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Thread: Question for VP players

  1. #1
    I have read that Las Vegas locals are enamored by video poker and that it is their game of choice.

    Given that, I wonder what games a sharp local would play, and and at which casinos, in order to maximize their chances of winning?

    Assume they know to take advantage of casino promotions such as multiplied points days.

    One other question: is there anywhere in the USA that offers better games / better promotions for VP players than Las Vegas?
    What, Me Worry?

  2. #2
    I would say, as a general rule of thumb....

    Las Vegas has LOTS of small advantage plays. It's going to be very rare to find a huge play in Vegas. Outside of Vegas, there are fewer advantage plays, but they can be worth a whole hell of a lot more. At least in my experience.

    A local (AP), is going to be playing at casinos where he gets good offers....but that requires you to come back several times to collect on the offers. Not something that an out-of-towner can really do effectively. There are few things that an out of towner can do and have an "immediate" advantage play -- where his EV is tied up "right now", and not something where you lose up front and collect on the back end.
    #FreeTyde

  3. #3
    In other words, this question could have been posed to just about any local 25c vp player in LV, and the same answer would have been arrived at.

    And no one knows anything even close to what the story on this is in "other than in LV". Not even mickey, who's casinos of choice are obscure, smaller, western area Indian clip joints.

  4. #4
    My impression has been that a lot of LV locals play VP in bars like people elsewhere play those trivia games. As entertainment at low bet levels while they drink rather than working any AP angle, while they drink drinks they paid for and hang out with their friends.

  5. #5
    I'm amazed that in every supermarket there is a small "casino" with about a dozen VP machines and about 1/3 are always in use. No free drinks either. Most gas stations have six machines, maybe one in use no matter what time it is. And all over there are local bars and small "casinos" like Dottys. All advertise VP.

    Don't ask me what the paytables are. I never looked.

  6. #6
    Grocery store VP are the best...

  7. #7
    Originally Posted by SLaPiNFuNK View Post
    Grocery store VP are the best...
    I can't imagine why anyone would play VP in a supermarket yet I see it all the time.

  8. #8
    Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson View Post
    Originally Posted by SLaPiNFuNK View Post
    Grocery store VP are the best...
    I can't imagine why anyone would play VP in a supermarket yet I see it all the time.
    And I can’t imagine why anyone would gamble when they can’t pay their debts. To each their own Alan. Who are you and I to judge what another person enjoys doing with their money.

    Addition is a terrible thing Alan. Hopefully you get the help you need! I do believe Stations will self exclude you if you ask.

  9. #9
    Originally Posted by The Boz View Post
    Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson View Post
    Originally Posted by SLaPiNFuNK View Post
    Grocery store VP are the best...
    I can't imagine why anyone would play VP in a supermarket yet I see it all the time.
    And I can’t imagine why anyone would gamble when they can’t pay their debts. To each their own Alan. Who are you and I to judge what another person enjoys doing with their money.

    Addition is a terrible thing Alan. Hopefully you get the help you need! I do believe Stations will self exclude you if you ask.
    That depends on what's being "added"

  10. #10
    Originally Posted by The Boz View Post

    And I can’t imagine why anyone would gamble when they can’t pay their debts. To each their own Alan. Who are you and I to judge what another person enjoys doing with their money.

    Addition is a terrible thing Alan. Hopefully you get the help you need! I do believe Stations will self exclude you if you ask.
    Why don't you knock it off with them negative waves?
    Why don't you dig how beautiful it is out here?
    Why don't you say something righteous and hopeful for a change?







  11. #11
    Originally Posted by jbjb View Post
    Originally Posted by The Boz View Post
    Originally Posted by Alan Mendelson View Post

    I can't imagine why anyone would play VP in a supermarket yet I see it all the time.
    And I can’t imagine why anyone would gamble when they can’t pay their debts. To each their own Alan. Who are you and I to judge what another person enjoys doing with their money.

    Addition is a terrible thing Alan. Hopefully you get the help you need! I do believe Stations will self exclude you if you ask.
    That depends on what's being "added"
    Knowing Alan’s “Adversion” to “Addition “ it’s entirety possible it was a Freudian Slip.

    Or it’s just Spell check doing what it does best.

    Either way help is out there Alan, but first you have to admit you have a problem with math.

  12. #12
    Originally Posted by The Boz View Post
    And I can’t imagine why anyone would gamble when they can’t pay their debts. To each their own Alan. Who are you and I to judge what another person enjoys doing with their money.

    Addition is a terrible thing Alan. Hopefully you get the help you need! I do believe Stations will self exclude you if you ask.
    Exactly you old decrepit broken-down shoe. Why can’t you just shut the fuck up? People like you who like to belittle others, usually are the ultimate losers in life trying to justify their own failures at the expense of others.

    Try leaving your broken-down shoe wisdom at WOV.

  13. #13
    Originally Posted by blackhole View Post
    Originally Posted by The Boz View Post
    And I can’t imagine why anyone would gamble when they can’t pay their debts. To each their own Alan. Who are you and I to judge what another person enjoys doing with their money.

    Addition is a terrible thing Alan. Hopefully you get the help you need! I do believe Stations will self exclude you if you ask.
    Exactly you old decrepit broken-down shoe. Why can’t you just shut the fuck up? People like you who like to belittle others, usually are the ultimate losers in life trying to justify their own failures at the expense of others.

    Try leaving your broken-down shoe wisdom at WOV.
    ‘Morning Mr Hole! How much did you lose this weekend? It’s Sunday so I’m going to assume you are walking up in your comped casino room wondering where the cash you had Friday afternoon went.

    I’m as positive as a person can be. I’m sitting on a plane flying somewhere cool. Maybe to Vegas to meet Donald Trump JR & Kimberly at a private fundraiser for Danny Tark. Or maybe I’m just some lowlife without $1000 to my name spreading my misery. Who knows?

    But I’m betting I’m close on your situation.

    How’s that for Sunday morning positivity Monet? And while your spreading your kindness, can you help Mr Hole? He sure could use a winning gambling trip. Thanks my friend!

  14. #14
    No sense responding to you anymore. You no doubt are a full blown broken-down shoe, mental patient, unable to pull your head out of your ass.

    Just carry on with you telling everyone else how fucked up they personally are. Funny how you responded in 10 minutes. Are you sitting in front of your computer searching for ways to make yourself feel better?

  15. #15
    Originally Posted by blackhole View Post
    No sense responding to you anymore. You no doubt are a full blown broken-down shoe, mental patient, unable to pull your head out of your ass.

    Just carry on with you telling everyone else how fucked up they personally are. Funny how you responded in 10 minutes. Are you sitting in front of your computer searching for ways to make yourself feel better?
    Looks like Mr Nail hit Mr Hole right on the head. Yea I did reply quickly and if you read my reason you would understand. Right now I’m responding from 32000 feet on my way to somewhere cool as hell. Gogo inflight allows one to keep in touch when they want to be. Does that make me special? No, I don’t see it that way. Just someone enjoying the fruits of hard work.

    So let’s get this straight Hole, you hate AP’s because they beat a system you can’t. You hate me because I live a life you COULD, but are not willing or capable of making the sacrifices it takes.

    Either way, enjoy your day! By the way, what time is checkout? Don’t worry, your host will give you a late checkout, it’s the least he could do.

    Have drive home!

  16. #16
    Originally Posted by blackhole View Post
    No sense responding to you anymore. You no doubt are a full blown broken-down shoe, mental patient, unable to pull your head out of your ass.

    Just carry on with you telling everyone else how fucked up they personally are. Funny how you responded in 10 minutes. Are you sitting in front of your computer searching for ways to make yourself feel better?
    Double post, so I’ll adjust it. What the hell is your infatuation with shoes?

    If you knew me you would know I’m more of a flip flop or sneakers kind of guy.

    And just how does one even get their head in their ass?
    Last edited by The Boz; 09-23-2018 at 07:26 AM.

  17. #17
    Originally Posted by MisterV View Post
    I have read that Las Vegas locals are enamored by video poker and that it is their game of choice.

    Given that, I wonder what games a sharp local would play, and and at which casinos, in order to maximize their chances of winning?

    Assume they know to take advantage of casino promotions such as multiplied points days.

    One other question: is there anywhere in the USA that offers better games / better promotions for VP players than Las Vegas?

    Las Vegas locals are considered a "mature market" by the gaming industry. That's a euphemism for saying they've had a generation to get hooked on the "crack cocaine of gambling," video poker. I'm going to attempt to give a short answer -- monet could certainly explain this better and in depth.

    If you previously played at some Stations or Boyd properties on Senior days or multiplier days, you were at worst treading water if you play well. Boyd has fluctuated the quality of its vp by casino and over time, sometimes radically. Now it's basically frozen lower end players out of its comp system, so that's a problem. And Boyd has now begun to correlate rating to machines played in a big way. Video poker players are persona non grata. Jean Scott gets into this a little on her LVA blog. She's usually overly positive and chipper, but even she recognizes it's time to hit the trail if you play video poker at Boyd. There is a good discussion on lvadvice.com regarding all this.

    Palms used to be a decent vp place, and was 10 years ago pretty great, but no more. Stations seem to be replacing some vp inventory with penny slots, and their comps and such suck, but they may be among the best of what's left.

    Westgate just instituted a new comp program, so it's a bit of an unknown. They have some good vp near the sports book. Impossible to say at this point how rating and comps will function with their new program. They folded the race/sports betting into the main comp program in a permanent fashion this week.

    If I play much vp in LV, I'll be playing at Westgate and Four Queens downtown until I find something elsewhere. I'd check vpfree for the latest updates on games in other states. Dan had some insights on Cherokee Casino's idiosyncrasies in my neck of the woods. Given the pullback in Las Vegas, I'm sure other locales are superior, but mickey and monet would know. Basically, you're likely to find better vp in non-mature (i.e. not addicted for a generation) locales.

  18. #18
    Originally Posted by redietz View Post
    Las Vegas locals are considered a "mature market" by the gaming industry. That's a euphemism for saying they've had a generation to get hooked on the "crack cocaine of gambling," video poker. I'm going to attempt to give a short answer -- monet could certainly explain this better and in depth.

    If you previously played at some Stations or Boyd properties on Senior days or multiplier days, you were at worst treading water if you play well. Boyd has fluctuated the quality of its vp by casino and over time, sometimes radically. Now it's basically frozen lower end players out of its comp system, so that's a problem. And Boyd has now begun to correlate rating to machines played in a big way. Video poker players are persona non grata. Jean Scott gets into this a little on her LVA blog. She's usually overly positive and chipper, but even she recognizes it's time to hit the trail if you play video poker at Boyd. There is a good discussion on lvadvice.com regarding all this.

    Palms used to be a decent vp place, and was 10 years ago pretty great, but no more. Stations seem to be replacing some vp inventory with penny slots, and their comps and such suck, but they may be among the best of what's left.

    Westgate just instituted a new comp program, so it's a bit of an unknown. They have some good vp near the sports book. Impossible to say at this point how rating and comps will function with their new program. They folded the race/sports betting into the main comp program in a permanent fashion this week.

    If I play much vp in LV, I'll be playing at Westgate and Four Queens downtown until I find something elsewhere. I'd check vpfree for the latest updates on games in other states. Dan had some insights on Cherokee Casino's idiosyncrasies in my neck of the woods. Given the pullback in Las Vegas, I'm sure other locales are superior, but mickey and monet would know. Basically, you're likely to find better vp in non-mature (i.e. not addicted for a generation) locales.
    Back in 2014 I thought it was over and seen the writing on the wall or the door closing in fast.
    This was during the tail end of the Plaza Promotion.
    4 Years later and it is really over now for Video Poker, that is in Vegas.
    You can still play quarters and make 10 to 20 dollars an hour and eat for free but for the most part it is getting really ugly and over.
    I got to hit a few good things in 2016 and that looks like the end.
    As you already stated Boyd is dead for now and it isn't even that great for reel players at Boyd with the new system.
    Many VP players are done with them and not just the pros but just your High Rolling Hawaiians are pretty upset and done with them.
    Ten Years ago I told some long time local players that we would all be back in the poker room.
    We all met playing poker in the mid 90s actually and I had a conversation last night with someone I have known since that time.
    We both agreed that you better learn the new style of Reel Progressive Machines if you want to keep at it but realize the heavy competition in Vegas.
    One could be like the other AP Teams on these boards and get into the Pit and whatever it is that they do but I think you have two choices.
    Live Poker because Online Poker is far too much work and heavy collusion or just get out and do something else.
    A few APs I've known of gave up VP because working for the Casino is now more profitable than hustling it.
    Better to Hustle/Steal from inside the Casino once again.

    Take one guy for instance playing quarter VP in Vegas in the late 90s to early 2000s.
    He was making 80k per year playing quarters believe it or not.
    3% or better winners were all over the place. Promotions and Paytables were downright crazy.
    IMO if you were to play quarters today for a living you would make about 20k to 25k per year.
    Maybe I am wrong, maybe some of these sharper guys know where the better quarter games are but that is my observation.
    I was at the Orleans last night to check on a few things.
    They downgraded the triple play quarters and nickles that used to have 9/7 double bonus to 9/6.
    I am not sure of when the downgrade happened so it could be over a year now.
    My point is they don't want to give you anything.
    I even seen a prominent semi famous poker player in the Orleans Poker Room playing 15-30 8 or Better.
    Times must be tough!

    One other option is to beg kewlJ to take you under his wing and teach you his ways.
    He seems to be able to make plenty of money playing in the Pit unrated.
    I am sure some serious sharpies are still killing it but gone are the VP days where money was all over the floor.
    Last edited by monet; 09-23-2018 at 09:02 AM.

  19. #19
    Originally Posted by Rob.Singer View Post
    In other words, this question could have been posed to just about any local 25c vp player in LV, and the same answer would have been arrived at.

    And no one knows anything even close to what the story on this is in "other than in LV". Not even mickey, who's casinos of choice are obscure, smaller, western area Indian clip joints.
    High paying vp is the exception rather than the rule in the indian casinos. A 2000 machine casino might have only 20 video pokers. Typical game selection is 8/5 Jacks, 6/5 BP, 8/5 DBP, 7/5 DDBP. Forget games in the 98 to 100% range. They dont exist.

    The money in the Indian casinos is in the vulturable line games.
    "More importantly, mickey thought 8-4 was two games over .500. Argued about it. C'mon, man. Nothing can top that for math expertise. If GWAE ever has you on again, you can be sure I'll be calling in with that gem.'Nuff said." REDIETZ

  20. #20
    When I’m in an Indian casino that I haven’t been in before, I consider 7/5 bonus a good game and 9/5 JOB a great game. If I see something above 99% I get a little suspicious.
    #FreeTyde

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