When Weakness Prevails, Show Them The Meaning of Strength

[The Boz]

Your average lefty has no idea how 2000 mules repeatedly delivered ballots to as many as 50 locations a day in Georgia, Arizona and Pennsylvania which threw the election to Biden. Check the results for how close the vote was in those states. The ballot harvesting was enough for Biden to win those states.

And dems want people to say it was a fair election? GTFO!

Micky has fallen very far.

Yeah, Montana must be pretty much an echo chamber. A silo for people with no motive to grasp reality.

I never met a conspiracy theory I didn't like, but the idea that there was massive vote fraud is asinine. Voting is not a black box. The numbers are so detailed, predictable and analyzable, there's no way to create magic votes that wouldn't fire off gazillions of red alarms. It's not just on a state level. Every county, every voting district, literally everyone on all sides knows how many are registered which way, they know the usual participation percentages, and unusual numbers from previous norms are impossible to not notice.

The public with a little know how can access the same numbers and see what registration totals are and the percentages of who voted which way in previous elections. There's a reason somebody like Carville has everything down to a science.

The only argument is whether mail-in should have been used, and if you want to create hoops to jump through not employed by other western democracies, welcome to Jim Crow revisited. If your whole strategy is to depress turnout, why not just admit you don't think people should vote?

Voting should be mandatory. How can you argue against mandatory voting for a healthy democracy? The far right would go nuts if voting were mandatory.

RED this is what you and others don’t get or won’t admit. The election was “won” by Biden because he had more votes in the states he needed. The question is where the votes came from and was it “fair” by the ways we considered how elections work and how votes were collected before 2020. No I don’t believe votes were changed in Dominion machines and other conspiracy theories. But I 100% believe votes were collected from people who had no interest in voting, would have never voted, and only voted because they were mailed a ballot they would have never requested. And in most cases, they were Biden votes from liberal cities and registered Democrats.

Not sure how anyone can argue that this didn’t happen. I give Democrats credit for being crafty enough to see this opportunity, seize upon it and get votes from voters they would have never had in a normal non Covid year. They saw opportunity to expand voting and used Covid as an excuse to push mail voting, which was always a goal of theirs. They know a certain segment of the population is too uncaring or lazy to show up and vote and wouldn’t request a mail in ballot. But send it to them automatically and have a Dem operative offer to show up and collect it, they may fill out it. And they executed it to a level high enough to tip the election in battleground states. Take this away and Trump won these same states in larger margins than 2016.

Unfortunately we are all now paying for it with what it did to our economy.

[tableplay]

I am really fascinated by sophisticated cheat moves (Not to say this is sophisticated) I would never do one myself, I will even stay out of gray areas.

Here's another unsophisticated one. A casino ran a promotion where they gave you a certain amount of free play for a jackpot of a certain size on a certain day of the week and it was once per player for that day. IIRC, you couldn't use multi-hand VP, but that was the only restriction. One Eyed Jacks was the solution since it has a four of a kind cycle (jack of hearts and spades are wild cards) of about 1 in 50 draw-deals and pays 15 for 1 (and since it was at this casino running this promotion at the proper denomination required for a safe take down). So I would hit the jackpot easily for the free play and that was that for the week. Well, as you may or may not know, OEJ is one of the least popular VP themes there is. So the next week I still see my four of a kind and could have easily double claimed it (you call the slot attendant over and show them the hand) since it was totally untouched and I would have just needed to insert a voucher exceeding the win size. I did not do this, but that just goes to show how easy it is to pull this kind of thing.

[mcap]

Micky has fallen very far.

Yeah, Montana must be pretty much an echo chamber. A silo for people with no motive to grasp reality.

I never met a conspiracy theory I didn't like, but the idea that there was massive vote fraud is asinine. Voting is not a black box. The numbers are so detailed, predictable and analyzable, there's no way to create magic votes that wouldn't fire off gazillions of red alarms. It's not just on a state level. Every county, every voting district, literally everyone on all sides knows how many are registered which way, they know the usual participation percentages, and unusual numbers from previous norms are impossible to not notice.

The public with a little know how can access the same numbers and see what registration totals are and the percentages of who voted which way in previous elections. There's a reason somebody like Carville has everything down to a science.

The only argument is whether mail-in should have been used, and if you want to create hoops to jump through not employed by other western democracies, welcome to Jim Crow revisited. If your whole strategy is to depress turnout, why not just admit you don't think people should vote?

Voting should be mandatory. How can you argue against mandatory voting for a healthy democracy? The far right would go nuts if voting were mandatory.

RED this is what you and others don’t get or won’t admit. The election was “won” by Biden because he had more votes in the states he needed. The question is where the votes came from and was it “fair” by the ways we considered how elections work and how votes were collected before 2020. No I don’t believe votes were changed in Dominion machines and other conspiracy theories. But I 100% believe votes were collected from people who had no interest in voting, would have never voted, and only voted because they were mailed a ballot they would have never requested. And in most cases, they were Biden votes from liberal cities and registered Democrats.

Not sure how anyone can argue that this didn’t happen. I give Democrats credit for being crafty enough to see this opportunity, seize upon it and get votes from voters they would have never had in a normal non Covid year. They saw opportunity to expand voting and used Covid as an excuse to push mail voting, which was always a goal of theirs. They know a certain segment of the population is too uncaring or lazy to show up and vote and wouldn’t request a mail in ballot. But send it to them automatically and have a Dem operative offer to show up and collect it, they may fill out it. And they executed it to a level high enough to tip the election in battleground states. Take this away and Trump won these same states in larger margins than 2016.

Unfortunately we are all now paying for it with what it did to our economy.

You can just say black people instead of coding it Boz, everyone knows what you meant. Biden certainly hasn’t helped but I’d argue keeping interest rates artificially low for at least five years longer than they should have been created a caricature in assets of the economy that was on the ground bubble that was inevitably going to pop whenever the artificially cheap money gift stopped.

[AxelWolf]

Speaking of Laughlin, I know a few on here, Mickey and Axel at a minimum talked about spending a lot of time playing there in the early 2000’s (I think, maybe earlier). Anyways were you there during the biker shootout and have any stories on it?

Certainly more interesting, to me at least, than you guys calling each other homos and figuring out who takes it up the ass.

Might make an interesting thread. Or no one gives a fuck and it’s more entertainment talking about cock.

For the record, I have never called Mickey A homo, hobo, or suggested he likes taking it up the ass.
.

For what it’s worth, that was a general statement on the forum and all of us, though rereading it I can see how you thought I was talking about you and Mickey in particular.

Obviously I’m not part of homo calling, I’m too busy trying to fuck Tasha.

Secretly wishing it was actually a Nathan or Kentry

[redietz]

Yeah, Montana must be pretty much an echo chamber. A silo for people with no motive to grasp reality.

I never met a conspiracy theory I didn't like, but the idea that there was massive vote fraud is asinine. Voting is not a black box. The numbers are so detailed, predictable and analyzable, there's no way to create magic votes that wouldn't fire off gazillions of red alarms. It's not just on a state level. Every county, every voting district, literally everyone on all sides knows how many are registered which way, they know the usual participation percentages, and unusual numbers from previous norms are impossible to not notice.

The public with a little know how can access the same numbers and see what registration totals are and the percentages of who voted which way in previous elections. There's a reason somebody like Carville has everything down to a science.

The only argument is whether mail-in should have been used, and if you want to create hoops to jump through not employed by other western democracies, welcome to Jim Crow revisited. If your whole strategy is to depress turnout, why not just admit you don't think people should vote?

Voting should be mandatory. How can you argue against mandatory voting for a healthy democracy? The far right would go nuts if voting were mandatory.

RED this is what you and others don’t get or won’t admit. The election was “won” by Biden because he had more votes in the states he needed. The question is where the votes came from and was it “fair” by the ways we considered how elections work and how votes were collected before 2020. No I don’t believe votes were changed in Dominion machines and other conspiracy theories. But I 100% believe votes were collected from people who had no interest in voting, would have never voted, and only voted because they were mailed a ballot they would have never requested. And in most cases, they were Biden votes from liberal cities and registered Democrats.

Not sure how anyone can argue that this didn’t happen. I give Democrats credit for being crafty enough to see this opportunity, seize upon it and get votes from voters they would have never had in a normal non Covid year. They saw opportunity to expand voting and used Covid as an excuse to push mail voting, which was always a goal of theirs. They know a certain segment of the population is too uncaring or lazy to show up and vote and wouldn’t request a mail in ballot. But send it to them automatically and have a Dem operative offer to show up and collect it, they may fill out it. And they executed it to a level high enough to tip the election in battleground states. Take this away and Trump won these same states in larger margins than 2016.

Unfortunately we are all now paying for it with what it did to our economy.

You can just say black people instead of coding it Boz, everyone knows what you meant. Biden certainly hasn’t helped but I’d argue keeping interest rates artificially low for at least five years longer than they should have been created a caricature in assets of the economy that was on the ground bubble that was inevitably going to pop whenever the artificially cheap money gift stopped.

Oh, I get it. It's not subtle.

You want a series of qualifiers to vote. Make it to the polling station. Get a car to make it to the polling station. Lug your children to the polling station. Pay a babysitter to make it to the polling station. Buy car insurance to make it to the polling station. Don't have a national voting holiday, thus forcing poor people to work the day of the voting. Limit voting to as few days as possible, so lower income people can't plan to vote when most convenient, that is, least expensive.

They're all just socioeconomic bars to leap through. It's ridiculous that an alleged democracy with the technology and wherewithal to have everybody vote goes out of its way to have voting cost something, which is what this boils down to.

Cars cost. Babysitters cost. Car insurance costs. Taking time off from work costs. And as percentages of income, they cost lower income people a lot more proportionally.

Now, here's the funny thing that points out rightwing hypocrisy. Far right folks are fine with voting costing something for lower income people.

Imagine if voting were mandatory, which is patriotic and honorable and civic duty and all that. And you got fined $500 if you didn't vote. So the poor would be under duress, just like they are when voting now. But what would the effect be? Poor people would vote, overall participation would go up, and the only people blowing off voting would be the wealthy.

And that's why we'll never see mandatory voting.

[accountinquestion]

RED this is what you and others don’t get or won’t admit. The election was “won” by Biden because he had more votes in the states he needed. The question is where the votes came from and was it “fair” by the ways we considered how elections work and how votes were collected before 2020. No I don’t believe votes were changed in Dominion machines and other conspiracy theories. But I 100% believe votes were collected from people who had no interest in voting, would have never voted, and only voted because they were mailed a ballot they would have never requested. And in most cases, they were Biden votes from liberal cities and registered Democrats.

Not sure how anyone can argue that this didn’t happen. I give Democrats credit for being crafty enough to see this opportunity, seize upon it and get votes from voters they would have never had in a normal non Covid year. They saw opportunity to expand voting and used Covid as an excuse to push mail voting, which was always a goal of theirs. They know a certain segment of the population is too uncaring or lazy to show up and vote and wouldn’t request a mail in ballot. But send it to them automatically and have a Dem operative offer to show up and collect it, they may fill out it. And they executed it to a level high enough to tip the election in battleground states. Take this away and Trump won these same states in larger margins than 2016.

Unfortunately we are all now paying for it with what it did to our economy.

Yes, Biden won because he had more votes in the states he needed. We agree. I can agree that people who would not have voted otherwise voted, yes. I don't think we can agree that this equates to "stealing the vote".

Is there any credibility to this other than the imagination of Trump? I know there were many many lawsuits attempting to overturn things and maybe 1 of them was seen as valid?

I like how you quote fair, as if what the word means is in question. As Red says this is more like Jim Crowe type shit. Lets get to the point where we're all "admitting" things. It was unfair previously, made more fair and thus it was stolen. Thats the legitinate argument that backs these claims of a stolen election?

For instance I actually voted Democrat President and that was a first for me. It had nothing to do with mail-in votes. It isn't hard for me to believe there are many others like me.

Not sure how Biden has ruined the economy. Was this bubble special because it was a MAGA bubble? Did you really not expect it to crash THIS time?

Plenty of jobs out there.. I thought that was important. No?

Regardless all I know is when businesses were getting all that fraudulent PPP money that was being given out hand over fist I wasn't able to get any of it. Now I gotta hear how Biden spent all the money !!!!!!

Can we agree that Trump is a man-child who never had to have a real job his whole life. Such a man-child that it was a given he'd cry and whine if he lost regardless of what most everyone around him told him?

[MisterV]

Here's a suggestion:

Require all Americans to vote.

Now sure, many are too lazy, busy or indifferent, so "What to do?"

Make it a requirement that people list a particular political affiliation, e.g. Republican, Democrat, Libertarian, Socialist; the choice can be made and changed at any time but it must be dealt with every time you renew your license or ID card, i.e. designate at that time.

The reason for this is simple: when an election comes, be it voting by mail, or at a polling place, or even via carrier pigeon, whenever someone does not vote the computer checks to see the party they designated then casts votes on their behalf automatically, following designated preference.

I call it a "default vote."

It will save us some time, especially if we'd vote straight party ticket.

[MaxPen]

I like how people pick sides and fight each other on all the political stuff. When in reality it is all one uni-party in charge and you are being used to serve their needs. Voting doesn't really matter anymore.

Personally I don't believe anyone without skin in the game should vote (i.e. mandatory property ownership). You should also have to pass a cognitive test.

I don't vote anymore because I could give a fuck about "society's" rules. I live by my own rules.

[mcap]

I like how people pick sides and fight each other on all the political stuff. When in reality it is all one uni-party in charge and you are being used to serve their needs. Voting doesn't really matter anymore.

Personally I don't believe anyone without skin in the game should vote (i.e. mandatory property ownership). You should also have to pass a cognitive test.

I don't vote anymore because I could give a fuck about "society's" rules. I live by my own rules.

You think a caste system should determine voter eligibility? Given human nature there’s zero chance that wouldn’t quickly devolve into voting in acts making it virtually impossible for those who don’t already own property to purchase it.

[accountinquestion]

I like how people pick sides and fight each other on all the political stuff. When in reality it is all one uni-party in charge and you are being used to serve their needs. Voting doesn't really matter anymore.

Personally I don't believe anyone without skin in the game should vote (i.e. mandatory property ownership). You should also have to pass a cognitive test.

I don't vote anymore because I could give a fuck about "society's" rules. I live by my own rules.

I agree with some of this. 2 party fucks up everything as does the electoral college where these largely irrelevant hick states are seriously over-represented. This dilutes *my* vote because i live in a populous state.

We need multiple parties and let them work together.

Owned property != skin in the game. I have to disagree with that. You don't even truly OWN property where I live. You basically lease it out from the government via property taxes which you purchase the right to do.

There are many ways we all have skin in the game. Paying taxes is far more of having skin in the game than owning some piece of land somewhere.

[redietz]

I like how people pick sides and fight each other on all the political stuff. When in reality it is all one uni-party in charge and you are being used to serve their needs. Voting doesn't really matter anymore.

Personally I don't believe anyone without skin in the game should vote (i.e. mandatory property ownership). You should also have to pass a cognitive test.

I don't vote anymore because I could give a fuck about "society's" rules. I live by my own rules.

I agree with some of this. 2 party fucks up everything as does the electoral college where these largely irrelevant hick states are seriously over-represented. This dilutes *my* vote because i live in a populous state.

We need multiple parties and let them work together.

Owned property != skin in the game. I have to disagree with that. You don't even truly OWN property where I live. You basically lease it out from the government via property taxes which you purchase the right to do.

There are many ways we all have skin in the game. Paying taxes is far more of having skin in the game than owning some piece of land somewhere.

I'm a Russell Brand fan when it comes to critiques of the two-party system. When it came time to choose between Hilary and Donald, I felt like I was looking at a lying scumbag with disdain for everyone versus a lying scumbag with disdain for everyone who somehow ran four casinos into the ground despite heavy municipal support.

The most important net effect of the electoral college is to, in essence, make white votes count as somewhere between 1.1 and 1.2 votes. Being German and pasty, I should be able to get along fine with that, but I'm not going to kid myself that I'm living in some textbook democracy.

[accountinquestion]

The most important net effect of the electoral college is to, in essence, make white votes count as somewhere between 1.1 and 1.2 votes. Being German and pasty, I should be able to get along fine with that, but I'm not going to kid myself that I'm living in some textbook democracy.

Well you can look at it from the point of wokeness and frame it as a black vs white thing but it is far from just that.

These states with small populations have a senator like everyone else. The only reason for this is they live in a state that few others wish to live in. (or the state is small). It is an absurdity. People will repeat the arguments of the founding fathers but it is clear the founding fathers got this one completely wrong. The cracks have been showing for some time.

Electoral college also disenfranchises people. When a state is solidly for one party then there is little incentive for the representatives overall to do anything for that state. Even the guys representing the state directly don't have to worry about the other side. And there is nothing you can do about it but move.

[The Boz]

RED this is what you and others don’t get or won’t admit. The election was “won” by Biden because he had more votes in the states he needed. The question is where the votes came from and was it “fair” by the ways we considered how elections work and how votes were collected before 2020. No I don’t believe votes were changed in Dominion machines and other conspiracy theories. But I 100% believe votes were collected from people who had no interest in voting, would have never voted, and only voted because they were mailed a ballot they would have never requested. And in most cases, they were Biden votes from liberal cities and registered Democrats.

Not sure how anyone can argue that this didn’t happen. I give Democrats credit for being crafty enough to see this opportunity, seize upon it and get votes from voters they would have never had in a normal non Covid year. They saw opportunity to expand voting and used Covid as an excuse to push mail voting, which was always a goal of theirs. They know a certain segment of the population is too uncaring or lazy to show up and vote and wouldn’t request a mail in ballot. But send it to them automatically and have a Dem operative offer to show up and collect it, they may fill out it. And they executed it to a level high enough to tip the election in battleground states. Take this away and Trump won these same states in larger margins than 2016.

Unfortunately we are all now paying for it with what it did to our economy.

You can just say black people instead of coding it Boz, everyone knows what you meant. Biden certainly hasn’t helped but I’d argue keeping interest rates artificially low for at least five years longer than they should have been created a caricature in assets of the economy that was on the ground bubble that was inevitably going to pop whenever the artificially cheap money gift stopped.

Oh, I get it. It's not subtle.

You want a series of qualifiers to vote. Make it to the polling station. Get a car to make it to the polling station. Lug your children to the polling station. Pay a babysitter to make it to the polling station. Buy car insurance to make it to the polling station. Don't have a national voting holiday, thus forcing poor people to work the day of the voting. Limit voting to as few days as possible, so lower income people can't plan to vote when most convenient, that is, least expensive.

They're all just socioeconomic bars to leap through. It's ridiculous that an alleged democracy with the technology and wherewithal to have everybody vote goes out of its way to have voting cost something, which is what this boils down to.

Cars cost. Babysitters cost. Car insurance costs. Taking time off from work costs. And as percentages of income, they cost lower income people a lot more proportionally.

Now, here's the funny thing that points out rightwing hypocrisy. Far right folks are fine with voting costing something for lower income people.

Imagine if voting were mandatory, which is patriotic and honorable and civic duty and all that. And you got fined $500 if you didn't vote. So the poor would be under duress, just like they are when voting now. But what would the effect be? Poor people would vote, overall participation would go up, and the only people blowing off voting would be the wealthy.

And that's why we'll never see mandatory voting.

RED I like you and will never understand how someone like you who came from an underdeveloped area can be a liberal. I assume you think others can’t become successful like you did. Or Sandusky fucked you at PSU as a kid. I’ll assume the former. Mcap, no clue why he’s such an anal asshole that cares where anyone posts on this shit forum.

No where did I say niggers in my post, but I’ll say it now because it’s a word I still use. Like others use words as insults on here. Why is nigger different than homo, fag, tonsil jockey, trouser grazing, gerbil killer etc.

I’m laughing at RED’s thoughts of requiring everyone to vote or face a fine. Of course it’s a liberal dream requiring the homeless and others for don’t give a damn to vote or face a fine. The same people who sell drugs, loot and don’t pay taxes because it’s “illegal”. There is not a person in America that wants or cares to vote that can’t. Anyone thinking otherwise is a moron. RED bringing up excuses only feeds into the liberal beliefs that blacks are lessor humans without cars, work menial jobs 12 hours a day, and have kids without fathers sucking on both tits.

I could go on all day but this debate shows liberals have nothing left in policies, only the hope of finding new voters to try and keep the Democratic Party as a major party in America.

Honestly it’s sad thinking someone like you RED feels this way. Perhaps you can give your picks away to poor communities in America with the expansion of legalized gambling and change the “wealth gap” in America. But then again, the niggers don’t have cell phones or access to internet in your vision of America.

[MisterV]

Don't say "niggers," that is disrespectful.

Substitute "spook" or "spear chucker" or even "porch monkey."

[Ozzy]

Don't say "niggers," that is disrespectful.

Substitute "spook" or "spear chucker" or even "porch monkey."

I always used spear chucker as a substitute for aboriginal. Wagon burner also works !

[mickeycrimm]

Your average lefty has no idea how 2000 mules repeatedly delivered ballots to as many as 50 locations a day in Georgia, Arizona and Pennsylvania which threw the election to Biden. Check the results for how close the vote was in those states. The ballot harvesting was enough for Biden to win those states.

And dems want people to say it was a fair election? GTFO!

Micky has fallen very far.

Yeah, Montana must be pretty much an echo chamber. A silo for people with no motive to grasp reality.

I never met a conspiracy theory I didn't like, but the idea that there was massive vote fraud is asinine. Voting is not a black box. The numbers are so detailed, predictable and analyzable, there's no way to create magic votes that wouldn't fire off gazillions of red alarms. It's not just on a state level. Every county, every voting district, literally everyone on all sides knows how many are registered which way, they know the usual participation percentages, and unusual numbers from previous norms are impossible to not notice.

The public with a little know how can access the same numbers and see what registration totals are and the percentages of who voted which way in previous elections. There's a reason somebody like Carville has everything down to a science.

The only argument is whether mail-in should have been used, and if you want to create hoops to jump through not employed by other western democracies, welcome to Jim Crow revisited. If your whole strategy is to depress turnout, why not just admit you don't think people should vote?

Voting should be mandatory. How can you argue against mandatory voting for a healthy democracy? The far right would go nuts if voting were mandatory.

Conspiracy theories? Do you mean like the conspiracy by the Clinton campaign to frame Donald Trump. The conspiracy known as the Russia Hoax? Is that the crazy conspiracy theory you are talking about?

There didn't have to be massive voter fraud. Just the purple states, Arizona, Georgia, Pennsylvania.

Arizona and Georgia were decided by about 10K votes, Pennsylvania 80K votes. Flip those 3 states and Trump wins the electoral college. This is why the 2000 mules operated in just those states.

PS: The left is going nuts because voting ISN'T mandatory.

[jpfromla]

Micky has fallen very far.

Yeah, Montana must be pretty much an echo chamber. A silo for people with no motive to grasp reality.

I never met a conspiracy theory I didn't like, but the idea that there was massive vote fraud is asinine. Voting is not a black box. The numbers are so detailed, predictable and analyzable, there's no way to create magic votes that wouldn't fire off gazillions of red alarms. It's not just on a state level. Every county, every voting district, literally everyone on all sides knows how many are registered which way, they know the usual participation percentages, and unusual numbers from previous norms are impossible to not notice.

The public with a little know how can access the same numbers and see what registration totals are and the percentages of who voted which way in previous elections. There's a reason somebody like Carville has everything down to a science.

The only argument is whether mail-in should have been used, and if you want to create hoops to jump through not employed by other western democracies, welcome to Jim Crow revisited. If your whole strategy is to depress turnout, why not just admit you don't think people should vote?

Voting should be mandatory. How can you argue against mandatory voting for a healthy democracy? The far right would go nuts if voting were mandatory.

Conspiracy theories? Do you mean like the conspiracy by the Clinton campaign to frame Donald Trump. The conspiracy known as the Russia Hoax? Is that the crazy conspiracy theory you are talking about?

There didn't have to be massive voter fraud. Just the purple states, Arizona, Georgia, Pennsylvania.

Arizona and Georgia were decided by about 10K votes, Pennsylvania 80K votes. Flip those 3 states and Trump wins the electoral college. This is why the 2000 mules operated in just those states.

PS: The left is going nuts because voting ISN'T mandatory.

You mean the Hunter Biden Lap Top Russian Mis-information Conspiracy?

[jdaewoo]

I like how mickey keeps saying 2000 mules like they were actual people instead of the title of a shitty fictional film made by a notorious scammer.

[mickeycrimm]

Yeah, Montana must be pretty much an echo chamber. A silo for people with no motive to grasp reality.

I never met a conspiracy theory I didn't like, but the idea that there was massive vote fraud is asinine. Voting is not a black box. The numbers are so detailed, predictable and analyzable, there's no way to create magic votes that wouldn't fire off gazillions of red alarms. It's not just on a state level. Every county, every voting district, literally everyone on all sides knows how many are registered which way, they know the usual participation percentages, and unusual numbers from previous norms are impossible to not notice.

The public with a little know how can access the same numbers and see what registration totals are and the percentages of who voted which way in previous elections. There's a reason somebody like Carville has everything down to a science.

The only argument is whether mail-in should have been used, and if you want to create hoops to jump through not employed by other western democracies, welcome to Jim Crow revisited. If your whole strategy is to depress turnout, why not just admit you don't think people should vote?

Voting should be mandatory. How can you argue against mandatory voting for a healthy democracy? The far right would go nuts if voting were mandatory.

RED this is what you and others don’t get or won’t admit. The election was “won” by Biden because he had more votes in the states he needed. The question is where the votes came from and was it “fair” by the ways we considered how elections work and how votes were collected before 2020. No I don’t believe votes were changed in Dominion machines and other conspiracy theories. But I 100% believe votes were collected from people who had no interest in voting, would have never voted, and only voted because they were mailed a ballot they would have never requested. And in most cases, they were Biden votes from liberal cities and registered Democrats.

Not sure how anyone can argue that this didn’t happen. I give Democrats credit for being crafty enough to see this opportunity, seize upon it and get votes from voters they would have never had in a normal non Covid year. They saw opportunity to expand voting and used Covid as an excuse to push mail voting, which was always a goal of theirs. They know a certain segment of the population is too uncaring or lazy to show up and vote and wouldn’t request a mail in ballot. But send it to them automatically and have a Dem operative offer to show up and collect it, they may fill out it. And they executed it to a level high enough to tip the election in battleground states. Take this away and Trump won these same states in larger margins than 2016.

Unfortunately we are all now paying for it with what it did to our economy.

You can just say black people instead of coding it Boz, everyone knows what you meant. Biden certainly hasn’t helped but I’d argue keeping interest rates artificially low for at least five years longer than they should have been created a caricature in assets of the economy that was on the ground bubble that was inevitably going to pop whenever the artificially cheap money gift stopped.

Artificially cheap money? Do you mean the 4K in covid money that even people with absolutely no work history got? Do you mean the 2 trillion Biden dumped into the economy? How about the 6 trillion with Build Back Better? If you think inflation is bad now just think what it would be if Build Back Better got through.

[mickeycrimm]

RED this is what you and others don’t get or won’t admit. The election was “won” by Biden because he had more votes in the states he needed. The question is where the votes came from and was it “fair” by the ways we considered how elections work and how votes were collected before 2020. No I don’t believe votes were changed in Dominion machines and other conspiracy theories. But I 100% believe votes were collected from people who had no interest in voting, would have never voted, and only voted because they were mailed a ballot they would have never requested. And in most cases, they were Biden votes from liberal cities and registered Democrats.

Not sure how anyone can argue that this didn’t happen. I give Democrats credit for being crafty enough to see this opportunity, seize upon it and get votes from voters they would have never had in a normal non Covid year. They saw opportunity to expand voting and used Covid as an excuse to push mail voting, which was always a goal of theirs. They know a certain segment of the population is too uncaring or lazy to show up and vote and wouldn’t request a mail in ballot. But send it to them automatically and have a Dem operative offer to show up and collect it, they may fill out it. And they executed it to a level high enough to tip the election in battleground states. Take this away and Trump won these same states in larger margins than 2016.

Unfortunately we are all now paying for it with what it did to our economy.

You can just say black people instead of coding it Boz, everyone knows what you meant. Biden certainly hasn’t helped but I’d argue keeping interest rates artificially low for at least five years longer than they should have been created a caricature in assets of the economy that was on the ground bubble that was inevitably going to pop whenever the artificially cheap money gift stopped.

Oh, I get it. It's not subtle.

You want a series of qualifiers to vote. Make it to the polling station. Get a car to make it to the polling station. Lug your children to the polling station. Pay a babysitter to make it to the polling station. Buy car insurance to make it to the polling station. Don't have a national voting holiday, thus forcing poor people to work the day of the voting. Limit voting to as few days as possible, so lower income people can't plan to vote when most convenient, that is, least expensive.

They're all just socioeconomic bars to leap through. It's ridiculous that an alleged democracy with the technology and wherewithal to have everybody vote goes out of its way to have voting cost something, which is what this boils down to.

Cars cost. Babysitters cost. Car insurance costs. Taking time off from work costs. And as percentages of income, they cost lower income people a lot more proportionally.

Now, here's the funny thing that points out rightwing hypocrisy. Far right folks are fine with voting costing something for lower income people.

Imagine if voting were mandatory, which is patriotic and honorable and civic duty and all that. And you got fined $500 if you didn't vote. So the poor would be under duress, just like they are when voting now. But what would the effect be? Poor people would vote, overall participation would go up, and the only people blowing off voting would be the wealthy.

And that's why we'll never see mandatory voting.

How does mandatory voting fit in with the right to be free? Oh, yeah. That's right. Fuck freedom, right Red.