Electronic Blackjack - hit after doubling down.

[kewlJ]

Quick kew---adapt, adjust, and deflect! Fill those holes fast

The Village Idiot strikes again!

I am not adapting, adjusting or deflecting anything. That has always been your game and Mdawg has followed suit. Especially the deflect. When you couldn't answer questions, you attack.

I am simply trying to answer questions raised as best I can. I am just a little frustrated that the discussion is occurring now after the play, rather than 10 weeks ago when I asked and could have used it.

But in fairness, I wouldn't have answered all these questions or been as open about the play and information then as I am now, for obvious reasons. So maybe this discussion could ONLY occur now, well after the fact.

[tableplay]

the common sense strategy I came up with was to re-double down more aggressively than you otherwise would have, doubling down more 8's and 9's, knowing you could re-double if you drew the dreaded 2 or 3 as your double card, and re-hit if you drew something like a 4 or 6 (dependent on what the dealers up card was). I never tried to re-double anything higher than an 11 as that didn't make sense to me, but my guess would be you would not be able to since the original double down was limited to 8-11 totals, I assume the re-doubledown would also be limited to hands totaling 8-11.

Feel free to link to the post in this thread where you mention re-doubling before I did in my last post before this one.

[MDawg]

Anything UNKewlJ hasn't had time to "study up" on (and we're talking YEARS, it takes him that long to wear one of his fables smooth enough to pass muster, we're dealing with a very dim witted individual here) he ends up sticking his fat foot in his wide loose mouth over.

The reason this one has holes is BECAUSE he hasn't had years to perfect the fable. But he did take long enough to try to make it more coherent than on his last attempt, which is the only reason he didn't spill it all before now, not because he was actually doing anything, but because he had to take some Time Out to Study Up.

Next time you want to tell a whopper, talk to me and lets walk through it. I'll only charge you $200.

The UNKewl one was a liar, and like most liars, he was constantly changing his stories, altering time and personnel from one telling to the next. One time he would tell a story about someone, next time he would switch the story around to give himself the lead. He would sit in the casino coffee shop over coffee and pound cake, talking at random about his experiences, posting constantly on internet forums, plotting ways to take down all those he is envious of, never actually entering the casino, afraid like a nervous poodle to even play.

[kewlJ]

Feel free to link to the post in this thread where you mention re-doubling before I did in my last post before this one.

That would be in the very first post that started this thread.

The way it worked is that after doubling down, and drawing a double down card, the "hit, stand, double down" options, lit up again, for a quick second, or more like partial second. If you acted quickly, you could hit and the extra card would be added.

I apologize if this wasn't clear to you.

[MDawg]

This is entire thread is a follow up to the failed

https://vegascasinotalk.com/forum/sh...ack-rule-value

after Studying Up.


Just look for the contradictions and differences between that thread and this one, to understand what some Studying Up might do for a compulsive liar hell bent on trying to prove he does anything more than try to keep sugar daddies happy at tables while pretending to play blackjack.

[kewlJ]

Subjects like the KJ glitch are a chance to get back to legitimate AP discusssion an are really what I like doing here. The glitch is interesting discussion.

I share mickeycrimm's sentiment here. I have always wanted more AP discussion, which is why frequently ask Dan Druff to limit the contant trolling.

But mickey, as you can see from this discussion, it just isn't possible with the likes of Singer and Mdawg hijacking any sort of legitimate discussion with their constant trolling.

That is why so many that might have engaged in at least some legitimate discussions have left or post infrequently. Druff has just allowed the trolls to run the funny farm.

[smurgerburger]

So this game has a .5% HE with basic strategy, $100 max bet, and 100 hph playing at max speed.

So assuming perfect play (obviously not realistic but still), this machine generates an absolute max of $50 per hour per player for the house.

I can see why it has so few installations.


ETA - Oh wow you can redouble? Or you can hit say a 6 vs a 7-9, and THEN double, if you catch the appropriate card?

Yeah that $200/hr figure is not holding up.

[kewlJ]

So this game has a .5% HE with basic strategy, $100 max bet, and 100 hph playing at max speed.

So assuming perfect play (obviously not realistic but still), this machine generates an absolute max of $50 per hour per player for the house.

I can see why it has so few installations.

This is not correct. The standard 6 deck games I mostly play in Las Vegas with standard rules have a house edge of 0.64%. And that is with doubling on any 2 cards. with the initial doubling limited to 8-11 and excluding any soft doubled, that will push the house edge up to about 0.73%.

As for your later comments about hitting first and then doubling. I am not aware of that. I didn't see the double option given after hitting first. That would have been nice!

[kewlJ]

Yeah that $200/hr figure is not holding up.

I don't know what this comment means. Whenever I post specific numbers of what I have made, you people get upset. I do that so it is clear just what we are talking about with these different things and not just a bunch of speculating or guessing. But since there is so much pushback, I have tried not to do so as much.

BUT by the numbers, combined, we made just over 100k (102K to be exact), before expenses, which ran about 17k. I have it recorded that we played 628 hours (combined). That comes out to $162 an hour. Like I said, reasonably close but just under the $200 and hour original estimate.

Now there was some rounding off involved. I didn't record down to the minute played each day. Just rounded off. So it may have been a little higher or lower that 628 hours played. And again, I never counted how many rounds per hour. I originally thought 120, but it may have been closer to 100. Maybe even just under 100, but I don't think so.

I didn't spend a lot of time figuring exact because it didn't matter. This was NOT going to be a long play. I trusted the $200/hr number, which was in the same range I originally guess, so we played. As much as we could, as long as we could.

If this has been a permanent type play that would last a long, time, yeah, you would want to figure out exactly to the dollar what it was worth to compare actual results. But that is NOT what this was.

[coach belly]

Feel free to link to the post in this thread where you mention re-doubling before I did in my last post before this one.

That would be in the very first post that started this thread.

The way it worked is that after doubling down, and drawing a double down card, the "hit, stand, double down" options, lit up again, for a quick second, or more like partial second. If you acted quickly, you could hit and the extra card would be added.

I apologize if this wasn't clear to you.

Did you ever re-double?

From your original post, it's not clear that you did.

You didn't mention that you did.

[smurgerburger]

So this game has a .5% HE with basic strategy, $100 max bet, and 100 hph playing at max speed.

So assuming perfect play (obviously not realistic but still), this machine generates an absolute max of $50 per hour per player for the house.

I can see why it has so few installations.

This is not correct. The standard 6 deck games I mostly play in Las Vegas with standard rules have a house edge of 0.64%. And that is with doubling on any 2 cards. with the initial doubling limited to 8-11 and excluding any soft doubled, that will push the house edge up to about 0.73%.

As for your later comments about hitting first and then doubling. I am not aware of that. I didn't see the double option given after hitting first. That would have been nice!

You wrote .6 in your original thread (which I misremembered as .5). I intended to go with your figure.

[kewlJ]

You wrote .6 in your original thread (which I misremembered as .5). I intended to go with your figure.

OMG! Forgive me.

I thought it was common knowledge that standard 6 deck blackjack with the most common rules, has ABOUT 0.6 house edge. .64% most games, but I have a couple games with rules like re-splitting aces and surrender which drop the house edge to just under .6%. So I rounded off. Forgive me.

[smurgerburger]

You wrote .6 in your original thread (which I misremembered as .5). I intended to go with your figure.

OMG! Forgive me.

I thought it was common knowledge that standard 6 deck blackjack with the most common rules, has ABOUT 0.6 house edge. .64% most games, but I have a couple games with rules like re-splitting aces and surrender which drop the house edge to just under .6%. So I rounded off. Forgive me.

You mean .73 to .6.

But regardless I was explaining where the figure came from.

[kewlJ]

You wrote .6 in your original thread (which I misremembered as .5). I intended to go with your figure.

OMG! Forgive me.

I thought it was common knowledge that standard 6 deck blackjack with the most common rules, has ABOUT 0.6 house edge. .64% most games, but I have a couple games with rules like re-splitting aces and surrender which drop the house edge to just under .6%. So I rounded off. Forgive me.

You mean .73 to .6.

But regardless I was explaining where the figure came from.

Ok, you are fucking with me right with this nit-picking.

Either that or you are coach belly in disguise

[Rob.Singer]

How much more fun can it get as we watch kew stumble through the ever-changing facts about his tale, then scramble to grab replacement pieces in desperate attempts to convince everyone that his concocted story is true.

C'mon kew, shut me up with copies of hotel/car/airline receipts that match either your first or second iteration of the "trip" We know I'm a big thorn in your side because you know that I know everything about your phony self. That's why you force yourself to make long REPITITIOUS responses that only repeat past lies. SO LETS HAVE IT!

[kewlJ]

You mean .73 to .6.

But regardless I was explaining where the figure came from.

If you want to have a discussion about blackjack rules, and conditions, and house edges, along with what a player may do to offset some slightly higher house edges, we can do that. I have always shared some of this and what I do and how I handle it, but frankly there is not a lot of interest on this forum.

For the most part, most games use a standard set of rules at least here in Vegas. Dealer hit soft 17, DAS, double on any two cards, no surrender. and that is .64% house edge. But like I said you may occasionally find something better of worse. Maybe surrender (a couple locations, or re-split aces (1 location that I play), or maybe something worse, like no DAS (Fremont had this for many years). And of course a couple S17 on some higher limit games.

In addition Penetration matters, probably even more than rules unless it is something extreme like 6:5. But penetration doesn't effect the house edge, but it really effects the win rate. 70% penetration (a little below the average of 75%) vs 85% penetration will be a huge difference in win rate, while still having the same house edge.

So you try to find and play the best games of course. But so as not to over-play only the great games, you round out your rotation with more average games (conditions and rules). BUT, there are things you can do to offset, the slightly worse conditions and rules. Easiest is increased bet spread. I don't like to go that route though. Bet spread is identifying. But bet ramp is less identifying. You use the same bet spread, but ramp up a little quicker, hitting your max bet at maybe TC +3 instead of TC +4. THAT will more than offset some slightly more negative rule of condition, without increasing your exposure.

BUT, my guess is YOU don't really want to talk blackjack card counting with me. You just want to coach belly type, nit-pick and troll.

[Rob.Singer]

You mean .73 to .6.

But regardless I was explaining where the figure came from.

If you want to have a discussion about blackjack rules, and conditions, and house edges, along with what a player may do to offset some slightly higher house edges, we can do that. I have always shared some of this and what I do and how I handle it, but frankly there is not a lot of interest on this forum.

For the most part, most games use a standard set of rules at least here in Vegas. Dealer hit soft 17, DAS, double on any two cards, no surrender. and that is .64% house edge. But like I said you may occasionally find something better of worse. Maybe surrender (a couple locations, or re-split aces (1 location that I play), or maybe something worse, like no DAS (Fremont had this for many years). And of course a couple S17 on some higher limit games.

In addition Penetration matters, probably even more than rules unless it is something extreme like 6:5. But penetration doesn't effect the house edge, but it really effects the win rate. 70% penetration (a little below the average of 75%) vs 85% penetration will be a huge difference in win rate, while still having the same house edge.

So you try to find and play the best games of course. But so as not to over-play only the great games, you round out your rotation with more average games (conditions and rules). BUT, there are things you can do to offset, the slightly worse conditions and rules. Easiest is increased bet spread. I don't like to go that route though. Bet spread is identifying. But bet ramp is less identifying. You use the same bet spread, but ramp up a little quicker, hitting your max bet at maybe TC +3 instead of TC +4. THAT will more than offset some slightly more negative rule of condition, without increasing your exposure.

BUT, my guess is YOU don't really want to talk blackjack card counting with me. You just want to coach belly type, nit-pick and troll.

Uhumma....uhumma....uhumma....

So funny! Kew puts the BSometer into "high gear scrambling" mode!!

[smurgerburger]

Here's a blackjack tip:

Before posting on a forum where you know nobody is going to help you to ask about the EV of a glitch, spend 30 seconds to input the rules into a BJ house edge calculator so you'll know what your baseline -EV is.

[kewlJ]

Here's a blackjack tip:

Before posting on a forum where you know nobody is going to help you to ask about the EV of a glitch, spend 30 seconds to input the rules into a BJ house edge calculator so you'll know what your baseline -EV is.

Hitting after doubling down and re-doubling down are not real rules on any real blackjack game I have ever seen. So they are not available options on the software I use.

I did the best I could, which was asking a couple of the math guys, I know or are acquainted with.

I noticed YOU didn't offer an appropriate answer at the appropriate time, when it would have been useful. All you do is snipe and troll, now after the fact.

[smurgerburger]

Here's a blackjack tip:

Before posting on a forum where you know nobody is going to help you to ask about the EV of a glitch, spend 30 seconds to input the rules into a BJ house edge calculator so you'll know what your baseline -EV is.

Hitting after doubling down and re-doubling down are not real rules on any real blackjack game I have ever seen. So they are not available options on the software I use.

I did the best I could, which was asking a couple of the math guys, I know or are acquainted with.

I noticed YOU didn't offer an appropriate answer at the appropriate time, when it would have been useful. All you do is snipe and troll, now after the fact.

I am referring to the basic strategy -EV.