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Thread: Any Experience with M Resort $500 Loss Rebate?

  1. #441
    Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson View Post
    The photo shows that the tables are in a straight line and not bunched up into an arrangement where you can look directly at another table.
    What is this tables bunched up crap? Another case of you making up facts or things that I said. Before we go any further show me where I ever said anything about tables being bunched up? I really shouldn't go any further until you either show where I said tables "bunched up" or acknowledge that you continue to add things, that aren't there. I see later in this thread you are saying I track cards that are face down. I never said that. You just continue to make stuff up to suit yourself. Now I am sure you will skip over this and not show where I said anything about tables being bunched up, because there is no such thing. So you will just gloss over it, not acknowledging your dishonesty.

    I am talking about tables next to each other. I am talking about the exact scenario that is in your blurry picture. That picture, blurry and all, would have proved my point IF you had taken the picture from the center seat like I said. But you didn't do that....probably because you saw it would prove my point. So that is not where that blurry picture is taken from. I can tell by the angle. You took that picture from either the first or second seat. I can tell because 3rd base is the seat blocking the view. Third base can only be blocking the view from first base (seat 1) at the table.

    IF you had taken the picture from the middle seat, which is where I said you have a view of both tables to your left and right, third base would not be blocking the view of the table. Maybe third base would be blocking the view of the discard tray, but not the playing surface. And as you can see seat 1 and 2 at that adjacent table are irrelevant because the cards on the table are actually in front of any people that would be sitting in those seats. The third seat, center seat is too far back to be blocking anything. IF you had taken the picture from where I discussed, you would have seen that only one seat on the table to the right can block the table and that is seat 4, just as I stated.

    And while seat 4 can sometimes block the table usually if you adjust you site line just a few inches, you can still see what you need to see. I mean, yes, if there is a big fat guy sitting in seat 4, you probably will not be able to track that table. (or seat 2 if you are tracking the table to your left). The other times you will be obstructed are if there are people standing around the table. I clearly said that it is not always possible, but I am able to do so most of the time, especially during the times that I like to play.

    None, of this will matter, you will change some more shit, make up more things that I never said. What you have proven to me, is that your a dishonest man.

    Now, I really shouldn't even have gone into all of this. My friends, wondering why I did are 100% correct. The last thing I need is every two bit counter trying to track multiple tables and jumping from table to table. Next thing you know, there will be a NMSE sign on every damn table.

    So, that's it. I am done with this conversation. You certainly haven't proven a damn thing other that you are dishonest. You didn't take the picture from where I said. Believe..... Don't believe. It really doesn't matter to me. I know I successfully track two tables on a regular basis. It really isn't that difficult nor unusual for experienced counters. And we both know you have been dishonest throughout this ordeal, injecting things I never said, and manipulating the picture, making it blurry and from an angle (seat) of your choosing, not what was discussed.
    Last edited by kewlJ; 08-11-2017 at 06:14 PM.

  2. #442
    Originally Posted by MisterV View Post
    Oh sure, it is human nature to defend ourselves when attacked (even verbally), but just ask yourself this: why bother?

    What have you got to gain?
    MrV (or MisterV here I guess), I have AP friends that read this site, but don't participate and they are asking me the same exact questions. And I don't have a good answer.

    What's worse, 3 different days this week, I have logged on here late morning, "killing a few minutes", while waiting for my partner to get ready to head out. And all three of those days, it ended up being my partner waiting for me, over an hour, while I respond to someone that wants to see what he wants to see.

  3. #443
    Yes KJ, it's me; I couldn't register as "MrV" so I took the next best thing.

    I see you have grasped the essence of arguing with Alan.

    It's unsatisfying; sort of like grasping smoke while suffering with a hemorrhoid.
    What, Me Worry?

  4. #444
    Originally Posted by MisterV View Post
    I see you have grasped the essence of arguing with Alan.

    It's unsatisfying; sort of like grasping smoke while suffering with a hemorrhoid.
    As I said, I don't pay much attention to the craps threads, because I don't play....don't even know how. But while I didn't know exactly who is was or is, I was vaguely familiar with his reputation of grasping on to something that is not reality and holding on for dear life. Refusing to budge no matter. Sticking to what he has decided is he wants to believe despite the truth staring his him the face. In other words, living in his own alternative reality.

    While I was vaguely familiar with that reputation of him, I was not prepared to encounter such a "earth is flat", kind of denier, of a character. A new internet experience for me.

  5. #445
    No doubt you've heard the old saw about not wrestling a pig; the pig loves it, but you'll just get dirty.

    Or how about Uncle Remus' Tar Baby?

    Fortunately none of this matters worth a tinker's dam (whatever that is).
    Last edited by MisterV; 08-11-2017 at 07:49 PM.
    What, Me Worry?

  6. #446
    Originally Posted by kewlJ View Post
    Before we go any further show me where I ever said anything about tables being bunched up?
    Let me be blunt.

    I mentioned how the tables were arranged in a bunch, at a small card casino in Compton, California, to explain how it might be possible to sit at one table and view the cards at a nearby table. That's all I did. I did not say that you said the tables were bunched up.

    What I also did was ask you to tell me which Strip casino I should go to? You wouldn't respond. I went to the Mirage because it fit your overall statement of a casino on the west side of the Strip between TI and Mandalay. And at the Mirage I saw and photographed how the BJ tables were all in a straight line and separated.

    I then suggested that everyone go on their own and see for themselves if it were possible to view the action at a nearby table while you are sitting at one of these tables that are arranged in a straight line.

    I also said that when I sat in seat #2 I'd have to twist my head (not the chair, my head) to see what was going on at the tables to my right or left. I also said that because of the distance between tables and the possibility that if the tables were actually open (the pit was closed when I was there) that humans would block the view, that you couldn't view the cards in play at the other tables.

    Now, WHO HAS GONE TO A STRIP CASINO AND LOOKED FOR THEMSELVES???

    Instead of arguing about what I wrote, I invite everyone on this forum TO LOOK FOR THEMSELVES. Bring along a tape measure, pace off the distance, take your own photos. Do something. But this continuous bickering about my photos and what I saw is pointless. I'm not going to change my mind but YOU go and show me evidence that you can see the cards that are played.

    I'm telling you that I doubt your story because the tables aren't close (like they were in Compton, California some time ago) and they are in a straight line which requires you to do a lot of head twisting hand after hand to keep track of the cards.

    Until you show me your own measurements and your own photos, I don't really give a damn what you say.

  7. #447
    KJ, Alan never let's the true facts get in his way either.

  8. #448
    Originally Posted by Rob.Singer View Post
    All self-serving nonsense from one of the biggest bsers on the forum circuit. Axel loves to portray his anonymous self as some hot-shot/money-makin' "AP" who trots around town outsmarting casinos at their own game (the math, duh) but all he does is claim secrecy whenever anyone requests proof-of-claims. Then bocce come on in an obvious failed attempt to save face by giving the age-old excuse these ap's regularly throw out there about how they win and why they just can't release the trick behind their phantom bucks extravaganzas:THE MATH!!
    Your pal kew didn't help your cause very much by making that ridiculous claim about accurately keeping count at his and another table before jumping, did he axel. You see how stupid and foolish you ap's look to people who actually gamble successfully?
    I've seen axel in action on at least one play so can testify as to his ability to beat casinos. It was on a double time promotion at the Pioneer in Laughlin. The machines were quarter game kings with video poker and 4-card keno. When the machines went into double time mode(the double time lasted one minute) everything that paid from 60 to 150 coins paid double. The credits racked up on the machine so you didn't have to stop for an attendent to pay you. 60 coins was to high for a full house to qualify for double pay. The only thing in video poker that fit in the parameter was 4 of a kind on 9/6 Jacks.

    The 4-card keno was a max 4 coins bet ($1) on each card. The 2-spot paid 15 for 1 or 60 coins. So axel loaded each card with 2 numbers. In the one minute double time he could hit the deal button ten times. With the four cards that would be 40 games total at $1 bet on each. The frequency of a 2-spot is 16.63157 games. So it was rare not to hit 2-spots when in double time mode.

    A 2-spot paying 15 for 1 is a 90% game (15/16.63157 = 90%). So in double time it was worth 180%. In double time he got out a $40 wager. Thats an average profit of $32 per double time.

    One of the drawbacks to the play was you had to keep your machine qualified to be eligible for double time. When you played a game the border around the card reader would turn green. That meant your machine was qualified. If you waited 11 seconds before playing another game the border would turn red meaning the machine wasn't qualified. So you had to play a game every 10 seconds. The question was what game to play.

    If you played the keno you could bet just one quarter per card or $1. At 90% return it cost you 10 cents per game to keep the machine qualified. Then you hit max bet when the machine went into double time. But you could bet just one quarter on 9/6 jacks to keep the machine qualified too. It was a 98% game with the royal short coined. So it cost half a penny per game to keep the machine qualified.

    So axel played the 9/6 jacks during non double time. When the machine went into double time mode (about every ten minutes) axel hit the menu tab, then on the game selection screen hit the 4-card keno tab, then smacked the max bet button on the keno game. So it only cost about 30 cents to keep the machine qualified for double time. A 30 cent cost to make $32. And double time came around about every ten minutes. So the play was worth about $180 an hour.

    I witnessed axel putting down this play because I was sitting just a few seats away doing the same thing. The casino eventually got tired of us beating the shit out of them and changed the parameters on double time. They raised it to 120 to 250 coins. My idea was to switch to the 3-spot which had a frequency of 72. It qualifed for the double pay but it would take much longer to pull the money out of the game. Axel had a better idea. Play the same numbers on two cards.

    I was originally playing 1 and 2 on the 1st card, 3 and 4 on the 2nd card, 5 and 6 on the 3rd card, and 7 and 8 on the 4th card. I switched to playing 1 and 2 on the 1st and 2nd cards, 3 and 4 on the 3rd and 4th cards. When the two spot hit it payed 120 coins which doubled to 240 coins. So we beat the shit out of the casino some more.

    Axel made the comment earlier about AP's thinking outside the box. The above is a prime example of how some AP's think outside the box.

  9. #449
    Mickeycrimm,

    Were you still homeless during that play?

  10. #450
    The play described above occurred at the Pioneer/Laughlin in 2002. Here is a link to what I wrote about it on WoV.

    http://www.wizardofvegas.com/forum/g...pril-may-2002/

  11. #451
    Originally Posted by blackhole View Post
    Mickeycrimm, Were you still homeless during that play?
    Absolutely not. I had been off the street for six years at that point. And I was enjoying full RFB in every joint in Laughlin.

  12. #452
    Originally Posted by mickeycrimm View Post
    Originally Posted by blackhole View Post
    Mickeycrimm, Were you still homeless during that play?
    Absolutely not. I had been off the street for six years at that point. And I was enjoying full RFB in every joint in Laughlin.
    That was 15 years ago. Are casinos still that stupid relating to AP abuse of promotions?

  13. #453
    Originally Posted by blackhole View Post
    Originally Posted by mickeycrimm View Post
    Originally Posted by blackhole View Post
    Mickeycrimm, Were you still homeless during that play?
    Absolutely not. I had been off the street for six years at that point. And I was enjoying full RFB in every joint in Laughlin.
    That was 15 years ago. Are casinos still that stupid relating to AP abuse of promotions?
    Abuse? You are hilarious, dude. I think KJ is right, you are a darksider. Only the darksiders think that using ones brain in a gambling game is some kind of abuse or cheating. I followed every rule of the promotion to a tee. If they don't want to get beat then they need to do a better job of designing their promotions.

    Now, for your question. The Nevada casinos have made every mistake in the book on promotions over the years and have mostly learned what not to do. They learned this from the AP's who beat the hell out of them when they got stupid. Nowadays, it's the casinos out in the middle of nowhere, who have not yet been raked over the coals by AP's that are prone to making these mistakes.

  14. #454
    Originally Posted by blackhole View Post
    Mickeycrimm,

    Were you still homeless during that play?
    Classic non sequitur. One good non sequitur deserves another.

    There are between 500,000 and a million homeless people in the US today. Worldwide, the homeless population is well over 100 million. Those living in "inadequate shelter" number about 1.5 billion.

    Blackhole seems to feel that homelessness is some flaw of character, something of which to be ashamed, like APing. Since blackhole likes to critique APs, may I suggest he shift some time and energy to trolling the homeless. I recommend www.nationalhomeless.org and www.habitat.org as starting points.

  15. #455
    Originally Posted by mickeycrimm View Post
    KJ, Alan never let's the true facts get in his way either.
    the problem for you is, I gave the facts.

    All we have from kewlj is his statement that he can count cards at two tables and does so even when the tables are a distance apart and there can be players blocking the view of the cards -- not to mention the physical limitations of having to view the cards when the dealers might be dealing hands simultaneously and that the cards would have to be perfectly arranged on the table layouts to facilitate a clear view.

    In other words, there is a whole boatload of claims by kewlj with NO evidence.

    And you guys doubted that I saw a random roller throw 18 yos in a row? LOL

  16. #456
    Alan, KJ brought up the drawback of players blocking cards well before you did. And KJ isn't the only one to claim counting 2 tables. Many players do. So you are calling them all liars.

  17. #457
    Originally Posted by redietz View Post
    Originally Posted by blackhole View Post
    Mickeycrimm,

    Were you still homeless during that play?
    Classic non sequitur. One good non sequitur deserves another.

    There are between 500,000 and a million homeless people in the US today. Worldwide, the homeless population is well over 100 million. Those living in "inadequate shelter" number about 1.5 billion.

    Blackhole seems to feel that homelessness is some flaw of character, something of which to be ashamed, like APing. Since blackhole likes to critique APs, may I suggest he shift some time and energy to trolling the homeless. I recommend www.nationalhomeless.org and www.habitat.org as starting points.


  18. #458
    Originally Posted by mickeycrimm View Post
    Alan, KJ brought up the drawback of players blocking cards well before you did. And KJ isn't the only one to claim counting 2 tables. Many players do. So you are calling them all liars.
    No. I asked from the beginning for everyone to go look for themselves. You stop lying.

  19. #459
    Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson View Post
    Originally Posted by mickeycrimm View Post
    Alan, KJ brought up the drawback of players blocking cards well before you did. And KJ isn't the only one to claim counting 2 tables. Many players do. So you are calling them all liars.
    No. I asked from the beginning for everyone to go look for themselves. You stop lying.
    What in that quoted part has Mickey lying?

  20. #460
    Originally Posted by redietz View Post
    Blackhole seems to feel that homelessness is some flaw of character, something of which to be ashamed, like APing.
    There are a variety of causes of homelessness.

    For some folks, it results from a failed marriage; with others, from mental illness, alcoholism, and/or drug abuse.

    In all cases though it cannot be questioned that those who are homeless have failed at providing at least one of the "big three" for themselves: food, clothing, and shelter.

    It's more "failure" than "flaw of character."
    What, Me Worry?

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