Bob Dancer's Relationship with Video Poker

[Rob.Singer]

If true it seems to me that someone should have been fired at the MGM. What happened? Or is this another Rob Singer Exclusive that no one else can confirm?

You always ask questions that are of little importance to and have nothing to do with the issue so you can under-handedly criticize points without appearing to. When people get involved with your obfuscations it dilutes whatever's being said.

[slingshot]

You always ask questions that are of little importance to and have nothing to do with the issue so you can under-handedly criticize points without appearing to. When people get involved with your obfuscations it dilutes whatever's being said.

[redietz]

You know, I haven't heard much about selling of high end comps in the last so many years. Dancer and other players made no bones about selling their swag back then, but nobody mentions this stuff, even anonymously, these days. How could casinos have cracked down on re-selling of swag? Or is it just ultra-quiet these days?

[slingshot]

Alan: If you had played through the $440 only once as Rob usually suggests, where would you have ended the session? I'm assuming it worked its way to $800 after the play-once-through was over?

Yes-that question interests me. In other words, did you reach the $800 BEFORE the total MUST PLAY of $440, -did you have to keep playing to put all the $440 through?

[Alan Mendelson]

Alan: If you had played through the $440 only once as Rob usually suggests, where would you have ended the session? I'm assuming it worked its way to $800 after the play-once-through was over?

When I played it through once, I finished with about $200. I put the $200 back in and started hitting some quads. I ended the session with $150 which was close to the $200 I originally had with a one-time play through. Plus I put on some extra tier points and cash back points from the extra play. And (and this is very important even though Rob will jump up and down about it) by playing more I will help keep the free play offers coming.

The bottom line is that I left with a $150 profit. No one ever went broke leaving a casino with a profit.

[Alan Mendelson]

I can't criticize that because you didn't state what your objective was before going in. But given your track record, I believe a good bet would be that you either had none--or made one up on the go. And probably because you just couldn't bear the thought of pulling yourself away from the machines. However, that's very, very common among vp players, and it greatly contributes to why casinos don't go broke. At least you made something, which is always far better than losing anything.

Gee Rob... does it bother you that as a 7 Stars player I got free play? Does it bother you that I left with a profit? Does it bother you that I didn't have to play YOUR way to leave with a profit?

[Alan Mendelson]

If true it seems to me that someone should have been fired at the MGM. What happened? Or is this another Rob Singer Exclusive that no one else can confirm?

You always ask questions that are of little importance to and have nothing to do with the issue so you can under-handedly criticize points without appearing to. When people get involved with your obfuscations it dilutes whatever's being said.

Actually it's a very important point. You made an allegation that Bob Dancer did something that got him banned and if he what you say he also had "inside help" which would seem to imply that a casino employee or employees also got into trouble.

If they banned a high roller such as Dancer wouldn't they not hesitate in firing a floor person who enabled the scam?

If they did fire someone it might support your claim. Or did this info come from another anonymous person who sat next to you on an airplane... like the IGT engineer who supposedly told you the machines are rigged on your flight?

The point Rob is that when you make allegations that are damaging to someone's good name and reputation you need to have facts to back them up. I cannot allow you to make the claim you did without questioning you and knowing your source and what other events might have occurred to support your claim.

In other words: put up or shut up.

[Vegas_lover]

Actually it's a very important point. You made an allegation that Bob Dancer did something that got him banned and if he what you say he also had "inside help" which would seem to imply that a casino employee or employees also got into trouble.

If they banned a high roller such as Dancer wouldn't they not hesitate in firing a floor person who enabled the scam?

If they did fire someone it might support your claim. Or did this info come from another anonymous person who sat next to you on an airplane... like the IGT engineer who supposedly told you the machines are rigged on your flight?

The point Rob is that when you make allegations that are damaging to someone's good name and reputation you need to have facts to back them up. I cannot allow you to make the claim you did without questioning you and knowing your source and what other events might have occurred to support your claim.

In other words: put up or shut up.

And since Rob never "puts up", hey Rob why don't you just shut up? It's all a bunch of bullhockey anyway. In Holland we have a saying about people like Rob: all foam, no beer. Cheers.

[a2a3dseddie]

In other words: put up or shut up.

If history is any indication, he'll do neither.

Back from a 4 night trip! It was good to escape -35C wind chills here! Got to see 3 shows. Laugh Factory, Carrot Top and Zumanity. Also came home with a bit of money. I went on a bad run the last day and gave some back though. Overall I'd say I won $1100.

Here's a question for anyone who cares to answer. What do you consider a "win"? To use numbers from this trip, I left home with $2500. I came back with $2800. I spent about $400 before leaving on tours/shows/flight/car rental. While in Las Vegas I spent an additional $800 on things for my wife and children.

My starting $2500 should be at $1700 now, so I guess I won $1100. BUT the pre-trip expenditures were $400, and I'm $100 short of $2900. In other words, if I didn't go on this trip at all, I would have an extra $100 in my bank account. So did I win $1100, $300 or lose $100? How does everyone else interpret results?

[Vegas_lover]

I never count money I spend on hotels, shows, food, etc. as costs that have to be earned back by gambling. I have to spend that money on any vacation. So if you had a gambling budget of let's say $1000 and you came back home with $2100 than you had a $1100 profit in my book.

[redietz]

I'm going to step in here and report that Dancer himself said he did stuff like what Rob reported -- although he referred to the activity as a wink and a tip. So it wouldn't surprise me if Rob is correct. The idea that you would be able to find evidence or some historical data that demonstrate MGM fired employees for this reason is preposterous. Whether it did or did not happen -- there's not going to be someone at MGM who says, "Yeah, we did that." And there will be no newspaper log with a clip stating that. That's just silly.

You know, before dismissing Rob's stuff as purely gossip, it might behoove one to realize that he did have his ear to the ground for a decade in that town, and his knowledge of what did or didn't happen there outstrips all other posters regarding video poker and such.

[slingshot]

When I played it through once, I finished with about $200. I put the $200 back in and started hitting some quads. I ended the session with $150 which was close to the $200 I originally had with a one-time play through. Plus I put on some extra tier points and cash back points from the extra play. And (and this is very important even though Rob will jump up and down about it) by playing more I will help keep the free play offers coming.

The bottom line is that I left with a $150 profit. No one ever went broke leaving a casino with a profit.

The reason I asked is that many times with my penny-ante free play I start out great and wish I could cash out then-only I have to finish the free play. I guess this is the reason that free play is annoying at times. Thanks.

[Alan Mendelson]

I never count money I spend on hotels, shows, food, etc. as costs that have to be earned back by gambling. I have to spend that money on any vacation. So if you had a gambling budget of let's say $1000 and you came back home with $2100 than you had a $1100 profit in my book.

I agree. Trip expenses are separate from gambling money unless you are a professional gambler.

[Alan Mendelson]

Sorry redietz but we have to draw the line between gossip and "ear to the ground" info and what is fact. This is a serious allegation. I want to see facts to support it. This goes beyond claims of personal big wins or success at picking NFL games. I'm setting the rules on this one.

[redietz]

Then any discussion of who has or has not been backed off by a casino is verboten, as none will ever be verified.

[Alan Mendelson]

Then any discussion of who has or has not been backed off by a casino is verboten, as none will ever be verified.

Here's the difference: I was "backed off" by NYNY, MGM and Bellagio and no verification is needed -- it happened to me and I admit it happened.

But if I were to say "Joe Blow was backed off because he put glue on the dice" I had better have supporting evidence.

And of course if you could show us a quote from a column or web article where someone wrote about how he was banned or backed off then that would be okay for discussion.

The point is this: to discuss Bob Dancer's strategy for playing various promotions (trying to win a car) is perfectly acceptable even if you are totally critical of it. And to comment about how he didn't pay for a breakfast buffet (he wrote about it in his web article) is also perfectly okay. But to make an allegation that the man cheated the system without any evidence of it is not okay.

I'll even cut Rob some slack about his claims about sitting next to an IGT engineer on a plane with the engineer allegedly spilling the beans about flaws with video poker games. But the difference is Rob's comments about Dancer are no less than a personal attack without evidence presented.

I think my "rules" here and explanations are fair.

[Rob.Singer]

When I played it through once, I finished with about $200. I put the $200 back in and started hitting some quads. I ended the session with $150 which was close to the $200 I originally had with a one-time play through. Plus I put on some extra tier points and cash back points from the extra play. And (and this is very important even though Rob will jump up and down about it) by playing more I will help keep the free play offers coming.

The bottom line is that I left with a $150 profit. No one ever went broke leaving a casino with a profit.

There's your main issue with having a gambling problem. While you dodge the issue of what exactly was your objective before going in, you obviously have no ability to leave even when way ahead, as you continuously produce excuses to justify reasons why you don't have to end the casino action. The only thing that matters to vp addicts is more action in order to keep the opportunity for those intermittent doses of satisfaction to keep on coming.

Did you ever think that this is how you keep getting to 7-Stars every year, why you get all that rope-'em-in free-play, and why you get so giddy talking about and going to those silly GGWU's? And have you ever wondered even a tidbit's worth why you say you always have losing years? How hard is adding 1+1?

[Rob.Singer]

Sorry redietz but we have to draw the line between gossip and "ear to the ground" info and what is fact. This is a serious allegation. I want to see facts to support it. This goes beyond claims of personal big wins or success at picking NFL games. I'm setting the rules on this one.

When will you ever learn to read? Ans: probably when you can get your craving for casino action off your mind. Pay attention this time--I was told this by MGM employees in the high limit room. He even wrote about some of it. And why do you care....you think Dancer has a good name now that he's a fellow divorcee? Get real.

[Rob.Singer]

And since Rob never "puts up", hey Rob why don't you just shut up? It's all a bunch of bullhockey anyway. In Holland we have a saying about people like Rob: all foam, no beer. Cheers.

No wonder you made up such a syruppy handle. Not only do the Dutch have a penchant for Harleys....the bleed American red, white & blue! Can you imagine this guy coming up with "Macau_lover" as his pride and joy and have a burning interest in the Chinese?

[Vegas_lover]

No wonder you made up such a syruppy handle. Not only do the Dutch have a penchant for Harleys....the bleed American red, white & blue! Can you imagine this guy coming up with "Macau_lover" as his pride and joy and have a burning interest in the Chinese?

And again more blablablablabla. I don't ride motorcycles and even if I would it would never be a Harley. They're more broken than running. Rob you have an "America the greatest arrogance" that makes people around the world hate Americans more and more. Why? Because your arrogance is misplaced. Want some examples? The debt load of your country is incredible, your automobile industry uses ancient technology (big petrol burning engines, shaky technics, break down easily, etc), the differences between rich and poor in your country are enormous, you're not the economic world leader anymore, etc.

Why is it I see more and more Hyundai's, BMW's, Honda's, Nissan's, Acura's, Volkwagens, Mercedes, etc in the United States? Because they are generally more reliable than American cars and because they don't burn so much fuel. The intolerance between black and white in your country and the way the majority looks at gay people is startling. But yet, you claim to bring democracy around the world. How many people in your country live in poverty? How many people in your country don't have health insurance?

Let me tell you something about the Chinese. I've never been to China but I know a lot of Dutch Chinese people. Never have I met a disrespectful Chinese person. Never have I met a Dutch-Chinese entrepeneur who went bancrupt. Wanne know why? Those people help eachother, they want their own people to succeed. My children play with Chinese children. So yes Rob, I would choose 99% of the Chinese population over arrogant American blowhards like you.

Folks, don't get me wrong, you have a beautiful country and wonderful people living there. I call many Americans friends. It's the ultra right-wing, redneck, arrogant, intolerant SOB's like Rob Singer who are giving Americans around the world a bad reputation. It's the "bow down or be crushed" additude that's sickening. Remember Rob, America is what it is today because Holland, Great Britain and France OWNED you in the past. It's incredible to see how a person who claims to be so intelligent can act so ignorant.