mr Singer claimed he paid for the RV with cash. I asked why he would keep cash on clean money? Makes no sense.

    He then launched a story about other accumulated wealth being used to pay for the RV in cash. Again, other accumulated wealth from his job and investments being held as cash also makes no sense.

    You don't risk cash on clean money... especially a million dollars or more in a home safe.
    AndrewG, really, how about two seniors worried about future health problems and having a nursing home bleading their life savings dry?
    You have no idea how Medicare and Medicaid works to protect seniors in nursing homes. You need to consult a senior's attorney for guidance. There are laws to protect assets.

  8. #168
    Originally Posted by Bob21 View Post
    Originally Posted by AndrewG View Post
    Originally Posted by Bob21 View Post

    No, but that pretty much goes without saying. I mean if heÂ’d paid taxes on it, heÂ’d show us his tax returns that he won $2.8 MM in gambling winnings over 4 years. I mean he claimed it was so important to him to get this story out that he couldnÂ’t hold it in. If thatÂ’s the case, heÂ’d show us his tax returns.

    Also, Rob would know that showing steady winnings of this magnitude would set off alarm bells at the IRS. I can assure you his tax returns would be flagged for auditing. This would smell of laundering money, and being involved in the drug trade or something like that, so it would be looked into. This is why itÂ’s almost better keeping some of it off his tax returns, even if he did it. But then if Rob did that, he knows he could go to jail for tax fraud. Again, there is no statute of limitations for tax fraud, and IÂ’m sure Rob knows that.

    Again, itÂ’s called common sense stuff. If Rob did this, I doubt if he claimed $2.8 million on his taxes for gambling winnings. And if he didnÂ’t claim this amount and he won this amount, he could go to jail. This has come up before. There are about 100 things you could point to that make no sense in RobÂ’s story.

    Look, nothing can ever be proved or disproved so people are wasting their time thinking it can be proved or disproved. This is why our standard in court is “beyond a reasonable doubt.”

    Being a scientist, I have had a hard time explaining to people nothing can ever be proved. I see people bringing this up again and again on this site and they donÂ’t get it, nothing can ever be proven! ItÂ’s impossible to prove something.

    Look up the definition of prove in scientific terms. Btw, that’s why conspiracy theories abound. Even though I believe the moon landing occurred, I can’t prove it. And there are people out there that still think it was a hoax, and no one can prove they are wrong, no matter how much tv footage you show them. You can’t “prove” it happened.

    This is why RobÂ’s story can continue no matter how ridiculous it becomes. ThereÂ’s always gonna be some possible reason for this or that.

    Hopefully Rob doesnÂ’t go off in the twilight zone or UFO explanations for why this or that happened. So far RobÂ’s story has mostly delt in reality to explain things. And heÂ’s actually getting some people to believe him, like Boz and Mickey, so itÂ’s somewhat working.
    Bob21 you might be a scientist but you're missing some points about the tax law. If you believe Mr Singer's story then you would know his money is clean because the big wins came with W2Gs.

    In the past Mr Singer claimed he paid for the RV with cash. I asked why he would keep cash on clean money? Makes no sense.

    He then launched a story about other accumulated wealth being used to pay for the RV in cash. Again, other accumulated wealth from his job and investments being held as cash also makes no sense.

    You don't risk cash on clean money... especially a million dollars or more in a home safe.

    Then there is the cash problem at the RV dealership. Even if Mr Singer kept clean money as cash and accepted the risk of loss, the RV dealership would report the cash transaction.

    These are just holes in his story that can't be filled with rational thinking or explanations.

    He dug a hole for himself with his blanket explanation that he keeps no records longer than necessary.

    You know what he'd also keep? Every service report on a million dollars plus RV because the next buyer will want to see them. It's like with a Rolls Royce: you don't buy a Rolls without the service records.
    Andrew, good points! But your first point is wrong: "If you believe Mr Singer's story then you would know his money is clean because the big wins came with W2Gs." It doesn't matter if the big wins came with W2Gs or if they didn't, it's still "dirty money". If you don't believe me reread the wired article. Kane and Nester had to give back the money, and spend time in jail. It didn't matter that they got W2Gs with their big wins. This money was seen as "dirty" by our government. Kane and Nester ended up avoiding a long jail sentence, but they weren't able to keep the money. I think Kane was able to keep some of his, since he said he spent it or he hid it well.

    But make no bones about it, all the money "won" through the DUB was "dirty money". And it doesn't matter who "won" it that way, or how much was "won" at a time. Even though the machines had a bug in them that doesn't make it legal to exploit them. As many people on this site have already pointed out, if you find a bug in a ATM that spits out cash that doesn't make it legal to take it.

    This would have been Rob's biggest problem if he truly exploited the DUB. How to get all this "dirty money" back into circulation? That's not easy. Ask all the big drug dealers. This is how they get caught many times. Trying to get "dirty money" make into circulation. Go try to make a deposit at a bank for $9,900 every day and see what happens. Even if you do it for less, it will set off alarm bells if large cash deposits happen regularly.

    Note that Rob also said he won a lot of money without W2Gs. I mean theoretically, someone could win using the DUB without ever having to get a W2G. The DUB allowed you to win as much or as little as you wanted. As Nester said, it was like "printing money". If I was in the same situation, I'd have won a small amount over many casinos. It's not hard to see how someone could easily win $10,000 a day with the DUB and never get a W2G. But the trick would be getting it into circulation.

    I'm surprised more people didn't bring this up. Once the DUB is found, the easy part is getting the money. The hard part is getting it into circulation so you can buy something big. Like you said, he would NOT have been able to go into a RV dealership and lay out $1.3 million in cash and buy a Newell. They would have had to report him, and he would have known that.

    That's why I continue to say, if he really did it and made this amount of money, he'd have taken it to his grave, because all that money he "won" was "dirty", and he would have know that. There is no way any intelligent person would risk having this come back to bite him by bragging about it. The last thing anybody wants is the IRS sniffing in your finances.

    Now if he didn't do it, then he has nothing to worry about. He can brag all he wants and make up any story he wants and nothing will happen to him. Nobody went to jail bragging about catching the biggest fish, or telling whoppers. All Rob is guilty of is telling whoppers, and that doesn't get you thrown in jail.

    That's why the biggest tell that it didn't happen is Rob saying it did happen. If it did happen, I can assure you Rob or anybody in his position would take it to their grave, and never tell anybody.
    Kane and Nestor got caught. Mr Singer did not get caught so his money was clean.

  9. #169
    Originally Posted by AndrewG View Post
    Kane and Nestor got caught. Mr Singer did not get caught so his money was clean.
    You’re missing my point, and you’re wrong. You said the W2G made the money “clean”. It was still “dirty” money even thought he got a W2G. The key is he didn’t get caught. That’s different, then saying the money is “clean”.

    And I get it. If someone can somehow get “dirty money”, then eventually there is a statue of limitations on the government being able to prosecute them for that crime. And this was a crime. Like you said, Rob just didn’t get caught. What we don’t know is if he reported it in his taxes.

    If he did, that means he was claiming money in his taxes that he knew he was getting illegally. Most people wouldn’t have done that. This is why it’s a tricky situation. If he didn’t claim the money in his taxes, the government can still prosecute him for tax fraud. Why would Rob open himself up to that possibility?

    If Rob really did this he’s still in a sticky situation with the government. That’s why he’d have kept quite and not brag about it.

    Here’s a good example: If two bank robbers rob two different banks and one gets away with it and one doesn’t that doesn’t mean the bank robber that got away with it has “clean money”. That makes no sense.

    And most smart bank robbers who get away with it don’t brag about it on an open forum, they take it to their grave.

    Personally, I don’t see anything to brag about in taking “dirty money” anyway. So this whole things makes no sense.

  10. #170
    Originally Posted by mickeycrimm View Post

    You are obsessed with me. You can't get me off your mind. Now, I'm not gay so you better stick with KJ. He tells me you are quite the rump roaster.
    Says the donkey with me featured in his signature line.

  11. #171
    Originally Posted by AndrewG View Post
    Originally Posted by BoSox View Post
    AndrewG, really, how about two seniors worried about future health problems and having a nursing home bleading their life savings dry?
    You have no idea how Medicare and Medicaid works to protect seniors in nursing homes. You need to consult a senior's attorney for guidance. There are laws to protect assets.
    This is irrelevant to the Rob stuff, but AndrewG, I suggest you look into guardianship abuse. If you have Netflix there is a good episode of Dirty Money about it (Guardians Inc.). It's alarmingly easy for greedy lawyers and nursing home operators to drain wealthy seniors of their assets. Some of the nursing home owners are in on the whole scam. Sadly, it's apparently pretty common these days.

  12. #172
    Originally Posted by GOATshoes View Post
    Originally Posted by AndrewG View Post
    Originally Posted by BoSox View Post
    AndrewG, really, how about two seniors worried about future health problems and having a nursing home bleading their life savings dry?
    You have no idea how Medicare and Medicaid works to protect seniors in nursing homes. You need to consult a senior's attorney for guidance. There are laws to protect assets.
    This is irrelevant to the Rob stuff, but AndrewG, I suggest you look into guardianship abuse. If you have Netflix there is a good episode of Dirty Money about it (Guardians Inc.). It's alarmingly easy for greedy lawyers and nursing home operators to drain wealthy seniors of their assets. Some of the nursing home owners are in on the whole scam. Sadly, it's apparently pretty common these days.
    If you need senior law representation private message me.

  13. #173
    Originally Posted by Bob21 View Post

    No, but that pretty much goes without saying. I mean if he’d paid taxes on it, he’d show us his tax returns that he won $2.8 MM in gambling winnings over 4 years. I mean he claimed it was so important to him to get this story out that he couldn’t hold it in. If that’s the case, he’d show us his tax returns.

    Also, Rob would know that showing steady winnings of this magnitude would set off alarm bells at the IRS. I can assure you his tax returns would be flagged for auditing. This would smell of laundering money, and being involved in the drug trade or something like that, so it would be looked into. This is why it’s almost better keeping some of it off his tax returns, even if he did it. But then if Rob did that, he knows he could go to jail for tax fraud. Again, there is no statute of limitations for tax fraud, and I’m sure Rob knows that.

    Again, it’s called common sense stuff. If Rob did this, I doubt if he claimed $2.8 million on his taxes for gambling winnings. And if he didn’t claim this amount and he won this amount, he could go to jail. This has come up before. There are about 100 things you could point to that make no sense in Rob’s story.
    I would never believe anything Singer says without overwhelming proof. I have seen no such proof about ANY of his claims. Unfortunately, your 'scientific' argument here is weak. Assuming Rob did win what he claims with the double up flaw, it would be stupid of him to not claim it as income and pay taxes on it. Why? Because most of those winnings would be reported on W2Gs. The IRS already knows about the gambling income. The criminal act would be not reporting that income.

    It's my contention that Kane and Nestor and (allegedly) Rob did nothing illegal. Remember charges against Kane and Nestor were dropped. They were never convicted of anything. Why is that? It's not a criminal act to exploit a design flaw in a gaming machine. It's the Game Manufacturer's and Casino's responsibility to deploy gaming devices that are tested and perform as they expect. If they put a weak design into production that's not the gambler's fault. Just like if they have a dealer who exposes his hole card or a biased roulette wheel (which have been exploited for over a century). It's their job to make sure their games can't be exploited and that they are making the correct pay outs. All the gambler does is push the buttons.

    So, if Rob felt what he was doing was perfectly legal, why would he make these claims that he waited until the running of the statute of limitation before discussing his multi-million dollar score? It would have nothing to do with the IRS. The logical thing to do there is report and pay all taxes.

    I can think of a few reasons why waiting would make sense. Although there is no criminal liability, there may be civil liability. The casinos could make the case in civil court that Nevada law voids winnings on machine malfunctions and that money rightly belongs to the casino. There is a statute of limitations on civil cases. Also, although it may end up being ruled a legal play, the casinos and Clark County law enforcement are in bed on anything that impacts casino profits. They could still charge a double up perpetrator with all kinds of crimes to send a message. Sure he would eventually prevail....after spending a fortune in legal fees. That's a message. So why not wait just until there is no possibility of prosecution?

    With all that said if Rob actually exploited the double up flaw, the really stupid thing he did was to ever mention it at all. I could see some relief at passing the time you can be charged or they can sue you in civil court, but mentioning it in a public forum after the fact is just plain stupid. There is no reason to do that.

    Although without real evidence, it's not possible to prove Rob exploited the double up flaw or ever made money with his martingale VP betting scheme. I think both are highly unlikely but not impossible. I do think we can agree on acceptable terms for a wager that can proves Rob owned the Motor Home he claims. This is a lot more tangible. So...if we get agreement on acceptable proof, how much are you in for? 10 Grand? More?

  14. #174
    Originally Posted by unowme View Post
    Originally Posted by Bob21 View Post

    No, but that pretty much goes without saying. I mean if he’d paid taxes on it, he’d show us his tax returns that he won $2.8 MM in gambling winnings over 4 years. I mean he claimed it was so important to him to get this story out that he couldn’t hold it in. If that’s the case, he’d show us his tax returns.

    Also, Rob would know that showing steady winnings of this magnitude would set off alarm bells at the IRS. I can assure you his tax returns would be flagged for auditing. This would smell of laundering money, and being involved in the drug trade or something like that, so it would be looked into. This is why it’s almost better keeping some of it off his tax returns, even if he did it. But then if Rob did that, he knows he could go to jail for tax fraud. Again, there is no statute of limitations for tax fraud, and I’m sure Rob knows that.

    Again, it’s called common sense stuff. If Rob did this, I doubt if he claimed $2.8 million on his taxes for gambling winnings. And if he didn’t claim this amount and he won this amount, he could go to jail. This has come up before. There are about 100 things you could point to that make no sense in Rob’s story.
    I would never believe anything Singer says without overwhelming proof. I have seen no such proof about ANY of his claims. Unfortunately, your 'scientific' argument here is weak. Assuming Rob did win what he claims with the double up flaw, it would be stupid of him to not claim it as income and pay taxes on it. Why? Because most of those winnings would be reported on W2Gs. The IRS already knows about the gambling income. The criminal act would be not reporting that income.

    It's my contention that Kane and Nestor and (allegedly) Rob did nothing illegal. Remember charges against Kane and Nestor were dropped. They were never convicted of anything. Why is that? It's not a criminal act to exploit a design flaw in a gaming machine. It's the Game Manufacturer's and Casino's responsibility to deploy gaming devices that are tested and perform as they expect. If they put a weak design into production that's not the gambler's fault. Just like if they have a dealer who exposes his hole card or a biased roulette wheel (which have been exploited for over a century). It's their job to make sure their games can't be exploited and that they are making the correct pay outs. All the gambler does is push the buttons.

    So, if Rob felt what he was doing was perfectly legal, why would he make these claims that he waited until the running of the statute of limitation before discussing his multi-million dollar score? It would have nothing to do with the IRS. The logical thing to do there is report and pay all taxes.

    I can think of a few reasons why waiting would make sense. Although there is no criminal liability, there may be civil liability. The casinos could make the case in civil court that Nevada law voids winnings on machine malfunctions and that money rightly belongs to the casino. There is a statute of limitations on civil cases. Also, although it may end up being ruled a legal play, the casinos and Clark County law enforcement are in bed on anything that impacts casino profits. They could still charge a double up perpetrator with all kinds of crimes to send a message. Sure he would eventually prevail....after spending a fortune in legal fees. That's a message. So why not wait just until there is no possibility of prosecution?

    With all that said if Rob actually exploited the double up flaw, the really stupid thing he did was to ever mention it at all. I could see some relief at passing the time you can be charged or they can sue you in civil court, but mentioning it in a public forum after the fact is just plain stupid. There is no reason to do that.

    Although without real evidence, it's not possible to prove Rob exploited the double up flaw or ever made money with his martingale VP betting scheme. I think both are highly unlikely but not impossible. I do think we can agree on acceptable terms for a wager that can proves Rob owned the Motor Home he claims. This is a lot more tangible. So...if we get agreement on acceptable proof, how much are you in for? 10 Grand? More?
    One question: If what Kane and Nestor did was legal why did they have to return all their money? People who obtain money through a legal means don’t have to return it.

    Their Lawyers did everything they could to keep them out of jail. And I agree the prosecutors came after them for the wrong reasons.

    And one more comment. Rob said he won a lot of the money below the W2G form. There would be no reason to claim this money unless he wanted to.

    Look none of Rob’s story makes any sense. He purposely didn’t keep his tax records or any proof of anything because he most likely didn’t win anything. That’s why he doesn’t have to worry about the IRS coming after him for anything.

    You are right nothing can be proved and I have said that over and over. But common sense should tell anybody Rob didn’t exploit the double up bug. It’s amazing anybody believes it might’ve happen at this stage of the game.

    Read what I said about Science. I said Science says you can’t prove anything. I never said I was given a scientific proof of anything. It only takes a little common sense to know this didn’t happen.
    Last edited by Bob21; 05-23-2020 at 03:39 PM.

  15. #175
    Fact. Once 2013 rolled around and Nestor and Kane walked, Rob would have known that criminal liability was not an issue.

    Civil liability is only four years, maybe even only three, in Nevada as far as the casinos suing him to recover whatever he won. Assuming they could win on such a claim, Phil Ivey style.

    There is no SOL on civil fraud for tax evasion, if the amount in question is large enough, if deliberate and done with specific intent to defraud.

    Given that Rob is now talk talk talking about all this, he's not worried about tax evasion, so strike that. So...given that the civil liability was at most four years (more likely just three) for the casinos' suing him, why did he wait until now? why not disclose three or four years after he did whatever he did? And if some clever lawyer could argue that the SOL was three or four years from when they became aware of the fraud, then why would Rob ever disclose?

    At the end of the day, at best, it's a headache not worth too much effort trying to figure out when the perpetrator has not given us enough information to assess the situation completely. At worst, it's all nonsense and not worthy of any serious consideration and good only for a laugh.
    I tell you it’s wonderful to be here, man. I don’t give a damn who wins or loses. It’s just wonderful to be here with you people.

  16. #176
    Of course Singer never played it. What is the purpose of continuing this discussion. Fat lady can't sing anymore. Laryngitis has set in.

  17. #177
    Originally Posted by AndrewG View Post
    Of course Singer never played it. What is the purpose of continuing this discussion. Fat lady can't sing anymore. Laryngitis has set in.
    Agreed! I guess it’s just a slow Saturday so it’s giving us something to do. You’re right it’s senseless at this point to go over it anymore.

    It’s like arguing if OJ murdered Nicole. Some people will believe he didn’t do it because he got off. But people that are born with half a brain cell and have a little common sense know he did it.

  18. #178
    Originally Posted by Bob21 View Post

    One question: If what Kane and Nestor did was legal why did they have to return all their money? People who obtain money through a legal means don’t have to return it.
    Except that's not what happened. Kane kept his entire $500,000 winnings. Nestor's winnings in Pennsylvania were seized by the local district attorney WHEN HE WAS ARRESTED and returned to the Meadows casino without any court ruling or agreement by Nestor. There was a third party, Nestor's roommate who did turn over more of Nestor's money upon threat of hundreds of fraud charges. That wasn't his money anyway.

    But just to be clear, I never claimed Rob did the double up flaw....only that your speculation on why he wouldn't report it as income makes no sense. That's why I asked you if he admitted not filing income taxes on it. But regardless. That isn't even the question. The question is if Rob has been tooling around the country for years in a 1.3 million dollar Motor Home. I think that would be a lot easier to prove. I was hoping Rob would join in so we could have a 'Put up or shut up' moment.

  19. #179
    Originally Posted by AndrewG View Post
    Of course Singer never played it. What is the purpose of continuing this discussion. Fat lady can't sing anymore. Laryngitis has set in.
    Right. That's old news. The current topic is Singer's Million Dollar+ RV. If you had to bet, would you say it's for real or a real figment of his imagination?

  20. #180
    Originally Posted by unowme View Post
    Originally Posted by AndrewG View Post
    Of course Singer never played it. What is the purpose of continuing this discussion. Fat lady can't sing anymore. Laryngitis has set in.
    Right. That's old news. The current topic is Singer's Million Dollar+ RV. If you had to bet, would you say it's for real or a real figment of his imagination?
    If you make the bet big enough the RV will become real.

    Let me explain in case you haven't figured out the thinking of a con artist.

    If you make a $100,000 bet with me, with proof that your $100,000 is in escrow, I can guarantee you that I can get a $600,000 RV to win your $100k.

    All I need to do is promise my investor or front man $60,000 for the RV for two or three days use... including a totally legal lease/buyback deal. He gets $60k and I keep $40k for a few hours of work including showing you the RV and the paperwork.

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