I'm sorry, but to Arci and quahaug -- you can throw in as many side issues as you want but the facts about craps are these:
1. Every bet is its own individual game. If for example you are betting a place bet on 5 your bet is simply this: you will hit a 5 before a 7. That is the only decision.
2. The pass bet is an individual bet. If before a point is set, you win on 7 or 11, and you lose on 2, 3, 12. If the comeout bet is another number then if you repeat that number before you roll a 7 you win, or if you roll a 7 first you lose.
There are no overall odds for the bets on the table. Each bet has its own individual odds.
Now video poker:
1. A bet at video poker could lose or it could win various amounts based on the combination of cards dealt and drawn. It is a more complex game.
2. While each hand bet in video poker is an individual bet, the overall payback on the game varies with the paytable and the number of hands played. The payback of video poker depends on a multitude of hands played since no one payback will give you, for example, 99.5% or 99.2%.
Arc wrote this: "So, the return of a pass bet is 98.6%. That is NOT the return on a single bet. In a VP game there are also multiple outcomes. It just turns out it might be 10-15 outcomes rather than 2."
This is not right, because Arc is not using the proper definitions. The return of the pass line bet is either 100% or it is zero -- you either win it or you don't -- and the passline bet is always paid as an even-money bet. No matter what the point is, if you bet $5 on the passline you will win $5 when the point is made, or you will lose the $5 bet. The house advantage or edge is 1.4%. There is no phrase in craps about "the return" being 98.6%. This term does not exist in craps. You are creating something that does not exist. Again, the return is either 100% or it is zero -- you either win or lose.
For the place bets and exotic bets on the craps table, the return or payoff will vary with the bet. For example, a place bet on the 6 will pay 7 for 6. While the odds on the point of 6 will pay 6 for five. The pay on the one roll bet on 12 will pay 30 to 1 OR 30 for 1 depending on the casino. There is no term for "return" on a bet, unlike 9/6 Jacks which has a 99.5% return.
In craps there is no way to figure or compute a return. But you can figure the advantage or "edge" that the house has on each and every bet.
The rest of the statement regarding VP is just more of his gibberish and has nothing to do with comparing video poker to craps.