Believe it Or Not 1?

[soxfan]

How many cats believe that the kewl-J has the ability to count multiple tables at the same time, simultaneous, hey hey?

[kewlJ]

Stanford Wong has famously said a monkey can be taught to count cards. And he is right. The actual act of counting cards is 1st and 3rd grade math, literally. I learned addition subtraction in 1st grade and multiplication in 3rd grade. Card counting is adding and subtracting 1 for a level 1 count like hi-lo, sometimes 1 and 2 for a level 2 count, occasionally 1, 2 and 3 for a level 3 count, which in my opinion adds little.

So for hi-lo, which the majority of players, even professional players, including most of the known teams, it is adding and subtracting 1 over and over. The simple division comes into play when you divide that running number added and subtracted by the remaining decks to be played. So anyone with a 3rd grade education can be taught to count cards.

And while a little bit foreign, to anyone starting out, just as all new things are, it takes very little practice to where a player is basically doing it in his sleep. If you play as little as several times a week for a couple months and you are on auto pilot.

So why would anyone think that such a simple task couldn't be done simultaneously at two tables, with a little practice. And it is not like a player has to count through two different sets of 6 decks simultaneously. He counts a couple rounds and then moves to the game that is the better opportunity.

Not all card counters do this or have done this. But any experience card counter, that is anyone that plays more than a few times a year could do this. They should have the ability. The fact that you, a guy who claims to have been on a card counting team thinks this can't be done, makes me doubt your story of being on card counting team.

Fact is, it is almost a moot point now. I always said when conditions were just right and now with fewer pure blackjack tables and all the other variations and games clogging the pit, it is difficult to find tables next to each other and uncrowded conditions to where this would be effective.

And if you say anything about missing seeing some of the cards like the late Alan used to, then stop telling us you were on a card counting team because you don't even understand some of the very basics of card counting.

The more you post, the more the needle points to troll.

[soxfan]

It is not just about counting two table at the same times. You claim that you can sit at one table, keeping the count, making bs decision and ramping the bets spread while being able to keep accurate count at another table, at the same times. The claim is dubious. And you, by not understanding why two cats counting as a team would be advantageous over two cats counting as individual tells me that you are a fraud and yer supposed knowledge of cards counter is superficial, hey hey.

[kewlJ]

It is not just about counting two table at the same times. You claim that you can sit at one table, keeping the count, making bs decision and ramping the bets spread while being able to keep accurate count at another table, at the same times.

Dude, it takes playing a couple hours a day for a couple weeks before all of this is done on auto pilot. Even a moderately experienced player doesn't have to think about any of these things. You should be able to count, make playing decision, watch a nearby TV screen and have a conversation with the dealer or player next to you.

And you, by not understanding why two cats counting as a team would be advantageous over two cats counting as individual tells me that you are a fraud and yer supposed knowledge of cards counter is superficial, hey hey.

I have never encountered any "cats" at the table. I have heard of a "dog" that claims he plays, but his knowledge is suspect at best.

There are ways two people counting as a team can be advantageous, no doubt. But two players playing the same table, raising and lowering bets in unison is a disaster. Couldn't be more obvious if they wore a shirt that said MIT card counting team.

For this reason, it was always a rule or common courtesy that if a counter joined a table with another counter, as soon as it was realized one would exit. Not doing so puts both in jeopardy. Even if they are using different counts, they still will be raising and lowering wagers almost in unisons (90-95% of the time).

You previously said they could get a bigger spread. tell me how? A player playing a 1-8 spread, lets say $50-$400. So 2 players sit next to each other and each bet $50-$400, totaling $100-$800, what spread is that? um 1-8. No difference. No bigger advantage.

There is a situation where if one is using a specialized count for say a side bet, while the other uses a primary count for the primary game, it could be advantageous, but still, if they are going to communicate that information or even just copy each others wager, you almost couldn't come up with a scenario that would draw more attention.

Do you KNOW how the MIT team was busted? Andy Anderson (Griffin database) basically noticed that every time a player sat down and bet big, there was already one of several different people (small group) at the table. From there it was just a matter of identifying who they were. Ever since that time, casinos are on the look out for and notice who is at the table and might be playing together. I know counters that have been linked in the databases to players and teams that they were not even associated with, just because they happened to play at the same table for a short time.

One of the very top rules for any kind of longevity, is if you find yourself at a table with another counter....leave! No good can come from it.

In the old days someone like Maxpen would have chimed in and confirmed what I am telling you. Now he wont because all he wants to do is troll.

[kewlJ]

Here is another reason for you. A mathematical reason.

Teams often play on the same bankroll. So say a player, an individual player has a BR of 40k. He will figure his bet spread and ramp based on what risk he wants or is comfortable playing, usually now easily done with software. So the solo play comes up with a bet spread and ramp of lets say xx @ TC +1, XXX @ TC +2, XXX at TC +3, XXXX at TC +4. And the RoR based on this spread and ramp for this bankroll is 3%.

Two players can play off that same BR at different tables, (shared bankroll) and each be playing that same bet spread/ramp and each be playing to a RoR of 3%.

But if they play at the SAME table with that same spread/ramp, putting the same money in play, The variance and RoR, goes up because of co-variance. So they are playing to a higher RoR. Co-Variance means because they are playing against the same dealer hand.

This also occurs with a single player playing 2 or 3 spots. This same co-variance effect is why a player that Max bets at $400, should only Maxbet at $300 when playing 2 spots (75%) and even less, I forget maybe 60% when playing 3 spots. If the player bet the same $400 across 2 or 3 spots that RoR and variance would be much higher. So similarly, 2 players playing off the same BR but still betting the optimal amount for 1 player, would be in fact increasing their total risk of ruin. Each would need to be betting LESS to have the same, variance and RoR. So your claim of bigger bet spreads is absolutely wrong.

[coach belly]

it is difficult to find tables next to each other and uncrowded conditions to where this would be effective.

You couldn't provide any locations where this would be effective when you made your dubious claim.

When Alan investigated and pointed that out, you attacked him with anti-semitic slurs.

You tried to discredit him so that your claims would somehow become more credible.

This is exactly what you project that others are doing to this very day.

[kewlJ]

it is difficult to find tables next to each other and uncrowded conditions to where this would be effective.

You couldn't provide any locations where this would be effective when you made your dubious claim.

Good God!!! Why would I? Why would I reveal where I am doing such a play or able to do such a play? That would be a death wish to that play. Just like if I were to say I play XXX casino because they deal 5.5 decks out of 6. Next thing you know they are dealing 4.

However there has been a bit of a change in circumstances that I can now name a place that I was able to do this fairly regularly. I can name the place because it is a place I no longer or at least don't currently play. South Point Casino.

There are quite a number of strip casinos were there are multiple tables next to each other. There are some caveats, like sometimes not all tables are open during slower times and during busier times when they are, you might not be able to jump to a set at the next table, so why bother tracking.

Back when I mentioned this technique, I didn't play the strip much. one or two casinos in my regular rotation. Now I play the strip more than anywhere and for higher stakes), but I also play busier times which is going to limit this opportunity. Conditions have to be just right and they are just right less and less frequently now a days.

Anyway, I can see we are into typical coach belly. You want to argue anything and everything. I only played along because I am bored.

[mcap]

I believes it. Alan didn’t. But i ain’t reading all that Kewlj wrote up there neither.

[MisterV]

I believe it.

Not just because KJ says he can, but because THESE guys at BTF say they can and do:

https://www.blackjacktheforum.com/sh...o-tables/page2

Sorry to interrupt your little flame of KJ, soxfan...troll rejected, try again.

[1Hit1der]

I believe it.

Not just because KJ says he can, but because THESE guys at BTF say they can and do:

https://www.blackjacktheforum.com/sh...o-tables/page2

Sorry to interrupt your little flame of KJ, soxfan...troll rejected, try again.

Start at the first page (of two), https://www.blackjacktheforum.com/sh...nt-two-tables& , which gives a better impression of what's going on, namely, way too little to take seriously.

Where's the math to show the advantage of counting two (or more) tables at once, via mirrors overhead, as opposed to the thus downside? Lol.

P.S. In KJ's case, he would be a lot better off to further develop what simple card counting he, supposedly, does.

[MisterV]

Garnabby, soxfan didn't ask whether it was advantageous to count two tables, he queried only whether it is possible.

Yes, it is: case closed.

[coach belly]

THESE guys at BTF say they can and do

The title of that thread is "How do you backcount two tables?"

That's not what tewlj is talking about.

[1Hit1der]

Garnabby, soxfan didn't ask whether it was advantageous to count two tables, he queried only whether it is possible.

Yes, it is: case closed.

MrV. No one counts cards not to take advantage. And, anyone can count the cards of even ten table at once, by walking up, and down, a row of tables, and, then, noting one card on each table where the cards are being dealt. So, if the intent of the question, by now, still wasn't to take advantage, then no, no one can "simultaneously" count the cards on even two spots on the same table, at the very same time - unless you're into scalar waves, which operate outside of space & time.

Ha.

Oh, speaking of 183

How many cats believe that the kewl-J has the ability to count multiple tables at the same time, simultaneous, hey hey?


soxfan
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1Hit1der
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[coach belly]

Why would I reveal where I am doing such a play or able to do such a play?

You are the one who mentioned counting a second table while playing another on the strip.

You could have provided the SP location privately, we all know how you like to work the PMs.

You really thought that Alan was going to expose your play?

It would have been your own fault, since you're the one who mentioned it in the first place.

You're a shameless liar.

[MisterV]

THESE guys at BTF say they can and do

The title of that thread is "How do you backcount two tables?"

That's not what tewlj is talking about.

Hmm...what's the difference?

The issue seems to be whether one person can keep an accurate count of two adjoining tables.

Pardon my ignorance, but I don't play blackjack..."back counting?"

[kewlJ]

THESE guys at BTF say they can and do

The title of that thread is "How do you backcount two tables?"

That's not what tewlj is talking about.

Wrong!

Back-counting is a spotter counting 2 or more tables and then signaling the player.

A player counting a second table is exactly the same thing. It's just the player is doing both roles, spotter (for himself) and big player.

[coach belly]

Back-counting is a spotter counting 2 or more tables and then signaling the player.

A player counting a second table is exactly the same thing.

How is an active player, counting a different table than where he is sitting, exactly the same thing as a non-player spotter, back-counting 2 tables and then signaling the player?

You're a moron.

Alan was investigating whether an active player could effectively see the cards on the second table, if there were players at that table.

You said strip, he checked the strip in the area where you said.

You could have PMd him SP, and he would have checked SP, and reported back without exposing your play.

[MisterV]

Whatever, coach...the guys at BTF are familiar with the concept, it's real.

Get over it.

[1Hit1der]

Whatever, coach...the guys at BTF are familiar with the concept, it's real.

Get over it.

Yeah, Coach, V's one of those guys who, just, can't, say, "Thanks. I was wrong." Ha. Delusional, even.

[MisterV]

I wasn't and am not "wrong."

It seems that experienced card counters can indeed "have the ability to" count two tables at once, which answers the exact question asked.

Harrumph.