Question about waived fees on credit card advances for Seven Stars members

[Dan Druff]

I thought of something recently. Someone tell me if this would work.

All Seven Stars members get "waived fees for credit card advances".

What does this mean?

Most credit cards charge a "cash advance fee" when buying gaming chips (or getting any other kind of cash through the credit card). This essentially bypasses the transaction fee for the casino, to where the player is paying the fee instead.

So what exactly is Caesar's doing in order to "waive your fees"? There's no way they can tell exactly what your bank charges you, so they can't even reimburse you.

So what fees are they waiving? Their own fees?

Or are they putting it through as a "purchase" so you don't get charged fees?

I ask this because you could easily rack up free airline miles by buying up "advances" where Caesar's eats the fees (provided it's a purchase). But I am probably being too optimistic here.

[Alan Mendelson]

I don't think the "bank's fees" can be waived. Maybe there is a "merchant's fee" that they don't collect?

[Dan Druff]

I don't think the "bank's fees" can be waived. Maybe there is a "merchant's fee" that they don't collect?

No, I thought you might have some knowledge of this, but apparently we are both confused on this one.

Anyway, I was told (by my friend) that there are TWO different ways the casino can give you chips for credit card charges:

1) Cash advance, typically at a machine. You use a PIN to get your cash. Gets charged as a cash advance on your card, costing you 3% immediately, plus a high interest rate with no grace period, plus some other fee assessed by the machine. You do not earn airline miles or points with these transactions.

2) Non-PIN chip buying. This is done at the casino cage. You don't need a pin. Your card is charged like a purchase. Your bank does not charge you any fees. However, the casino itself charges you fees -- usually 9-13% for the transaction! You get casino chips, NOT cash. You do earn airline miles and points, but obviously it's not worth the 9-13% fee, as airline miles are worth (at best) 2% if you get one per dollar.

Now if my friend is right, is Caesar's waiving the fees on #2 for Seven Stars members? And if so, what is the limit I could take out?

Let's say the limit was $30,000.

I show up and do #2, buying $30,000.

Caesar's waives the fees.

I don't play (or barely play) and redeem my $30,000 in chips for $30,000 in cash.

I earn 30,000 airline miles, worth $500-$600 in today's market.

I immediately pay off my credit card with the $30,000 cash I just got.

Would this work?

[Alan Mendelson]

At Rincon they waive ATM fees at the cage when you use your ATM card to get cash. But I don't know anything about fees and credit cards.

At Caesars I've used markers so I don't even know what their policy is for fees on credit cards or ATM cards at the cage. So I can't provide any info. I will try calling the cage later. They are usually pretty good about answering questions over the phone.

[Rob.Singer]

So inexperienced....The casino would eat your lunch if you use a credit card for anything having to do with gambling. Any fees "waived" to those oh-so-special 7-Stars folks would only be done because they know such players never saw a casino game they didn't play. When are you people going to learn--do anything in a manner the casino wants, expects, or ropes you into, and you will likely lose and then be forced to do what every 7-Stars cardholder is a true expert at: self-valuing all of their comps, offers & "freebies" in order to justify their gambling problem.

Wise up.

[Alan Mendelson]

Rob: how much money do you think you gave up by not accepting casino offers, gifts, free play, events that members of players clubs receive?

[Rob.Singer]

Please listen this time: No card was used from 2005 to 2009 when I quit in early May, and ONLY when playing SPS. During that time I played my other 4 strategies far more often than SPS, and I always used a card for them. So how much "money" did I "give up" by not using a card in SPS? Zero. The only thing that mattered to me--and still is the only thing that matters--is how much I win from the machines. I didn't care about or count, slot club fluff as anything but a bonus, and I never needed or need any of it. If casinos eliminated the slot programs it would have no effect on how I approach playing. For all those who rely upon such programs, they are doing exactly as the casinos expect and hope they do....usually on the way to controlled losing.

I know you guys miss me. However, since I'm not obsessively controlled by the game, casinos, slot clubs, or writing/reading or thinking about gambling when away from the action, it's more meaningful to me to continue to educate on how much more important non-gambling events are for everyone. As I said earlier, we're doing some travelling, I have one more article to write, and my family is here for a week. People who only do things as entertainment that involve gambling in any form, have hopeless, helpless lives.

Treat this as a valued teachable moment.

[Alan Mendelson]

Rob, the only thing I care about is winning from the machines also... but why turn down the freebies that come along whether your win or lose?
If the casinos eliminated their slot clubs it would have no effect on my playing either. But while they have their slot clubs I'm going to be sure to get every bonus I'm entitled to.

Just because you take the perks or make yourself eligible for the perks doesn't mean you're controlled by anyone.

However... it seems strange to me that you would pick and choose when you use slot clubs and slot bonuses. So you're telling us that sometimes they're okay and sometimes they're not? Did Rob the SPS player yell at Rob the non-SPS player when Rob the non-SPS player uses a card?

[regnis]

Did Rob the SPS player yell at Rob the non-SPS player when Rob the non-SPS player uses a card?

I smile and also get a little scared picturing that.

[Dan Druff]

Let's ignore Rob's attempt to terrible up yet another thread.

Alan, did you ever call the Rincon about this?

[Alan Mendelson]

Dan, I called the cage and left a message and I expect a call back. If I were there I would simply ask them. But since I don't have plans to go there anytime soon, I went the "phone route."

If I don't get a response by Tuesday, I will phone my host and ask her. She is off today, Monday.

[Rob.Singer]

Rob, the only thing I care about is winning from the machines also... but why turn down the freebies that come along whether your win or lose?
If the casinos eliminated their slot clubs it would have no effect on my playing either. But while they have their slot clubs I'm going to be sure to get every bonus I'm entitled to.

Just because you take the perks or make yourself eligible for the perks doesn't mean you're controlled by anyone.

However... it seems strange to me that you would pick and choose when you use slot clubs and slot bonuses. So you're telling us that sometimes they're okay and sometimes they're not? Did Rob the SPS player yell at Rob the non-SPS player when Rob the non-SPS player uses a card?

It wasn't me who caused me not to use a card when playing very high denominations. If I never got barred from the 2 casinos I'd never have known not to keep using the cards. Now my question to you is, why do I keep having to repeat that and so many other things? Are you playing poker online at the same time because you just can't stand the lack of action in between casino visits?

No one else will say this but I will: of course you'd keep on playing if the card programs ended because you are in huge denial that you have a gambling problem....just as "I don't gamble because I'm an AP" arci has not stopped his weekly escapes to the Minn. Indian joints. You both crave the action; casino play and gaming forums run your lives for you both. Even a seriously ill wife cannot come between arci and his habit; in your case, you continuously use the excuse that the business will collapse without you, yet constant casino visits at all times of the day & night rule your life while you supposedly "have not been able to take a vacation in 7 years".

Do you get the point yet??

[Alan Mendelson]

Yes, Rob, I get the point. You are a sick puppie.

[regnis]

I have never been one to chase the comps and perks or try to maximize them. I take what they give me--knowing I am entitled to more--but knowing I just won't ask them for anything. Alan isn't wrong to want whatever he is entitled to--and unlike me, he is not shy about claiming whatever he feels he is entitled to. As long as it doesn't force him to play more, why is that wrong? Again, personally, I just prefer not to ask them for anything, but that's just my personality.

[Alan Mendelson]

I actually do ask for more. When I get a mailer from a casino for a special event such as a shopping spree, I always call up my host and ask if I can get "an increase" or "an upgrade" based on recent play. Sometimes it's worked and I get an extra few hundred dollars of shopping credits or free play credits. (And if I don't get an increase then sometimes I decide not to make the trip!)

[Alan Mendelson]

Rincon waives their fee. Not bank fees.