Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 23

Thread: Woman exploited payout glitch in Michigan BetMGM online roulette, sues casino for over $3 million

  1. #1
    https://www.playmichigan.com/michiga...int-not-filed/

    She ran up $50 to $3.2 million via some kind of glitch where wins would be multiplied every time she hit a winner.

    She kept upping her bets in order to get to the huge balance. She requested and received her first cashout for $100k (after the huge run up), but then the casino got wise and refused to pay the balance.

    Interestingly, BetMGM offered her either $23,000 or $75,000 in BetMGM credits ON TOP OF THE $100K ALREADY RECEIVED, if she were to drop the claim for the rest, and sign a contract agreeing never to speak of what occurred. She refused and sued them.

    I'm actually on BetMGM's side here. They should have voided the entire thing once they discovered it, demanded the $100k back, and sued her if she refused.

    I'm not understanding why no one else caught this, unless it required an obscure series of clicks which others hadn't tried yet.
    Check out my poker forum, and weekly internet radio show at http://pokerfraudalert.com

  2. #2
    Originally Posted by Dan Druff View Post
    https://www.playmichigan.com/michiga...int-not-filed/

    She ran up $50 to $3.2 million via some kind of glitch where wins would be multiplied every time she hit a winner.

    She kept upping her bets in order to get to the huge balance. She requested and received her first cashout for $100k (after the huge run up), but then the casino got wise and refused to pay the balance.

    Interestingly, BetMGM offered her either $23,000 or $75,000 in BetMGM credits ON TOP OF THE $100K ALREADY RECEIVED, if she were to drop the claim for the rest, and sign a contract agreeing never to speak of what occurred. She refused and sued them.

    I'm actually on BetMGM's side here. They should have voided the entire thing once they discovered it, demanded the $100k back, and sued her if she refused.

    I'm not understanding why no one else caught this, unless it required an obscure series of clicks which others hadn't tried yet.
    I miss Ozzy.

  3. #3
    Originally Posted by Dan Druff View Post
    https://www.playmichigan.com/michiga...int-not-filed/

    She ran up $50 to $3.2 million via some kind of glitch where wins would be multiplied every time she hit a winner.

    She kept upping her bets in order to get to the huge balance. She requested and received her first cashout for $100k (after the huge run up), but then the casino got wise and refused to pay the balance.

    Interestingly, BetMGM offered her either $23,000 or $75,000 in BetMGM credits ON TOP OF THE $100K ALREADY RECEIVED, if she were to drop the claim for the rest, and sign a contract agreeing never to speak of what occurred. She refused and sued them.

    I'm actually on BetMGM's side here. They should have voided the entire thing once they discovered it, demanded the $100k back, and sued her if she refused.

    I'm not understanding why no one else caught this, unless it required an obscure series of clicks which others hadn't tried yet.
    Machine malfunction cancels all plays. Not sure how that works online in Michigan, but probably legal code in there, somewhere, and she will lose. Take the offer while you can.
    Keep your friends close, keep your drinks closer...

  4. #4
    Originally Posted by jpfromla View Post
    Originally Posted by Dan Druff View Post
    https://www.playmichigan.com/michiga...int-not-filed/

    She ran up $50 to $3.2 million via some kind of glitch where wins would be multiplied every time she hit a winner.

    She kept upping her bets in order to get to the huge balance. She requested and received her first cashout for $100k (after the huge run up), but then the casino got wise and refused to pay the balance.

    Interestingly, BetMGM offered her either $23,000 or $75,000 in BetMGM credits ON TOP OF THE $100K ALREADY RECEIVED, if she were to drop the claim for the rest, and sign a contract agreeing never to speak of what occurred. She refused and sued them.

    I'm actually on BetMGM's side here. They should have voided the entire thing once they discovered it, demanded the $100k back, and sued her if she refused.

    I'm not understanding why no one else caught this, unless it required an obscure series of clicks which others hadn't tried yet.
    Machine malfunction cancels all plays. Not sure how that works online in Michigan, but probably legal code in there, somewhere, and she will lose. Take the offer while you can.
    Here you go….
    Although all the particulars and considerations of this case aren’t known, Michigan’s Lawful Internet Gaming Rules address voiding internet wagers.
    The rule states: “An internet gaming operator or internet gaming platform provider may not void a completed internet wager without board approval unless a void is necessary to resolve an internet gaming platform or internet game error or malfunction.”
    Keep your friends close, keep your drinks closer...

  5. #5
    Originally Posted by jpfromla View Post
    Machine malfunction cancels all plays.
    Yes, Machine Malfunctions cancel all pays but Machine Glitches are the gift that keeps on giving, for years on end, in many circumstances.
    Two completely different animals.
    One of my favorites that lasted for a few weeks was this example below.
    Put 100 dollars in the machine.
    Cash out 100 dollars.
    100 dollars in credits still on machine.
    Play Machine.
    Repeat.

  6. #6
    Originally Posted by monet View Post
    Originally Posted by jpfromla View Post
    Machine malfunction cancels all plays.
    Yes, Machine Malfunctions cancel all pays but Machine Glitches are the gift that keeps on giving, for years on end, in many circumstances.
    Two completely different animals.
    One of my favorites that lasted for a few weeks was this example below.
    Put 100 dollars in the machine.
    Cash out 100 dollars.
    100 dollars in credits still on machine.
    Play Machine.
    Repeat.
    Agree! “Do what you want, don’t get caught”. Or in her case stupid greedy.
    Keep your friends close, keep your drinks closer...

  7. #7
    The fact that MGM offered anything in addition to the 100k tells me that she is in the right with whatever is going on. It doesn't appear to be a malfunction. It appears to be a payout error in the program. She didn't design the game or offer the game. She just played it. They owe her the money and they know it.

  8. #8
    This should be a win for the woman. There was no malfunction in the playing of the game. It paid her wins larger amounts than it should have. Nothing that she could control. And the game had no problem taking her $5000 losing bets during her sessions. It's an even simpler resolution than the DU play, where the player had to go thru several moves in order to get the machine to pay out larger amounts than it stated it would. Here, she simply played the game and the game paid her wins extra.

  9. #9
    This game is no longer offered in MI, but it is still offered in NJ. Is BetMGM going to give back money to all the players who lost money on this game.
    https://www.new-jersey-online-casino...o-the-roulette

    https://www.newsweek.com/woman-claim...glitch-1603273

  10. #10
    Originally Posted by MaxPen View Post
    The fact that MGM offered anything in addition to the 100k tells me that she is in the right with whatever is going on. It doesn't appear to be a malfunction. It appears to be a payout error in the program. She didn't design the game or offer the game. She just played it. They owe her the money and they know it.
    I agree.
    I think many members on this site agree with this statement.
    Not much of a reason to really get into it.
    Can't wait to stumble upon a new glitch in the Casinos.

  11. #11
    Originally Posted by MaxPen View Post
    The fact that MGM offered anything in addition to the 100k tells me that she is in the right with whatever is going on. It doesn't appear to be a malfunction. It appears to be a payout error in the program. She didn't design the game or offer the game. She just played it. They owe her the money and they know it.
    I'm no friend of the casinos, as you know. However, I try to look at these things logically and fairly, and not just side with the underdog.

    I cannot see how a player can make legal claim to an overpay. That's where the "malfunction vods all plays and pays" comes in, which you see on every machine. It's to protect the casino in the case where you win $5 and the machine somehow pays you $5,000,000.

    I will agree that casinos need to eat losses from misset paytables or games somehow placed in lucrative +EV states. It is the casino's responsibility to set games properly to where there is a house advantage.

    However, if the machine doesn't function as intended, and simply pays out more than the player has won, that's definitely a malfunction, and I'm on the casino's side. I'm not going to hold it against anyone who tries to exploit this and make a little coin before the casinos catch on, but I'm also not going to cry for them when they get caught and face the consequences.

    BetMGM apparently paid the first $100,000 before realizing there was an issue. It was shortly after that where they realized what had occurred, and locked her account. The offer to pay her an additional $23k (and let her keep the $100k as well) was likely for PR purposes. Rather than deal with the bad optics of the situation if this story hit the press, it was worth it for BetMGM to just pay a little more money and make the problem go away.
    Check out my poker forum, and weekly internet radio show at http://pokerfraudalert.com

  12. #12
    If the casino has a game paying 50:1 on one number on the roulette wheel that is not a malfunction. That is a poorly built game that they offered. Same as having a 20% instead of a 2.0% meter setting on a slot progressive.

    The casino can pull the game at anytime and make changes but they need to pay for the bets already made. MGM knows this. That is why they are trying to weasel out.

    I cannot believe the number of people that think the casino is entitled to a do over because they made an error when they built the game. Sheep

    Plus the laws in this state require the casino to verify there games are operating correctly every 24 hours. So at best they have an argument to void only her last day on the game. But not the previous 4 days.
    Last edited by MaxPen; 06-30-2021 at 04:46 AM.

  13. #13
    Originally Posted by MaxPen View Post
    If the casino has a game paying 50:1 on one number on the roulette wheel that is not a malfunction. That is a poorly built game that they offered. Same as having a 20% instead of a 2.0% meter setting on a slot progressive.

    The casino can pull the game at anytime and make changes but they need to pay for the bets already made. MGM knows this. That is why they are trying to weasel out.

    I cannot believe the number of people that think the casino is entitled to a do over because they made an error when they built the game. Sheep

    Plus the laws in this state require the casino to verify there games are operating correctly every 24 hours. So at best they have an argument to void only her last day on the game. But not the previous 4 days.
    Good Point.

    In my personal experience, in these situations, the Casino has never given me trouble over glitches or asked for their money back. The only time I did have a problem was with abusing a Restaurant/Gift Shop Point Glitch that went on for over 6 months. They 86'd me for that but couldn't recoup their money, points or merchandise. I've found many of these point glitches and only had one casino give me strife over it. Everyone else just chalked it up and one other Casino just put me upside down on my point account. In one instance, with the point glitch at Binions, the Casino was actually cheating and had to give everyone a drawing chance to collect 2000+ dollars and you could win multiple times. Funny because we all took advantage of that glitch for a few years, so not only did we crush them on the glitch but since they cheated everyone on the top prize they had to give more money out. And nobody I know of who exploited this glitch got in any trouble or 86'd. MaxPen has already talked about this Swipe Glitch at Binions before. He knows what I am talking about. I've had much more heat over playing higher denominations and running hot, compared to exploiting glitches or +EV games, which I find kind of ironic.

    1:58
    You made a bet.
    Pay the man.

    Last edited by monet; 06-30-2021 at 05:30 AM.

  14. #14
    You forgot to mention that she ran up her money up to 11 Million and back down to the 3.2 Million.
    You are telling me that nobody noticed her playing for 5 days and running it up to 11 Million at one point???
    I find that hard to believe.
    They owe her the money but MGM will either win in court or settle.
    Life isn't fair.

  15. #15
    Originally Posted by monet View Post
    You forgot to mention that she ran up her money up to 11 Million and back down to the 3.2 Million.
    You are telling me that nobody noticed her playing for 5 days and running it up to 11 Million at one point???
    I find that hard to believe.
    They owe her the money but MGM will either win in court or settle.
    Life isn't fair.
    I think her total wins were 11 million and total losses 8 million.

  16. #16
    Originally Posted by MaxPen View Post
    I think her total wins were 11 million and total losses 8 million.
    Not the way I understand the story but the point is she played 5 days, started with 50 dollars and eventually was betting 5,000 dollars a spin AND NOBODY NOTICED??
    Dem Magums are some Sharpies I tell you.
    You would think when she cracked her first Million they might of had an alarm go off or noticed!?
    Last edited by monet; 07-01-2021 at 06:58 PM.

  17. #17
    Originally Posted by Dan Druff View Post
    Originally Posted by MaxPen View Post
    The fact that MGM offered anything in addition to the 100k tells me that she is in the right with whatever is going on. It doesn't appear to be a malfunction. It appears to be a payout error in the program. She didn't design the game or offer the game. She just played it. They owe her the money and they know it.
    I'm no friend of the casinos, as you know. However, I try to look at these things logically and fairly, and not just side with the underdog.

    I cannot see how a player can make legal claim to an overpay. That's where the "malfunction vods all plays and pays" comes in, which you see on every machine. It's to protect the casino in the case where you win $5 and the machine somehow pays you $5,000,000.

    I will agree that casinos need to eat losses from misset paytables or games somehow placed in lucrative +EV states. It is the casino's responsibility to set games properly to where there is a house advantage.

    However, if the machine doesn't function as intended, and simply pays out more than the player has won, that's definitely a malfunction, and I'm on the casino's side. I'm not going to hold it against anyone who tries to exploit this and make a little coin before the casinos catch on, but I'm also not going to cry for them when they get caught and face the consequences.

    BetMGM apparently paid the first $100,000 before realizing there was an issue. It was shortly after that where they realized what had occurred, and locked her account. The offer to pay her an additional $23k (and let her keep the $100k as well) was likely for PR purposes. Rather than deal with the bad optics of the situation if this story hit the press, it was worth it for BetMGM to just pay a little more money and make the problem go away.
    Dan this type of overpayment for wins issue has already been ruled on in Federal Court, which while not Michigan state court, is a valid precedent. And the "malfunction" argument has no merit here. She's not playing a machine--just navigating online software. It's not her responsibility to do anything beyond gambling while she racks up wins and/or losses. She should easily prevail.

  18. #18
    Sorry but as much as I'd like to root for the underdog here, I can't take the woman's side here.

    Let's say the online game paid her a billion dollars due to the same glitch. Would BetMGM ower her a billion?

    This is WAY different than a misset paytable. For example, if a casino sets a Jacks or Better game to 18-15 instead of 8-5, then they're responsible to pay out whatever winnings the machine spits out. It's their fault for accidentally providing a +EV game.

    This wasn't an accidental +EV game. It was a bug which simply overpaid the woman beyond her winnings. This isn't too different from an ATM which overpays you when you go withdraw $40, and it spits out $400. It's actually a crime to take advantage of this. In this case, it's probably not a crime, but she shouldn't get her winnings.
    Check out my poker forum, and weekly internet radio show at http://pokerfraudalert.com

  19. #19
    Originally Posted by Dan Druff View Post
    Sorry but as much as I'd like to root for the underdog here, I can't take the woman's side here.

    Let's say the online game paid her a billion dollars due to the same glitch. Would BetMGM ower her a billion?

    This is WAY different than a misset paytable. For example, if a casino sets a Jacks or Better game to 18-15 instead of 8-5, then they're responsible to pay out whatever winnings the machine spits out. It's their fault for accidentally providing a +EV game.

    This wasn't an accidental +EV game. It was a bug which simply overpaid the woman beyond her winnings. This isn't too different from an ATM which overpays you when you go withdraw $40, and it spits out $400. It's actually a crime to take advantage of this. In this case, it's probably not a crime, but she shouldn't get her winnings.
    You are making up bad hypotheticals and examples but I'm in favor of you doing whatever you got to do to prove your point in this matter.

  20. #20
    Am I misunderstanding the situation?

    She was playing a -EV roulette game which was set correctly, but the payouts were inexplicably multiplying before being awarded. This was not a feature of the game or a misset paytable. It was simply incorrectly paying its wins, similar to an ATM machine giving you $400 when you request $40.

    From what I've read, that seems to be the situation here.
    Check out my poker forum, and weekly internet radio show at http://pokerfraudalert.com

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 9
    Last Post: 10-08-2020, 04:59 AM
  2. Encore Boston has slots suddenly shut down due to mass payout error
    By Dan Druff in forum Eastern US & Non-US Casinos
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 02-22-2020, 12:18 AM
  3. Replies: 9
    Last Post: 12-29-2017, 03:41 PM
  4. Video Poker machine glitch: cheating or not ??
    By Vegas Vic in forum Las Vegas
    Replies: 33
    Last Post: 11-28-2013, 01:24 PM
  5. Replies: 0
    Last Post: 02-27-2013, 05:10 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •