King has arrived

[monet]

But, then, simple arithmetic tells me that's not even close to being in my favor. I just put up the proof for everyone else's benefit, honestly, I read that and immediately knew nothing about it was in my favor.

So, you obviously think I'm a complete fucking moron. Which is fine, we can be civil with you thinking that, but I'm not going to do anything related to a game with you.

I went back and checked...

I took a whole TWO MINUTES to change it up and let you make the rules after you posted the Math.

The posts were 3:33 and my response was 3:35
Post Numbers 38/39

[monet]

I don't want more. I want $0 from you. How is that more?

A guy willing to negotiate Free Prize Money isn't good enough for you.

You want to stipulate that I have to get Dan Druff involved in our business and you won't even play the game with all of us.

That is More!

[Mission146]

I don't want more. I want $0 from you. How is that more?

A guy willing to negotiate Free Prize Money isn't good enough for you.

You want to stipulate that I have to get Dan Druff involved in our business and you won't even play the game with all of us.

That is More!

Not the definition of, "More," that I would usually use. Okay, I'll modify my terms:

I will not play the game if you make any donation whatsoever regardless of who holds it.

Is that still more?

[monet]

I don't want more. I want $0 from you. How is that more?

A guy willing to negotiate Free Prize Money isn't good enough for you.

You want to stipulate that I have to get Dan Druff involved in our business and you won't even play the game with all of us.

That is More!

Not the definition of, "More," that I would usually use. Okay, I'll modify my terms:

I will not play the game if you make any donation whatsoever regardless of who holds it.

Is that still more?

You and I realize we are both done here.
I know you just want the last word and you think you are right and I am wrong and you just want to prove that.
However, I think you are completely wrong but that is ok... let us just go back to trolling each other.
Why don't you make me a Cupid Profile as well... thanks.

[Mission146]

No... I am not a math genius like you are.

HA!!!

[Mission146]

Why don't you make me a Cupid Profile as well... thanks.

Because you are either generally or always faithful to your wife, and even if you were inclined not to be, would prefer to engage in extramarital activities in a legal Nevada brothel.

Ergo, you have no use for OKCupid.

[monet]

No... I am not a math genius like you are.

HA!!!

Are you saying that I am lying?

The truth is I can't do those equations like you and Mickey.
I don't even understand them.
I just know when a Progressive gets to a certain amount it is exploitable.
I do have a strong memory but not what I would consider photographic.
I wouldn't even know or care where to begin.
My whole game is from volume and experience and handed down from word of mouth or being observant.
I suppose I am good at exploitation as well.

[monet]

Why don't you make me a Cupid Profile as well... thanks.

Because you are either generally or always faithful to your wife, and even if you were inclined not to be, would prefer to engage in extramarital activities in a legal Nevada brothel.

Ergo, you have no use for OKCupid.

I have never stepped foot in a Legal Brothel anywhere in this world.

If I did, I certainly wouldn't be going in for the tour, ONLY, like Dan Druff.

Supposedly there was some old dollar coin machines in one that was full pay or overpaying.
I never got to participate.

[Mission146]

I never said you did. Wasn't it you who made the point that is a better way to do something extramarital as opposed to having sex with the neighbor, or your wife's sister or whatever? I don't think you said you actually ever did it, you just said that was the way without any drama. Unless I'm confusing you with someone else.

[Mission146]

Are you saying that I am lying...I suppose I am good at exploitation as well.

[monet]

Are you saying that I am lying...I suppose I am good at exploitation as well.

Just because I can lie or exploit doesn't mean I understand mathematical equations.
Guys like me tried to read “Theory of Games and Economic Behavior” but the truth is that it is above people like me.
Street Guys don't have the patience for all that theory and those charts. We are more about Action.

I never said you did. Wasn't it you who made the point that is a better way to do something extramarital as opposed to having sex with the neighbor, or your wife's sister or whatever? I don't think you said you actually ever did it, you just said that was the way without any drama. Unless I'm confusing you with someone else.

Well you have to check a couple of posts and threads.
I stated that I was not like every member on these boards that say they never paid for it.
I have paid for it many times over.
I found it strange that nobody else on these boards have or couldn't admit that they had.

I also made the point several times that if an individual is going to cheat it is better for that person to go "pay for it" because if you cheat on your wife with some friend, relative or neighbor or even stranger at a bar or online you are most likely going to get caught and it is going to cause you more money and headaches compared to just going to some call girl or massage parlor.

You made a decent rebuttal about less chance of catching a disease and spreading it around but I am not convinced that it would be better to be playing around with your wife's sister or neighbors wife compared to going to a Hooker.

[Mission146]

Just because I can lie or exploit doesn't mean I understand mathematical equations.

HA!!!

My point about not, "Wanting more," is I don't know how you could say I want more when, by taking myself out of the game, I can't get any of your money to begin with.

To be perfectly honest, I don't know what your angle is. I can think of at least two possibilities and not only do I not want your money, but I don't want to have to list and agree to every single contingency that would make what I think your angles could be (not saying are) impossible, so that we have to agree to every single contingency one by one.

If you send the money to Dan Druff, then I have nothing to worry about.

But, you're determined that you must send the money to me. Has to be a reason for that.

Well you have to check a couple of posts and threads.
I stated that I was not like every member on these boards that say they never paid for it.
I have paid for it many times over.
I found it strange that nobody else on these boards have or couldn't admit that they had.

I also made the point several times that if an individual is going to cheat it is better for that person to go "pay for it" because if you cheat on your wife with some friend, relative or neighbor or even stranger at a bar or online you are most likely going to get caught and it is going to cause you more money and headaches compared to just going to some call girl or massage parlor.

Okay, had my facts a little mixed up on the hooker thing, sorry. I had the right general idea, just the wrong specifics.

[monet]

Just because I can lie or exploit doesn't mean I understand mathematical equations.

HA!!!

My point about not, "Wanting more," is I don't know how you could say I want more when, by taking myself out of the game, I can't get any of your money to begin with.

To be perfectly honest, I don't know what your angle is. I can think of at least two possibilities and not only do I not want your money, but I don't want to have to list and agree to every single contingency that would make what I think your angles could be (not saying are) so that we have to agree to every single contingency one by one.

If you send the money to Dan Druff, then I have nothing to worry about.

But, you're determined that you must send the money to me. Has to be a reason for that.

Yes... because I trust and respect you over Dan Druff who I have no trust for and most any other members.
You have been doing this Picks Game thing for a long time so I am not worried about you skating.
The truth is you have to hold the money for a long time and god forbid if you pass away we aren't seeing that money.
You and I have somewhat of a history with football picks games.

I have met 3 people off of the forums that you know of and have not cheated them out of any money or ever contacted them about anything.
As a matter of fact they have profited off of me and I have had 0 profit from them except that Axelwolf told me a place that mail was good that worked for me for a few months.
So I did make some cash off of that meeting but it was information at the tail end and the heat was turned up. Not an easy angle at all but I managed.
Another exception is ZenKing who I have had a few texts back and forth with about posts on WoV or warnings of being careful of teaming up.

You want to think I want to get your banking information or personal information and run wild with it... I understand... whatever.
The truth is your side actually has all of my information and can do me much more harm in the long run if they wanted to.
I don't even care. I am not worried. If someone wants to come to my door and file a complaint I am always ready. I am not hiding. I have had this house for 14 years now solid.
Never missed any payments or been late on any bills. As a matter of fact I pay 6 months to 12 months ahead of time on everything.

I would send you cash through the mail to a PO Box or Western Union to some fake name for you or many, many, many other options that would have no chance of you getting screwed.
Your the guy in the smart 10% of the country... I am sure you can figure many ways of how to get the money to you from me with no liability on either side.

Guys like you and RS just can't believe that I am into many things with no strings or angles attached.
You both have a bad perception of who I really am or have become over time.

[Mission146]

Yes... because I trust and respect you over Dan Druff who I have no trust for and most any other members.
You have been doing this Picks Game thing for a long time so I am not worried about you skating.
The truth is you have to hold the money for a long time and god forbid if you pass away we aren't seeing that money.
You and I have somewhat of a history with football picks games.

Fair enough. Do you trust yourself? If you would like to hold the money related to the contest, then you can decide where the prizes go when we know how many participants we have and then you can send them their money that comes from you at the end.

What history? I made some picks for you and never won. I think we would have been in the money one week had one game broke the other way.

I have met 3 people off of the forums that you know of and have not cheated them out of any money or ever contacted them about anything.
As a matter of fact they have profited off of me and I have had 0 profit from them except that Axelwolf told me a place that mail was good that worked for me for a few months.
So I did make some cash off of that meeting but it was information at the tail end and the heat was turned up. Not an easy angle at all but I managed.

None of that is any of my business or concern.

You want to think I want to get your banking information or personal information and run wild with it... I understand... whatever.
The truth is your side actually has all of my information and can do me much more harm in the long run if they wanted to.
I don't even care. I am not worried. If someone wants to come to my door and file a complaint I am always ready. I am not hiding. I have had this house for 14 years now solid.
Never missed any payments or been late on any bills. As a matter of fact I pay 6 months to 12 months ahead of time on everything.

What would you do with my personal information, get rejected for loans? Least of my concerns.

I have no desire to have any of your personal information. I also have no desire to have any of your money.

If you wish to donate to a game here, then hold your own money until the game is over. I'll manage and play the game, and if I finish with a prize, I will surrender my prize over to the person closest to me in the ranking for the relevant prize, deal?

I would send you cash through the mail to a PO Box or Western Union to some fake name for you or many, many, many other options that would have no chance of you getting screwed.
Your the guy in the smart 10% of the country... I am sure you can figure many ways of how to get the money to you from me with no liability on either side.

Guys like you and RS just can't believe that I am into many things with no strings or angles attached.
You both have a bad perception of who I really am or have become over time.

No thank you. Just hold your money until it comes time to pay whoever finishes with a prize. Sound good?

[monet]

No thank you. Just hold your money until it comes time to pay whoever finishes with a prize. Sound good?

It does sound good except that it puts responsibility and pressure on me.
Two things I basically hate.
In the last 15 years all I do is throw money at it... if you understand what I mean.
I don't like having to do the work or be responsible or on the hook so to speak.
If I can get the money over to you I don't have to worry about it if I decide never to participate online for an extended amount of time.

I thought we had some history since we were, at least in my mind, partners for a week or two on my free contests.
If I was wrong and we didn't have some sort of history or connection that is my fault in thinking too much of it... sorry bout that.

You are very good at being responsible compared to me.

I wanted to be more of a silent partner or donor to the cause of the "fun" as you put it.

Do we even have interest? I haven't seen anyone else say they would want to participate?
I really hate having to hold the money and distribute it. I would rather you do that.
I could hold the money and get it to you in Vegas when you visit... you are coming to Vegas soon right?
I could put it in your poker account at the Rio so neither of us have to have contact with one another... I think that can be done.
Just a quick thought... it doesn't have to go down like that.

It was better when you told me to Fuck Off and we were done with this... it is starting too get complicated.

[Mission146]

Yup. Too complicated. Doesn’t seem to be any real interest. I’ll let you know what my Vegas dates are if you want to meet up for a few drinks, though. Most likely December the week before Christmas.

[monet]

Yup. Too complicated. Doesn’t seem to be any real interest. I’ll let you know what my Vegas dates are if you want to meet up for a few drinks, though. Most likely December the week before Christmas.

I am too much of a Hustler to send you money and you can think of two angles that I am shooting for to screw you over in some way but you have no problem meeting me in person for drinks??

[Mission146]

Sure, why not? We’ll play a quarter bartop progressive, the drinks will be free and the game +EV. I’m thinking The D.

There might be some other people there depending how the schedule works out, but not if you don’t want there to be. I’m sure I can cut out a few hours. If my ex wife gets her vacation where she wants it, I should be there for four or five days. Not The D for four or five days, Vegas, in general. Not even sure I’d be staying at The D at all.

[MisterV]

It could be interesting if this nascent discussion of a private get together were to expand to become the VCT equivalent of WoVCon.

Never happen, of course, but if it did, one can only wonder how things would be were some of the board's more opinionated, vocal members to meet up in the real world?.

[monet]

It would be nice to get some sort of rivalry thing going between WoV West vs. WoV.

Something like Missions Football Picks Game where it is LVCT vs. WOV.

We need WoV to ban more members and send them over here to WoV West.

I don't think ZenKing is Nuked, so he can still enter the game if he wants. He can let me know here if he wants to play and just PM me his picks here.

I might ask Wizard if the banned Members from WoV who post here would be allowed in the game if anyone wants to play. The only difference is banned people would have to escrow the funds for their entries to me only because they would have no incentive to pay if they lose.

If not, then we could always have a VCT Picks Game. I'll host it and the Rules will be the same. People who play in the WoV game and post on both sites could also play in the VCT Picks Game. If it's VCT only, we can decide an Entry Fee and it can be based on honor system.

I will donate less to the VCT Picks Game, maybe just something small for the winner, because I imagine there will be fewer players. I think the WoV game will have 25-30 this year. If we can get up to ten players for the VCT Picks Game, then I will do a small contribution for first place and last place.

As you can read for yourself on these quotes Mission was willing to host and run a VCT Picks Game. He wanted the rules to be the same and was willing to donate less money to the VCT Picks Game.

I came in next and offered to put in 300 dollars if Mission agreed to a side bet.

Mission ran the numbers and said the bet wasn't even close to fair.
Mission did not run the numbers with the X Factor of how I have to get my picks in every week.
If I missed one week I would forfeit any chance of winning and the 300 would stay in the Prize Pool.
I know that I have a 99% chance of missing a week... perhaps even a 100% chance of missing a week.
There is no way that I am going to be able to get my picks in for 18 or 19 weeks in a row and most likely I am going to just randomly pick my picks.
This is a main problem with Math Guys vs. Street Guys... The Math Guys can see the numbers but they can't size up the real world situation of the problem.
They aren't able to know what certain people will do or how to calculate it.

Two Minutes after Mission Posted the Math and that I was calling him stupid I agreed and asked him to adjust the rules and gave him the chance to give himself a small edge in the bet.

He refused that offer and told me that even if I gave the money with no stipulations that he would still tell me to Fuck Off!

We negotiated after that and I said I would donate 500 dollars to the Prize Pool for the VCT Game with the only stipulation that I send him the money directly because I trust him and he knows what he is doing running these games and has a long track record in this arena. I thought it might be fun for the forum over here to get involved in a FREE SHOT at some money. He could of made it winner take all or broke down the prize money however he wanted.

So now he is too scared for me to send him the money directly because I must be up to some sort of underhanded mischief.
So he agrees but I have to send the money to Dan Druff and Mission146 will not be participating in the game.

I refuse to those terms

I honestly do not understand how hard it is when someone says they are going to give you 500 dollars with no strings attached to just agree but these guys make it complicated and difficult.
Mission146 thinks I am giving him the money and keeps saying that he doesn't want my money.
The truth is I wasn't giving him money. I was giving him money to put into a prize pool for a VCT Picks game that the VCT community could enjoy a chance at winning.
I certainly wasn't giving him money for him. However I would of broke him off some dough if he needed some sort of fee for his time and his hard work in organizing the game.

The truth is I would of gone all the way up to 1000 dollars and sent it immediately for the game but many times it is difficult to give free money away.
Recently I had a lawyer instruct me to just spend this certain money that I have so that I do not have to worry about a legal situation.
I tried to explain that it isn't so easy to spend that kind of money and the money keeps growing. Every time I talk to these lawyers they put me in a Catch22 situation.
Something like sure you can own this or that but you can't do this or that with it. Fucking Lawyer double and triple talk.

Reminds me of Brewster's Millions... it really is that hard to spend large sums of money.